Are You Under Pressure About Not Having A Relationship...

[consumerismsux]

I've lived in Thailand for a little over 2 years now. I have worked as a teacher at 2 schools during this period, my current school being my longest serving job (more than 1 year).

I realise that one of the many Thai idiosyncracies is to ask others rather personal questions & even though I'm consistent (& honest) with my answers, the questions never seem to stop. I'm not suggesting that I face a torrent of questions on a regular basis but invariably, I will be questioned about my 'status'.

Some examples;

"Do you like Thai ladies?"

"Do you have a Thai wife?"

"Do you live alone?"

If I answer any of these questions in the negative, the response is usually something like;

"Why? Don't you like Thai ladies?"

I've even had Thai colleagues try to 'set me up' with someone (a female) whom was thought to be appropriate for me.

I am very reluctant to tell anybody at my workplace about my sexual preference (gay man) as I have heard whispers that it is generally frowned upon for a teacher to be gay in Thailand.

This kind of thing has happened to me before in Australia but with a definite sinister ulterior motive. I don't believe that my Thai colleagues have any plot to 'expose' anybody so that they can erradicate any possible moral malevolence but at the same time, I still carry this fear.

What do others think of my situation? Has it happened or is it happening to others now? Has anybody been able to put a 'respectful' end to these uncomfortable questions?

Ps I think that one of my Thai colleagues is...has many gay mannerisms (voice, limp wrist, mincing walk, avoids everybody). He is also one of the least tolerant people whom I've met. I'm sure he has some big hangups, which he seems to take out on the students by way of physical or humiliatory punishment.

[jumnien]

Don't take the questions as an agressive assault on your homosexual status. Thais often ask questions they really don't need a complicated answer for. "Have you eaten yet?" can be answered yes. If you say no, expect a dialogue, "are you hungry?", etc. Where are you coming from? or Where are you going? can be answered very simply; they really don't want to know. When people asked me if I like Thai ladies, I just say sure; though I'm in a commited relationship and definitely not looking for action from Thai ladies.

[PeaceBlondie]

I never came out at any of the three Thai schools where I worked, except to trusted farang coworkers. I could have, though, and it wouldn't have mattered. Several of my old Thai school colleagues were at a party recently, and I openly referred to having a Thai boyfriend when it came up in the conversation (about who cooks my food). No problem. And the teacher I thought must be a gay Thai because his wrists were limp, and his voice was high? He has wife and a baby. Maybe he's bi; nobody cares.

I got that big tour of the staffroom "And this is Ajarn Pachasakajaweeya; she's not married!" but when I showed no interest in such things, they guessed that I had other preferences.

[visionary]

I am definitely not gay and I don't think I look it. Even in Canada I have found that Thai and East Asian women are quick to ask if you would like a meaningful relationship with one of their women. At first I thought these women were leaning towards something prostitution related but when I tested them I found they were trying to find real relationships for other women. I don't know why they try so hard to marry off their friends. Given the aggressiveness that I have found even outside the country I don't think you need to worry about them asking to try to expose you. Most of the Thais that I have met are very tolerant.

[ProThaiExpat]

I suspect we are discussing a "cultural thing" here, as I am retired and old and yet I get the same questions at immigration, dentist, hospital and anywhere else I pause in my purposeful walk on errands.

In Japan, I experienced similar questions and was told that it was "polite" to ask such questions, as they demonstrated a kind interest in another person.

[farang prince]

Asian women, not just Thai women, are under intense pressure to marry early and have a family. So the questions about your availability are simply a reflection of this situation. I'm asked all the time to introduce my friends to Thai women...but I wouldn't subject most of these lovely ladies to the guys I know.

[Tyke]

I've lived in Thailand for a little over 2 years now. I have worked as a teacher at 2 schools during this period, my current school being my longest serving job (more than 1 year).

I realise that one of the many Thai idiosyncracies is to ask others rather personal questions & even though I'm consistent (& honest) with my answers, the questions never seem to stop. I'm not suggesting that I face a torrent of questions on a regular basis but invariably, I will be questioned about my 'status'.

Some examples;

"Do you like Thai ladies?"

"Do you have a Thai wife?"

"Do you live alone?"

If I answer any of these questions in the negative, the response is usually something like;

"Why? Don't you like Thai ladies?"

I've even had Thai colleagues try to 'set me up' with someone (a female) whom was thought to be appropriate for me.

I am very reluctant to tell anybody at my workplace about my sexual preference (gay man) as I have heard whispers that it is generally frowned upon for a teacher to be gay in Thailand.

