Farang Motorcyclists In The Pattaya Area.

[Mobi]

A couple of weeks ago I was driving East on Pattaya Klang (towards Sukhumvit) and there was a farang couple (male and female) on a motorcycle just in front of me. We slowed down for the red light at Carrefour, and a cop waved the couple to the side of the road. Neither was wearing a helmet. After he stopped them, they lifted up the motorcycle seat, retrieved 2 helmets and put them on. And then they paid their fine. Nearly every time I drive around Mabprachan Lake I come across farangs on motorcycles without helmets – in fact I would say the majority don’t wear helmets.

This afternoon I was approaching Pong on the 3240 and just before the Or Bor Tor office, there is a police check point where they check drink drivers over the New Year period. There was a farang in front of me on a motorcycle, wearing a helmet. As we passed the check point I noticed that the helmet strap was hanging loose. I thought how stupid. Then, as we drove round a bend, and out of sight off the checkpoint, I realised why he hadn’t strapped up the helmet – he took it off and put it on his lap, and continued on his way.

Some of these guys heap shame on us westerners even further by driving East of Sukhumvit, not wearing shirts. And remember, this is some 15 – 20 kms from the Pattaya beach area, where you might argue that allowances can be made. There was one the other day who both my wife and I thought was riding naked, until we detected briefest of shorts showing as we approached a line of traffic.

At night, the roads around the Mabprachan Lake area are very dark. Yet almost every night when I drive along these roads, I almost run into farangs driving motorcycles with out any lights on. I have had so many near misses, all involving farangs with either the rear, front or both lights not working at night. I can only imagine they have a suicide wish.

Then this afternoon I was driving south along 3^rd road, and stopped in the centre of the road as I wished to turn right into a small soi. I waited until there was a reasonable break in the traffic approaching on the other side of the road. After a couple of minutes the traffic cleared and there was a single pick up, some distance away, proceeding slowly – plenty of time for me to make my turn. I just started to make the turn, when out of the blue, from the near side of the pick up there loomed a motorcycle which must have been doing at least 120 kms/hr. He approached at a frightening speed, and almost hit me. Yes, you’ve guessed it – it was a farang.

It is both my wife's and my observation that most farang drivers drive very dangerously. We believe that many have no ‘empathy’ for the style of driving in this country, and the ways to drive to avoid accidents. Frequently, they seem to think they are back in the home country and have equal rights on the road. They drive in the centre of the lane, often slower than the general run of the traffic, and are just asking for vehicles to hit them as they try to overtake (Or undertake). Well, I have news for them. Motorcyclists will never have equal rights on the roads here, and the Thais understand this and keep well to the left, or stay on the hard shoulder in the centre of the road. Its common sense and self preservation, but farangs – they seem to think that the western rules of the road are more important than the need to stay alive.

I truly believe that riding motorcycles anywhere in Thailand is one of the most dangerous things anyone can do, and I need more than my 2 hands to count the number of people I have known and who have died as a result of motorcycle accidents – many through no fault of their own.

I just cannot understand why farangs ride these machines with such callous disregard for themselves or their loved ones.

Rant over.

[jumnien]

Thank you for your rant; it may save someone's life. It does get tiring living here in Thailand seeing farangs behave even more stupidly than they would in their home country.

[hp8000]

I'll add that most tourists coming to Thailand don't have a proper motorbike driving license, they just ride a bike 2 weeks/year when in holiday here. Due to the lack of control from the rental shops they can rent from a Honda Dream to a big 750-1000cc and become a threat to others on the road.

Wearing a helmet will never cross their small brains as with the head covered it's not so easy to be well spotted and show off in front of the girlies.

They don't seem to realize that the roads here are covered with traps like hole, sand, stones and dust, without speaking about all the animals who can cross their way at any moment. I wish them good luck but I'm affraid it should not suffice and many of them will have to visit any of the thai hospital this winter.

So, in capitals "WEAR at least A HELMET" and some appropriate clothes !

[Rudy47]

I think what happens is the farangs try emulate the Thai style. The farangs think this is the norm and for the most part anyone can drive as dangerous as the please with little to no penalty a la Wild West.

The Thais are dangerous, the farangs are hazardous.

[naka]

Perhaps Farangs are just good at adapting to local conditions !

