As an example of this, last night on the news I saw goose stepping police units and also the military on special occasions. I always feel uncomfortable when I see this, because it was one of the in your face things Nazis did when they were in power. Always makes me think of the old news reels they used to show, with the goose stepping Nazi troops going off to war.

I just don't see why Thailand would copy this, seems rather insensitive to say the least. Why would they bring back an image of dark times, that are best laid to rest.

I am sure most Thais would not relate to this image, but it seems the government would have more thought , about how this is a negative thing to see by people in many countries around the world.

Maybe I am being to critical, but I would be interested in the reasoning behind it. What do you all think?

If you look a bit closer than you can see that there are many similarities to fascist and semi fascist societies here in Thailand.

You have constant calls for 'national unity', a latent and regularly rising ethnocentric nationalism, and you have countless paramilitary organizations, armed militias and mass organizations founded by the state propagating this nationalism. And often in recent history those mass organizations were used by the state to eliminate political dissent under the population, often with very brutal methods.

Since a few years, and especially right now, these organizations experience a huge revival since they disappeared into obscurity between the end of the communist insurgency here and the end of the cold war.

It is rather clear to see that the Thai state has used, and still does so, methods that are elementary to fascist systems.

That particular form of marcging has been done for a LONG time ... long before Nazi Germany. Maybe you should just let it go?

equating Goose stepping with National socialism & Facism does not compute in my book.

Its more closely aligned with Prussian militarism & was used in Germany long before the raise of National Socialism, used during WWI & earlier.

About Facism, Il Duce, was so anxious to please his new allies, that their methodology was copied & adopted to their own use. Quite unsuccessfully as you know.

This thread is an insult to the great David Campese

This thread is an insult to the great David Campese

Forgive my ignorance. But you're refering to the australian rugby player? How is this thread an insult??

edited for spelling

Edited May 28, 200719 yr by cm-happy

I don't have a clue as to who this David person is or could care less.

I am saying that using an image of any kind from the Nazi regime is in very bad taste, and this kind of marching went hand in glove with it.

It may have been used previously, same as the swastika, but in reality it is linked to the Nazi group for all time. These symbols should be shunned by all, as far as I am concerned.

It may have been used previously, same as the swastika, but in reality it is linked to the Nazi group for all time. These symbols should be shunned by all, as far as I am concerned.

You should learn more about the history and origins of the swastika.

"Since World War II, most Westerners have known the swastika as solely a Nazi symbol, leading to incorrect assumptions about its pre-Nazi use in the West and confusion about its sacred religious and historical status in other cultures."

Learn more about it here.

This thread is an insult to the great David Campese

Forgive my ignorance. But you're refering to the australian rugby player? How is this thread an insult??

edited for spelling

That was his style of running to 'fox' the opposing tackler.

What is goose stepping?

As an example of this, last night on the news I saw goose stepping police units and also the military on special occasions. I always feel uncomfortable when I see this, because it was one of the in your face things Nazis did when they were in power. Always makes me think of the old news reels they used to show, with the goose stepping Nazi troops going off to war.

I just don't see why Thailand would copy this, seems rather insensitive to say the least. Why would they bring back an image of dark times, that are best laid to rest.

I am sure most Thais would not relate to this image, but it seems the government would have more thought , about how this is a negative thing to see by people in many countries around the world.

Maybe I am being to critical, but I would be interested in the reasoning behind it. What do you all think?

You need to acquaint yourself more with military marching around the world.

There are many countries that use that form of marching or forms that very closely resemble it and have done so since the early 19th century.

Do a wiki on goose-step and I think you'll see that you're over-analyzing things.

Edited May 28, 200719 yr by sriracha john

This thread is an insult to the great David Campese

Forgive my ignorance. But you're refering to the australian rugby player? How is this thread an insult??

edited for spelling

Someone missed the "sense of humor" queue at birth

Point taken Jai Dee, too bad it was borrowed for a symbol of such evil. That makes it hard to view in a rational way.

I was raised in the times when, fathers and uncles were off fighting against this symbol, and what you learn at an early age stays with you, I suppose.

I still would like to know what the attraction is of the goose step marching, looks pretty uncomfortable to me. I still think it makes them look like a bunch of Nazis.

... I still think it makes them look like a bunch of Nazis.

A look undermined a little by the pink bearskins?

Point taken Jai Dee, too bad it was borrowed for a symbol of such evil. That makes it hard to view in a rational way.

I was raised in the times when, fathers and uncles were off fighting against this symbol, and what you learn at an early age stays with you, I suppose.

I still would like to know what the attraction is of the goose step marching, looks pretty uncomfortable to me. I still think it makes them look like a bunch of Nazis.

No problem KhunDennis... sometimes a lot of symbolism we have learnt in our Western influenced lives have totally different meanings here in the East. We must learn to broaden our thinking to be accepting of such meanings, and try not to impose our way of thinking.

By the way, regarding the goose-stepping, also from Wikipedia:

"It emerged from Prussian drilling regulation during the early 19th Century. This takes much practice and dexterity, and so the purpose of the goose-step is the demonstration of absolute mechanized discipline and superiority."

What is goose stepping?

Elementary, my dear friend! Goose Stepping (PLURAL: GEESE STEPPING) refers literally to Stepping As A Goose. Now, when geese (again: the plural of goose) step, they normally do so whilst making a sound somewhat like eins, zwei,drei... Hence, the term "goose stepping". Would you like further elaboration?

Yeah. The territorial defense raksadindan is like a reincarnation of the Hitler Youth.

For five hours once a week they spew nationalist BS at you in the sweltering heat of the day and the heat makes you lose your judgment so you don't question it.

