Visa Run Accident

[goldfinger]

mattias 33,

some things you are posting are really nonsens-better talk about facts or the truth.

[GetBackJoJo]

Hi Roo

What i mean is, if he has an arangment with the police - and i would bet my house on it - then by default, he is legal. If the police ok him driving, then he is essentialy legal.

For all we know, he may have citizenship.

For all we know, the law may have been officialy bent through various loopholes and he has legal docs to show he can drive.

Herbert is not daft - if it was illegal for him to drive, he would not. There is almost certainly a grey area to this law which he has probably not manipulated, but rather adhered to, using the proper procedures.

What i am certain of is that you and I do not know the laws, beyond the scope of your initial and rather closed statement of 'FERANG IS NOT ALLOWED TO DO FOR HIRE OR REWARD'. This alone, is not substantial - there is possibly all maner of loopholes which entitle Herbert to drive, quite legaly.

Essentialy, what you are doing is jumping on a web forum consisting of Herberts target market, advising his customers that he is running an illegal business. Thats not fair and a little spitefull, actualy, considering you have no facts.

It annoys me. The guy has completed 800 successfull trips, yet just one crash and the judge and jury of Thai Visa Samui forum is here announcing all these negative insights to his pottential customers when at the end of the day, its as simple as this; the guy had a crash, pure accident. Simple as that. No need to condem every other aspect of his service which is, may i reiterate, rather brilliant.

Value your life? Foir heavens sake Roo....!!!

How many people have died from Thailand visa runs, since conception decades ago? Truthfully, i dont know; but i will take a wild guess at ZERO. I fail to remember any news articles reporting death on visa runs and yet here we are, talking about the pottential threat of life on a visa run. Its never happened, so why bring it up?

There was s immilar discussion on this forum around a year ago regarding quad bikes on Samui and the total detah and destruction just around the corner. The usual doom mongers jumped on, worried out of there minds about these contraptions - how many nasty accidents have actualy transpired?

Just, you know.... take it easy, relax, recline, and stop thinking the worst. The poor bloke has a business to run - a reputable business thta has been running for years and most of the ex-pats know Herbert personaly. Its way unfair to jump on this forum and slander the guys business over a one off, out of the blue, freak accident.

Maybe its not the visa that got you to fly from Bangkok to samui to join Herberts trips. Are you sure your not secretly in love with the guy? By the way, flying from Bangkok to samui and join a bustrip from here and then fly back to bangkok sounds really stupid. I know you want him to look good and for some reason (commission?) you really want to promote the insane buisness he do, but lets not overdo it.

Off course there should be people that like the trip, but you are now defending stuff to a limit where at least i get a bit confused.....

Mattius, you did not read my post in full. To be clear, i said that for me, it was a good way to catch up with old buddies on samui and go on a decent visa run at the same time. I could have flown to Singers from BKK and got a TV. I could have flown to Penang from BKK and got a TV. hel_l, i could have flown to Loas and got a TV. However, none of these destinations would have been in any way fun - yet i could fly to Samui, a place where i have many pals, catch up with the lads over a few beers, and then do my visa run. In terms of actual time, it cost me a day more than going to Singers - yet in an unstable climate in terms of tourist visas, i felt safer going with Herbert as i know he always comes up with the goods, PLUS i got to spend a day or two with my mates on my old island home.

I hope thats clear for you now.

No i am not on commision, please do not be so obsurd. How exactly i am supposed to recruit new customers on this forum is beyong my thinking. Maybe i just hate to see a good bloke get slagged off by anon posters, who do not know the facts.

[elfe]

as far as i know the schedule has changed already and they are leaving 2 hours earlier now...

[poorfarang]

Who cares if its legal or illegal? The police and immigration officials are obviously paid off on these visa run trips.

Herbert knows what he is doing and that is why I go with him. Hes not out to make a buck and scam you like most of the other visa run companies. He took me aside and explained to me a way I could organize my visa so I could take less visa runs (which in turn means less cash in his pocket) but he did it because he genuinely cares about helping out fellow farang.

Before going with herbert I used a thai visa run service that went to Ranong and I was never so scared in my life. These Thai drivers would have the peddle to the metal while you were driving around mountain sides on 1 lane roads.

When we go with herbert everything is fast. We are in and out of immigration in 10 mins

[mattias33]

Hi Roo

What i mean is, if he has an arangment with the police - and i would bet my house on it - then by default, he is legal. If the police ok him driving, then he is essentialy legal.

For all we know, he may have citizenship.

For all we know, the law may have been officialy bent through various loopholes and he has legal docs to show he can drive.

Herbert is not daft - if it was illegal for him to drive, he would not. There is almost certainly a grey area to this law which he has probably not manipulated, but rather adhered to, using the proper procedures.

What i am certain of is that you and I do not know the laws, beyond the scope of your initial and rather closed statement of 'FERANG IS NOT ALLOWED TO DO FOR HIRE OR REWARD'. This alone, is not substantial - there is possibly all maner of loopholes which entitle Herbert to drive, quite legaly.

Essentialy, what you are doing is jumping on a web forum consisting of Herberts target market, advising his customers that he is running an illegal business. Thats not fair and a little spitefull, actualy, considering you have no facts.

It annoys me. The guy has completed 800 successfull trips, yet just one crash and the judge and jury of Thai Visa Samui forum is here announcing all these negative insights to his pottential customers when at the end of the day, its as simple as this; the guy had a crash, pure accident. Simple as that. No need to condem every other aspect of his service which is, may i reiterate, rather brilliant.

Value your life? Foir heavens sake Roo....!!!

How many people have died from Thailand visa runs, since conception decades ago? Truthfully, i dont know; but i will take a wild guess at ZERO. I fail to remember any news articles reporting death on visa runs and yet here we are, talking about the pottential threat of life on a visa run. Its never happened, so why bring it up?

There was s immilar discussion on this forum around a year ago regarding quad bikes on Samui and the total detah and destruction just around the corner. The usual doom mongers jumped on, worried out of there minds about these contraptions - how many nasty accidents have actualy transpired?

Just, you know.... take it easy, relax, recline, and stop thinking the worst. The poor bloke has a business to run - a reputable business thta has been running for years and most of the ex-pats know Herbert personaly. Its way unfair to jump on this forum and slander the guys business over a one off, out of the blue, freak accident.

Maybe its not the visa that got you to fly from Bangkok to samui to join Herberts trips. Are you sure your not secretly in love with the guy? By the way, flying from Bangkok to samui and join a bustrip from here and then fly back to bangkok sounds really stupid. I know you want him to look good and for some reason (commission?) you really want to promote the insane buisness he do, but lets not overdo it.

Off course there should be people that like the trip, but you are now defending stuff to a limit where at least i get a bit confused.....

