Prosecutors Vow To Arrest Thaksin Upon His Return To Thailand

[Plus]

Re. selling AIS.

Unspoken rule in this country is that they give you a concession to make money off Thai people but you must invest it back in return. You don't get 20 million Thai subscribers to pay for pensions for SINGPOREANS. It's not illegal, but it's against the accepted rules.

We can't be sure that even proceeds from Shin sale were meant to be reinvested here, so far Thaksin invested only in making sad English sobs really happy for a while.

He hasn't set up even ONE charitable organisation. For the richest man in the country that's not very patriotic. I really wish our posters from the "he was the Robin Hood" train consider these facts for a moment.

Re. economy.

Democrats guided the country through the crisis, bound by conditions negotiated by the team led by Thaksin's closest man in finance - Thanong Bidaya, soon would be in charge of the economy yet again.

Last year under Democrats the growth was 4%, first year under Thaksin it was 1.8%, then things sped up for a while, but 2005 saw a big drop again, 2006 was bad, the coup had little impact overall, things were screwed badly well before September. 2007 has its own problems, but the growth is still respectable given the conditions. Prospects for next year are not much better regardless who comes to power.

Re. elections.

More people voted for Democrat led government but PPP got more seats so they have a first go. If they can't form the coalition, Democrats will take over.

[jumnien]

Far more Thai civilians voted for PPP than for Democrat. The inflated numbers for Democrat party include the mandatory military vote for the Democrats.

[blaze]

I can't believe my eyes while reading through this thread... so many people, educated in the west, used to rules, to laws, to punishment if one doesn't follow them...

Condoning at will these wrongdoers with arguments like: "was the (ousted) Government any more corrupt then the previous?"

"Mr.T. didn't do anything wrong..."

"The economy was thriving"

"he did a lot of good for the rural poor.."

even bringing up "Enron", because others are doing wrong, his and his cronies wrongdoings are O.K. (????????)

So I can shoot someone and argue that so many have been shot already and therefor it got be alright and far from wrong!

This concept sounds to me like the polemics xactly this guy and his entourage are using over and over again!

yes it's all as true as his "memoirs" which were floating in the north and north-east, where it says...that he has grown up in a temple sleeping on just a mat..."

"Honest lies..."

And he simply "forgot" how rich he really was...

How much more cynical can things get?

Has anyone said that the allegations against Thaksin should not be investigated and if cause is found, tried? Or even that he should not be tried on the charges that have been brought against him while the reins of power were in the hands of his most committed enemies.

The problem for some of us- who may not care for Thaksin one bit- is that we perceive a strange set of coincidences: many of the people who detest him as a man (his facial shape, voice, choice in wives) also just happen to detest his policies and also happen to detest his authoritarian control of the government while he was in power- and ALSO- as it happens- detest his personal corruption (while conveniently never discussing corruption beyond his- as if there is none in the latest acquisitions by some of THaksins more vocal and active enemies. (and well armed, I might add). One would expect that such devotion to clean government would yield a demand to investigate every single financial transaction that every gov't official in the last ten years at least has been involved in- but curiously- we don't hear that.

These people invariably site the drug wars and his role in them- commendable- but rarely demand to know why, after a year in power, the military still has not taken proper and transparant steps to investigate the human rights abuses that are still happening in th south.

It makes one wonder if the cry is for justice at all- or simply to see an enemy vanquished using any tools available- including the noble ideals of justice for all.

That's not justice- that's a rotten perversion of a beautiful ideal- either justice applies to all- or it applies to none.

Edited December 28, 2007 by blaze

[blaze]

I can't believe my eyes while reading through this thread... so many people, educated in the west, used to rules, to laws, to punishment if one doesn't follow them...

Condoning at will these wrongdoers with arguments like: "was the (ousted) Government any more corrupt then the previous?"

"Mr.T. didn't do anything wrong..."

"The economy was thriving"

"he did a lot of good for the rural poor.."

even bringing up "Enron", because others are doing wrong, his and his cronies wrongdoings are O.K. (????????)

So I can shoot someone and argue that so many have been shot already and therefor it got be alright and far from wrong!