This kind of thing has happened to me before in Australia but with a definite sinister ulterior motive. I don't believe that my Thai colleagues have any plot to 'expose' anybody so that they can erradicate any possible moral malevolence but at the same time, I still carry this fear.

What do others think of my situation? Has it happened or is it happening to others now? Has anybody been able to put a 'respectful' end to these uncomfortable questions?

Ps I think that one of my Thai colleagues is...has many gay mannerisms (voice, limp wrist, mincing walk, avoids everybody). He is also one of the least tolerant people whom I've met. I'm sure he has some big hangups, which he seems to take out on the students by way of physical or humiliatory punishment.

You have a right to answer their nosey questions in any way you like, truthfully or not - it ain't their business.

You could say your 'partner' died, or even that you were divorced/separated and not looking for anyone else, ever!. Gay mannerisms? = Doesn't seem to mean a thing here. The question asking is asian not just Thai. Personal questions are a way to show they are interested in you? Bullshit - thay wanna know because some will persisit even if you tell them "that is a very personal question", or whatever.

[endure]

As Thailand is possibly one of the most hierarchical countries where everyone has a 'place' the questions that are asked are to try and define where you, as a foreigner who isn't as easily pigeonholeable as a Thai, fit into the grand scheme of things. You'll alos be asked about your salary and your age. They aren't being rude, they're just trying to fit you into their world.

[consumerismsux]

As Thailand is possibly one of the most hierarchical countries where everyone has a 'place' the questions that are asked are to try and define where you, as a foreigner who isn't as easily pigeonholeable as a Thai, fit into the grand scheme of things. You'll alos be asked about your salary and your age. They aren't being rude, they're just trying to fit you into their world.

I appreciate what you are saying endure but over the last year, I have been asked these questions repetitively by some of my Thai colleagues. By & large, I've also noticed that these particular are the 'gossips', which to me, reflects that they have a boring life.

And as Tyke said, I suppose I can answer these 'nosy' questions any way I like. Only once (not at my present school) have I resorted to saying, "It's not your business to know my personal affairs". This was an extraordinary situation in which I felt I was being interrogated/harrassed.

Anyway, I will 'weather the weather, whatever the weather' & hopefully, one day, these rather tedious questions will cease.

[PeaceBlondie]

You can always turn the tables, at the risk of losing a bit of face, yourself. Ask the curious one, "Do you have a boyfriend? Are you divorced? Do you think I'm sexy? Do you want to have sex with me? Who do you have sex with?"

[peter991]

Interesting topic. One of the best things about Thailand is the acceptance of gay farangs by Thai people. From the big cities, to tourist resorts to remote Issan villages, I have found a gay farang is treated the same as a straight farang.

While I wouldn't even dream about opening up about my sexuality in most parts of Australia, I have no problems in Thailand. When the local ladies found out I was gay - they still wanted to marry me (to escape from Thailand to Australia) and regularly asked me if I knew any Australian men who would marry them.

There's a lot of sanook (fun) in Thailand. I have not come across any pressure from a Thai person - but I know there is a LOT of pressure on (educated) Thai guys to marry and have children. That's another story - perhaps some of our Thai members would like to add their comments.

Peter

[kek]

Whenever I've been asked the question "Do you like Thai ladies?" I always reply "Yes - my maid is wonderful."

[endure]

Whenever I've been asked the question "Do you like Thai ladies?" I always reply "Yes - my maid is wonderful."

[Suszzy]

Don't take the questions as an agressive assault on your homosexual status. Thais often ask questions they really don't need a complicated answer for. "Have you eaten yet?" can be answered yes. If you say no, expect a dialogue, "are you hungry?", etc. Where are you coming from? or Where are you going? can be answered very simply; they really don't want to know.

that's so true and you're so right about that.

did you get stressed with those questions from thais?

don't think too deep..relax and enjoy your stay in los

[FranklyNoMore]

As Thailand is possibly one of the most hierarchical countries where everyone has a \'place\' the questions that are asked are to try and define where you, as a foreigner who isn\'t as easily pigeonholeable as a Thai, fit into the grand scheme of things. You\'ll alos be asked about your salary and your age. They aren\'t being rude, they\'re just trying to fit you into their world.

It\'s considered just as rude to ask about salaries here as it is in the west, so I doubt you will ever be asked about your salary. They may say you farang get paid a lot but thats about it. Thais dont asked each other what they get paid either.