Mattius, you did not read my post in full. To be clear, i said that for me, it was a good way to catch up with old buddies on samui and go on a decent visa run at the same time. I could have flown to Singers from BKK and got a TV. I could have flown to Penang from BKK and got a TV. hel_l, i could have flown to Loas and got a TV. However, none of these destinations would have been in any way fun - yet i could fly to Samui, a place where i have many pals, catch up with the lads over a few beers, and then do my visa run. In terms of actual time, it cost me a day more than going to Singers - yet in an unstable climate in terms of tourist visas, i felt safer going with Herbert as i know he always comes up with the goods, PLUS i got to spend a day or two with my mates on my old island home.

I hope thats clear for you now.

No i am not on commision, please do not be so obsurd. How exactly i am supposed to recruit new customers on this forum is beyong my thinking. Maybe i just hate to see a good bloke get slagged off by anon posters, who do not know the facts.

I get you on that. Anyway all costumers have the right to say there opinion. That is the real point with a forum like this. Objective truth from us all, the costumers. If we start to think that we cant say the honest truth about products or services because we might "slagg" somebody that somebody else like, thats when the forum in a way gets pointless. If you read for instans this whole post up to this date i think you get a quite honest opinion, and also close to the truth about what Herberts trips are all about. Fast, effective,you sure get a visa,risky, all the other things that are brought up in these 3 pages. I think somebody that never went with Herbert can actually read this whole thread and then make his own decission to use or not. Based on facts that we all put in here with our different point of views and differense in taste and needs. To me thats what make the forum interresting, a bit more informative than an ad in samui-express. And, yes, i can clearly see that we (mostly i) slagged the guy a bit when i been telling my truth (nothing is made up) and i wouldnt want that kind of posts about my own buisness off course, but then again the groundmisstake in that matter is made by Herbert himself during a long period of time not listening to advise and tips from costumers. I still dont feel the need of defending dangerous activitys. Thats what i meant with the commission question because you where starting to defend and making it normal to have special deals with the police and speeding and all that stuff. You obviosly like the guy and the service he provide and i respect that point of view, but defending every single move he do as he is somekind of good is like i said before a bit overdoing it. But good thing is we got all thogether an informative thread about Herberts visaruns. As usuall we manage to leave te op topic quite quick (bottom rule of the forum?) but interresting discussions came up. Cheers.

[mattias33]

mattias 33,

some things you are posting are really nonsens-better talk about facts or the truth.

Got you. Very imformative post, gonna try to learn how to write as much facts and truth as you in the future. Might take a while.

[Rooo]

as far as i know the schedule has changed already and they are leaving 2 hours earlier now...

He must have taken some advice.Why don't we wait & see what feedback we get from more recent trips.

[mattias33]

as far as i know the schedule has changed already and they are leaving 2 hours earlier now...

He must have taken some advice.Why don't we wait & see what feedback we get from more recent trips.

That sounds good. Anybody got more info on that?

[Samuian]

You guys are being very unfair.

Why, because some are simply airing their opinion, since when is this unfair? if everyu body would be entirely satisfied there wouldn't besuch a thread in the first place, would there?

exactly what they say on the tin' - quick, cheap, no messing about. His main selling point and reputation is that you know from start to finish, it’s going to be very organized.

Cheap? 1400.- for a Border run is Cheap? I can go for half of that all way to Penang!

Seems some of you disagree with his 'pee pee' rules. Yup, it is reminiscent of being on a school coach trip as a 12 year old but there is a method to his madness. Everything is planned so accurately, the slightest thing out of routine can cause problems.

Come on they are all adults - accurately? Thats being cut off human rights the very moment you've entered this mini van!

As it has been written here already, how much of time will an unscheduled stop cost, 5 Min. 10 by the absolut max.!

For example, he does make it clear on the ferry, early in the morning that there will be scheduled stops and they will not be deviated from. He explains, quite clearly, that 'that’s the way it is - we don’t stop for anything or anyone apart from the scheduled stops'. He explains that no booze is allowed on the bus and also explains that you should maybe use the ferry toilet before getting on the bus, as you won’t have a chance for another few hours. These trips are scheduled with the logic that after 3 hours, the chances are that most people will need a piss - as apposed to just one person, after one hour. 5 people all making unscheduled stops, 5 times would probably cost him an hour - and, he still has to make his scheduled stops. The only reason that this could be a problem is if you have a medical condition - and if that’s the case, you should not be on a visa run with any company, full stop.

You got to be joking, are you the PR Consultant of this Company? This Company is paid for a SERVICE by the CUSTOMER, if the CUSTOMER NEEDS require anything out of schedule, shoulnd't the COMPANY do ALL to serve the CUSTOMERS needs?

What if someone, because of the stress involved, suffers a heart attack, will he/she have to wait till the next 'scheduled' stop, or even till the Ferry Pier is reached?

If he lets one person stop at a service station after say, one hour, you can almost guarantee that someone else will get out. Then the hung-over guy who has been caning it all night slips away and buys a can of beer, lights a cigarette, Herbert asks him to get back on the bus, the drunk guy takes issue and starts an argument…. Etc etc, et al.

It's a century old argument, it's NOT about filling up on booze it's about unscheduled stop, because of 'unscheduled' CALLS of NATURE!

[Samuian]

Visa runs are not as simple as you think to organize. Not if you want efficiency.

What efficiency? Is being pushy and rude towards simple NEEDS of CUSTOMERS is efficiency? You really make me smile! A bit of organizing, a certain routine, and hey after all why is he doing it? Is he a Samaritan? or is this done out of business considerations? I understand it's quite lucrative, this border/vis run business.

Who cares about loosing an hour you ask? Well, he does., and so do most of the people on the bus. Don’t forget, Herbert is up at like 3am in order to fly around the ringroad picking everyone up before the ferry - many visa run companies ask you to make your own way to the travel agency. Then, when he gets to the hotel later that night and everyone else jumps in bed, he takes your passports, application forms, money etc and sits in his room making sure everything is organized and spot on. Then he has to pay the hotel, find out who is in which room, plus he has to eat just like everyone else! This takes a good couple of hours. Then he is up the next morning a good hour before everyone else, organsing the morning ahead. The quicker he gets to the hotel, the better. The alternative is to casually drive to the border, and let everyone organize it all themselves at the border. You can almost guarantee, it will take ten times as long this way - especially considering the idiots that get the paperwork wrong and delay everyone else.

Very funny, it's ALL part of the business. And why are the others "Idiots"? Why, can only he get it right?

Also, think of the benefits when you actually get to the consulate. You are in and out in 5 minutes. A Thai company would just drop you off there and let you get on with it.

In just 5 Minutes????? A new VISA, does the Embassy has all the Paperwork done in Advance? That "other Thai Companies" would "just drop you off..." isn't true either it's all PR for this particular business!!

If you are happen to be his "friend" why not pass on some advice, take it a bit easier, if a customer has a personal need like this "unscheduled call of nature", let it comment less happen - this business will do even better because of more happy and satisfied customers!

