Orient Thai Aircraft Trashed

[john b good]

I am a 747 & 777 mechanic and all of us are sworn to secrecy to the FAA and to the safety of the public

Make sure the airline you chose do not have any 777's on their fleet either as our Dave is let loose on these as well.

It's very worrying as Dave is sworn to secrecy he will be unable to tell us which airline he mends the planes for when they get broke, you see I am picking up the technical jargon now.

Looks as if my choice of options is reducing by the minute

[DaveYo]

Relax guys. You can fly and be happy in the sky.

A. As to what parts, no comments (Its a secret)

B. As to Design modifications again no comment. (Its a secret)

C. As to the tallest building in Bangkok, a crack is a crack, so what does a person think concerning the building????? Say yummy, oh goody this building is going to fall and we will be in the World News Tonight?????

D. No, no no. When one supposingly now gets a work permit, they do the cleaners test on you for a positive or negative finding. If they find you positive, I would think they will Vacuum you up, and if negative, just dust you off. Hope this clears that up.

E. Ah, my 777's are indeed safe, and so is my 747's. Feel free to sleep like a baby and snooze it up till you get to your next destination. All clear and all is well so make sure you're buckled up provided you not see the bubble gum attached to it holding it!!!!!!!!

F. Now I must attend to my other secret projects that beckons my attention. Talk to you later!!!!

Fixing this and fixing that, oops forgot to put the bolt in the wrong place, oops, oh well forget it, since it stripped its threads, some Wrigleys chewing gum will do, so now what to do next on this confounded FMC.

Warning, after you get done reading this, some of you might get Paranoid. So please see the designated sign showing the directions to the head shrink for some peace of mind!!!!!!!! --------------------> and follow it judiciously.

Chow chow

Daveyo

[p1p]

Secret??

Crap, Balderdash, Bullsh1t.

On several occasions I have been asked to purchase detailed blueprints and manuals on various planes, 747, 777, Airbus etc. from a respected body in the UK. (OK, I'm keeping who and where quiet!!!)

I walked in, filled in an order form, paid by credit card and walked out with the info, which was required by my wife's uncle, the senior manager in charge of aircraft maintenance at Don Muang.

I was never asked for any identification, other than my credit card and no documents were ever refused on security or other reasons.

It's all in the public domain.

[DaveYo]

To P1P.

First off, why do you have to be the one purchasing detailed blueprints and manuals on various planes if such respected body is in the UK and if they are really legit they can get it over there in Great Britain????????????? Why are you getting such assignments via your wifes Uncle who is supposingly in charge of aircraft maintenance here at Don Muang, and you go to Don Muang in doing such activity???? Here you say you have done such activity on several other occasions.

Secondly yes the FAA knows full well that the security in Don Muang is extremely very poor. Try doing such again in American territory my friend and you wouldn't even get past the first doorway to such privy of information unless you have a valid ID and valid clearances for such information along with a valid employment for such activity.

So who are the people that you are helping in their efforts (along with your wifes Uncle) (from Great Britain) to side track the legit route by employing you to do some (possibly) dirty work on their behalf. How do you know these people are not part of a terrorist cell?????

Obviously the information you have supplied here you become a suspect and a possible danger to the public's safety.

Like it or not you are (and can become) an accessory to possiblity a crime being committed (either by you or your wifes Uncle or those people in UK) by circumventing airline and aircraft security at known airports.

Any comments from other members???

Daveyo

[fatter than harry]

Any comments from other members???

Yes, bless you for asking!

You poor man, is everyday a struggle? Do you vary your daily routine so as not to become an easy target?

In your wardrobe are there any clothes of a camoflage nature? or vests / trousers with lots of extra pockets? for storage of secret stuff?

My mate is an aircraft mechanic in Saudi and he never bloody shuts up about the amount of coke he's left in the engine block, long shifts, right?

[p1p]

First off, why do you have to be the one purchasing detailed blueprints and manuals on various planes if such respected body is in the UK and if they are really legit they can get it over there in Great Britain?????????????  Why are you getting such assignments via your wifes Uncle who is supposingly in charge of aircraft maintenance here at Don Muang,  and you go to Don Muang in doing such activity????  Here you say you have done such activity on several other occasions.