This concept sounds to me like the polemics xactly this guy and his entourage are using over and over again!

yes it's all as true as his "memoirs" which were floating in the north and north-east, where it says...that he has grown up in a temple sleeping on just a mat..."

"Honest lies..."

And he simply "forgot" how rich he really was...

How much more cynical can things get?

Has anyone said that the allegations against Thaksin should not be investigated and if cause is found, tried? Or even that he should not be tried on the charges that have been brought against him while the reins of power were in the hands of his most committed enemies.

The problem for some of us- who may not care for Thaksin one bit- is that we perceive a strange set of coincidences: many of the people who detest him as a man (his facial shape, voice, choice in wives) also just happen to detest his policies and also happen to detest his authoritarian control of the government while he was in power- and ALSO- as it happens- detest his personal corruption (while conveniently never discussing corruption beyond his- as if there is none in the latest acquisitions by some of THaksins more vocal and active enemies. (and well armed, I might add). One would expect that such devotion to clean government would yield a demand to investigate every single financial transaction that every gov't official in the last ten years at least has been involved in- but curiously- we don't hear that.

These people invariably site the drug wars and his role in them- commendable- but rarely demand to know why, after a year in power, the military still has not taken proper and transparant steps to investigate the human rights abuses that are still happening in th south.

It makes one wonder if the cry is for justice at all- or simply to see an enemy vanquished using any tools available- including the noble ideals of justice for all.

That's not justice- that's a rotten perversion of a beautiful ideal- either justice applies to all- or it applies to none. (heard that on a TV show)

[jumnien]

Well said, Blaze. The anti-Thaksin brigade was tremendously insincere from the very start. I don't like Thaksin any more than the next guy, but as free speech activist Supinya said, "The military junta is far more dangerous than Thaksin ever was."

[Johpa]

Can you tell me one place on earth where this "money is power" is not true?

Perhaps when the money is in the hands of a relatively modest man like Warren Buffet.

[sriracha john]

I can't believe my eyes while reading through this thread... so many people, educated in the west, used to rules, to laws, to punishment if one doesn't follow them...

Condoning at will these wrongdoers with arguments like: "was the (ousted) Government any more corrupt then the previous?"

"Mr.T. didn't do anything wrong..."

"The economy was thriving"

"he did a lot of good for the rural poor.."

even bringing up "Enron", because others are doing wrong, his and his cronies wrongdoings are O.K. (????????)

So I can shoot someone and argue that so many have been shot already and therefor it got be alright and far from wrong!

This concept sounds to me like the polemics xactly this guy and his entourage are using over and over again!

yes it's all as true as his "memoirs" which were floating in the north and north-east, where it says...that he has grown up in a temple sleeping on just a mat..."

"Honest lies..."

And he simply "forgot" how rich he really was...

How much more cynical can things get?

Has anyone said that the allegations against Thaksin should not be investigated and if cause is found, tried? Or even that he should not be tried on the charges that have been brought against him while the reins of power were in the hands of his most committed enemies.

The problem for some of us- who may not care for Thaksin one bit- is that we perceive a strange set of coincidences: many of the people who detest him as a man (his facial shape, voice, choice in wives) also just happen to detest his policies and also happen to detest his authoritarian control of the government while he was in power- and ALSO- as it happens- detest his personal corruption (while conveniently never discussing corruption beyond his- as if there is none in the latest acquisitions by some of THaksins more vocal and active enemies. (and well armed, I might add). One would expect that such devotion to clean government would yield a demand to investigate every single financial transaction that every gov't official in the last ten years at least has been involved in- but curiously- we don't hear that.

These people invariably site the drug wars and his role in them- commendable- but rarely demand to know why, after a year in power, the military still has not taken proper and transparant steps to investigate the human rights abuses that are still happening in th south.

It makes one wonder if the cry is for justice at all- or simply to see an enemy vanquished using any tools available- including the noble ideals of justice for all.

That's not justice- that's a rotten perversion of a beautiful ideal- either justice applies to all- or it applies to none.

To rid a nation of a tyrannical despot such as Thaksin is no easy task...