And why is Herbert being singled out for driving fast? .... This is preferable to being crammed into a tiny, 15 year old min bus with faulty air con.

well, they aren't, aren't they? And not ONLY fast but occasionally AT HIGH RISK too! This Business isn't "singled out" - and "15 year old minivans with defunct A/C" is really bad defense boy! Others are as bad, but maybe you/they can take a lesson of their CUSTOMERS and listen to their opinion!

The point is - it is not the speed at which they drive that helps you achieve a quick visa run as they all drive fast. It’s the organization. He plans everything so finely that any deviation can ruin the day.

:D :D wel, I call that "upright tight" why is everything SO exaggerated? One or 2 extra, unscheduled pee stops will "ruin a whole day" ???? You got to be joking! It happens that the human being and many other creatures happen to have "calls of nature" absolutely OUT of SCHEDULE, despite ALL kind of "fine planning"! Nobody wants to pick daisies or Coconuts!

Herbert is no more dangerous than any other operator and you know there will be no hassles, problems or delays at the border - which you can almost guarantee with a Thai visa runner.

Well, so what makes this particular Visa Run than so much better? the "effieciency", being exactly as DANGEROUS as the "others", the presence of a DVD player? The"time factor" of may be one or two hours difference, but a much higher stress factor?

Edited September 8, 2007 by Samuian

[Samuian]

All this talk of danger makes me laugh. ...

\

Well, if you are not Herbert himself or a company associate - I can't understand it at all - WHO the hel_l gives ANYONE in this world the right to put other peoples LIFES knowingly in DANGER? And that makes you laugh??? Is ti the lawlessness, paying the "cops" security? If anything happens the responsiable people know that they will get away with it, is it this? Because this is what I read between the lines of this pro-Visa Run, playing down everything, post!

A newcomer to his service will get the immediate initial impresion that Herbert is almost like a military seargent major issuing orders to his subjects.

Well, you see and her is the point where it is all wrong - they aren't his "Subjects" they are CUSTOMERS who pay for a service!

The fact is, he has a responsibility to his customers to provide a well organized trip. He has to make sure that everyone understands clearly how the day will pan out. When you stop at the service station and he shouts out loud '10 minutes and not a second more', he is not bullying you, he is ensuring that he dosent let you down becasue of the one guy who wanders off to talk to his tee rak on the mobile for half an hour.

Again, playing down the real core of the situation! It's NOT about "Joe" talking to his tee rak!

that he is the most organized, reliable, hassle free visa runner in the entire Kingdom.

Isn't that a bit far fetched, PR Agent?

Never, in all my trips with Herbert, have I ever experience problems – on the contrary, they have always been seamless, quick, efficient and you have e general sense that someone is there taking control.

Yes, it's about IF there occurs a PROBLEM, you may NEVER EVER have a Problem again! And this is NOT efficiency, it's ruthlessness! Anywhere in EU, In GB in the "real world" this would have been stopped for long! The country this guy is from, has severe penalties for speeding on highways and reckless driving - he would certainly be without a license already! Not to mention about a license for public transport and the RESPONSE ABILITIES connected to such operations!

Especially he is NOT a local, he should know MUCH better and do so!

This is my point regarding reckless public transport operations, for what reason ever, there is NO reason reasonable enough to be rude to customers, ignorant towards customers needs and KNOWINGLY putting CUSTOMERS in DANGEROUS situations!

And NOTHING, not so called "EFFICIENCY", no "fast and reliable" slogan, will make the wrong, right, or even a "better service"!

It can be done in a much more relaxed way, think about it!

just a thought or 2 and my 2 cents...

Edited September 8, 2007 by Samuian

[GetBackJoJo]

Jesus. If i am the PR consultant for this company (which im not) i guess your little three consecutive post war makes you his competition? Ok - lets go through it again.

You guys are being very unfair.

Why, because some are simply airing their opinion, since when is this unfair? if everyu body would be entirely satisfied there wouldn't besuch a thread in the first place, would there?

Airing an opinion negates anything which could be unfair, does it? If i was to insult you on this thread, it would be unfair and my post would likely be removed.... yet it would still be my opinion. Opinions and fairness are not mutualy exclusive. Please read back on my post; the reason i see it as unfiar is that the guys has a crash, and the doom mongers jump on a TV thread describing the negative aspects of a visa run in a way that makes them sound unique to herberts trip. Granted, he drived quick - granted, he only stops once or twice on the way - but this is common with ALL visa run companies. It is un fair that his service is being singled out as unique in this respect.

Cheap? 1400.- for a Border run is Cheap? I can go for half of that all way to Penang!

No, you cant. Not on an organised group run, return. Whats the point of your post here? I can fly to Cambodia for a few thousand baht - or i can get the bus, for 800 Baht. Does this make flying expensive?

Come on they are all adults - accurately? Thats being cut off human rights the very moment you've entered this mini van!

As it has been written here already, how much of time will an unscheduled stop cost, 5 Min. 10 by the absolut max.!

Human rights? Dear heavens above boy - get a grip. Unless Herberts mini bus is crammed with 10,000 burmese refugess, which i doubt very likley, may i suggest you are being a little dramatic here.

You got to be joking, are you the PR Consultant of this Company? This Company is paid for a SERVICE by the CUSTOMER, if the CUSTOMER NEEDS require anything out of schedule, shoulnd't the COMPANY do ALL to serve the CUSTOMERS needs?

What if someone, because of the stress involved, suffers a heart attack, will he/she have to wait till the next 'scheduled' stop, or even till the Ferry Pier is reached?

No, <deleted>, I am just a guy who hates to see a reputable established and trusted service dismissed as crap - by doom mongers, like you, for little reason. had this thread been discussing the actual event - the crash - i may not have stuck my nose in. However, as per bloody usual, here we go with a whole host of posters banging on about the whole kit and schebudle. Jesus Christ! Its just another excuse to moan, complain and generaly have a go at the ills of anything in particlular! Some of you guys just frikin love a good old moan!!!! And dont wave the 'opinion' flag in response to this - its unfair, plain and simple. You can stick your opinion firmly where the sun dont shine mate - its out of order, plain and simple.

Yes this SERVICE is a SERVICE paid for by the CUSTOMER who expects to arive ON SCHEDULE with LITTLE FUSS AT THE BORDER/HOTEL. However you may have a point, and i now feel INSPIRED to demand that the air steward of my next air flight alows me to sit on the captains lap of my flight back to the Uk as, after all, its a SERVICE i have paid for AND I DEMAND ANYTHING I WANT, WHENEVER I WANT. Should the captians wife not be waiting for me on arival, donned in her Victoria Secrets susspenders with a bottle of tequila and promise, i will jump on this forum and complian about how crap British Airways are.

I alrerady explained - ill explain again. If one guy asks to stop for a pee, another guy gets out and lights a smoke. Another guy uses this opportunity to call his Mrs in Udon. A 2 minute stop culminates in a 20 minute stop. Half an hour later, someone else needs 'pee pee' They have to stop again, as it would be unfair not to, seeing as they stopped for the other guy 20 mins earlier. Its a schedule - a confirmed schedule that is planned for a reason. If you cant hold your bladder for a couple of hours, then you shouldnt be on a visa run! FLY!!!

