Why So Many Cynical, Angry Bitter Members

[Jingthing]

Yep, being an expat anywhere takes flexibility and going with the flow. My wise old Dad used to say, "you gotta bend with it, carry vaseline." I had a very strange Dad.

great

Sounds like you had a very smart dad

Thanks. I quite agree. On the surface he was a mild mannered US federal government bureaucrat, but his real calling was as an underground pop philosopher. His classic and original quote was:

Enjoy each miserable day.

Words to live by in Thailand.

Edited May 28, 2007 by Jingthing

[mikethevigoman]

If you jump into shark infested waters, gushing blood from an open wound, I don't think you have much of gripe when a shark acts like a shark and has you for breakfast

I certainly agree with that, and I also think that we should not forget there are two sides to the story. Thailand and the Farang.

That Thailand attracts so many guys with "open wounds" is a significant factor in why they get in such a mess when they arrive in Thailand.

Yes dont generalise about thais ,Just dont trust anyone ! works for me

[mikethevigoman]

Highdiver,

i don't agree with those quotes about americans. i have lived and worked in several countries but only in one of those countries (Cyprus) i have experienced people more friendly than in the fifteen years i spent in the United States.

the average american is naive and (judged by european standards) quite uneducated when it concerns "things" across the borders of the Greatest Nation on Earth™.

examples:

"you are a german? do you know by chance a Werner Müller who lives in Hamburg?" (happened several times, names and cities different of course).

-to a singaporean friend of my wife the question (asked by a Ph.D.!) "so how will you feel when next year your country is handed back to communist China?"

"you spend your holidays often in Thailand. aren't you and your wife afraid to contract AIDS?"

(possessing a second home in the U.S. worth three quarter million dollars the question of a neighbour) "how can you afford to pay xyz dollars per gallon for gasoline in Germany?"

but let me depict with a small (invented) story the difference between an american and e.g. a german neighbour:

Germany:

hey neighbour, my power drill conked off. can i borrow yours?

ahmmm... how long will you need it? because... ahmmm... you see... i mean... it's a DUSS and quite expensive. can you handle it?

U.S. of A.:

hey neighbour, my power drill conked off. can i borrow yours?

the code for my garage is 7890 where you'll find all my tools. take whatever you need. and... by the way... i've seen your wife and her visiting sisters rowing on the lake. in this drawer are the keys for my boat. use it whenever you please.

concerning "rip offs":

whenever a handyman saw my home the estimates he gave me on the phone doubled.

Do they have an education over there ? im from devon and as soon as i said i was from England 99 out of a hundred would say which part of london !, but in my experience its common sense they lack,.Went in to a bank with a girlfriend to cash her paycheck, cashier asks for ID, ( fair enough ) ,Geenas driving license had expired by one week, cashier says " im sorry this has expired, i cant accept it " !, i said "she hasnt expired ,thats her in the picture as you can see ", .like talking to a stepford wife, not uncommon,.drove me mad,.

[click2delete]

Do they have an education over there ? im from devon and as soon as i said i was from England 99 out of a hundred would say which part of london !, but in my experience its common sense they lack,.Went in to a bank with a girlfriend to cash her paycheck, cashier asks for ID, ( fair enough ) ,Geenas driving license had expired by one week, cashier says " im sorry this has expired, i cant accept it " !, i said "she hasnt expired ,thats her in the picture as you can see ", .like talking to a stepford wife, not uncommon,.drove me mad,.

You would get the same response in America. It's called CYA.

[torito]

I gotta say, its not far off the truth this, if you aint on guard here you will be raped and left to die penniless,

As it will happen in any poor country in the world....Argentina, Panama,Mexico?....they will steal from you whenever they can, and with a knife in your throat...they will break in your house and your car.....latinos delinquency is confrontational..

I knew that Asia was difficult in this money aspect since the first day I arrived....and I live with that...but I have never feel more safe in my life than in Thailand, any place, any time...even with my pockey full of money

[Jingthing]

Oh cool! America bashing! It had to happen. A country of 300 million people and they are all dumb. Imagine that.

Cultural explanations:

Most of the people asking where in London were being glad handed friendly, hoping they would guess correctly, and there would be good feelings. US people are much less educated about geography than Europeans, more so than Thais, but I bet the majority actually know your country is an island containing more then London. Now if they had asked where in Manchester, that would have been stupid, as London was the most likely place to be a correct guess.

The cashier was doing her job and following the rules. She most likely had no option to be flexible. That hurts anywhere if it happens to you, but hardly anything to do about American cashiers.

Common sense? Whats special about that?