Marcos's 23-year rule is a prime example of that...

so yes, every tool needs to be brought to bear to incise that cancer out...

still, as with the War on Drugs, Tak Bai, etc. as I've advocated before, by all means prosecute everyone involved... starting at the top which is Thaksin.

Samuian does have valid points in that many posts defend Thaksin by some of the methods he mentions. The posts invariably include insincere messages like, I don't like Thaksin any more than the next guy, or, I'm no fan of Thaksin... then proceed on to excuse his actions.

Edited December 28, 2007 by sriracha john

[blaze]

I can't believe my eyes while reading through this thread... so many people, educated in the west, used to rules, to laws, to punishment if one doesn't follow them...

Condoning at will these wrongdoers with arguments like: "was the (ousted) Government any more corrupt then the previous?"

"Mr.T. didn't do anything wrong..."

"The economy was thriving"

"he did a lot of good for the rural poor.."

even bringing up "Enron", because others are doing wrong, his and his cronies wrongdoings are O.K. (????????)

So I can shoot someone and argue that so many have been shot already and therefor it got be alright and far from wrong!

This concept sounds to me like the polemics xactly this guy and his entourage are using over and over again!

yes it's all as true as his "memoirs" which were floating in the north and north-east, where it says...that he has grown up in a temple sleeping on just a mat..."

"Honest lies..."

And he simply "forgot" how rich he really was...

How much more cynical can things get?

Has anyone said that the allegations against Thaksin should not be investigated and if cause is found, tried? Or even that he should not be tried on the charges that have been brought against him while the reins of power were in the hands of his most committed enemies.

The problem for some of us- who may not care for Thaksin one bit- is that we perceive a strange set of coincidences: many of the people who detest him as a man (his facial shape, voice, choice in wives) also just happen to detest his policies and also happen to detest his authoritarian control of the government while he was in power- and ALSO- as it happens- detest his personal corruption (while conveniently never discussing corruption beyond his- as if there is none in the latest acquisitions by some of THaksins more vocal and active enemies. (and well armed, I might add). One would expect that such devotion to clean government would yield a demand to investigate every single financial transaction that every gov't official in the last ten years at least has been involved in- but curiously- we don't hear that.

These people invariably site the drug wars and his role in them- commendable- but rarely demand to know why, after a year in power, the military still has not taken proper and transparant steps to investigate the human rights abuses that are still happening in th south.

It makes one wonder if the cry is for justice at all- or simply to see an enemy vanquished using any tools available- including the noble ideals of justice for all.

That's not justice- that's a rotten perversion of a beautiful ideal- either justice applies to all- or it applies to none.

To rid a nation of a tyrannical despot such as Thaksin is no easy task...

Marcos's 23-year rule is a prime example of that...

so yes, every tool needs to be brought to bear to incise that cancer out...

still, as with the War on Drugs, Tak Bai, etc. as I've advocated before, by all means prosecute everyone involved... starting at the top which is Thaksin.

Samuian does have valid points in that many posts defend Thaksin by some of the methods he mentions. The posts invariably include insincere messages like, I don't like Thaksin any more than the next guy, or, I'm no fan of Thaksin... then proceed on to excuse his actions.

Then let me go on record and remind me when I deviate: I want Thaksin tried for his role in the drug wars. But every other person of power at the time who endorsed those actions or participated must also be named and shamed.

As far as Tak Bai- I know of no precedents internationally where the leader of a country is prosecuted when men in the army take it upon themselves to commit murder. So leave Thaksin out- unless you will include Chuan for Ratchaburi.

I certainly want him tried for any substantive allegation of corruption. And investigated and if need be, banned for life, for policy corruption. Of course I also expect a full auditing of the books of the subsequent government- and appropriate measures taken.

Most important- I would like to see some hard academic analysis of his populist programs- cost, efficiancy etc-

As far as his perverting the checks and balances- sadly- I'd like to believe that- but my cynicism suggests that the nature of the culture with its emphasis on dancing with the one what brought ya- makes me wonder if they even need to be tinkered with. Which really makes an uphill battle for democracy.

