Running Away And Being Selfish....

[Teach]

Damnaam,

Thank you very much for this topic, it will I'm sure by it's very imflammatry nature go on for some time.

That said, and by noticing that Rooboy has had a pop, I cannot resist adding my most profound opinion in this matter.

Boris, go to bed, read a book preferrably Pooh bear. The Victorian age is gone gone gone.

Dave, Yohan, nice one. Rooboy, you are an uncouth youth.

Here's the deal,

As the lads have said, you have only one life ( unless you are an evangelist like boris) during this singular life you will hold yourself responsible for all the decisions you make, unless like boris you need a crutch to forgive you all your sins on a nightly basis ( just so you can go out tomorrow and start all over again.. sinning).

If you do not intend blaming others for your misdirections, then consult your integrity, character and your sense of fair play.

Many, many single families are created by accidents/acts of God/war/famine/ pestilence, etc,etc.

Your doing the right thing by marrying this girl may only, as suggested by Dave I think go south, if you harbour "what might have been" thinking later in life.

She did deceive you by forgetting to take the pill but, as has been my experience only you can take resposibility for guaranteeing that sex doesn't lead to children by using the withdrawal system. Witnessing the birth will no doubt slaughter you and by then the chains will be set.

Despite the rantings of do-gooders and seedless wonders, your life is your own and when it is at it's end only you will know whether you did the right thing.

Don't follow your heart, it can't be trusted, don't follow good judgement- there's no such thing. Follow the one thing that carries us all through every situation good or bad- your will.

You are what you do.

Or... the shorter version... offer to assist in the abortion cost, there are far too many people in the world anyway.....

and not one of them mine

Teach

[DeDanan]

Hi Damnaam,

I do not think that any fair minded person would bet that the relationship between you and this woman (“who you had a fling with”) would last. From your version there is little doubt that she trapped you.

Can she really want you when you feel this way about her?

It might be an idea to send her the link to your post in this forum.

The responsibilities you have are to the child. Offer to help her support the child. When you are in the UK, try to spend time with the child if she will let you.

She has to be responsible for her choices and the consequences of her decision to stop taking the pill.

Have a Happy…

DeDanan.

[Dickie]

Just because you sired the baby doesn't make you the father. Se did it without your knowledge or consent and knowing you didn't want it. Get out of there and don't maintain any contact whatsoever. If you pay anything or even see the child you'll be admitting responsibility/liability and that's the worst thing you can do in this situation. She's had a baby, it's down to her.

[Dr. Jekyll]

Se did it without your knowledge or consent and knowing you didn't want it.

He did not want it?

Such a bad girl who allows you to f....k her without condom, knowing you do not want a baby.

What world are we living in?

They should be responsible for their actions.

I'm the man, I do not care, why should I,...?

[damnaam]

O.K guys, I'm back from work and having read your comments would like to thank you all for your comments, excepting of course, the two I have already responded to in an earlier post...

A little more information. She's 31, lives in Scotland. I'm 36, living in London. She has only one ovary left after having had the other removed due to a 'growth' a few years back, the remaining one may have to come out too now, after she gives birth. She gave me a get out clause "I'll get rid of the baby if you promise me we'll get back together again and try to make things work...." but in the knowledge she was unlikely to be able to conceive ever again, my conscience weighed too heavily and I had to be honest and say it was unlikely to work. So, yeah, I MUST be stupid......

As I mentioned before, I come from a broken home - my parents split up when I was six and me, my brother and mother moved a long way from where we'd been up to that point. Odd then, it may seem, that I appear to want to inflict this on a child of mine. Fact is, this is the last thing I ever wanted and something within tells me maybe I should give it a go, for the sake of the kid, but as I already know in my heart and DaveThailand and ThaiPauly pointed out so well, I can't see any value in bringing up a child in an environment which is not full of mutual respect and love and in any case is doomed to fail. The way I see it is if the child grows up with one parent along with, albeit distant, support from the other then surely it's better it knows how things are straight up than having the rug ripped out from under it's feet as it's parents go their seperate ways a few years down the line?

TingTawng makes a great point about how much this is going to cost me 'roughly 5 people in Thailand' and sure it's going to be a major financial drain, as we all know you really need to minimise 'Western cost' outgoings when on extended leave abroad. Many of you make the very valid point about financially supporting the child. I will not flinch from this and have already bunged her in the region of £2000 to make sure she can get everything she thinks she needs prior to the new arrival. We're going to try to reach a private agreement about how much maintenance she needs since we've learnt that the CSA retain around 40% of any money that passes through them, like I don't pay enough tax as it is.