Secondly yes the FAA knows full well that the security in Don Muang is extremely very poor.  Try doing such again in American territory my friend and you wouldn't even get past the first doorway to such privy of information unless you have a valid ID and valid clearances for such information along with a valid employment for such activity.

So who are the people that you are helping in their efforts (along with your wifes Uncle) (from Great Britain) to side track the legit route by employing you to do some (possibly) dirty work on their behalf.  How do you know these people are not part of a terrorist cell?????

Obviously the information you have supplied here you become a suspect and a possible danger to the public's safety.

Like it or not you are (and can become) an accessory to possiblity a crime being committed (either by you or your wifes Uncle or those people in UK)  by circumventing airline and aircraft security at known airports. 

Any comments from other members???

Daveyo

Whoa Boy... Shure wish I knew what you were smoking. Must be the best cure for a hangover in existence. Just don't let my wife have any.

Now. Be a good boy and sit down and quietly and calmly read my post.

Where does it say or even imply I compromised security at Don Muang, any other airport, or anywhere else for that matter? It did not happen.

If you wish, I will give full details of what, when, why and how. But that would be sure to compromise your beloved security. Suffice it to repeat, "all blueprints and manuals etc. are in the public domain" and available over the counter from respected agencies in the UK, the USA and elsewhere. They are not cheap, but they are easy to purchase.

[maerim]

As someone who is sworn to secrecy Dave Yo is certainly verbose to say the least on here but perhaps he has dispensation from above to enlighten us as to the dangers of say an engine falling off mid flight.

Thanks Dave

[DaveYo]

P1P

Your Post-->

On several occasions I have been asked to purchase detailed blueprints and manuals on various planes, 747, 777, Airbus etc. from a respected body in the UK. (OK, I'm keeping who and where quiet!!!)

A. First question , why you?? How come they cannot do it themselves??

Your Post-->

I walked in, filled in an order form, paid by credit card and walked out with the info, which was required by my wife's uncle, the senior manager in charge of aircraft maintenance at Don Muang.

B. What does this say here above????? If your wifes uncle is the senior manager in charge of aircraft maintenance, again why you instead of him??????

Your post -->

I was never asked for any identification, other than my credit card and no documents were ever refused on security or other reasons

C. I do believe this explains the security problem that I mentioned that the FAA is fully aware of concerning Don Muang.

Daveyo

[DaveYo]

Maerim

An engine falling off the wing is a good question. Yes it has happenned in the past. Reason ___> defective bolts. The manufacture of those bolts got sued and is now out of business. But don't worry on the 747, you still have 3 left. As of the 777, I leave that up to you. They only have two on the plane!!!!!

Also before in the past, some years back to simplify the names for you, the tail screws and the flap screws are now known to wear out much faster than anticipated, that was scheduled on the maintenance list for replacements, thus some planes took a dive and I think you know the rest.

Hope that helps

Daveyo

[DaveYo]

Ah ha, no wonder we were trying to figure out that tin noise coming from inside It certainly had us befuddled to know how it got there in the first place.

Thanks for the tip my friend.

[maerim]

An engine falling off the wing is a good question.They only have two on the plane!!!!!

OK Dave things are about as clear as mud now thanks.

You mean to tell me they don't carry a spare, well I never.

From what I can gather then the problem with two engined aircraft as opposed to four engined ones is that if one engine falls off due to defective nuts and bolts it will fly in a circle.

Is this correct?

[p1p]

P1P

Your Post-->

On several occasions I have been asked to purchase detailed blueprints and manuals on various planes, 747, 777, Airbus etc. from a respected body in the UK. (OK, I'm keeping who and where quiet!!!)

A. First question , why you?? How come they cannot do it themselves??

Davey boy, you sure have a rocket up your ass, don't you. I suggest a quiet lie down, some soothing music and maybe an ovaltine to wash down a valium or two. You might then feel a bit better.

Now, as regards "why me?" Would you believe it was simply because of expediency. (Sorry, long word, means it was easier for them.)

I walked in, filled in an order form, paid by credit card and walked out with the info, which was required by my wife's uncle, the senior manager in charge of aircraft maintenance at Don Muang.