Heart Attacks? Are you not taking the whole point heer to the extreme? Do you honestly imagine that Herbert considers a heart attack and the need for a piss in the same bracket? Mate.... again, get a grip.

It's a century old argument, it's NOT about filling up on booze it's about unscheduled stop, because of 'unscheduled' CALLS of NATURE!

I dont know where you come from. Frankly, nor do i care. But let me ask you this; in your home country, im assuming you have a bus service. Would you consider it unfair if the driver of the bus would not make a stop on the side of the road, so you can piss? Lets imagine you are on a Baht bus in BKK.... would you jump on the TV forum and condem the BKK bus service if the driver did not permit you to stop on the corner of Suk 37 and piss in the 7/11 doorway?

What efficiency? Is being pushy and rude towards simple NEEDS of CUSTOMERS is efficiency? You really make me smile! A bit of organizing, a certain routine, and hey after all why is he doing it? Is he a Samaritan? or is this done out of business considerations? I understand it's quite lucrative, this border/vis run business.

Have you been on a visa run with Herbert? If not, you are not qualified to offer an opinion on his efficiency.

Please also qualify why 'you understand' its quite lucrative. I would like to know what insight you have into this - where you get your info from.

This is Herberts living. His job. His bread and butter. Of course he is in it for the money - though by my estimations, it is not a truck load of revenue for the guy, however it is adequate, yes. In the same breath, as another poster pointed out, he is a by no means an 'evile genius' who rapes evry penny out of you.... He will advise you on certain procedures that will ensure you have to do LESS visa runs, in your benefit and not his. I am also aware of at least two people that i know who, last year, whilst down on there luck had been granted a visa run on credit, pay later. I have also been on a visa run with Herbert with only three customers on the bus - a loss for him, yet he still fulfiled the trip as he didnt want to let us down.

Very funny, it's ALL part of the business. And why are the others "Idiots"? Why, can only he get it right?

I am begining to wonder if you have ever been on a visa run. OK; The guy who fils the form incorectly. The guy who applies for the wrong visa. The guy who fills his TM card wrongly. etc etc, et al.

In just 5 Minutes????? A new VISA, does the Embassy has all the Paperwork done in Advance? That "other Thai Companies" would "just drop you off..." isn't true either it's all PR for this particular business!!

If you are happen to be his "friend" why not pass on some advice, take it a bit easier, if a customer has a personal need like this "unscheduled call of nature", let it comment less happen - this business will do even better because of more happy and satisfied customers!

As you are still banging on about 'human rights' (people, for human rights read = pee pee) i will not reply to this, as i have it covered. Lets talk about the consulate. You arive with the consulate officials allready given a 'heads up' that 14 of you are coming in 45 minutes. There is adequate staff on hand. The passports are given along with the forms in an orderly fashion, and you are out of there in litteraly 5 minutes. If you have ever been on a Thai visa run with a group of people, it would take miniumum one hour to go through these motions.

Again, you have not read my posts in full. I am not suggesting you get a visa in 5 minutes - i am stressing that you are in and out in 5 minutes. Owing to this efficiency and correct paperwork that Herbert has reviewd and checked the night before, the chances are you pick up your visa WITHIN A COUPLE OF HOURS. Honestly, do you think you would get this with a Thai visa run to Penang?

well, they aren't, aren't they? And not ONLY fast but occasionally AT HIGH RISK too! This Business isn't "singled out" - and "15 year old minivans with defunct A/C" is really bad defense boy! Others are as bad, but maybe you/they can take a lesson of their CUSTOMERS and listen to their opinion!

Yes, IT IS singled out. All the talk of driving fast has been reversed exclusivley for Herbert on this thread which is unfair, AS THEY ALL DRIVE FAST. Your suggestion of driving at hig risk is your perception, not mine. Personaly, i have a backbone and do not worry about driving at speed.

wel, I call that "upright tight" why is everything SO exaggerated? One or 2 extra, unscheduled pee stops will "ruin a whole day" ???? You got to be joking! It happens that the human being and many other creatures happen to have "calls of nature" absolutely OUT of SCHEDULE, despite ALL kind of "fine planning"! Nobody wants to pick daisies or Coconuts!

Here we are agin with your sole argument - taking a piss. I have covered this though i do have a feeling, considering you have missed all my points on this, that i will have to go over it again, just for you, at a later stage.

Before i answer this, i have a question for you; Have you been on a Herbert visa run and also a Thai visa run? I have. I am qualified to answer this and i have allready described in full the benefits in earlier posts. Im not going to do do again, simply becasue you are so blinkered and choose not to digest the merits of this service.

Well, if you are not Herbert himself or a company associate - I can't understand it at all - WHO the hel_l gives ANYONE in this world the right to put other peoples LIFES knowingly in DANGER? And that makes you laugh??? Is ti the lawlessness, paying the "cops" security? If anything happens the responsiable people know that they will get away with it, is it this? Because this is what I read between the lines of this pro-Visa Run, playing down everything, post!

And who the hel_l ARE YOU to suggest a visa run with this guy will furnish you with an apointment with Mr Reaper? hang on a second.... Mr Judge and Jury; where are you getting you facts from that he is dangerous? One bloody crash in 800 trips, is that it? or are you using others opinions that THEY feel he drives fast AS YOUR OWN. Herbert is not putting anyones life in danger - grow up, and stop being such a bloody drama queen. he drives at EXACTLY THE SAME SPEED AS ALL VISA RUNNERS!!!!! The buss that i use from Central Thailand to BKK drivers EVEN FASTER than Herbert - but you wont complain about that, as it is a goverment bus.

Well, you see and her is the point where it is all wrong - they aren't his "Subjects" they are CUSTOMERS who pay for a service!

NO. Again you are missing the point!!! herbert treats all of his customers as customers. He is proffesional and full of advice. However, he organises the trip very well and makes all aspects of the trip clear to you on departure. I also made a point that herbert is a good blocke who has a laugh and a joke with you - interesting how you did not comment on that

Isn't that a bit far fetched, PR Agent?

I am not his bloody pr agent and let me tell you, if you pm me i will give you my mobile number and you can make the same childish comment to me verably. Again, i qualified why i feel that way - i have done visa runs all over the Kingdom, and his is the best. As simple as that. For a guy whose sole argument is the 'pee pee' issue and 'opinions', i am suprised you are not respecting my opinion there.

Yes, it's about IF there occurs a PROBLEM, you may NEVER EVER have a Problem again! And this is NOT efficiency, it's ruthlessness! Anywhere in EU, In GB in the "real world" this would have been stopped for long! The country this guy is from, has severe penalties for speeding on highways and reckless driving - he would certainly be without a license already! Not to mention about a license for public transport and the RESPONSE ABILITIES connected to such operations!

Especially he is NOT a local, he should know MUCH better and do so!