Lastly, for now, this is not a flash in the pan idea - the moving to Thailand thing - I have travelled the world and seen many amazing places and things. I don't want to stay in the U.K any longer than I have to. For the past 6 years I have spent at least 4 months of the winter in the southern hemisphere and worked my ass off during the summer in Europe, I'm a freelance engineer/editor in the broadcast industry, to allow me to do this. It's been great but I'm almost leading a double life, neither here nor there and the vicious circle of earn for so many months then purely spend for so many months is starting to take its toll.

That's all for now. I'm going to enjoy a well earned beer after a long day at work. Doubtless I'll think of something else I shold have mentioned here but nevertheless I'm grateful to those of you who considered my predicament and took the time to think, then reply. It's a great help having a bunch of people who don't know me or her giving me another angle on things.

Cheers...!

[TingTawng]

She gave me a get out clause "I'll get rid of the baby if you promise me we'll get back together again and try to make things work...." but in the knowledge she was unlikely to be able to conceive ever again, my conscience weighed too heavily and I had to be honest and say it was unlikely to work. So, yeah, I MUST be stupid......

damnaam, oh boy.

She is a nasty peice of work. boris, wouldn't you agree? Oh sorry old chap: you appear to have your balls in a vice, therefore unable to offer a truthful point of view.

OK, joking aside, she is a peice of total shit, or even a total peice of shit, if I may be so bold. For her, she maybe thought you would be delighted by the news of pregnancy. On hearing you were not, she wants to win your favour by terminating the pregnacy. She saw it as a win-win situation (pregnant: you are happy. pregnant: you are not happy, so she will have an abortion to make you happy IF you go back to her).....(listen, my paranoia radar is set to "ultra-sensitive" for your story).

Sorry damnaam, heard this story before....many a time. It's not even original. Your missus is a bad 'un and NO mistake, no matter what Mr Boris, the beautiful White Knight in Shining Armour says.

[RooBoy]

Dave, Yohan, nice one. Rooboy, you are an uncouth youth.

Or... the shorter version... offer to assist in the abortion cost, there are far too many people in the world anyway.....

and not one of them mine

Teach

Uncouth?? You bastard! Whilst your suggestions might have made Sir lancelot the knight he was, they dont really help the bloke much do they??

"Do what your will says because you shall be judged by your deeds"

Poor bloke should go and top hisself right now, there is little chance of getting an abortion since the crazy bitch has lost an ovary already!

Tell me, the withdrawal method? is this where you remove your hand at the last minute??

[Begs]

Tell me, the withdrawal method? is this where you remove your hand at the last minute??

hehe..........in your case, certainly.

[Yohan]

I do not expect, Boris to be back again with his moral advices.

Interesting to see, up to now, not even a single female poster was showing up in this thread posting a comment. Where are all these Farang girls to help out?

Damnaam, what you can do and what you should not do in your situation:

1-

Are you sure, she is really pregnant? Have you seen any confirmation so far?

This woman is just a liar....about all and everything. The typical Euro-Trash-girl.

If she is pregnant and loves to have her own child, which is understandable for me, she would not consider the option of an abortion at any moment, with or without the father...

2-

If she is really pregnant, stay calm, you cannot force a woman for abortion, and you cannot force her to deliver the child. Should she give birth, then insist immediately on a paternity test. Who knows? Maybe you are not the father....

Do not pay anything to her, untill this is confirmed by attests!

3- If you are not the father, then just leave....and never look back!

4- If you are the father, leave her, but please do not run away from obligations towards the child. Forget her, but not your child.

bartender100 Posted: Sat 2004-08-28, 22:52:38 Why don't you bring her over with you after the child is born.The child would probably get a better upbringing here than the u.k.anyway.Also cost you a lot less than maternity payments.

An interesting idea....bring this woman into Thailand and treat her in the harshest possible way, she really deserves it.

[boris]

I do not expect, Boris to be back again with his moral advices.

I accept that much of this is a bit of knock around fun but I am intrigued at the outraged reaction to my posts.Some of it seems to be a kind of pavlovian dog reaction to concepts like "chivalry" or "responsibility".The suggestion I am offering moral advice is completely misplaced.If you read my posts carefully, I have not expressed an opinion on either side in the case under discussion, and have no real interest in it.The point I originally made however holds good and it relates to the debased way these matters were discussed, the style as much as the substance, which I take to be a product of UK yob culture.I also deplored the increasing presence of this culture in Thailand.