B.  What does this say here above?????  If your wifes uncle is the senior manager in charge of aircraft maintenance, again why you instead of him??????

Yet again, would you believe the answer is expediency. (explanation above)

I was never asked for any identification, other than my credit card and no documents were ever refused on security or other reasons

C.  I do believe this explains the security problem that I mentioned that the FAA is fully aware of concerning Don Muang.

Now Dave. Have you taken your valium, got your Ovaltine. Now, please re-read my posts and try to work out where Don Muang security could have been breached. I did not go there, so it was not by me.

Now, be a good boy and leave off the nasty chemicals.

[Crash999]

The aircraft in question were old 747 's(25 yrs +) and there is nothing secret or sensitive in them,except where all the cockroaches hide.

So where do the cockroaches hide? Was wondering about this on my most recent long-haul flight- there surely must be bugs and possibly even larger vermin roaming around in the nooks and crannies of big aircraft.

[Digger]

The aircraft in question were old 747 's(25 yrs +) and there is nothing secret or sensitive in them,except where all the cockroaches hide.

So where do the cockroaches hide? Was wondering about this on my most recent long-haul flight- there surely must be bugs and possibly even larger vermin roaming around in the nooks and crannies of big aircraft.

Dont worry Crash, unless the vermin have been FAA cleared they do not have access to the blueprints and thus dont know which wire to chew through in order to cause a fatal crash.

[Maejo Man]

Out of interest, I just did a quick search on Yahoo for the 747. Well there were 164,000 sites listed, and on flicking through some of the more technical orientated ones, it's possible to find out what type of hydraulic fittings are used throught to detailed engine specifications, but Shhhhhhh don't tell everybody

[maerim]

Out of interest, I just did a quick search on Yahoo for the 747. Well there were 164,000 sites listed, and on flicking through some of the more technical orientated ones, it's possible to find out what type of hydraulic fittings are used throught to detailed engine specifications, but Shhhhhhh don't tell everybody

I just hope DaveYo does read this he will have a fit, all this classified information open to all and sundry.

[p1p]

Looks like he might have taken his valium, (with any luck.)

[Hermano Lobo]

Generally only military aircraft would be covered by such secrecy and even some of their parts have been taken from the civil field because of cost. The fact that the B747-200 was damaged at a Military Airfield seems incredible?

Who has to gain and who has to lose ?

From being mostly monopolised the Thai Airline industry appears to now have opened its doors to deregulation.

When I was involved with some of the Hadj contracts many years ago our Company Boeing 707's suffered from bad driving from airport support vehicles.

This happened in Kano in Nigeria and I remember receiving a telex(no e-mails then) that one of our B707's had been damaged(on purpose) by a ground truck.

"Please send speed tape and pop-rivets we are going to make a repair!"

Nigeria has always been a bit 'crooked Third-World' and this is the first time I have heard of such a thing in a country like Thailand?

How did the culprits get on to a secure area on a military airfield. = Inside collusion?

To effect the damage described at least one of them must have spent time as an aircraft engineer. Surely it would not be too difficult to investigate the list of licences? Unless of course a Foreign National(s) was used which is likely.

I think an odour comes from this incident that resembles the smell inside those old B707's after they had finished the Hadj contract(The cleaners at the UK airfield refused to clean them they were so bad as the pilgrims had no idea what a toilet was and anywhere would do seemed to be their motto!)

Another Thai crime where the culprits are not found or get off ?

[ChiangmaiJim]

I can't understand this thread as all that was said/divulged about the aircraft was the fact that the engines and cockpit were damaged, surely an apprentice terrorist would know this much! I would adopt the same logic if I was to vandalise someone's car!

Or maybe it was the statement "The intruders sneaked into the jetliners through the maintenance foxholes on the aircraft's fuselage, an entrance known only to aviation experts, to carry out the act last Sunday"

I wouldn't have a fox myself as to the whereabouts of these holes!

Have I missed something?

[ChiangmaiJim]

Another thought, although no aviation expert myself, I would presume that if a 747 was to loose one of it's engines (God forbid), then apart from the obvious fuel leaks etc. the aircraft would become unbalanced, and totally uncontrollable.