I was in the same situation as the OP but as im now into my 3rd year at my school the questions have died down and now its only the students from time to time that ask me if im gay. I\'ve been asked around 10 times. I know im gossiped about and have heard many things from students who are close to me. On one occasion I complained to the principle because a Thai teacher told the parent of a private student I was teaching, who doesnt go to my school, that I was gay and the 7 year old came to class and asked me if i was because the Thai ajarn at my school said I was. That really pissed me that a fellow teacher would say that to a parent and I had to here it from a 7 year old. I cleaned the teacher at school and complained about her and she just denied ever saying such a thing, the lying bitch.

In time I learned to just let it pass. I try to let my teaching do the talking but, like the Op, I dont want anybody to know my business. However I know nearly everyone at my school thinks im gay even though I dont look it. If I were in their shoes I would probably think the same. A reasonably good looking guy whose been single for 3 years, doesnt talk about girls, yeah right!

I was fed up with all the gay talk so I let it be known that I was married in the UK for 7 years but i dont tell them I was married to a guy! I tell them i\'m now divorced.

I dont think its frowned upon to be a gay Thai teacher, ive met and seen a few, but as a farang I just wouldnt flaunt it. I just try to do a professional job. Im sure my sexuality doesnt matter one bit to the school but if I came out, then it might. To be honest I just wish they would mind their own bloody business but Thais love to gossip about someone cos most of their lives are pretty dull or like at my school there are many fat ugly single women who are just jealous and have absolutely nothing going for them.

My advice to the OP is to try and ignore it and let it pass over. You have to have your answers ready to any potentially embarassing questions that may and probably will be asked. There is nothing worse than a student standing up in class and asking, Ajarn are you gay? and not knowing what to say back. But just ask the student, Are you? and move on with the class. If like me you hate to lie then just avoid direct answers with questions back.

Good luck

[consumerismsux]

The comments so far have been very interesting & to some degree, enlightening. Thanks to all.

But I tend to go along with the ideas of FranklyNoMore. I think that he is living in the 'reality' of things. I'm not a person who simply kowtows to any authority unless I think that the authority is being reasonable. In any case, I think it is reasonable for others to acknowledge that people are different & cannot be expected to all have the same ideas. I guess what I'm saying is that certain people do need to be told to 'mind your own business', politely. This is not a sure way to gain friends but it will weed out the real people from the gossips. I don't see that this has much to do with culture. I further think that culture is often used as an excuse to get away with things that would otherwise be distasteful or unwarranted. It doesn't take any effort or responsibility whatsoever to follow any rule but it does require effort to truly appreciate anothers right to their own life. The cost of being an individual? Rejection...& I know all about that. But since I am very familiar with it, I guess I could risk it. I just don't want to become a 'target' for sick people with narrow minds.

I can understand the benefit of totally 'going with the flow' but at what point does this start to affect your life? I think that there is a 'tradeoff', where you feel pain by not 'going with the flow' & you also feel pain by conforming to things that are not to your liking. As the old saying goes, "You can satify 80% of people, 20% of the time & you can satisy 20% of people, 80% of the time."

For now, I will continue to dodge & weave around these uncomfortable issues. I guess that the only reason why I am uncomfortable is because I fear that there may be repercussions if my sexuality were to become public information. If I didn't have this fear, I wouldn't be writing about it. I guess old habits die hard. I do not wish to go back to my old way of living whereby my whole life was a lie...a 'coverup'. This was one of the reasons why I came to Thailand...I hoped that I could escape these fears. But I brought them with me, didn't I.

Maybe I should 'come out'? It would certainly end all the questions...but at what cost? Hmmmmmm!?

Edited September 23, 2007 by consumerismsux

[FranklyNoMore]

I do think you maybe unduly worrying.

For me, I have no intentions of coming out because I dont think its a big deal to Thais. It\'s only a big deal if you make it.

[PeaceBlondie]

I was asked, by one of my gay students, if I had a boyfriend. I didn't answer him. He asked me again, on his deathbed, and I refused to answer him. I regret that I didn't finally tell him. To the ajarns who gossip, I would face them publicly, with witnesses, saying, "Ajarns are professionals. If you gossip, you are a terrible Buddhist and unprofessional. If you spread any more gossip about me, I will take you by the hand to the Director, even if it causes me to lose my job. If I'm gay, or if you are a lesbian, it's a private matter."

[TopChinese]

My mother had survived my relationship with a farang for 5 years.. and even came over to our place to feed our dog and iron our underwear. Her first words to her only son when we broke up and I moved back home.... "so when are you going to marry a decent woman?". She even offered to pay for a visit to a Vietnamese bride agency so she could have lots of pan-asian grandchildren to play with in her old age.