Edited May 28, 2007 by Jingthing

[rychrde]

mmm.... I can smell the sulphur of some american stories wafting this way.

ok can't resist. genuinely overheard by me.

"Gee that's cute, why do they spell "night" with a K?"

2 americans arriving at Knightsbridge Station, London.

[sbk]

...Which will stop immediately. If you can't keep it on topic then this thread will be closed.

[click2delete]

Oh cool! America bashing! It had to happen. A country of 300 million people and they are all dumb. Imagine that.

Cultural explanations:

Most of the people asking where in London were being glad handed friendly, hoping they would guess correctly, and there would be good feelings. US people are much less educated about geography than Europeans, more so than Thais, but I bet the majority actually know your country is an island containing more then London. Now if they had asked where in Manchester, that would have been stupid, as London was the most likely place to be a correct guess.

The cashier was doing her job and following the rules. She most likely had no option to be flexible. That hurts anywhere if it happens to you, but hardly anything to do about American cashiers.

Common sense? Whats special about that?

You all seem to have hair triggers.

I am an American.

I'll write it again - the same thing would happen in America. I cannot speak for Mexico or England.

Your ID is either valid or not valid. I guarantee it would happen in the USA especially now after all the 911 crap.

[qwertz]

I gotta say, its not far off the truth this, if you aint on guard here you will be raped and left to die penniless,

As it will happen in any poor country in the world....Argentina, Panama,Mexico?....they will steal from you whenever they can, and with a knife in your throat...they will break in your house and your car.....latinos delinquency is confrontational..

I knew that Asia was difficult in this money aspect since the first day I arrived....and I live with that...but I have never feel more safe in my life than in Thailand, any place, any time...even with my pockey full of money

Yo torito, I've rarely found myself in a threatening situation anywhere.

You may call this luck, I call it avoiding confrontation.

Show me a threat and I'll show you how fast an oldster can run for the hills.

As you say, I'm analytical and I figure that most thieves are thieves because they're opportunistic, lazy or cowardly.

Or a combination of all three.

My logic tells me - not giving them the opportunity leaves them at a serious disadvantage.

As for being raped - with my looks, I should be so lucky.

[click2delete]

As it will happen in any poor country in the world....Argentina, Panama,Mexico?....they will steal from you whenever they can, and with a knife in your throat...they will break in your house and your car.....latinos delinquency is confrontational..

I knew that Asia was difficult in this money aspect since the first day I arrived....and I live with that...but I have never feel more safe in my life than in Thailand, any place, any time...even with my pockey full of money

What is it about Thailand that no one can stay on the topic of Thailand? We all know that Thai Vendors from Baht Bus Drivers to Taxi Cabs will generally cheat you if they can. Yet you want to talk about Panama.

My suggestion to you is to join a Panamanian board - I know of a few in case you would like to really know about that country.

Let's stick to Thailand.

They cut the clitoris of women in Africa.

Oh, that has nothing to do with Thailand - but let's discuss it anyway. We wouldn't want to speak the truth about this country.

WHY IS THAILAND TRUTH TABOO?

[rychrde]

Actually, from some posts it looks like one can be bitter and twisted in many other countries.

re USA my experience is of two very different places, NYC and Albany, which by historical accident is the capital of NY State. I imaged that much of the US is like Albany rather than NYC. The jokes about Americans are the mis-match between what we think it like (NYC) and what it is really like (Albany). Probably the same extremes as living in BKK and Isaan.

I'm sure most angry comments about personal experiences in Thailand will be turned into jokes when retold back home. Hope most of them, anyway.

Yeah... one of my ex-gf always called it a 'third world awareness' - she should know she's from Mexico. Holes in the ground, police rip-offs, bandits round the corner, family mart closed - somehow one needs to smell what's coming, before it hits you. being sober helps.

rych

[click2delete]

Oh cool! America bashing! It had to happen. A country of 300 million people and they are all dumb.

Educated people know that the use of the word dumb is reserved for people who cannot speak, as in Blind Deaf and Dumb.

I am an American, I assure you, the majority of us are able to speak.

[sbk]

As it will happen in any poor country in the world....Argentina, Panama,Mexico?....they will steal from you whenever they can, and with a knife in your throat...they will break in your house and your car.....latinos delinquency is confrontational..

I knew that Asia was difficult in this money aspect since the first day I arrived....and I live with that...but I have never feel more safe in my life than in Thailand, any place, any time...even with my pockey full of money

What is it about Thailand that no one can stay on the topic of Thailand? We all know that Thai Vendors from Baht Bus Drivers to Taxi Cabs will generally cheat you if they can. Yet you want to talk about Panama.