Why this coarse British sub-society has emerged as a problem now is problematic and there is an interesting article by Ferdinand Mount in today's Sunday Times.He talks about the transformation of a social class that was the envy and amazement of foreign observers in the 19th century into an underclass that is the subject of baffled despair today.Mount writes

"We see moral and physical degradation shown with a lurid relish that Dickens might have envied.The women are slags, either scrawny with straggly blonde hair, or grotesquely fat and bulging out of their tracksuit bottoms.The children are surly.whining.spoilt.wolfing down their junk food with no concept of manners and not much grasp of their native language.The men in the regulation get-up - T-shirt,earring,shaven head -are equally surly and incoherent,callous and faithless to their women,sentimental about their children but liable to forget to pick them up from school and prepared to leave home and abandon them if they meet a bit of skirt at the pub."

[twix38]

Interesting read and yes, to some significant degree I also see British society progressing nicely to Slob culture with the characteristics you describe from the Sunday Times. I only have to look around me!

I would agree with the general advice. She knowingly and deliberately got pregnant secretly and refused initially to abort. She has all the power and selfishly used it to suit her own goals. A life together without love and respect is doomed. Do the right thing by the Child. In spite of her behaviour, you seem to care for this women on some level and I can understand this, so when leaving her to her thoughts, she may realise she might have done what she did out of desperation, loosing her man and misplaced/mixed up emotions. Try to do right by her as far as is possible too. After all you are opting out (quite correctly in my opinion), but she will have a somewhat difficult and unhappy period in her life, even if largley self inflicted. Two wrongs don't make a right and people do silly and desperate things when they see their life, love and reproductive future all slipping away. It can be one ###### of a fright!

[RooBoy]

hehe..........in your case, certainly.

hehe, good one Begs, you can go back to TGT and troll Bkk chat again now..

[Begs]

hehe..........in your case, certainly.   

hehe, good one Begs, you can go back to TGT and troll Bkk chat again now..

Rooboy, i have important work here.

Go back to TGT..... Explain, or do you think i am TGT?

Well..................

They say what you do not know cannot harm you.....If it is true, that makes you nearly invincible.

[Yohan]

I do not expect, Boris to be back again with his moral advices.

I accept that much of this is a bit of knock around fun but I am intrigued at the outraged reaction to my posts.Some of it seems to be a kind of pavlovian dog reaction to concepts like "chivalry" or "responsibility".The suggestion I am offering moral advice is completely misplaced...........

Boris,

It seems to me that your 3rd posting again is nothing else but worthless like data-garbage and missing the topic....

The question of this thread is simply said, what do you think, should this man do, to regulate his problems.

Your explications about 'pavlovian dog reaction' is not helpful at all.

If you do not like to offer some useful reply to this topic, then better do not post at all, or post somewhere else...there are some radical feminist forums out in the internet, which will appreciate your questionable philosophical contributions and observations.

Still missing is any comment by females to that subject - Why do they remain silent?

How do they think about this relationship, what would they recommend to this man or to this woman, is there any practical advice from women?

Damnaam,

I think, you got some interesting and good advice in a very short time.

However, it is single-sided as all comments were posted only by men out of their negative experiences with Western women.

[Begs]

Boris,

It seems to me that your 3rd posting again is nothing else but worthless like data-garbage and missing the topic....

Yohan does not mess about with his words, direct and to the point is the order of the day.

[davethailand]

yohan, yohan, yohan

[boris]

I do not expect, Boris to be back again with his moral advices.

I accept that much of this is a bit of knock around fun but I am intrigued at the outraged reaction to my posts.Some of it seems to be a kind of pavlovian dog reaction to concepts like "chivalry" or "responsibility".The suggestion I am offering moral advice is completely misplaced...........

Boris,

It seems to me that your 3rd posting again is nothing else but worthless like data-garbage and missing the topic....

The question of this thread is simply said, what do you think, should this man do, to regulate his problems.

If you do not like to offer some useful reply to this topic, then better do not post at all, or post somewhere else...there are some radical feminist forums out in the internet, which will appreciate your questionable philosophical contributions and observations.

Yohan

I don't really know how to answer you.I had a look at your website which was quite an eye opener with its preoccupation with "feminazis" and the "evils of Western women".Clearly you have a few quite serious problems you need to work through.Oh cripes, I've broken my own rule of not getting personal!

I cheerfully plead guilty to sidestepping the original topic but I think it is legitimate to comment on the language and style of postings.My particular angle was the pernicious effect of UK yob culture.However I've given it a good airing so no more on that subject and I wouldn't wish to bore members.

[ThaiGirlTeen]

I wouldn't wish to bore members.

Too late for that!

[Halo]

Well put Falong. Enough said.

My word the sucker trusts a Thai, how long have you known her, where did you meet???