I didn't have the heart to tell her that unless they have brides with hairy bums, I am not likely to be in the family way.

Edited September 24, 2007 by TopChinese

[Tyke]

My mother had survived my relationship with a farang for 5 years.. and even came over to our place to feed our dog and iron our underwear. Her first words to her only son when we broke up and I moved back home.... "so when are you going to marry a decent woman?". She even offered to pay for a visit to a Vietnamese bride agency so she could have lots of pan-asian grandchildren to play with in her old age.

I didn't have the heart to tell her that unless they have brides with hairy bums, I am not likely to be in the family way.

Hi,

apparently Australian women have hairy bums - couldn't you make do with one of those, or is that too down market?

[Timothy]

Umm

I feel obliged to share my view on this.

As a Thai who grew up in BKK and worked and lived in BKK for 21 years before spending many years in London (both educational and professional purposes) I thought I could perhaps add somthing slightly more informative to this topic.

I am now 30, own a nice car, a nice flat and have a very promising career. All I have been asked by colleagues, friends, colleagues' friends, counsins, counsins' friends is Are you married?, Where is your gf?, Why dont you have a gf?, Do you actually fancy women?, When was the last time you dated a girl and the list on this matter goes on and on. They all wanted to know, wanted to introduce someone to me or wanted to join the competition for this single, reasonably looking and well paid Thai who is according to them at the right age to be married!!

There are times when these questions are raised at lunch or dinner where 10 other people at the table would stop eating and listen to my answers. Believe me it is worst for me than for an expat as I could not really pretend not to understand that this is part of the Thai culture. I am upset and find it very impolite to be asked certain personal things but people could not carless about my feeling on this. They believe that it is absolutely normal to ask others about private lives. In my cases, I used to go out with a fw ladies but have decided to stop that completely so people are wondering why I am not with anyone seriously. And yes, Thai educated men from middle class families find it very hard to answer this and they cant always open their sexuality either. Please dont think it is easy for a Thai not like when you were in the West, it is so not easy and I can assure you that. In my case, I look totally straight and have straight friends and play footie with my mates so very few would even wonder if I could be gay. Upper middle class Thais dont take homosexuality as well as what you think they do. We dont have a gay TV star or politician who is open to the public but in the UK you do.

In the West, good and close friends who care about you of course ask a question like "are you seeing anyone" or things along that line but in a very different approach and I know that. They would not ask me this if they are not close and they would not ask me this in front of others.

Being asked by cousins about the pay is another very common thing in Thailand. The same applies to friends but not colleagues.

Hope this is useful

[Tyke]

Timothy,

believe me farangs can be just as embarrassing, especially if they are not a close friend or dislike you or want to find what your reaction is so they can judge you. The only difference is that 'losing face' is not considered as important as it seems to be in Thailand. However, I have found out that 'losing face' seems to be important to Thais but they don't always respect that when they want to embrarass a farang!

[consumerismsux]

Umm

I feel obliged to share my view on this.

As a Thai who grew up in BKK and worked and lived in BKK for 21 years before spending many years in London (both educational and professional purposes) I thought I could perhaps add somthing slightly more informative to this topic.

I am now 30, own a nice car, a nice flat and have a very promising career. All I have been asked by colleagues, friends, colleagues' friends, counsins, counsins' friends is Are you married?, Where is your gf?, Why dont you have a gf?, Do you actually fancy women?, When was the last time you dated a girl and the list on this matter goes on and on. They all wanted to know, wanted to introduce someone to me or wanted to join the competition for this single, reasonably looking and well paid Thai who is according to them at the right age to be married!!

There are times when these questions are raised at lunch or dinner where 10 other people at the table would stop eating and listen to my answers. Believe me it is worst for me than for an expat as I could not really pretend not to understand that this is part of the Thai culture. I am upset and find it very impolite to be asked certain personal things but people could not carless about my feeling on this. They believe that it is absolutely normal to ask others about private lives. In my cases, I used to go out with a fw ladies but have decided to stop that completely so people are wondering why I am not with anyone seriously. And yes, Thai educated men from middle class families find it very hard to answer this and they cant always open their sexuality either. Please dont think it is easy for a Thai not like when you were in the West, it is so not easy and I can assure you that. In my case, I look totally straight and have straight friends and play footie with my mates so very few would even wonder if I could be gay. Upper middle class Thais dont take homosexuality as well as what you think they do. We dont have a gay TV star or politician who is open to the public but in the UK you do.