Naka.

[CGW]

I agree in principle with Mobi's rant! farangs driving like Thai's is most annoying - they no better!

But, are the Thai crash helmets going to give any protection at all in a crash? I fear not, in a previous life i used to sell quality helmets with standards, the Thai helmets meet no standard what so ever - one size fits all!

[hp8000]

Dumba$$ they are, they had an education that many thais never had, The sould show the rignt way to behave.

I notice here in the north that more and more thais are wearing a helmet and it's a great improvement for their security. But the farangs are soooooo clever.

[Jareddiving]

I agree in principle with Mobi's rant! farangs driving like Thai's is most annoying - they no better!

But, are the Thai crash helmets going to give any protection at all in a crash? I fear not, in a previous life i used to sell quality helmets with standards, the Thai helmets meet no standard what so ever - one size fits all!

My helmet actually gave quite some protection when i had a accident with my moterbike..

There were deep scarfs in my helmet but luckily nothing to my face.

They dont help a lot but they surely help a bit.

Btw this subject has nothing to do with Thai or Farang.. They both drive like idiots.

[jumnien]

My head too was saved by an inferior Thai helmet. Any helmet is better than none.

[bottleymike]

The stupidest farrang i have ever seen was spotted the other day on central road near carrefoure on a motor byke. For a "helmet" he was wearing a childs plastic toy UK policemans helmet.

Complete prat in my opinion. And whilst I dont mind if he kills himself, he will probably take others with him when he goes.

And all this when for about 250 baht you can get a helmet.

[JSixpack]

It is both my wife's and my observation that most farang drivers drive very dangerously.

Spot on! The farangs are more of a menace to other drivers, not to mention themselves, than the Thais. They have absolutely no excuse for being such utter fools.

I notice that Thailand does eventually serve up an education to those who remain alive long enough.

[Jareddiving]

The Farangs drive like idiots and the Thai people drive like idiots...

If you think the Farang drive worser then the Thais, take a look on Sukhumvit.

If you think the Thais drive worser then the Farang, take a look on Beach road.

[CHdiver]

If I watch how the Pizza Delivery Guys drive around, I wonder how they survive one day. But many Tourists do the same, but they sit many times on bigger bikes. Thoes who really can hurt other people if they get down.

I don't care if somebody don't has a helmet or drives to fast. If they have an accident and I come along, I just drive on. I don't waist my time to help stupid people.

[CGW]

If I watch how the Pizza Delivery Guys drive around, I wonder how they survive one day.

I always think of them as "temporary citizens" as they are surely not long for this earth!

[sharecropper]

Until I see a Farang make a citizens arrest of a fat lardy copper weaving unsteadily on his motorbike, usually with a mobile to one ear, with his soft cap on and no helmet, I will take all this with a big pinch of salt.

But I agree, farang are worse than Thais when it comes to motorbikes, and, especially in high season, in cars. They are shocking. Almost every day I see some cretinous piece of farang driving. When I confidently assert they must be Thai (to my then triumphant missus), they have recently turned out to be foreigners. I then say they must come from France or Southern Europe, but hey, I'm prejudiced.

[tropo]

The stupidest farrang i have ever seen was spotted the other day on central road near carrefoure on a motor byke. For a "helmet" he was wearing a childs plastic toy UK policemans helmet.

Complete prat in my opinion. And whilst I dont mind if he kills himself, he will probably take others with him when he goes.And all this when for about 250 baht you can get a helmet.

That's quite unlikely. Why would wearing a cheap helmet make it more likely that he'll kill someone else?

[tropo]

If I watch how the Pizza Delivery Guys drive around, I wonder how they survive one day. But many Tourists do the same, but they sit many times on bigger bikes. Thoes who really can hurt other people if they get down.

I don't care if somebody don't has a helmet or drives to fast. If they have an accident and I come along, I just drive on. I don't waist my time to help stupid people.

It's amazing how you manage to do a full IQ assessment while driving past.