This is my point regarding reckless public transport operations, for what reason ever, there is NO reason reasonable enough to be rude to customers, ignorant towards customers needs and KNOWINGLY putting CUSTOMERS in DANGEROUS situations!

And NOTHING, not so called "EFFICIENCY", no "fast and reliable" slogan, will make the wrong, right, or even a "better service"!

It can be done in a much more relaxed way, think about it!

just a thought or 2 and my 2 cents...

Yes but im afriad WE DO NOT LIVE IN THE EU!!! Its not his fault that the Thia governemt makes you border bounce every 30/90 days is it! The service is there as the goverment ensured so!!! Or is that Herberts fals also????

WHAT WRONG!!! WHAT RIGHT!!! what on earth are you talking about now!!!! Are you getting moral here pal? Or are we back to the driving fast/pee pee thing again?

Fact is, you have two points to make;

He drives fast

You can only take a piss every couple of hours.

If you do not like driving fast - dont go! This is the nature of a quick and cheap visa run!!! Do you expect him to casualy meander down the highway on the back of a sodding elaphant, donned with parasol??? Its a quick cheap visa run that hundres of companies in the Kingsom offer!! They all drive quick and AND ON NONE OF THEM can you stop every 20 mins for a piss!!!

[goldfinger]

maybe, to find a solution on the Pi...ah Toilet prob,

herbert can offer some nappys for those who need...

[keepsamuiclean]

Herbert, IF you read this: Please NO nappy for me on my 10th or so visa run next week. Hope that I'll get the seat as usual and that I can sleep again during the bus ride.

For the others: I do not walk anylonger on the ringroad of Samui as I find this dangerous with lots of construction trucks and concrete mixers on the road. But I do not remember one single moment on Herberts bus where I felt insecure.

[goldfinger]

Edited September 8, 2007 by goldfinger

[mattias33]

Getbackjojo.

You say Herbert treat all of his costumers like custumers?? Is that something you really mean or did it just come in the speed of writing?

I didnt see him treat anybody like a costumer on the trip i went thats for sure. He shouted like a millitary all the time and to prove his power he for instans when we came from malaysia did a quick stop at the hotel and he said "anybody want a beer before we go?" Everybody bought a big bottle of leo since that was all they had and Herbert himself helped the barman serving them. I thought that if he encourage this bottle he must give us at least 15 minuites to drink it. F. Me. 4 Minuites after i got my bottle he is shouting "boarding!". We had to ruch. Not to a border, not to a ferry, not to get sleep in somewhere or to have time to organize. We had to stress it so we could all have maximum waiting-time in hat yai were he droped us at a mall 7 in the evening and picked us up 1 in the morning.

I said it before : totally pointless stress most of the time.

If you are late to an ambassy and realise that you have to run, thats motivated stress. Run and get it done. Most stress Herbert do is only him trying to get over the fact that he is doing visatrips and didnt make it to the millitary.

Also the argument that "one guy lights a smoke another call ubon" is total bogus. If somebody realy needs to go, and that can happen with anybody totaly normal man that nature calls on a way that you couldnt plan and you just need to go. You can get sick and need to trough up. If the bus stops unplanned to let somebody take a leak its 2 minuites. Nobody else leaves the bus. I seen this happen in many cases. If you shout to the driver in a bus in Bangkok that he need to stop, somebody have problems, i think he will stop and let you of. Thats the middle of the town so he wont wait for you, you will have to take the next bus. I think any normal thinking person would stop if somebody needs to trough up or realy needs to pee.

You are not the only guy that have experience when it comes to visaruns. Many of us in this forum are expats and we all done many,many visaruns trying different services. At least in the group of people i hang out everybody is agreed that we will never,never use Herberts insane service again.

Once again: some people like it and some dont. Totally fine with that and there are some people on this forum that keep saying hes service is good and that they use only that. People that say "i always go with Herbert" i feel sorry for. That means they never get to try the real alternatives, firefly for instans for visas, Julies for border-runs (supergood), but thats their choise not mine. But i still can not see why you are defending things that even the few people i meet who like the trip overall say is wrong.

I mean you are gloryfying the guy with no limits. I bet you Herbet himself would laugh at some of your statements. He always treat costumers good,he is in this buisness only to help people and not for money (jesus nr 2. He do visaruns everyweek only because he looooves the people. Halleluja what a man!). The thing you say about this guy is not the Herbert i saw on my run with him thats for sure.

One poor guy on his first visarun tryed in the hotel to ask him a question and Herbert shouted all he could "FROM NOW ON EVERY QUESTION IS HUNDRED BAHT!!!" Poor guy almost got tears in his eys. Helping costumers in his case is important. Yes, Hebert know everything, but i dont. Telling me how things work is his job. It should be included and i should not feel like im bothering him when i try to ask a question.

Keep liking him, keep go with him on visaruns, anbody who enjoy beeing puched around like a schoolkid for 40 hours. Or anybody else who like him. But for heavens sake getbackjojo, stop saying everything is so and so perfect and stop defending the things that actually are wrong. Its not safe, it is stressful,he dont treat all his costumers good and he is not doing visaruns only because he want to help people. Stop that and we (at least i) can start to think that you are actually a happy costumer and not a promoter. ( ) .

[elfe]

well, here is (another) satisfied customer of herbert's visatrips for many years.

i have tried another company once, never again. then the minibus stopped in a town in the south at a travel agency and we were asked for our tickets !? which we had to leave with the lady from the company in the morning at the pier. as noone had his ticket we were told we had to buy new ones!!! thankfully i had the phone number of the lady and could call her. i had to discuss a lot and then she with the driver, with the travel agency guy and so on. with this hassle we almost did not make it back the same day to samui

i don't know about julie's trips, never went on one. but what will happen if she has an acciden - which god forbid!! - what would be the postings here on this forum...

i know herbert since long time and he is a genuine guy. it is unbelievably hard work what he is doing, ok it's his choice - but still. he has to do it in this manner to get everything in order, it is no fun trip, if you don't like his ways then don't go with him and get merry elsewhere. also the other passengers can easily do without hung-over or still drunk people who claim they have to pee all the time.

he makes sure you will get your visa and everything sorted perfectly, even for the guy who cannot even spell his name right in the form. all you have to do is fill the forms and sit on the bus. even at the consulate you just have to sign in and then leave, off to shopping center where you can relax because herbert is in the consulate taking care of your visa.

on the two day trip you get early enough to the hotel to have a good sleep and the next day you can even rent a cheap room in hat yai to get a 6 hrs sleep before departure and arrive well rested in samui the next morning.

of course the drivers are not trodding on the roads with 80 km/h when there is almost no traffic, who would?? accidents can happen everywhere anytime, if going on a minibus is too dangerous for your taste then leave it. i know that herbert tries his best to avoid any danger and hassle and he is good in that. his trip is strictly organized and perfectly worked out. he announces to everyone the rules and schedule and if you cannot follow them so then don't go with him as you will spoil the day for others who can - as some posters here claim - there are other companies which are much much better

this is no leisure trip and i also hate to do these runs but what can you do if time is important. with herbert i find is the best, easiest, safest and cheapest possiblity around which i know of. he knows his business and i trust him, also he has given lots of advice to me about doing my visa even he would lose some money by that.