My suggestion to you is to join a Panamanian board - I know of a few in case you would like to really know about that country.

Let's stick to Thailand.

They cut the clitoris of women in Africa.

Oh, that has nothing to do with Thailand - but let's discuss it anyway. We wouldn't want to speak the truth about this country.

WHY IS THAILAND TRUTH TABOO?

????

Re-read torito's post. I do believe he was keeping it on topic and your post is taking it off topic.

Cynical angry bitter members.

I think several members have made very valuable points. Too many people come with here with sky high expectations only to become disappointed that it wasn't the paradise they thought it was. Also, many people think that by leaving their countries they are escaping what made them unhappy only to find their problems escalate here. When the truth is the problem is within. Deal with your own issues and you may find yourself in a happier space.

Sure, Thailand has problems, unique to Thailand but Torito's point was that problems occur everywhere. No matter where you move, if you are bitter, cynical and angry, you'll still be bitter, cynical and angry in the new location.

[qwertz]

If Click is an MD and has studied psychology at any level, I fail to understand why he gets so uptight about the Thai mentality and cannot accept what can't be changed.

Torito and I (and I suspect many other BMs too) have already learned the drawbacks - and benefits - of being an immigrant so Thailand and its customs are perhaps easier for us to accept.

[torito]

Other countries such as Argentina, Panama or even Mexico don't play with their expats, they treat them with respect.

Immigration in those countries are friendly

As it will happen in any poor country in the world....Argentina, Panama,Mexico?....they will steal from you whenever they can, and with a knife in your throat...they will break in your house and your car.....latinos delinquency is confrontational..

I knew that Asia was difficult in this money aspect since the first day I arrived....and I live with that...but I have never feel more safe in my life than in Thailand, any place, any time...even with my pockey full of money

What is it about Thailand that no one can stay on the topic of Thailand? We all know that Thai Vendors from Baht Bus Drivers to Taxi Cabs will generally cheat you if they can. Yet you want to talk about Panama.

These are your words Click, comparing countries having no idea what you are talking about....

People cheat you in here, yes it is a fact.....people assault and hurt you in the countries you claim to be better than Thailand. This is a fact.

ah and I forgot.....don't you dare to talk in Argentina, Panama, or Mexico the same way you do it in here against Thailand...those people are not so pacifists and tolerant as Thais...they will knife you if they can!! a fact!

Edited May 28, 2007 by torito

[rychrde]

WHY IS THAILAND TRUTH TABOO?

I hope it isn't!!

but obviously people here have experiences of other countries, so comparisons can be valid, if they come from experience rather than wiki!

Also, I suspect most people want some kind of personal resolution to any problem. I think learning how to handle a cop who's stopped you for speeding is worth more trying to petition the chief of police to stop corruption.

On another point, I have run forums myself in the past. They are hard work and one gets little thanks apart from seeing the vibrancy of the community (and hopefully some advertising revenue). The restrictions on thaivisa are there to keep it alive and not get blocked. It is very easy to setup another forum without those rules and just have falangs who know how to get around the blocks participate. Can be done. But it's work!

rych

[ThaiGoon]

Sure, Thailand has problems, unique to Thailand but Torito's point was that problems occur everywhere. No matter where you move, if you are bitter, cynical and angry, you'll still be bitter, cynical and angry in the new location.

[solent01]

Or to put it another way sbk, "where ever you go..... there you are......"

I too have never had a problem in thailand, sure scams etc exist here as everywhere, just need to keep your wits about you.

[lannarebirth]

Other countries such as Argentina, Panama or even Mexico don't play with their expats, they treat them with respect.

Immigration in those countries are friendly

As it will happen in any poor country in the world....Argentina, Panama,Mexico?....they will steal from you whenever they can, and with a knife in your throat...they will break in your house and your car.....latinos delinquency is confrontational..

I knew that Asia was difficult in this money aspect since the first day I arrived....and I live with that...but I have never feel more safe in my life than in Thailand, any place, any time...even with my pockey full of money

What is it about Thailand that no one can stay on the topic of Thailand? We all know that Thai Vendors from Baht Bus Drivers to Taxi Cabs will generally cheat you if they can. Yet you want to talk about Panama.

These are your words Click, comparing countries having no idea what you are talking about....

People cheat you in here, yes it is a fact.....people assault and hurt you in the countries you claim to be better than Thailand. This is a fact.

ah and I forgot.....don't you dare to talk in Argentina, Panama, or Mexico the same way you do it in here against Thailand...those people are not so pacifists and tolerant as Thais...they will knife you if they can!! a fact!