[pattayadave]

Come on gentlemen don't tar us all with the same brush

the two helmets that were supplied with the new bike i bought binned them and bought propper ones

i woulndnt even take the bike from the front of the house without putting it on

stick to all the speed limits etc etc

NOW the car drivers why is it they hog the middle of the road even in the smaller soi's wont give way to other vehicles and have the awful habit of driving with thier lights on full beam at night time, and the size of the bl@@dy things would house a third world country,

nearly got felled by one on soi wat boon sanphan 3 weeks ago pulled straight out of the junction at 7/11 never even bothered to look me thinks! her in doors nearly had kittens ! not talking about thai drivers here either.

now i'm not trying to stick up for the morons who do drive around with no shirts and flip flops or helmets but some expats do have considerations for other drivers while on motorbikes

[tropo]

Well, I have news for them. Motorcyclists will never have equal rights on the roads here, and the Thais understand this and keep well to the left, or stay on the hard shoulder in the centre of the road. Its common sense and self preservation, but farangs – they seem to think that the western rules of the road are more important than the need to stay alive.

I'm sorry, but this absolute nonsense. Thai motorcyclists (and car drivers) don't keep to any place on the road...they drive anywhere they please.

It's hard to believe you even drive in Pattaya having made such inaccurate observations. Thais drive the wrong way up most one-way Sois too... have you not seen that? Another major observation is that many Thai motorcyclists and car drivers jump red lights at high speed...often many seconds after they've turned red. The Thais are maniacs on the roads here.

BTW, I'm a motorcyclist.

[Mobi]

Tropo.

I'm sorry, but this absolute nonsense. Thai motorcyclists (and car drivers) don't keep to any place on the road...they drive anywhere they please.

It's hard to believe you even drive in Pattaya having made such inaccurate observations. Thais drive the wrong way up most one-way Sois too... have you not seen that? Another major observation is that many Thai motorcyclists and car drivers jump red lights at high speed...often many seconds after they've turned red. The Thais are maniacs on the roads here.

BTW, I'm a motorcyclist.

I have been driving in Thailand for over 30 years.

I have spent the past 3 years in Pattaya, and in the past 2 years alone, have chalked up over 70,000 kms, in and around Pattaya.

I drive into Pattaya maybe 4 days per week on average.

I did not say that every Thai is a good driver and that every farang is a bad driver. There are lunatic drivers from all nationalities in Thailand.

In fact, apart from mentioning that most Thai drivers have the sense to keep out of the way (either on the left or on the hard shoulder of roads), I made no mention of Thai drivers in my post. I was having a rant at the majority of very bad and unsafe farang drivers.

You can drive down Sukhumvit at any hour of the day or night, and you will see farang motorcyclists hogging the centre of the road, and Thais keeping out of the way whenever possible.

It is a fact, whether you accept it or not.

BTW if you drove a car, I suspect you would see the driving habits of other motorcyclists in a totally different light.

I used to ride a bike back in the 70's until one day I stopped at a red light and the bus behind wanted to jump the light. Mobi flew through the air - all the way to hospital, and the bike was a write off. The bus had a smashed headlight and cracked windsreen.

Maybe that accident impaired my judgement?

Edited December 29, 2007 by Mobi

[tropo]

Tropo.

I'm sorry, but this absolute nonsense. Thai motorcyclists (and car drivers) don't keep to any place on the road...they drive anywhere they please.

It's hard to believe you even drive in Pattaya having made such inaccurate observations. Thais drive the wrong way up most one-way Sois too... have you not seen that? Another major observation is that many Thai motorcyclists and car drivers jump red lights at high speed...often many seconds after they've turned red. The Thais are maniacs on the roads here.

BTW, I'm a motorcyclist.

I have been driving in Thailand for over 30 years.

I have spent the past 3 years in Pattaya, and in the past 2 years alone, have chalked up over 70,000 kms, in and around Pattaya.

I drive into Pattaya maybe 4 days per week on average.

I did not say that every Thai is a good driver and that every farang is a bad driver. There are lunatic drivers from all nationalities in Thailand.

In fact, apart from mentioning that most Thai drivers have the sense to keep out of the way (either on the left or on the hard shoulder of roads), I made no mention of Thai drivers in my post. I was having a rant at the majority of very bad and unsafe farang drivers.

You can drive down Sukhumvit at any hour of the day or night, and you will see farang motorcyclists hogging the centre of the road, and Thais keeping out of the way whenever possible.

It is a fact, whether you accept it or not.