In the West, good and close friends who care about you of course ask a question like "are you seeing anyone" or things along that line but in a very different approach and I know that. They would not ask me this if they are not close and they would not ask me this in front of others.

Being asked by cousins about the pay is another very common thing in Thailand. The same applies to friends but not colleagues.

Hope this is useful

Hi Timothy.

I found your post VERY enlightening. I only wish that more Thai people would post & help to dispel some misconceptions.

As a foreigner, it's very difficult to find any reality or consistancy regarding the Thai code of ethics, as such, since there doesn't seem to be a 'book of rules' covering this. Although, I did attend a Thai orientation course (2 day course), at which some ladies from the Thai Ministry of Culture attended. They provided us with these little red books, which were supposedly designed to teach foreigners how to behave in Thailand. I read the book & was a little shocked. I'm sure that most of the information in that book is completely outdated as I see many Thais not adhering to the 'rules'. Nowhere in the book, did it discuss such things as 'appropriate' questions or expected questions although it did say something about Thais being curious. This statement can be applied to all of humanity.

When I lived in Argentina, it was a very common thing to be confronted by a stranger & then be subject to very personal questions, which most of the time I completely ignored. On one occassion, my boyfriend & I went to a pizza restaurant for a bite. The rather cute waiter took our orders & when he returned, asked me the following questions, in the following order;

a] Are you married?

b] How old are you?

c] What's your name?

I asked him the same questions & he bloodlywell answered them . He then stared at me, waiting for my answers. I told him that it was personal & I don't give that sort of info to strangers, although I did tell him my name.

Later, I asked my boyfriend if this was a cultural thing. He said, "No, he was just being a busybody." When I told him that many people seem to behave this way, he said that they only do this because everybody else does it. He further said that it is rude to ask such personal questions to strangers.

I think that the same thing is happening here in Thailand. It appears that almost anything can be listed under the banner of "culture" based on convention, where in actual fact, it has nothing to do with culture & more to do with convention. I also get the impression that many people use this situation as a way of being able to do things that aren't necessarily respectful. How convenient.

I also think that because of the vagueness of this "culture" thing, many farangs who don't understand something also put the misunderstood thing under the banner of "culture".

So I guess the question is, does ANYBODY have to suffer the 'spanish inquisition' concerning their private lives? It seems rather disrespectful in most other parts of the world. And as Timothy said, it's different when it comes from close friends in a private situation as opposed to work colleagues in a staffroom.

So, where are we with all of this?

[ProThaiExpat]

My experience in the West regarding personal questions seems to indicate that the level of society in which one is in has something to do with personal questions.

Most social situations among the affluent that I have been in do not expose you to personal questions. As you go down in societal levels, what you do, what car do you drive and where you live seem to take on greater importance to others and often become the first questions asked.

While traveling in Europe with a 19 year old, I was late forties at the time, I would encounter many tourists from around the world traveling on similar itineraries. I was routinely asked if my b/f was my "nephew". If I liked the asker, my response was "Yes". If I didn't like the asker my response was "No, he is my lover, we have been together since he was nine".

The expressions upon hear this reply were priceless and the discomforture suffered by the recipients of this information well deserved what they got.

In Thailand, knowing that these questions are common, I just reply "No" regarding lady friends, wives, etc. and leave it at that, going on to other things or places.

As I have posted elsewhere, it seems to be an Asian thing. Perhaps a form of prospecting for themselves or their friends.

At Chiang Mai Immigrations, enlisted police asked on behalf of their Captain, a lovely 40's Thai female, who smiled a lot when this information was being given out about her singularity and husband hunting, but I am sure she was embarrassed by her subordinates who were sharing her personal information with an aged falang "customer".

[FranklyNoMore]

So, where are we with all of this?

Well to me it appears that those of us who have been asked the questions and feel uncomfortable with them havent really accepted ourselves and are not confident enough to give truthful answers. Yes I can say its none of their business but isnt that an excuse to face the truth. If im really honest I want everyone to know im gay and have a bf that ive been with for 4 years and im very happy. Its sad that even today I dont feel confident enough to say this to my work colleagues. Its a fear of being judged and I must be judging others otherwise I wouldnt have this fear.

[orchis]

I'm totally out.

but when some innocent soul asks me 'are you married?'

I answer 'not yet'. Usually 'enlightenment' follows quickly.

Edited September 26, 2007 by orchis

[Tyke]

I'm totally out.

but when some innocent soul asks me 'are you married?'

I answer 'not yet'. Usually 'enlightenment' follows quickly.

Yea, and I say "I'm too young to get married" (I'm in my 50's). Or "Can't afford it yet"