But just to add: when people, myself included, tend to downplay Thaksin's sins- I think what we are doing is putting them in the perspective of that historic thorn in the side of many developing democracies and especially Thailands: military coups.

Edited December 28, 2007 by blaze

[dan10400]

Most important- I would like to see some hard academic analysis of his populist programs- cost, efficiancy etc-

The Thailand Development Research Institute (TDRI) has a fair range of topics (in the subject area I had

researched, they were fairly well-written and appeared to be under-read by most Thais). Quick search on

"populist policies" found more than a few hits. Here is the link if you are interested:

http://www.info.tdri.or.th/

Regards,

--Dan

[Lockstock]

I am stunned at the arogance of some posters on this site. A country has voted, the result is declared, and yet you still continue to wine.

Months ago, some of the very same posters I am sure, were complaining about the lack of democracy in the country when the military flexed their muscles. Now it has played its course, you are still not happy....and to blaim a result on the 'uneducated rural people' is just pure ignorance. To have a result that took into account just the views of the 'haves' in the city whilst ignoring the 'have nots' in the country, now that would be a sad day.

Just as a reminder, this is how it works........people vote, the votes are counted and then there is a winner......Live With It?

... And people that blatantly cheat the system for their own worth should be thrown in jail.

Oh, hang on....

....Oh well....if its posted on the Internet then it must be true.

[beammeup]

The whole think makes me sad, the Thais had a chance to go forward with some new faces and new idea's, but they chose the same old bunch of #&%$("£@... Vote buying is a crime in this country. Who said crime doesnt pay?

[Ricardo]

Far more Thai civilians voted for PPP than for Democrat. The inflated numbers for Democrat party include the mandatory military vote for the Democrats.

Soldiers don't have a secret vote - like other voters in Thailand ?

[hhfarang]

I am still stunned that the ordinary and quite poor people of Thailand supported the PPP, it is just beyond belief after Thaksin is almost certainly guilty of robbing these people of Thailand's inheritance of billions of Baht and ensuring their future will take many many more years before they can escape the poverty trap whilst Thaksin and his cronies just get richer and richer

I've never have understood why so many people who have lived in LOS for a couple rounds of government, thai style, cannot seem to grasp Thaksins ADMINISTRATION, was no more nor less corrupt than previous governments.

Is it that difficult? Is there a switch that just won't click? A mental block that stops all thought when this is stated? Unlike those governments he actually gave something to poor people. Yes he is corrupt, yes he is venally corrupt we all know this. I guess the point is if the other non Thaksin administrations would have been something less than as bad as Thaksins we could honestly throw brickbats at the people who voted for the PPP.

Obviously we cannot

I doubt the elections were real. if there can be fixed elections in USA then there can be in Thailand. The mistake was that the coup did not stay in place longer and ensure a real election.

My wife talked to her family and there were PPP (and maybe other party's) representatives in rural Issan villages buying votes again this time just like the TRT did in past elections. The poor people up there will vote for whomever gives them money and promises to help their lives out the most. Under TRT they did get better health care and educational services in rural areas and well as a lot of job opportunities due to expanding OTOP so can you really blame them? I'm afraid it's pretty much that way everywhere. People don't vote for the best leader for the whole country, they vote for the person who they think will help them the most in their personal situation. Sad but true...

[blaze]

I am still stunned that the ordinary and quite poor people of Thailand supported the PPP, it is just beyond belief after Thaksin is almost certainly guilty of robbing these people of Thailand's inheritance of billions of Baht and ensuring their future will take many many more years before they can escape the poverty trap whilst Thaksin and his cronies just get richer and richer

I've never have understood why so many people who have lived in LOS for a couple rounds of government, thai style, cannot seem to grasp Thaksins ADMINISTRATION, was no more nor less corrupt than previous governments.

Is it that difficult? Is there a switch that just won't click? A mental block that stops all thought when this is stated? Unlike those governments he actually gave something to poor people. Yes he is corrupt, yes he is venally corrupt we all know this. I guess the point is if the other non Thaksin administrations would have been something less than as bad as Thaksins we could honestly throw brickbats at the people who voted for the PPP.