BTW if you drove a car, I suspect you would see the driving habits of other motorcyclists in a totally different light.

I used to ride a bike back in the 70's until one day I stopped at a red light and the bus behind wanted to jump the light. Mobi flew through the air - all the way to hospital, and the bike was a write off. The bus had a smashed headlight and cracked windsreen.

Maybe that accident impaired my judgement?

It's not a fact at all. The Thai motorcyclists are absolutely crazy in and around Pattaya....far more so than the Farang drivers/riders.

Being a motorcyclist in Pattaya gives me a pretty good idea of how other motorcyclists are riding.

Don't worry so much about motorcyclists. If you have a collision with one you'll probably be ok. They're less of a danger than the car/bus and truck drivers.

The most scary of all are the Thai drivers. Can you get worse?

[Jareddiving]

Mobi, are you making a joke or what??

Most thai drivers have the sense to keep out of the way???

I think you are talking about a different Pattaya then we are!!

See a lot of evil kneivels on the roads of Pattaya.

[Mobi]

Mobi, are you making a joke or what??

Most thai drivers have the sense to keep out of the way???

I think you are talking about a different Pattaya then we are!!

See a lot of evil kneivels on the roads of Pattaya.

OK, Let me qualify this particular aspect.

I agree that in the area west of Sukhumvit (Beach Road up to Suk) anything goes. Most Thais and farangs drive like maniacs. No argument.

But as we have said many times in this forum, Pattaya is not only the area between Beach and third road.

When you get out onto Sukhumvit, towards Jomtien, Bang Sarae and beyond, or east of Sukhumvit (e g Siam Country Club Road, Nern Plum wan, 3240 and all the various roads in Nongprue, Pong, Horseshoe point etc etc) then the traffic is a bit more orderly. If you had been driving these 'normal' roads as long as I have you would know and understand this. Sure, drivers change lanes with little notice, and motorcycles still cut across you if they want to turn left or right etc, but by and large all the drivers understand what's going on, and are in sync with the 'culture' of the road, and the amount of serious accidents is surprisingly low. (Nearly all accidents involve drunk driving or falling asleep, and this is out of the remit of this particular discussion).

But time and time again on these type of roads you will see farang motorcyclists hogging the centre of the lane, driving slower than the general stream of traffic, as if they own it, whereas the Thai drivers will stay at the sides. This is even more so on the single lane roads, east of Suk, where most Thai motorcyclists value their lives and try to stay out of 'hitting range', but the farangs just plough along, oblivious of the dangers. I see this every time I go out on the road, and it's not only me that has made this observation.

Apart from being knocked off my bike 30 years ago, I have never had any serious road accidents in Thailand, and can only recall 2 very minor bumps in the past 10 years.One when I was stationery at Dolphin roundabout and a 'souped up' car with Thai driver hit me and sped off, and another when I was stationery at a red light in Sukhumvit and a Pizza delivery rider whacked my rear bumper as he tried to weave in between the waiting cars. So I think I do know how to drive safely in Thailand, and I still maintain my observations are relevant. but I suspect many of you can't see the wood from the trees, and can't understand that the roads are not total chaos - but simply organised chaos.

But at the end of the day I am far more concerned with the farangs who drive without helmets, and have defective lights on unlit roads, for this surely is the height of lunacy.

[PeaceBlondie]

Those of us who don't live in Pattaya or Phuket may not realize that in those places, farang tourists can rent bikes with 100 to 160 horsepower, which can accelerate faster than almost any Ferrari or Porsche. If you don't know how to ride such a bike (and much worse, if you're drunk), you've got a guided missile between your legs and can go from zero to 160 kph in about eight seconds!!

Riding one of those things bare-headed proves that they consider their head worthless.

[Jareddiving]

Many Thais drive like idiots!!! Even on the dark-side!

I live there my self as well.. Believe me i know how they drive.

Like shit, most of them... Farangs and Thais.

There are a lot of motorbike accidents on this road..

Only Yesterday i saw 2 Allready.

How can you say the Thais get out of the way... They Dont!! Some do but most don't!

[Mobi]

Many Thais drive like idiots!!! Even on the dark-side!

I live there my self as well.. Believe me i know how they drive.

Like shit, most of them... Farangs and Thais.

There are a lot of motorbike accidents on this road..