so don't slag a genuine guy who is working hard to make a living here and does not do anything shady or hurt anyone

[mattias33]

well, here is (another) satisfied customer of herbert's visatrips for many years.

i have tried another company once, never again. then the minibus stopped in a town in the south at a travel agency and we were asked for our tickets !? which we had to leave with the lady from the company in the morning at the pier. as noone had his ticket we were told we had to buy new ones!!! thankfully i had the phone number of the lady and could call her. i had to discuss a lot and then she with the driver, with the travel agency guy and so on. with this hassle we almost did not make it back the same day to samui

i don't know about julie's trips, never went on one. but what will happen if she has an acciden - which god forbid!! - what would be the postings here on this forum...

i know herbert since long time and he is a genuine guy. it is unbelievably hard work what he is doing, ok it's his choice - but still. he has to do it in this manner to get everything in order, it is no fun trip, if you don't like his ways then don't go with him and get merry elsewhere. also the other passengers can easily do without hung-over or still drunk people who claim they have to pee all the time.

he makes sure you will get your visa and everything sorted perfectly, even for the guy who cannot even spell his name right in the form. all you have to do is fill the forms and sit on the bus. even at the consulate you just have to sign in and then leave, off to shopping center where you can relax because herbert is in the consulate taking care of your visa.

on the two day trip you get early enough to the hotel to have a good sleep and the next day you can even rent a cheap room in hat yai to get a 6 hrs sleep before departure and arrive well rested in samui the next morning.

of course the drivers are not trodding on the roads with 80 km/h when there is almost no traffic, who would?? accidents can happen everywhere anytime, if going on a minibus is too dangerous for your taste then leave it. i know that herbert tries his best to avoid any danger and hassle and he is good in that. his trip is strictly organized and perfectly worked out. he announces to everyone the rules and schedule and if you cannot follow them so then don't go with him as you will spoil the day for others who can - as some posters here claim - there are other companies which are much much better

this is no leisure trip and i also hate to do these runs but what can you do if time is important. with herbert i find is the best, easiest, safest and cheapest possiblity around which i know of. he knows his business and i trust him, also he has given lots of advice to me about doing my visa even he would lose some money by that.

so don't slag a genuine guy who is working hard to make a living here and does not do anything shady or hurt anyone

Yeah, i actually agree with you in alot. You are a bit more objective and serious about things than other posters and you are absolutely right about that its really that simple: you dont like it, you dont go. Difference in taste.

I (off course) have to comment on somethings in your post (anybody thought anything else? )

When you say that he have to do it in this manner to get everything in order i say: no he dont. Non of the other organised visatrips around Thailand do it this way and you still get visas with them. The visatrips i used from Koh chang,Bangkok, chiang mai (when i was longterm tourist before i moved here, so i cant say names of them) where always hasslefree and in normal speed and with no shouting or military way. You say you never tryed Julie, and thats one reason way you would think Herbert is good. Julies (only border-runs) is very quick, she also help you with all paperwork, you also get a visa, but with no stress,dangerdriving or anything else. I never suggested 80 km / hour on empty roads. But there musy be something between 80 and 160 right? The timelost ( with almost no stops anyway) on a 600 km trip is less than 2 hours if you drive 110 instead of 160. Safer and more comfortable. This does not make Herbet unorganised. It proves that he care about costumers and on that issue alone i dont trust him at all. It dosent matter that he know what he is doing. If he plans a trip for so many people a year that have no choice but to trust him (once they are there) i can not respect the fact that he dont plan the trip with maximum speed 120 and then decide what boat he should take.

The difference in this oppinion is clear. Its not only clear in this forum but all over the world where a big percentage of trafficdeaths are because people think they are so good drivers and that they are in such a big hurry that they realy need to puch both their vehicle and themself to the maximum, many times ( as with Herbert) with little sleep. To me, or people like me (because i know im not alone) with trafficsense and respect for other peoples lifes you can never justify this behavior. It is and will always be pure insanity and disrespect of the people that actually pay your salery.

I might ad that i have a motorbike racinglicense in Sweden (at least had for many years, might not be valid anymore) and i love speed. But when people are in my car or on my bike i drive with my head. Racing is for the track.

I keep repeating myself and saying that he is organised and that he know very well what he do and you have every right to like him. Just stop justifying the insane risking of many peoples lifes.

And a answer to the thing you said about what will happen if Julie have an accident. I feel like im teaching a small kid, but i have to tell you that even if you do everything right and by the book in traffic, you still have a fairly good chans to die everytime your out there. Sad but true. And off course if you ad any of the following factors: Alcohol,highspeeding,worn tyres,little sleep, of witch Herbert at least ad two, you immediatly increas the chanses. Big time. This is the sad reality. If you do it in your car i might forgive you. If you take money from costumers in organized trips and do it, i say you are a respectless m.f .

I guess we all are different.

[ilCapitano79]

Went with him once and never again, most of the stuff has already been said so i wont repeat it. I just cant stand the constant orders from him, some maybe do but i dont.

[easer]

Hi all. I just found this forum and i love it! I used to live in samui many years but is now since a year ago living in Hua Hin. I have to say i am very sad for Samui-people when it comes to visaruns. I joined Herberts visarun one time and i have to say it is amazing that he still is doing it and nobody stopped him. He must have plenty of reports on him in the police-office by now but perhaps they are paid of.

Not only the danger he causes on the roads but also the harassment of passengers. We are off course in thailand, anywere in Europe his buisness would be closed long time ago. Human rights, and safety is completely ignored on these trips. As said before.

Let me just tell some off you people that seem to think the Herbert-style is the only way to do it if you want to have a visa. Its not. Off course now im living in Hua Hin and i also have a non-b nowadays, but even in Samui there are better alternatives. As mentioned already, firefly (never tryed myself) is flying direct to Penang, if you have car, try driving yourself (very fun) to the south and take a taxi on maly-side.

I did one visarun (little expensive) where i flew to bangkok and took the bus to pnom phen one time and had a week holiday there wile i did the visa. Visaruns dont have to be boring, they can be fun!

You guys already brought up the most serious part and thats the safety, im happy for this eye-opening forum and i hope the police and locals now will see to it that somebode stop this guy before it is to late. This post have already been viewed by almost 2000 people and if half of them speek to a friend aswell the word gets out there, (is there still about 5000 foreign people in Samui?), and thats very good. Gives us, the costumers, back the right we should always have had. Power of the word.