Obviously we cannot

I doubt the elections were real. if there can be fixed elections in USA then there can be in Thailand. The mistake was that the coup did not stay in place longer and ensure a real election.

People don't vote for the best leader for the whole country, they vote for the person who they think will help them the most in their personal situation. Sad but true...

Not sad at all- it's called enlightened self-interest. It's how and why democracy works. If someone votes for interests which are not his own- that would be sad. And pretty hard to believe. Our 'personal situation' has many aspects- our immediate financial concerns, our security concerns, our understanding of how how the nation's economy can best be shaped to improve our personal economy, our moral values, our personal sense of social justice and compassion etc etc. But in the end, they all come down to our own needs.

When western political parties promise tax cuts to the middle class or lowering capital gains taxes for the wealthy, they do so in full recognition that people vote in their own best interest. Why should it be different here?

I don't think there's a country on earth where the poorest segments, when choosing how to vote, will think- ok- now what's best for those struggling capitalists in the cities- how should I vote so that the SUV set can be assured subsidized fuel?

Edited December 29, 2007 by blaze

[Bagwan]

When western political parties promise tax cuts to the middle class or lowering capital gains taxes for the wealthy, they do so in full recognition that people vote in their own best interest. Why should it be different here?

People vote for what they perceive as their own best interests. One of the problems is that the uneducated poor accept a bribe for their vote rather than vote for education, health care and a decent infrastructure. Jam now, not steak and lobster in the future - maybe. Perhaps they are right; I wouldn't trust many politicians, and certainly not a Thai one.

To digress from the main thrust of this thread, I am surprised that nobody is throwing bricks at La Thaksin. I can't help thinking that she operates as an 'eminence grise', and that she provides the policies and impetus for the front man. She has certainly made sure that her kith and kin have open access to the trough.

[blaze]

When western political parties promise tax cuts to the middle class or lowering capital gains taxes for the wealthy, they do so in full recognition that people vote in their own best interest. Why should it be different here?

People vote for what they perceive as their own best interests.

Absolutely correct- nobody knows the actual way their best interests can be realized. And the Thai perception- that of the poor- is that no political party is going to follow through on serious adjustments that would substantially improve their lives. A pretty accurate perception if ya ask me.

It's not up to the voters to educate themselves so much as the parties to educate THEMselves. And start realizing that if they want to serve two terms, they would do well to follow through on announced policies to improve the lot of the people. THEN the people will put more faith in policy and start looking at the bigger picture.

[Tolley]

The naievity of some posters here is incredible.

All this uproar over vote buying.

Wake up.

What do you think happens in all our western democracies?

It might be a little more sophisticated but it amounts to exactly the same thing.

Parties pump huge amount of money into marginal electorates for infrastructure projects to get the votes....it is called pork barrelling and is used extensively.

What about tax cuts...another form of vote buying.

Favourable legislation to big party political donors....vote buying

The reason many in the far north of Thailand support Thaksin is that at least they get something from him and his cronies.

Further as corrupt as Thaksin may have been he may still have been better or less corrupt than any of the other alternatives.

[selftaopath]

I think he will be arrested and prosecuted. The new PPP leaders have tasted power, and even though Thaksin has vowed not to get involved in politics anymore, they would loose influence when he returns. And all politicians that have tasted power want as much of it as they can, so the Democrats, miltitary and PPP will want to get rid of him.

I could not help but think of the saying: Money talks and b/s walks. Is it different in LOS? Or maybe the "golden rule."

[HobbsTheFerociousTiger]

The whole think makes me sad, the Thais had a chance to go forward with some new faces and new idea's, but they chose the same old bunch of #&%$("£@... Vote buying is a crime in this country. Who said crime doesnt pay?

Sigh.. Beam, the answers ARE in this topic. Please read my posts, and those for example of Rainman, Emperor Tud. Of course Thais don't WANT to vote for Samak, but the ones that did were left with no choice. Don't misunderstand the huge resentment the "Democrats" called upon themselves by derailing the democratic process, enabling the coup to happen, and then supporting the coupe and all the illegal shambles that followed.

