Traditional Thai Massage In Pattaya

[bl2]

I'm in BKK, not in Pattaya, so I can't speak to the Thai massage business market there.

But here in BKK, the massage business is tough, especially if the shop is actually doing real Thai massage, as opposed to some other things (which have their own price structure). There's a ton of competition, way more ladies than customers most times, and at most shops, a lady is LUCKY to have a couple customers in an entire day.

If they don't live nearby their work and their shop closes late as many do, they might need to take a taxi home because Skytrain and MRT are closed by then. So, if you figure a couple customers a day (and some days with none) times the lady's share of maybe a 300 baht massage, you're not looking at big money under any circumstance.

So, tips become a very important part of the lady's earnings since they basically don't receive any salary per se. If you have a regular shop and/or lady that you often frequent and they treat you well, a 100 baht tip to me is a reasonable thing. As another poster noted, it's the price of about one drink at a bar. For maybe 2 hours of real work on her part, something that hopefully leaves you feeling fine, it's a pretty small thing.

Back in Los Angeles, any Thai massage shop is charging rates between $45 and $65 AN HOUR... So, to have a two hour massage here from a lady who takes good care of you, I think paying 300 or 350 baht ($10 U.S.) including tip is a pretty good deal.

I can't think of too many better ways to spend 100 baht that are any better for you. And the lady, if she's any good, will truly appreciate it.

I agree....massages are a very important part of my health.....100baht is not over the top. The pretty girl scenario is

not aplicable to me as I tend to take the older stronger ladies, who know there stuff.

I hate your comparisons to the US thou....its just not applicable.

[bl2]

The best deal I've come across began this week on Soi Arunotai 2 (near Carrefour and Shagwell Mansions). 159 baht for 2 hours of Thai and/or foot massage! Nice!

Had a look today......on special buy 1 hr, get 1 hr free......I guess they were'nt getting any business otherwise....have you tried it?

[jfchandler]

Edwardandtubs... you're right a bit...but you miss the broader point.

Yes... the price of services...massage or other..is set by supply and demand in the marketplace... Hence, because of the oversupply of ladies willing/wanting to do the work, the market price has remained relatively low and stagnant for years, which is great for customers.

BUT... TIPPING is not something set by supply and demand.. And tipping is what the post and discussion is about. Tipping is something apart from the cost of the service itself, as a means of rewarding good service. So, as I said before, if a lady has just spent two hours strenuous work giving me a first-rate Thai massage, I think a decent tip is the decent thing to do.

If someone says they give 50 baht just out of custom, then 100 baht to someplace where you are a regular and treated well is reasonable. And, I'm NOT (and never was) talking about flirting... That was a different poster.

[CHdiver]

There are thousends of womans working in factorys for 8, 10 or more houres, going home with 200 Baht a day, and there is nobody tipping them. No wonder many want to work in a Massage Place, getting the same ore more money for much less work. After 4 hours, they allready have more then working hard in a factory. But you don't see the womans working in a factory.

If there are too many places, I don't care. Nobody forces anybody to open the massage shop # 10 at the same street. It's not my responsibility to help a Massage Shop or any other Business to stay in Business.

[MisterFingers]

There are thousends of womans working in factorys for 8, 10 or more houres, going home with 200 Baht a day, and there is nobody tipping them. No wonder many want to work in a Massage Place, getting the same ore more money for much less work. After 4 hours, they allready have more then working hard in a factory. But you don't see the womans working in a factory.

If there are too many places, I don't care. Nobody forces anybody to open the massage shop # 10 at the same street. It's not my responsibility to help a Massage Shop or any other Business to stay in Business.

So let him do his thing and you do your thing. No problem.

[tropo]

No, I don't think of it as buying attention.

I like to think that I've already got her attention.

I think of it as more of sending her a message, "I like you" or "I think you're cute"

A message which she usually understands.

I'm sure if you ever took a survey, the better looking ones probably get better tips in general, just like with hot bar waitresses in the West.

Not only that, but I tend to enjoy the massage much more if it's a woman that I'm attracted to who's massaging me.

So the massage in my books tends to be better too, whether she's more skilled than others or not.

We obviously differ a lot here, guy.

When it comes to STRAIGHT massage I don't care what the massage therapist looks like and I would prefer a stronger male therapist over a "cute" little female anyday.

If I needed other stimulation I could visit the Fish Bowl and pick out the "cutest" therapist that I was most attracted to.

Regarding tips, as you said, the "cute" therapist probably gets more tips, mainly due to people such as yourself encouraging this practice. I'd feel more inclined to tip the less attractive therapists because they need the tips more.

