Water Softner For Swimming Pool?

[jaideeguy]

After fighting the scale and calcium build-up for 3 yrs in my pool, as well as the spots on car, glasses, windows etc, I finally got a professional water test of my well water and it revealed that my ground water ph measured 8.5 and was recomended to get a resin water softner.

Last week, i checked prices at the biggest pump shop in CM and they quoted me 12,500 bhatt for a small unit and 18,000 for a larger unit [+ instalation]. stainless steel construction for non corrosion with salt backwashes.

My question is....does anyone else out there have the same problem and can offer any alternative cures or should i just bite the bullet and sink another 20kbhatt into my 'hole in the ground' that some people call a swimming pool??

[Naam]

After fighting the scale and calcium build-up for 3 yrs in my pool, as well as the spots on car, glasses, windows etc, I finally got a professional water test of my well water and it revealed that my ground water ph measured 8.5 and was recomended to get a resin water softner.

Last week, i checked prices at the biggest pump shop in CM and they quoted me 12,500 bhatt for a small unit and 18,000 for a larger unit [+ instalation]. stainless steel construction for non corrosion with salt backwashes.

My question is....does anyone else out there have the same problem and can offer any alternative cures or should i just bite the bullet and sink another 20kbhatt into my 'hole in the ground' that some people call a swimming pool??

Jaideeguy,

the pH of your water has not necessarily anything to do with the hardness of your well water. my well water is extremely acidic (pH 6.2) but i face the same problem like you (spots on the cars because lawn sprinklers were hitting them) but no problems with the pool as i run the water when filling up through a filter/softener which is resin based.

unfortunately there is no other way than to spend the dough on the softener. however two different systems are normally used. one is resin and one is salt. by the way, for the resin filter backwash no salt is needed. my system is dual (charcoal and resin) although the charcoal is not really needed and i might replace it with another filter media or leave as is (i bypassed the charcoal).

the price of 18k which was quoted to you seems to be alright. i paid the same about one year ago. personally i think stainless steel is overkill and a good coated steel quality would do too. got the stainless steel because i didn't bother to look for alternatives and left it to the builder. my only concern was enough flow.

[jaideeguy]

Nice and tidy pump house you have Dr, but i don't quite understand it. do you have a sand filter [not in the foto]? and i see what looks like two household pumps, where i have one big sand filter and 2 hp motor/pump.

different [looking] resin filter too...as the one that i looked at here in CM is a [single] fabricated free standing 40cm dia model that looks like a space ship. stands about 5 ft high and the vendor tells me [and i googled] that the resin had to be backwashed regularly with a brine solution to wash the calcium deposits off the media.

with your 6.2 ph and my 8.5, we should trade off some h20 and may come out about neutral.......i'll send you 40,000 ltrs.

thanks for your reply and please explain your system works if you have the time,

aloha,

jdg

[cdnvic]

If your local water is that hard you may need to look at softening your whole water supply, not just the pool's. You can mitigate this problem somewhat by topping up with collected rainwater (when the season allows) rather than groundwater, but there's no way you are going to get around buying a softener in Chiang Mai.

I'm surprised pool companies aren't telling people to test their water before building. It could work to everyone's advantage. The buyer can get the right equipment from the beginning and the builder can see more addons.

[Naam]

Nice and tidy pump house you have Dr, but i don't quite understand it. do you have a sand filter [not in the foto]? and i see what looks like two household pumps, where i have one big sand filter and 2 hp motor/pump.

i don't have a sand filter for the house water supply. the pumps are Hitachi (each 800 watts) pumping from two different underground tanks through the filter to house piping. different pressure setting for each pump. first one kicks when pressure is below 45psi and the second one at 40psi. will soon install a pressure tank as the pumps cycle too much.

different [looking] resin filter too...as the one that i looked at here in CM is a [single] fabricated free standing 40cm dia model that looks like a space ship. stands about 5 ft high and the vendor tells me [and i googled] that the resin had to be backwashed regularly with a brine solution to wash the calcium deposits off the media.

one filter contains charcoal, the other one resin. don't know how it's technically feasible to use a brine solution for backwashing. moved into the house beginning of august last year. never did any backwash until now. resin filter 50% bypassed as water was too soft.

with your 6.2 ph and my 8.5, we should trade off some h20 and may come out about neutral.......i'll send you 40,000 ltrs.

by UPS?

[jaideeguy]

Dr Naam,

do a google on water softners and you should find info on backwashing resin filters....it seems that the resin is a sacrificial media that collects the calcium and brine solution is the solvent to remove it. surprised that your pool company didn't mention that as it is supposed to extend the life [and efficiency] of the resin.

cdnvic,

yea, it looks like i should get a resin filter for the whole house and pool, as the calcium deposits [on car, glasses and plumbing] are quite a nusience and in the end costly. do you know of any sources other than the big pump shop near the ping river?? would like to compare prices and service [and english].

Big thanks to both of you for your input.....

[Naam]

Dr Naam,

do a google on water softners and you should find info on backwashing resin filters....it seems that the resin is a sacrificial media that collects the calcium and brine solution is the solvent to remove it. surprised that your pool company didn't mention that as it is supposed to extend the life [and efficiency] of the resin.

in my former home i used a salt softener. i have no experience with resin based softeners and the contractor who installed it (it was not the pool contractor) just told me to backwash and did not mention brine. anyway, my question "how to apply the brine" still stands and i see no other way than to remove the resin grains, "wash" them in brine and fill them back into the filter.