This is the first year even my wife didn't vote democrat. (Abstained).

[CWMcMurray]

When western political parties promise tax cuts to the middle class or lowering capital gains taxes for the wealthy, they do so in full recognition that people vote in their own best interest. Why should it be different here?

People vote for what they perceive as their own best interests. One of the problems is that the uneducated poor accept a bribe for their vote rather than vote for education, health care and a decent infrastructure. Jam now, not steak and lobster in the future - maybe. Perhaps they are right; I wouldn't trust many politicians, and certainly not a Thai one.

What good are steak and lobster in the future if you don't even have enough jam to eat today?

Most of the rural poor in this country live hand to mouth, day to day. Until their survival needs are satisfied they will not consider the other things. This isn't a question of not being educated it is simply a matter of being human... (mazlo's hierarchy of needs and all of that)

[sriracha john]

The whole think makes me sad, the Thais had a chance to go forward with some new faces and new idea's, but they chose the same old bunch of #&%$("£@... Vote buying is a crime in this country. Who said crime doesnt pay?

Thais don't WANT to vote for Samak, but the ones that did were left with no choice.

A total of 43 different political parties received votes in the election held on Dec. 23.

http://203.150.244.10/reports/eng/index.php

Edited December 29, 2007 by sriracha john

[meemiathai]

I can't believe my eyes while reading through this thread... so many people, educated in the west, used to rules, to laws, to punishment if one doesn't follow them...

Condoning at will these wrongdoers with arguments like: "was the (ousted) Government any more corrupt then the previous?"

"Mr.T. didn't do anything wrong..."

"The economy was thriving"

"he did a lot of good for the rural poor.."

even bringing up "Enron", because others are doing wrong, his and his cronies wrongdoings are O.K. (????????)

So I can shoot someone and argue that so many have been shot already and therefor it got be alright and far from wrong!

This concept sounds to me like the polemics xactly this guy and his entourage are using over and over again!

yes it's all as true as his "memoirs" which were floating in the north and north-east, where it says...that he has grown up in a temple sleeping on just a mat..."

"Honest lies..."

And he simply "forgot" how rich he really was...

How much more cynical can things get?

Has anyone said that the allegations against Thaksin should not be investigated and if cause is found, tried? Or even that he should not be tried on the charges that have been brought against him while the reins of power were in the hands of his most committed enemies.

The problem for some of us- who may not care for Thaksin one bit- is that we perceive a strange set of coincidences: many of the people who detest him as a man (his facial shape, voice, choice in wives) also just happen to detest his policies and also happen to detest his authoritarian control of the government while he was in power- and ALSO- as it happens- detest his personal corruption (while conveniently never discussing corruption beyond his- as if there is none in the latest acquisitions by some of THaksins more vocal and active enemies. (and well armed, I might add). One would expect that such devotion to clean government would yield a demand to investigate every single financial transaction that every gov't official in the last ten years at least has been involved in- but curiously- we don't hear that.

These people invariably site the drug wars and his role in them- commendable- but rarely demand to know why, after a year in power, the military still has not taken proper and transparant steps to investigate the human rights abuses that are still happening in th south.

It makes one wonder if the cry is for justice at all- or simply to see an enemy vanquished using any tools available- including the noble ideals of justice for all.

That's not justice- that's a rotten perversion of a beautiful ideal- either justice applies to all- or it applies to none.

[meemiathai]

Can you tell me one place on earth where this "money is power" is not true?

Perhaps when the money is in the hands of a relatively modest man like Warren Buffet.

In 2007, Buffett was listed among Time's 100 Most Influential People in The World.

[B Fuddled]

Patisan politics = mindlessness.

Vote buying?

In the west politicians go for the special interest groups, who then quite openly vote en bloc.

The gay community votes for the gay friendly candidate. The religious community votes for the former minister or the candidate that brings God into every campaign speach. Do you think the military are going to vote for the pacifist, or the candidate on a platform that includes cuts in defence spending?