At the end of the day it's the quality of the massage that counts.

Edited December 3, 2007 by tropo

[edwardandtubs]

So if I buy som tam from a street vendor and I'm served som tam should I tip if it turns out to be edible? If you get a decent massage you've got no more than you've already paid for.

If tipping makes you feel good about yourself then go for it but I doubt it has the impact you think it does. You think these poor, unfortunate, underpaid, overworked massage ladies are going to be eternally grateful to the rich and generous white man, or will they think you're another clueless farang who pays more than he should?

Edited December 3, 2007 by edwardandtubs

[jfchandler]

Final thought from me here.... if your som tam vendor spends two hours making the dish for you, to the exclusion of all other things and customers, maybe you SHOULD give some tip.....

In my book, there's a value in this world to being polite and decent...in everything...even here in Thailand. Sure, a person can get by being cheap and ungrateful... That's their choice...not mine.

[edwardandtubs]

Well obviously she takes less than two hours but is paid much less money. I'm sure on a daily basis the som tam seller earns less than the masseuse. I give the som tam seller exactly what she asks for which is the same price everyone else pays. Nothing to do with being cheap and ungrateful. How is paying the asking price which is the price everyone else pays cheap and ungrateful? If you want Thai people thinking "Great! Here he comes! The clueless overpaying dumb farang!" wherever you go then you're going about it the right way. If you want to try and fit into Thai society you should do things the Thai way and tipping for a traditional Thai massage is definitely not the Thai way.

[saparot]

How is paying the asking price which is the price everyone else pays cheap and ungrateful? If you want Thai people thinking "Great! Here he comes! The clueless overpaying dumb farang!" wherever you go then you're going about it the right way. If you want to try and fit into Thai society you should do things the Thai way and tipping for a traditional Thai massage is definitely not the Thai way.

Agree totally, and the 100baht tip is ridiculously out of perspective.

[njpski]

A 300 baht massage for one hour, house gets 190, masseuse 110.

I have just seen in Melbourne Australia, Thai massage for $80 for one hour.

Converting the Thai price to Australian dollars, I am paying $11 for my one hour massage in Pattaya of which the masseuse gets approx $4.

If choose to give an extra 100 baht, I am still only paying $15 - by my calculations, I am way in front - I certainly don't begrudge the money I pay - mai ki niaow

[bl2]

If you want to try and fit into Thai society you should do things the Thai way and tipping for a traditional Thai massage is definitely not the Thai way.

Wow, not sure where you get your massages, but where I go, the majority of customers are Thai's.....and I see at least 70%

tipping after the massage, and I'm sure the majority of the other 30% ,do so after going to there locker and getting changed

into their street clothes.

[tropo]

A 300 baht massage for one hour, house gets 190, masseuse 110.

I have just seen in Melbourne Australia, Thai massage for $80 for one hour.

Converting the Thai price to Australian dollars, I am paying $11 for my one hour massage in Pattaya of which the masseuse gets approx $4.

If choose to give an extra 100 baht, I am still only paying $15 - by my calculations, I am way in front - I certainly don't begrudge the money I pay - mai ki niaow

Here we go again, converting the cost of a Thai massage into home currency.

It works for a short holiday punter, but retirees or long time stayers don't think like this, nor should they.

Think about it, giving a 100 baht tip for a 200 baht masage is the same as paying a $40 tip on your $80 massage in Australia.

I've been away from Australia for over 4 years and I don't convert the cost of commodities and services in Thailand into Australian money.

Most people who retire here in Thailand do so because it's good value for money. It's not our responsibility to keep local businesses afloat just because we get a good exchange rate.

[beginner]

[quote name='njpski'

A 300 baht massage for one hour, house gets 190, masseuse 110.

I am very familiar with one large and successful Spa in Pattaya.

The girls get 60 baht per Thai massage. They get no basic pay, holiday or sick pay. They work 12 hour shifts and if they have no customers then they have spent twelve hours waiting for nothing. They may not leave the premises during work time.

They buy their own uniforms, pay for training and leave a deposit or guarantee of 3,000 baht with the management when joining.

The expectation of receiving tips is the reason some of them have left children and partners at home in Chang Mai and Isaan. The basic wages hardly pay for their rent and food whilst living here in Pattaya.

Generous tippers such as an American lady who left US$20 are talked about, appreciated and celebrated. Poor tippers (often Indians) are tolerated but resented.

Why tip? Up to you.

[jing jing]

Sure I could walk out without leaving a tip at all, but for a two hour massage costing on average 350 baht, 100 baht seems like a pretty generous tip. Still, somehow I feel guilty leaving less, especially if it was a really good massage.