Its great to be reassured by professionals, thanks.

[Hermano Lobo]

An engine could fall off and as long as there was not an uncontrolable fire a B747 can fly on 3 engines. In some cases even two. I wouldn't try it for fun though.

A BA B747 flew through a volcanic cloud some years back and all FOUR engines stopped. Luckily they got them going again although on landing the edges of the aircraft looked like someone had had a go at them with sandpaper !

The Boeing B747 is one very tough aircraft !

[john b good]

Generally only military aircraft would be covered by such secrecy and even some of their parts have been taken from the civil field because of cost. The fact that the B747-200 was damaged at a Military Airfield seems incredible?

Who has to gain and who has to lose ?

From being mostly monopolised the Thai Airline industry appears to now have opened its doors to deregulation.

When I was involved with some of the Hadj contracts many years ago our Company Boeing 707's suffered from bad driving from airport support vehicles.

This happened in Kano in Nigeria and I remember receiving a telex(no e-mails then) that one of our B707's had been damaged(on purpose) by a ground truck.

"Please send speed tape and pop-rivets we are going to make a repair!"

Nigeria has always been a bit 'crooked Third-World' and this is the first time I have heard of such a thing in a country like Thailand?

How did the culprits get on to a secure area on a military airfield. = Inside collusion?

To effect the damage described at least one of them must have spent time as an aircraft engineer. Surely it would not be too difficult to investigate the list of licences? Unless of course a Foreign National(s) was used which is likely.

I think an odour comes from this incident that resembles the smell inside those old B707's after they had finished the Hadj contract(The cleaners at the UK airfield refused to clean them they were so bad as the pilgrims had no idea what a toilet was and anywhere would do seemed to be their motto!)

Another Thai crime where the culprits are not found or get off ?

How did the culprits get on to a secure area on a military airfield. = Inside collusion?

You have made a good point Herman.

But when you allow for the local factor anything can (and very often does) happen here.

You aint seen nothin yet!!

[maerim]

At their October meeting in the clubhouse at Fairoaks Airport, Woking Branch members of the Aircrew Association were fascinated by Retired Captain Eric Moody of British Airways, speaking on his encounter with the plume of ash and smoke issuing from Mount Galanggung, an active volcano on Java, South of Jakarta. He was flying at 37,000 feet in a Boeing 747, and carrying 247 passengers from Kuala Lumpur to Perth, when he suddenly noticed puffs of "smoke" billowing out from the air conditioning vents at floor level, and a smell which he described as "acrid, or ionised electrical", such as one finds near sparks from electrical machinery. The Flight Deck windscreens became ablaze with the most intense display of "St. Elmo’s Fire" he had ever seen, and the engine intakes were glowing as if lit from within. The electrical discharges had a stroboscopic effect which gave the illusion that the fans were turning slowly backwards!

At this point, the Flight Engineer announced "Engine failure Number 4", so the crew immediately carried out the fire drill. Whilst the Captain was still worrying about the smoke coming into the aircraft, which at that time he thought was the major hazard, the remaining three engines also failed - an unbelievable event which just doesn’t happen in modern aircraft! After trimming the autopilot to control the aircraft in a gentle gliding descent the crew had time to consider all possible system faults which might explain this extraordinary situation, but it was incomprehensible. Eric Moody was one of the few BA 747 captains who had completed a simulator exercise into actions after complete engine failure, but since reality and the simulated situation were very different, this experience further added to their diagnostic problems. Indeed, they had no idea what had caused the problem until some time after they landed, as the ash cloud was only reported some days afterwards. So their initial impression was that they must have done something wrong (like fuel management, for example.)

All attempts to relight the engines failed, although the fuel had been igniting outside the engines, and treating those passengers with window seats a view of, what appeared to be, four engines on fire! At about this time, the cabin pressure reached 14,000 ft, the passenger oxygen masks were deployed, and Captain Moody was contemplating the need to turn away from the mountains and to face the horrendous prospect of having to ditch the fully loaded aircraft into the sea in the dark. His thoughts were interrupted by jubilation from the other two crew members, as No. 4 engine successfully restarted. By the time the other three engines started, an interminable 90 seconds later, they were down to 12.000 feet, where the safety height was 10,500 feet.