Some guy in here said he felt sorry for Herbert as "the poor bloke is trying to make a living". That is the wrong attitude. Anybody in buisness knows that the bad word spreads on twice the speed of the good word. You can not keep on irritating people and ignore what you costumers say, year after year, and think you are in buisness simply because you are better than everybody else. Nobody is without competitors and everybody with buisness needs to listen to their buyers. The forum, and they guys in it, are not to blame if this causes Herberts buisness problems, they are simply airing opinions and Herbert had many years to give them the opinion he want them to have.

[mattias33]

My good friend (not a tv userbefore) was reading this post and wanted to post so he signed up yesterday. For some reason they wont let him post and error accurs (maybe he did something wrong?) so he send me this letter and asked me to post it for him. However, comments on him should be stated as "samui Bond" (i hope he did sign up) and not mattias33. Im just the link and messagecarrier. Heres his letter:

" Dear Herbert, Herbert fans and -haters, I read the whole thread and just simply to sum this thing up I'll give you this visa trip sample: I was in Bangkok, wanted a fast, fun, reliable and above all safe visa run. I googled up visa runs from the web and found one that sounded fitting. I left from Nana stop around 8.50 with a Skytrain. Several stops later jumped out. Nice restaurant with ponds and garden was right in the corner as a meeting point. Man game to me and said "Hello, girl will be with you in a minute". Girl game with papers, I only signed my name few times, she smiled and said we're leaving in 20 minutes as scheduled.I had a drink and 20 minutes later we were taken to a big bus. Everyone had their own two seats with lots of leg space. Both ways to Cambodian border we watched two of the latest copy dvd movies. Some people slept since the sound wasn't annoyingly loud and you could also read subtitles. Bus drove really smooth and you couldn't really say we were moving (I guess 100-120 km at the best). We went to new Cambodian border on a new highway with no traffic where we waited for 30 minutes and bought some bargain booze and smokes. We got the passports back at the border with all the necessary stamps. Girls took care off the questions, filling the forms, food, drinks and serviets (there was two! - local Herbert never came along to the trip) on board and toilet was available for the needy. Half way we stopped so everyone could have a smoke, buy snacks and beer although the trip was just 4 hours one way. We were back around 5.30 and if I remember correct price was around 1.400 B. I would say that service would be worth flying to BKK and doing it again... Now Herbert fans can think if things could be better if you had? Is there room for competitition? Should there be competition? Yes, if you like Russia go there. If you want to feel what a real well organized Visa trip is have a look at www.thaivisarun.com I have absolutely nothing to do with these people and as a long term Samuian would welcome here something like this with open arms since Julia doesn't have her big bus anymore. Her minibus trips are way safer and comfortable than Herberts. Matter of comparison. Last. If you do want to keep living on Samui and using Herbert, why not agree with him to loosen up and bring in some service upgrades. If he doesn't, someone else eventually surely will. Maybe this BKK guy can spread his wings to samui if we all try really hard. It is so wrong that once the visa trip is over, you have to start to fear the next one..." Samui Bond - Time is relative as long as you're alive -

[sbk]

Have your friend email [email protected] with his user name and password if he still can't get on.

[mattias33]

Have your friend email [email protected] with his user name and password if he still can't get on.

Yeah, might tell him to do that, allthough he is not a user of this forum and not particulary intressted to be either i think, just i told him in this particular subject he might want to read, i know he realy hate Herbert. He felt he wanted to do a comment and he done it know,throught me so i think he wont bother.

Cheers

[Samuian]

I just love it, especially "GetbackJoJO's" Comments!

You're trying to be good, but only in disarming yourself in trying to defend things, situations on behalf of the thoroughly "positive' side of the security and customer relations of the here discussed Visa-Run.

it's a tuck of war of words, rhetorical polemics...

From the beginning this thread was about customer complaining and discussing a certain business doing these visaruns, the way thi ssparticular company treats their customers and the way the entire process is conducted.

The way the wrongs, which are certainly not on minor grounds, concerning the Travel-Service-Industry-Safety-Standards, are condoned by some, are indeed frightening!

It is like one puts himself with one leg in the ICU and tells the driver: "to step on it, not to worry about solid lines, double solid lines, Do NOT overtake signs, speedlimits"!

It is NOT the question of: "the others do too...!" it is, as has been written here before, that the Operator is NOT of Asian Origin and so he DOES KNOW and (Should) DO BETTER!

Knowingly, ALL of safety requirements, traffic laws, speed limitations and simple needs of customers are NOT taken care of, for the sake of being the "fastest", masked with being the "most efficient"!

In the country of my birth, it is punishable by law to deny a person access to a toilet to relieve him/herself!

Phrases like: "if they can't, they shouldn't" or "they shouldn't partake on such a trip if they arent fit for it" huh, baby... this is so extraodinarily ignorant!

Nappies won't be a solution, besides belitteling customers, who do pay for a service; the smell will finallly give every other participant a bad time....not to go to any further indepth analysis of this suggestion - again how much time will it take to make it more often breaks or just stop if a customer has the need for it, why not?

How many really do fill out the forms wrong? Why not have them filled out a day in advance or by skilled staff?

Why then are people taken on the trip which have overstayed, if ti's al about timing? How much extra and unnessecary time does it take for just ONE individual to have his overstay processed, not to mention that it is illegal to overstay a visa-expiry date!

Well after all, I am sorry for these people being 'happy' for being exploited in such a way and on top condoning an act, which would be considered criminal, in ALL of the countries of the origin of the participating passengers!

Remember: One is only "good", as long as there goes nothing wrong!

Edited September 11, 2007 by Samuian

[Mark Wolfe]

The topic here is "Visa Run Accident."

Heard that Herbert, aka "Herman the German", failed to stop at a portable stopsign during a visa run a few days ago.

This resulting in a palmtree crashing into his minibus injuring several people.

Anyone got any first hand information regarding this incident?

I am waiting for something, anything, on-topic. 99 percent of these posts are off-topic. You want to slag this visa-run company? Start a new thread!

If you don't have any "first hand information regarding this incident," don't post.

[mattias33]

The topic here is "Visa Run Accident."

Heard that Herbert, aka "Herman the German", failed to stop at a portable stopsign during a visa run a few days ago.

This resulting in a palmtree crashing into his minibus injuring several people.

Anyone got any first hand information regarding this incident?

I am waiting for something, anything, on-topic. 99 percent of these posts are off-topic. You want to slag this visa-run company? Start a new thread!

If you don't have any "first hand information regarding this incident," don't post.

Starting a new thread would be step 2 to put an end to it. But lets see how many weeks we keep this thread readble first. Herbert is now paying a little bit back to all the people he steped on during the years and thats why this thread is in the top 5 every day. Intressting subject and when people start to open thier mouth it takes time for them to close it. I personaly think there is many among the 2000 people that read this thread that have been steped on one tim to many by Herbert and i realy think if this gets him out of buisness we achived someting good on this forum. On a small island with a forum were many expats express themselves and give eachother tips and recommendations, it shouldnt be possible to run a buisness like Herbert run his. Lets see where this leads. Very exiting. And very possitive. I find this forum supergood. We all tip in and help eachother and it is very imformative. Its important that we keep this style on it. This island dont have a real newspaper (samui express diningtips is interresting but not that important) with journalists that investigate and report. The only chans we have to get forhandinformation on stuff without experience the same problems other already have, is this forum. Yes, its true, i never saw a thread that stuck to the op topic very long, hahaha, but every single thread on this forum have good,imformative, opinions from expats,former expats and others, and i realy think we all to something supergood for eachother. Keep it up, boys and girls!