Only Yesterday i saw 2 Allready.

How can you say the Thais get out of the way... They Dont!! Some do but most don't!

IMHO: Most do but some don't.

We can agree to disagree.

But this thread was never started to talk about Thai drivers. We have all seen enough of their driving to form our own opinions, and I dare say thousands, if not millions of words have been written about their lack of driving skills.

I might have inadvertently opened the discussion to include Thais, when I compared how farangs drive with how Thais drive. This is regretted.

At the end of end day my rant is about farnags - supposedly from a more highly developed , orderly and law abiding society - who come to Thailand and suddenly behave the same, if not worse than their hosts. Is it any wonder there is a growing anti-farang sentiment in the land?

Many of the Thais may genuinely not know any better, and only ape what they see their peers doing on the roads, with no one to chastise them or point out the error of their ways.

This is patently untrue of these selfish farangs who put themselves at unnecessary risk, some of whom will undoubtedly will give untold grief to their loved ones when they are injured or killed.

[CGW]

I both agree and disagree with everything that has been written , why are some Thai drivers bad? there government does not consider educating them is worth the cost?

Another of my pet peeves in Pattaya, your behind a "Vios" or the like, shiny, clean, lots of toys and symbols on display and the female does not have a clue how to drive, seems the first thing the Mia gets these days is the car!

[edwardandtubs]

On The Darkside I recently saw a farang on a motorbike with a black sleeveless vest and his Thai girlfriend (or whatever) on the back. He pulled a wheelie before speeding off. Such a man!

Edited December 30, 2007 by edwardandtubs

[JSixpack]

Well, I have news for them. Motorcyclists will never have equal rights on the roads here, and the Thais understand this and keep well to the left, or stay on the hard shoulder in the centre of the road. Its common sense and self preservation, but farangs – they seem to think that the western rules of the road are more important than the need to stay alive.

I'm sorry, but this absolute nonsense. Thai motorcyclists (and car drivers) don't keep to any place on the road...they drive anywhere they please. . . .

BTW, I'm a motorcyclist.

I'm a motorcyclist too, been driving for years in PTY. Sorry, but I agree w/ Mobi. Most Thais do stay on the left etc. most of the time, esp. if there's traffic. It makes sense to do that, because that's where you pass cars, you have a better view of what's ahead, it's less start-and-stop, and it's safer (less likely to be hit from behind, less likely to hit someone who stops suddenly in front). Many cars will want to go faster than bikes, so they won't tolerate bikes in the middle of the road and will flash lights and follow aggressively; motorcyclists want to avoid the problem.

However, if there's a nice big clear space, not many cars near, experienced bikers like most Thais will move to the center, since the road is probably smoother there and now it is is safer (nobody's gonna open his door on you and you have more time if somebody pulls out in front of you from a side street, no cart vendors blocking you, etc.).

At any given time you see a lot of Thai bikes in the center even in traffic, but most of them have a purpose, such as preparing to turn right, or attempting to pass on the right, or filtering between lanes. I think filtering is legal in Thailand, but even if not it is recognized as a normal practice.

Then there's a substantial minority, say, 20%, who are just crazy drivers and weave all over everywhere etc. These are so high profile that they get all the attention and seem to represent the majority. They don't.

So most Thais are much better motorcyclists than most farang in Thailand. But the OP's point was to rant against the farangs rather than to compare driving skills. I totally agree with that rant and would add that a lot of farangs, esp. the old ones, drive too slow.

No, many Thais don't receive any driver's ed and don't even take a test for their license; no, obviously the gov't doesn't care, but does issue periodic warnings, like "be careful during Songkran." Farangs have passed a driver's test at least. But most Thais are used to motorbikes from an early age, and many are in fact skillful drivers.

As for helmets, many motorbike shops sell a heavy INDEX for about 1200 baht that give substantially more protection than the 150 baht job sold at Tesco's. If I didn't have an import, that's what I'd wear.

Edited December 30, 2007 by JSixpack

[harleyclarkey]

The old saying lads!! Ten pound head 10 pound helmet.

I have 4 bikes and also track day a lot at horrifing speeds..and would never ever get on a bike here in Ireland, Europe or Thailand without proper protection...and no !! I don't mean wearing a condom on my head.....55555!!!