Following a Mayday call, they were cleared to Jakarta airport, but their troubles were not over. The Instrument Landing System glidepath information was not available for the duty runway, and while the aircraft was on base leg for landing, the crew had great difficulty in picking out the runway lights. Eventually the runway was spotted to the right of the aircraft out of the co-pilot’s side window; but when they lined up with the runway, the lights disappeared again, and the crew realised that their front windscreen was almost opaque. The final descent to touchdown was made using the localiser to stay on the centreline, and by peering through the outer edge of the front window, which was still clear. The delay before the wheels touched down felt like minutes rather than seconds but, downstairs in the cabin, spontaneous cheers and clapping broke out from the passengers.

This incident hapened in 1982 whilst flying over Java I knew a woman from New Zealand who was on the aircraft at the time.

She made no mention of the queues for the toilets afterwards.

[Hermano Lobo]

John B Good

O senor it is Hermano = Brother

Lobo = Wolf

I went for the wrong entrance to the Royal Thai Air Force Museum.

The security seemed good enough !

Suspicious or what !

You would need knowledge to knobble a B747 properly !

[DaveYo]

Well enjoy yourselves looking at the blueprints. You say you know all about it. Good for you. I am happy about that.

I liked reading all this coming from some people who never spent 1 hour of official training and of course most importantly self learners who know what they are doing or saying.

You can guess who. This thread is closed for me. Chow chow

[maerim]

DaveYo

I don't think they are called blueprints anymore but engineering drawings but your info on the security aspect of aircraft i.e. doors and engines has been gratefuly recieved, thanks.

Oh and Dave just before you ride off into the sunset, any chance of a song?

[fatter than harry]

If I may be so bold...

[clears throat]

Ladies and Gentlemen! I'd like to bring you this stirring rendition of a traditional bluegrass tune some of you may remember from the popular motion picture 'Oh brother where art thou' I bring it alive for you today, with a little help from my muppet friends.

[slow jigging, elbows high]

[The Muppets] In constant sorrow all through his days!

I am a man of constant sorrow,

I've seen trouble all my days.

[The Muppets] he's seen trouble all his days!

I bid farewell to old Kentucky,

The place where I was born and raised.

[The Muppets] The place where he was born and raised!

--- [Miss Piggy] Banjo breakdown ---

For six long years, I've been in trouble.

no pleasure here, on earth I've found.

[The Muppets] no pleasure here, on earth he's found!

For in this world, I'm bound to ramble,

I have no friends to help me now.

[The Muppets] He has no friends to help him now!

It's fare thee well, my old true lover,

I ne'er expect to see you again.

[The Muppets] He ne'er expects to see you again!

For I'm bound to ride, that Northern Railroad,

Perhaps I'll die upon this train.

[The Muppets] Perhaps he'll die upon this train!

You can bury me in some deep Valley,

For many years, there I may lay.

[The Muppets] For many years, there he may lay!

Then you may learn to love another

while I am sleeping in my grave

[The Muppets] While he is sleeping in his grave!

Maybe your friends think I'm just a stranger,

My face you'll never see no more.

[The Muppets] His face you'll never see no more!

But, there is one promise that is given,

I'll meet you on God's golden shore.

[The Muppets] He'll meet you on God's golden shore!

[astral]

Another thought, although no aviation expert myself, I would presume that if a 747 was to loose one of it's engines (God forbid), then apart from the obvious fuel leaks etc. the aircraft would become unbalanced, and totally uncontrollable.

Its great to be reassured by professionals, thanks.

Back in the 60's a civilian jet, probably a 707 in those days did loose and engine over southern England and still made it in to land at London Heathrow.

Those babies are more resilient than you think.

[maerim]

Back in the 60's a civilian jet, probably a 707 in those days did loose and engine over southern England and still made it in to land at London Heathrow

I bet the bloke who's garden it landed in is still talking about it in the pub now.

[Hermano Lobo]

Back in the 60's a civilian jet, probably a 707 in those days did loose and engine over southern England and still made it in to land at London Heathrow.

Those babies are more resilient than you think.

I know it sounds odd but the engines are designed to come off under certain catastrophic circumstances.