The TRT did a good job of placating the poor with bread and circuses. Real change will come when these people storm the Bastille. How many among us are willing to sacrifice our comfortable lives here in favour of promoting a real life for the majority of the Thais?

Give the man a fish and he'll eat today; give him the Net and he'll forget about food while he sits and posts mindless rhetoric.

[meemiathai]

When western political parties promise tax cuts to the middle class or lowering capital gains taxes for the wealthy, they do so in full recognition that people vote in their own best interest. Why should it be different here?

People vote for what they perceive as their own best interests.

Absolutely correct- nobody knows the actual way their best interests can be realized. And the Thai perception- that of the poor- is that no political party is going to follow through on serious adjustments that would substantially improve their lives. A pretty accurate perception if ya ask me.

It's not up to the voters to educate themselves so much as the parties to educate THEMselves. And start realizing that if they want to serve two terms, they would do well to follow through on announced policies to improve the lot of the people. THEN the people will put more faith in policy and start looking at the bigger picture.

If they want to serve two terms, they would have to do well enough so those with guns and cannons are satisfied. But that could mean upsetting the voters. So there would be a lot of struggle and balancing work again.

[meemiathai]

The naievity of some posters here is incredible.

All this uproar over vote buying.

Wake up.

What do you think happens in all our western democracies?

It might be a little more sophisticated but it amounts to exactly the same thing.

Parties pump huge amount of money into marginal electorates for infrastructure projects to get the votes....it is called pork barrelling and is used extensively.

What about tax cuts...another form of vote buying.

Favourable legislation to big party political donors....vote buying

The reason many in the far north of Thailand support Thaksin is that at least they get something from him and his cronies.

Further as corrupt as Thaksin may have been he may still have been better or less corrupt than any of the other alternatives.

At least he is a stronger and more capable man.

[meemiathai]

Patisan politics = mindlessness.

Vote buying?

In the west politicians go for the special interest groups, who then quite openly vote en bloc.

The gay community votes for the gay friendly candidate. The religious community votes for the former minister or the candidate that brings God into every campaign speach. Do you think the military are going to vote for the pacifist, or the candidate on a platform that includes cuts in defence spending?

The TRT did a good job of placating the poor with bread and circuses. Real change will come when these people storm the Bastille. How many among us are willing to sacrifice our comfortable lives here in favour of promoting a real life for the majority of the Thais?

Give the man a fish and he'll eat today; give him the Net and he'll forget about food while he sits and posts mindless rhetoric.

There is no vote buying in the west!!! They are called donations.

[plachon]

When western political parties promise tax cuts to the middle class or lowering capital gains taxes for the wealthy, they do so in full recognition that people vote in their own best interest. Why should it be different here?

People vote for what they perceive as their own best interests. One of the problems is that the uneducated poor accept a bribe for their vote rather than vote for education, health care and a decent infrastructure. Jam now, not steak and lobster in the future - maybe. Perhaps they are right; I wouldn't trust many politicians, and certainly not a Thai one.

What good are steak and lobster in the future if you don't even have enough jam to eat today?

Most of the rural poor in this country live hand to mouth, day to day. Until their survival needs are satisfied they will not consider the other things. This isn't a question of not being educated it is simply a matter of being human... (mazlo's hierarchy of needs and all of that)

Don't remember a mobile phone for every man, woman and child being one of Mazlo's pre-requisites of human existence, but then humans may have evolved a bit on the essentials of life since he was around?

Toxin certainly knew how to satisfy that craving......

[jumnien]

My guess would be that the military-appointed prosecuters who allege to arrest Thaksin upon his return are themselves shopping for residences in Hong Kong at the moment; they certainly aren't welcome in Singapore!

[wintermute]

My guess would be that the military-appointed prosecuters who allege to arrest Thaksin upon his return are themselves shopping for residences in Hong Kong at the moment; they certainly aren't welcome in Singapore!

These guys will have nowhere to run. They are old diehard khun thai nationalist rightwing blowhards anyways. Most likely they'll get pardoned though to appease a certain elite segment of Thai society. I figure that is probably the best way to resolve the situation after permanently neutering the military so they don't get anymore "ambitions" to rule civilians.