[damnaam]

Hi Halo and thanks for your input. Your incisiveness and unique commentary on Thai culture is omnipotent and quite breathtaking...

There's an almost beautiful symmetry going on in this topic in that all the useless replies appear at the top and bottom

[davethailand]

Well put Falong.  Enough said.

My word the sucker trusts a Thai, how long have you known her, where did you meet???

not another one :D

[chonabot]

Well put Falong. Enough said.

My word the sucker trusts a Thai, how long have you known her, where did you meet???

Troll / Wank Spaniel parentage I'd concur....

[davethailand]

time for the arse clown award i think

[chonabot]

Is he moving to Chiang Mai / Hua Hin / Cha Am ?

Methinks the troll hasn't moved from his jizz-filled bedroom in Enfield for several weeks.

Nevermind school starts soon lad.....

[Yohan]

I don't really know how to answer you.

Boris,

No need to worry, I noticed it already.....

I had a look at your website which was quite an eye opener with its preoccupation with "feminazis" and the "evils of Western women".Clearly you have a few quite serious problems you need to work through.Oh cripes, I've broken my own rule of not getting personal!

Thanks for browsing my webpages!

Please sign my guestbook, any comment is welcome!

No problem - get personal! I am truly accustomed to it, long arguments with US-feminazis, Euro-Trash-girls and with male feminists are my speciality.

I cheerfully plead guilty to sidestepping the original topic but I think it is legitimate to comment on the language and style of postings.My particular angle was the pernicious effect of UK yob culture.

OK, but maybe in your posting No. 4 you might add some of your wisdom, what this young man, who was deceived by his Euro-Trash-girlfriend, should now really do to improve his situation.

About the pernicious effect of UK yob culture I agree with you....

Female yobs (Euro-Trash-girls) in the UK are indeed responsible for the fate of many honest British gentlemen (the OLD-BRITs), who remain unhappy and single, until they modify their behavioral action towards a poor young Thai farmer-girl, who was sold by her drunken parents.

I suppose, this is the so-called 'pavlovian dog reaction' what you mentioned in your previous posting.....(development of the NEW-BRITs)

(pavlovian condition=individuals who either have the best genetic endowment for reflexes, or who have the capacity to modify their genetically predetermined reflexes for a better chance of survival and reproduction through unconditional stimulus that will elicit a predictable response and spontaneous recovery)

[davethailand]

I don't really know how to answer you.

No need to worry, I noticed it already

another great reply yohan

[TingTawng]

boris, you seem to say that all British people are affected by yob culture, yet apportion no blame or criticism towards damnam's girlfriend. Double standards? If so, you are a feminist - congratulations. Keep up that chivalry - you're winning the hearts and minds of the females as braindead as you are.

[boris]

boris, you seem to say that all British people are affected by yob culture, yet apportion no blame or criticism towards damnam's girlfriend. Double standards? If so, you are a feminist - congratulations. Keep up that chivalry - you're winning the hearts and minds of the females as braindead as you are.

I certainly don't think all British people have been affected by yob culture( or the brutalisation of large sections of the working class), except to the extent that those who are not part of it have to put up with it.Do I have to explain again that I have no comment on the case under discussion other than the coarseness with which the original discussion was conducted.Let others decide who is "braindead" or not.By the way I would not dream of applying that epithet to somebody simply because he took a different view, even someone as disturbed as Johan or his little Golem type sycophant.

[Insight]

damnaam, call me cynical but do you defo, defo, defo know for sure she's pregnant? It's a nasty card to pull, but women the world over have been known to pull it.

[Pudgimelon]

What we're talikng about here is being shoved in to a situation here that I didn't ask for and will affect me for many, many years to come...

A situation you didn't "ask for"??

Sorry, buddy, but if you have that kind of attitude, you're either a complete idiot or a callous dirtbag.

Simple fact:

You stick you dick in a woman, and you ARE asking to have a baby. Period.

There is no 100% effective contraceptive, and the only sure way not to have a kid is to abstain (but even then, God may come along and do a Mary&Joseph on your ass, so you never know...).

Point is, you did the deed, and now you've got to pay the dues.

Pissing and moaning about how "unfair" this situation certainly proves that you are too immature to be a father, but it does NOT excuse you from your legal responsibilties to support that child. And if you honestly think you can afford to pay UK child support on a Thai wage, you're OUT OF YOUR MIND.

Get back to the UK, get a real job, and pay for the raising of that kid. Sure it sucks for you and maybe you'll have to give up your adolescent life of hedonistic pursuits, but TOUGH S--T. Like sucks. Buy yourself a violin.