I find in general the cuter girls give the worse massages, maybe because they know some dudes will give them a good tip just because they're cute so they don't need to put much effort into the massage. I try to discourage that practice by giving a much smaller tip for a lousy massage, regardless of how hot the girl looks.

[torrenova]

At my previously regular massage place (now closed and redeveloped) I often went with my then girlfriend for a 2 hour massage at a price of Bt200 per hour. My bill would therefore be Bt800 and I would give them Bt1000 or Bt1200 tipping between Bt50 and Bt100 per hour.

I know they used to get Bt70 from the Bt200 and then later on, Bt80 as another shop offered Bt90. The problem about this business is that the price of Bt200 is stuck in a time warp and has been Bt200 for as long as I can remember. Why not charge Bt250 per hour ? because most people would think it was too expensive. therefore they need the tips but I think Bt50 per hour is fair.

[nidge]

A little bit off topic but i had a silly thought while reading this thread.

There are some people that don't tip, others that tip in the 10-20% range and others that tip almost everybody and their dog.

Now the most important service i receive in Thailand, way above massages, drinks, food, haircuts, is a visa stamp in my passport. The people that give me my visa are always polite and so far i have always, (eventually), got what i wanted. I don't know what they get paid but probably not much above the average local wage. I bet there is not one single person in TV that has ever tipped an immigration officer.

[tropo]

I am very familiar with one large and successful Spa in Pattaya.

The girls get 60 baht per Thai massage. They get no basic pay, holiday or sick pay. They work 12 hour shifts and if they have no customers then they have spent twelve hours waiting for nothing. They may not leave the premises during work time.

They buy their own uniforms, pay for training and leave a deposit or guarantee of 3,000 baht with the management when joining.

The expectation of receiving tips is the reason some of them have left children and partners at home in Chang Mai and Isaan. The basic wages hardly pay for their rent and food whilst living here in Pattaya.

Why should we care? If the staff don't like working there, they have the right to leave to find better employment...or just go back home to the province.

Have a good look at the staff of most massage places...they look quite healthy, eat plenty and don't need my sympathy.

[beginner]

Why should we care? If the staff don't like working there, they have the right to leave to find better employment...or just go back home to the province.

Have a good look at the staff of most massage places...they look quite healthy, eat plenty and don't need my sympathy.

As I said whether or not you tip is 'up to you'.

They don't need your sympathy but they do need/appreciate your tip!

Most straight massage ladies are ordinary hard working people doing their best to make a living with little education/training or skill to lift them above minimum wage jobs. Its quite a strenuous and tiring job when done properly.

When someone tips, at whatever level, from even 20 baht upwards, it is greatly appreciated and almost always ends up in the family coffers for food, rent, school fees etc.

When a bar girl is tipped there is a much bigger probability that it will go on booze and fast living in Pattaya. Up to them.

There are of course, exceptions to this but I have known many massage ladies who endure great personal hardship and lonliness to come to Pattaya to try and earn enough to get their families out of debt.

You can take the view that its their bad luck to be born here in a poor country and its not my problem. Alternatively you can believe that its our good fortune to be in a position to give a tip that is of almost no value to us but combined with other tips has the power to help improve someone's life dramatically.

[njpski]

My attitude is almost biblical, " the worker deserves his pay" . it makes me happy to pay what i consider is a fair amount for good service

it is voluntary, unlike in america, where tips are compulsory

[tropo]

You can take the view that its their bad luck to be born here in a poor country and its not my problem.

Actually I do take the position that poverty here is not my problem, however Thailand is not doing it tough compared to most neighboring countries. The Thais in Pattaya are generally living the good life.

The hard work is back in province on the farm. Massaging a few customer every day is like a holiday for these ladies (and guys).

[edwardandtubs]

I am very familiar with one large and successful Spa in Pattaya.

The girls get 60 baht per Thai massage. They get no basic pay, holiday or sick pay. They work 12 hour shifts and if they have no customers then they have spent twelve hours waiting for nothing. They may not leave the premises during work time.

They buy their own uniforms, pay for training and leave a deposit or guarantee of 3,000 baht with the management when joining.

The expectation of receiving tips is the reason some of them have left children and partners at home in Chang Mai and Isaan. The basic wages hardly pay for their rent and food whilst living here in Pattaya.

Tips will be factored into an employee's pay and conditions by the employer. If customers are giving tips the employer will be able to offer derisory basic pay and conditions and still keep his employees. The tipper might feel good about himself but his actions are just encouraging employers to offer low pay and conditions. That's what happens if you distort the market with unnecessary tips. In the end the massage ladies are no better off.