A very nationalist country.

Do they wear the Nazi style helmets like the Americans? I think I read in a book somewhere that the first step to becoming a dictatorship is goose-stepping. Of course only the experts here who noticed this key activity would know. Has anyone seen any Burmese soldiers teaching this very militaristic march? It's not as easy as it looks and surely there's no way that the Thais could have figured this out alone. You know, the other day I noticed that the school children at some schools are carrying side arms and have Communist Manifestos. It could be the newest fashion craze but I'd rather let the anti-communist experts on this board check it out and get back to us.

Yeah. The territorial defense raksadindan is like a reincarnation of the Hitler Youth.

For five hours once a week they spew nationalist BS at you in the sweltering heat of the day and the heat makes you lose your judgment so you don't question it.

Same thing happens in every bootcamp in every country's military.... but it's a lot more than just "five hours once a week"

A very nationalist country.

Not all that more so than the list of countries above.

Do they wear the Nazi style helmets like the Americans? I think I read in a book somewhere that the first step to becoming a dictatorship is goose-stepping. Of course only the experts here who noticed this key activity would know. Has anyone seen any Burmese soldiers teaching this very militaristic march? It's not as easy as it looks and surely there's no way that the Thais could have figured this out alone. You know, the other day I noticed that the school children at some schools are carrying side arms and have Communist Manifestos. It could be the newest fashion craze but I'd rather let the anti-communist experts on this board check it out and get back to us.

You would benefit from availing yourself to the link that Jai Dee so courteously provided.

Yeah. The territorial defense raksadindan is like a reincarnation of the Hitler Youth.

For five hours once a week they spew nationalist BS at you in the sweltering heat of the day and the heat makes you lose your judgment so you don't question it.

Same thing happens in every bootcamp in every country's military.... but it's a lot more than just "five hours once a week"

A very nationalist country.

Not all that more so than the list of countries above.

Not though with hundred thousands of armed civilians organized in militias and paramilitary organizations all over the country. This is a rather unique feature to Thailand. There is some reading material available on this, of academic nature.

Edited May 28, 200719 yr by ColPyat

What is goose stepping?

goose stepping is a deception technique employed by world class rugby wingers in order to evade being tackled and hence cross the oponent's line a score what is known as a try.

Edited May 28, 200719 yr by kiakaha

Yeah. The territorial defense raksadindan is like a reincarnation of the Hitler Youth.

For five hours once a week they spew nationalist BS at you in the sweltering heat of the day and the heat makes you lose your judgment so you don't question it.

Same thing happens in every bootcamp in every country's military and occurs in countless other militias, paramilitary organizations, hate groups, religious extremist units, street gangs....from countries all over the globe but it's a lot more than just "five hours once a week"

A very nationalist country.

Not all that more so than the list of countries above.

Not though with hundred thousands of armed civilians organized in militias and paramilitary organizations all over the country. This is a rather unique feature to Thailand. There is some reading material available on this, of academic nature.

The fundamentals of indoctrination techniques of the original post have been modified to provide clarification with nothing more needed than a quick look at wiki.

Perhaps it's my perpetual sunny disposition but it always brings to my mind John Cleese, and that quickly removes any threatening connotations from the spectacle.

Patrick

That's funny p brownstone, I was just thinking of him myself. It does put a different light on things doesn't it?

Perhaps it is better not to dwell on this too much, like some of you have said already, times change and you have to let things go.

Yeah. The territorial defense raksadindan is like a reincarnation of the Hitler Youth.

For five hours once a week they spew nationalist BS at you in the sweltering heat of the day and the heat makes you lose your judgment so you don't question it.

Same thing happens in every bootcamp in every country's military and occurs in countless other militias, paramilitary organizations, hate groups, religious extremist units, street gangs....from countries all over the globe but it's a lot more than just "five hours once a week"

A very nationalist country.

Not all that more so than the list of countries above.

Not though with hundred thousands of armed civilians organized in militias and paramilitary organizations all over the country. This is a rather unique feature to Thailand. There is some reading material available on this, of academic nature.

The fundamentals of indoctrination techniques of the original post have been modified to provide clarification with nothing more needed than a quick look at wiki.

Thanks for your editing in red. Can you tell me please then which other country has that many state sponsored "countless other militias, paramilitary organizations, hate groups,..." as Thailand has?

Some think that the goose step was invented by Oliver Cromwell for his Roundhead troops.

It's ridiculous to ban things just because they have a connection with the Nazis, especially when it's things that weren't even invented by them like the goose step or swastika. What next - the Sam Brown belt, full length black leather jackets, forage caps.

It's like when people get agitated over Germans use of words that have a Nazi connection like volk or reich that are just plain German words and were in use long before any Nazis came on the scene. Another 1 is the portrayal of Nietzsche as a Nazi even though he was dead 20 years before the Nazi party came into being and twisted his philosophy.

In 1939 the dictator of Thailand was that old master-coupster Phibun Songkhram . He was an open fan of Fascism and National Socialism. He did bring about several changes that relfected this admiration- (according to the historian Sulak Sivaraksa, he even referred to himself as the 'fuehrer' though whether officially, and whether in translation or not, doesn't say).

He insisted on a new national anthem that was (and remains) more militantly patriotic than the previous, declared that Siam would be henceforth known as the land of the Thais, forebade the wearing of traditional Malay style dress in the south and introduced the playing of the anthem at 8 AM and 6 PM - (citizens were ordered to stop, stand and salute when the anthem was played.)

Does anybody know when the Thais adopted this style of marching?

Edited May 28, 200719 yr by blaze