[keepsamuiclean]

"I personaly think there is many among the 2000 people that read this thread that have been steped on one tim to many by Herbert and i realy think if this gets him out of buisness we achived someting good on this forum."

Sorry but I really think THIS sentence is absolutely disgusting!

This week I am going again with Herbert on a short visa trip and when this will be o.k. as all others I will not report about it here as it could be taken as advertisement.... but your trying to destroy his business - I can only feel sorry for you. You like a restaurant - you go there often; you dislike a restaurant because you got food poisoning you simply do not go there anylonger!

Anyhow seems that here are lots of people without sense of humour and take Herberts sometimes very casual remarks even personally.

[mattias33]

"I personaly think there is many among the 2000 people that read this thread that have been steped on one tim to many by Herbert and i realy think if this gets him out of buisness we achived someting good on this forum."

Sorry but I really think THIS sentence is absolutely disgusting!

This week I am going again with Herbert on a short visa trip and when this will be o.k. as all others I will not report about it here as it could be taken as advertisement.... but your trying to destroy his business - I can only feel sorry for you. You like a restaurant - you go there often; you dislike a restaurant because you got food poisoning you simply do not go there anylonger!

Anyhow seems that here are lots of people without sense of humour and take Herberts sometimes very casual remarks even personally.

You like a restaurant you go there often and if you are a nice guy towards your friends and the restaurant you recomend it to others. And the other way around. And theres the real use of a forum aswell.

Give others information about good things aswell as bad things.

But do it objetively. If something is good, say so, and say why. And the other way around. "i did not approve of...." and so on so others get the chans to make their on fair judgement. That is not advertisment. It will not be advertisment if you come back from you Herbert-run and say it was super.good this time. Its simply you sharing your opinions with fellow forum-users.

In the long run (if this forum gets realy big) this will lead to that we all will be treatened better. If everybody know that people discuss all kind of buisnesses here and honestly bring up goods and bads about everybody, that will lead to that all kinds of buisnessmen will care more about customrelations. Very important.

Its also important to do it honestly. Yes, i wouldnt mind if Herbert got out of buisness, not for my personal benefit (none) but for reasons i already said. If you bring up good and bad, seriously, and tell real stories about what happen, readers can make their own judgement.

So please, if you do get poison in your food or find rats in the kitchen on a restaurant, let us know. If it is a one-time thing and bad timing, people will know and come in and comment on it. Theres not a chans in the world you can get a real,genuine,customcarring,safe,serious entrepreneur out of buisness by saiyng your opinion. Others will come in and make sure of it.

On the other hand there is a big chans that if you constantly serve poison in the food many people will speak up if you mention it here and people reading about it, thinking about going there can then be saved from eating poison.

Yes, it will get the poor restaurantowner out of buisness, but in my opinion he had the chans to not serve poison in the first place. And if people come in and say "i like poison in my food", or "rats in the kitchen is a must to make good food like this", or "the poison in the food is there because there is rats in the kitchen, without the poison the rats would eat the food", that still very good for us, the readers, because that proves that there is rats in the food and anybody that like it go, everybody else got the good information that the restaurant is nothing for them.

My point remains the same, you can only run a buisness like Herbert (for instans) do, if people is quiet and dont speak and help eachother out with recommendations. It should not be possible to only have 50 % happy payers and give jack shit about what the other 50 % say (who also paid). And it will not be possible if everybody keep saying what they feel.

This thread (mostly Herberts friends that say they like his trips) has shown exatcly what his visaruns are all about. His friends never argue with what i (among others) ´brought up to the surface. They all agreed on that he is speeding with little sleep,have almost no stops, and so on (try to not repeat to much) but they only defended the "rats in the kitchen". So readers can read between the lines, get a real grip on what these trips are about, and then make a decession to use, or not use. Perfect informative forum, i love it more everyday.

Herberts "casual remarks that requires a sense of humour to understand"???????????????????????????????????????????????

Somebody from the "ditch Herbert-side" please comment on this statement on your next post since i tend to make superlong posts.

[goldfinger]

....maybe, it would be interesting to investigate, if the tree, which was "fallen" on the road,

was so old and rotten, that he "had" to fall just in the moment, when herbert came there.....

(only a thought, when I read some of the comments here)

[Chayaphum]

Hello 2 everybody in this forum

i am very surprised about what and how the people here talking about this "VisaRunAccident".

First of all some facts:

1. his name is Herbert and not Herman.

2. he is an austrian falang, not german.

3. this accident was on a VisarunTrip to Malaysia, not on a 1day Borderrun.

4. there is no alcohol allowed on board during travel, if somebody have problems with that...take another company for visaruns.

5. if some customer can´t wait 3-4h until the next stop (go toilette)...take another company for visaruns.

6. if you feel stressed on these trips with Herbert....take another company for visaruns.

7. if somebody not like or understand the humor of Herbert and his style....take another company for visaruns.

8. if somebody know a company they have drivers who can stop a minivan from 120km/h to 0 km/h in 3seconds, pls. tell me....

- why is a lower speed with the minivan more comfortably?

- how much more secure is a visatrip if they drive just with 100km/h (instead of 140km/h)

- how many people died in the last 10years on visatrips in LOS?

- and how many people die every month in samui in the normal daily traffic?

- how safety is the ferry from the mainland to samui-island?

Herbert isn't a friend of me, i am just a customer of him for a long time now.

But i can recommend him for shure. Sorry, i not get money/commission from him 4 write this statement here

I have to pay the fullprice on every trip with him, same everybody.

Not forget to tell, on every trip in his minivan....i slept well everytime, also with 140km/h.

If i don't trust the drivers experience or feel unsecure, shure i will not sleep in the minivan.

Or is somebody there who feel scary with thai-airways (airbus) with a travelspeed of 900km/h?

Will the journey be more safety if they fly only with 650km/h? I d'ont think so.

And what's about TGV in france, or every other highspeed train in the world,

every year they go more faster, but is it also more safety? nobody think about that.

Anyway, Herbert will never stop his business about this story.

If somebody know another mode of transportation who is 100% safe and secure, pls. let me know.

And last but not least:

There are two categories of customers (from Herbert)

the one who LOVE him (and travel again with him)

or the other ones who HATE him....(and never come back)

Dschok dee khrap

and good luck to Herbert the Austrian-busy-man

PS: maybe the company Julie´s VisaRuns get more customers now...because this very big story now about the accident.

Mai pen rai, we say in LOS

NOBODY IS PERFECT, khau dschai mai?