Colon (aptly named), Panama is the most dangerous place I've ever been. Idle gangs sit about watching you and then fall in behind you as you walk about. I had to carry a knife in my hand as I walked around.

I own oceanfront property in Mexico and wouldn't even consider to move there now. Total gun/gang culture.

Thailand is like a day in the park by comparison. I have never once felt physically threatened here.

[rychrde]

yeah true, but good to let off steam sometimes.

does anybody feel really personally insulted by what they read on a forum?

really?

[click2delete]

Let's clarify again for those who need it. Other countries such as Argentina, Panama etc .. throw down the red carpet for Expats. Unlike Thailand they want us. A comment was made about my previous posts concerning immigration, and I answered the poster.

My mood would be much better if the Thai Government or lack thereof would stop moving the mark every week. Just graze the Visa Forum and your head will spin.

Now back to the topic - why are so many angry or bitter. I answered that question with aplomb.

[qwertz]

Oh cool! America bashing! It had to happen. A country of 300 million people and they are all dumb.

Educated people know that the use of the word dumb is reserved for people who cannot speak, as in Blind Deaf and Dumb.

I am an American, I assure you, the majority of us are able to speak.

The PC word, Click, is mute.

Edited May 28, 2007 by qwertz

[endure]

Personal gibes will get you a week in the wilderness.

[click2delete]

Oh cool! America bashing! It had to happen. A country of 300 million people and they are all dumb.

Educated people know that the use of the word dumb is reserved for people who cannot speak, as in Blind Deaf and Dumb.

I am an American, I assure you, the majority of us are able to speak.

The PC word, Click, is mute.

Maybe, but I don't do PC. Now, you either meant that we all cannot speak in a derogatory way or ... what?

If you are insinuating that all Americans are "stupid" it would follow that you would use the proper word. I don't read anywhere that dumb means stupid. If it does, show me.

Notice the first definition from Merriam Webster

Main Entry: 1dumb

Pronunciation: 'd&m

Function: adjective

Etymology: Middle English, from Old English; akin to Old High German tumb mute

1 a : lacking the human power of speech <dumb animals> b of a person, often offensive : lacking the ability to speak

2 : temporarily unable to speak (as from shock or astonishment) <struck dumb with fear>

3 : not expressed in uttered words <dumb grief>

4 : SILENT; also : TACITURN

5 : lacking some usual attribute or accompaniment; especially : having no means of self-propulsion <a dumb barge>

6 a : lacking intelligence : STUPID b : showing a lack of intelligence <asking dumb questions> c : requiring no intelligence <dumb luck>

7 : not having the capability to process data <a dumb terminal> -- compare INTELLIGENT 3a

synonym see STUPID

- dumb·ly /'d&m-lE/ adverb

- dumb·ness noun

Edited May 28, 2007 by click2delete

[click2delete]

Colon (aptly named), Panama is the most dangerous place I've ever been. Idle gangs sit about watching you and then fall in behind you as you walk about. I had to carry a knife in my hand as I walked around.

I own oceanfront property in Mexico and wouldn't even consider to move there now. Total gun/gang culture.

Thailand is like a day in the park by comparison. I have never once felt physically threatened here.

In America I many times carried two firearms. I can take you to places in my city where I was nervous driving in and out and I was armed to the teeth. I assure you, the people who live in these neighborhoods would eat the baddest a$$ in Panama, Venezuela or Thailand.

[Jingthing]

Click, so sorry you misunderstood. I did indeed mean that 300 million Americans are mute.

[click2delete]

Click, so sorry you misunderstood. I did indeed mean that 300 million Americans are mute.

Good - I feel better now.

Moderator: Close this thread! It has degenerated into quite a mess.

[qwertz]

Click, sorry to butt in again but you forgot:

dumb waiter

dumb cane

dumbbell

BTW, the Americans got the word from German immigrants; "dumm" = stupid and "stumm" = mute in modern German.

And I never insinuated a thing, you got the wrong BM I think. Just being PC, sorry you don't do it.

Edited May 28, 2007 by qwertz

[wolfmanjack]

Do they have an education over there ? im from devon and as soon as i said i was from England 99 out of a hundred would say which part of london !, but in my experience its common sense they lack,.Went in to a bank with a girlfriend to cash her paycheck, cashier asks for ID, ( fair enough ) ,Geenas driving license had expired by one week, cashier says " im sorry this has expired, i cant accept it " !, i said "she hasnt expired ,thats her in the picture as you can see ", .like talking to a stepford wife, not uncommon,.drove me mad,.

You would get the same response in America. It's called CYA.

Some people give their expired id's to others to be used as fake id's. The law says a valid id and if it is expired it is no longer valid.