[Naam]

calcium deposits [on car, glasses and plumbing]

the deposit on the windshield of one car was impossible to wash off. had to use VERY CAREFULLY a ~3-5% acid solution applied with a rag. surprisingly the deposit on the car lacquer came off with several times of shampooing.

[jaideeguy]

I'm new to resin filters as well and am only going with what the vendor told me about his fabricated unit. he said to add salt and backwash when needed [?] and that some people do remove the resin and wash it carefully [in brine] then replace it for longer life of resin.

and i discovered that the 5% vinegar removes most of the white spots on glass, cars, and stainless steel. occasionally, i'll have to soak my faucet screens and shower heads [in vinegar]that get clogged with calcium build-up.

would really love to get that calcium out of my water system!! have to chamois my truck immediately after rinsing or those ugly white stains are left.

lets keep in touch on this problem and maybe some others will put in their 2 bhatt worth of info as well.

[Naam]

he said to add salt and backwash when needed

where? how? open all the screws of the resin container, take off the lid and add salt? then get a new seal and close it again? even then how can one backwash with salt if the salt/brine is not added between the pump and the filter?

will call my contractor tomorrow and let you know what he said.

p.s. adding salt direct into the resin container might work if one let it rest for several hours. but during that time no water consumption in the house possible.

[cdnvic]

Dr Naam,

do a google on water softners and you should find info on backwashing resin filters....it seems that the resin is a sacrificial media that collects the calcium and brine solution is the solvent to remove it. surprised that your pool company didn't mention that as it is supposed to extend the life [and efficiency] of the resin.

cdnvic,

yea, it looks like i should get a resin filter for the whole house and pool, as the calcium deposits [on car, glasses and plumbing] are quite a nusience and in the end costly. do you know of any sources other than the big pump shop near the ping river?? would like to compare prices and service [and english].

Big thanks to both of you for your input.....

A good softener should be a two part system consisting of a resin tank and a brine tank. The brine solution is metered into the resin tank to regenerate the resin as it absorbs calcium ions. This is likely what he was talking about when he said backwashing.

Here's an installation & service manual for one example to give you a better idea how they work:

http://qualitywatertreatment.com/PDF/Insta...%20Softener.pdf

http://qualitywatertreatment.com/PDF/2510_Manual.pdf

My info on prices would be out of date as I'm in Canada at the moment. (My pools eat calcium voraciously as I have just the opposite problem here.)

[Naam]

A good softener should be a two part system consisting of a resin tank and a brine tank. The brine solution is metered into the resin tank to regenerate the resin as it absorbs calcium ions. This is likely what he was talking about when he said backwashing.moment.

but in this case (without backwashing) brine with absorbed minerals is added to the output water and enters the home.

edited for addendum: had that problem with a "salt"-softener in my former home and the options either to have mineral deposits in the bathrooms or brushing teeth with salty water.

Edited September 26, 2007 by Dr. Naam

[cdnvic]

What should be happening is that the brine is washing through the resin at select times and going straight to the sewer, rather than passing through the regular plumbing (yuck). You set the timer to flush the brine through the resin tank at say, 4am Sunday, and shortly after it's flushed out through a drain. I've seen older setups where this happens manually, but the same result.

[Naam]

What should be happening is that the brine is washing through the resin at select times and going straight to the sewer, rather than passing through the regular plumbing (yuck). You set the timer to flush the brine through the resin tank at say, 4am Sunday, and shortly after it's flushed out through a drain. I've seen older setups where this happens manually, but the same result.

that makes sense but it invokes a minimum of two solenoid valves to be triggered and for the timer uninterrupted power supply. high tech in combination with Thailand's power supply is not necessarily an optimal solution. in this respect i can sing a song with many stanzas

[cdnvic]

Probably a better option to get one where it's just done manually then. I get spoiled here and keep forgetting about my electrical woes I had in CM.

[cloudhopper]

Our well water in Pai goes thru a 30 micron paper filter (which seems to collect a red iron oxide-like fine grit), then 2 backwashable filters in series that have charcoal, resin and manganese in an order I can't remember. We had the post-filtered water tested at a gov't lab in CM, and everything was OK for drinking water but the hardness level was just below the max allowable of 350, and we get the white residue everywhere it evaporates.

So, I'm thinking I need a salt-type softener. Any good sources in CM?

Thanks

[jaideeguy]

There is a large pump shop near the ping river on the opposide side of the american consul and they sell large domestic units and almost every superstore has a shop that sells small drinking water units. depends on the volume of water you want to filter/treat........the more you need, the more you pay and it's always better to oversize.

I'm in the process of searching for a large unit to soften my incomming [from well] pool water and and will check out other sources in CM. will report what i find.

[jaideeguy]

Just doing a follow up on my now softened water and swimming pool. It's the best improvement that I've done to both my house water and swimming pool water. After going thru the winter months and always topping off the pool with 'softened' water, I've slowly lowered the ph to an acceptable level and not only do my chems last longer and less algae blooms....but the added plus is that the white stains on glass, stainless, the car and tile is much less.

I got by cheap, with a 2nd hand stainless tank, but had to replace all the resin becaude the former owner never regenerated with brine.

Would highly recomend to other pool owners to soften their water, if they have calcium stains on tile or unusually high ph levels from ground water.