Hand To Mouth : Dispatches From Thailand

[LaoPo]

Generally I avoid Lamai like the plague, one day it will become like Pattaya.If you want 'facts' take a stroll down to the pier at Bang Rak and have a look for yourself (particulary before/after a full moon party) and look at the human debris passing as back packers getting on or off the ferries.

Mark, you also mention 'standards'. They simply seem to have no acceptable standards whatsover, OK.80% of them if we are being picky. If, as it seems these low lifes are mostly dossing down in Lamai then there is no hope for the place. IMHO I thought the post from Tax exile was accurate, humorous but worrying. Some places in Maenam are already being infected by the rot of these shameful Farang.

Hmmmmm... it seems you don't have a high view of back packers, qualifying them as human debris and low lifes.

May I remind you that the majority of these youngsters are from middle to upper class families in the west; most of them don't come from the poorer working class families. These back packers are educated and a lot of them just finished a higher education or university.

They have the opportunity to travel around the world for 6 or 12 months and I think that's an unbelievable experience (I never had the chance...)

That they 'don't behave' is a matter of time and I'm convinced that their parents would feel ashamed if they would see their siblings like you see them. But, if you would take one or more of them home with you, put them in a bathtub, settle on your terrace, you would find out that under their backpacker appearance, there are some fine young people behind that facade.

And, in a few years from now they will be respectable citizens of their own world, work hard, marry and have children...and....l'Histoire se repete..

To call those youngsters "the rot of these shameful Farang" it's not nice.

How are you qualifying tattooed, shirtless, shouting and boozing Farang sitting in the open air bars of Thailand ?

Personally I'm more annoyed by the latter than back packers.

LaoPo

[burman]

May I remind you that the majority of these youngsters are from middle to upper class families in the west; most of them don't come from the poorer working class families. These back packers are educated and a lot of them just finished a higher education or university.

And what if they do come from poorer working class homes and don't have a higher education? I assume they are are welcome too?

[LaoPo]

May I remind you that the majority of these youngsters are from middle to upper class families in the west; most of them don't come from the poorer working class families. These back packers are educated and a lot of them just finished a higher education or university.

And what if they do come from poorer working class homes and don't have a higher education? I assume they are are welcome too?

Of course, why not ? Being poor(er) doesn't mean someone can't be a nice human being.

LaoPo

[burman]

Sorry if I read you wrong Lao Pao I thought you was giving their class and education status as some kind of argument against them being human debris. I was a poor working class backpacker once too.

To comment on the article, it seems like the writer is a bit of a snob.

[LaoPo]

Sorry if I read you wrong LaoPo I thought you was giving their class and education status as some kind of argument against them being human debris. I was a poor working class backpacker once too.

To comment on the article, it seems like the writer is a bit of a snob.

Yes, I think you did but that's not your fault but mine as I should have formulated differently or not at all.

Mea Culpa.

LaoPo

[mattias33]

There are different kind of backpackers just as there are different kind of other tourists. But in general the people from my youth (south Sweden) that choosed to backpack where not poor at all. The had the same, sometimes more, money saved up for their holidays as the "high class" tourists who went to fancy hotels and flew first class. The only reason they did it backpack-style was to make the trip 6 months instead of 3 weeks for the same money. Not in anyway would i call them low life or human debris. With some exceptions.

Another interresting thought is that if you are (like for instans backpackers) up to stay longer due to lower expenses, you are not spending money. Its like a circel. Backpackers find the islands first. Its very cheap. Then others find it, come in and spend big money, development starts, prices go up, backpackers disapear to new destinations. Lamai ending up like Pattaya i see very smal chans of. Its to expensive compared to other destinations in Thailand.

Btw, i thought most backpackers today only came to Samui as a steppingstone to koh tao and marinepark? With a one night stop at kohpagnan for the moon-party?

[Gatorade]

Generally I avoid Lamai like the plague, one day it will become like Pattaya.If you want 'facts' take a stroll down to the pier at Bang Rak and have a look for yourself (particulary before/after a full moon party) and look at the human debris passing as back packers getting on or off the ferries.

Mark, you also mention 'standards'. They simply seem to have no acceptable standards whatsover, OK.80% of them if we are being picky. If, as it seems these low lifes are mostly dossing down in Lamai then there is no hope for the place. IMHO I thought the post from Tax exile was accurate, humorous but worrying. Some places in Maenam are already being infected by the rot of these shameful Farang.

Hmmmmm... it seems you don't have a high view of back packers, qualifying them as human debris and low lifes.

May I remind you that the majority of these youngsters are from middle to upper class families in the west; most of them don't come from the poorer working class families. These back packers are educated and a lot of them just finished a higher education or university.

They have the opportunity to travel around the world for 6 or 12 months and I think that's an unbelievable experience (I never had the chance...)

That they 'don't behave' is a matter of time and I'm convinced that their parents would feel ashamed if they would see their siblings like you see them. But, if you would take one or more of them home with you, put them in a bathtub, settle on your terrace, you would find out that under their backpacker appearance, there are some fine young people behind that facade.

And, in a few years from now they will be respectable citizens of their own world, work hard, marry and have children...and....l'Histoire se repete..

To call those youngsters "the rot of these shameful Farang" it's not nice.

How are you qualifying tattooed, shirtless, shouting and boozing Farang sitting in the open air bars of Thailand ?

Personally I'm more annoyed by the latter than back packers.

LaoPo

I think that there has developed a fine line between the backpackers and the lager louts you describe. In many cases they are now becoming one and the same. If you wish to be an apologist for their unsavoury behaviour, your choice. I do not agree.

But I repeat many of these Farang are shameful, and not youngsters either.

[PoorSucker]

But I repeat many of these Farang are shameful, and not youngsters either.

Shame Shame, Butt different

[cobra]

Why is Lamai a "vulgar little town"?

... a vulgar little town , a scruffy strip of shabby bars and litter strewn fast food outlets , inhabited by the usual crew of thai loser beach boys , bewildered holidaymakers , squawking predatory bargirls , avaricious business owners and unshaven , baggy eyed , bull necked , beer bellied , big-mouthed hungover ....

Excellent, Papa Hemingway could have used you as a ghost writer,

as always, nail, head, kudos

[somchai jones]

To comment on the article, it seems like the writer is a bit of a snob.

Agreed.

Also, it seems that increasingly some posters are equating loutish behaviour with 'class'. In the real world this is obviously not true. If you don't have a university education it doesn't make you a moron or a bad person. I was the first person in my family to be educated at university and definitely come from what I guess you'd call a working class family. My sister didn't go to university, she doesn't have a high flying job but nevertheless she is a lovely, well mannered lady.

My father, who is a brick-layer, would be appalled at the behaviour of some of the tourists/ex-pats here, 'working' class or 'middle' class, just as he is appalled at the behaviour of 'working' class and 'middle class' thugs in his home country (the odious binge drinking office workers that litter the streets of London on a Friday night spring to mind - working class or middle class? Both I guess).

I came to Thailand for the first time seventeen years ago as a back packer (and a wide eyed kid amazed at what I saw).

It broadened my horizens and taught me to take people as I found them, not with a sanctimonious preconceived view.

The American author of the article, had he taken the time to speak to some of the people he dismisses as scum and trash may have been pleasantly surprised.

Still, after reading his piece I get the impression he wouldn't have taken the time.

I very much doubt if he would have looked upon myself, my wife and our French friends in a favourable light on a fishing trip we took last week. I have some tattoes (but not the paunch, thankfully!), so I would have been seen as a yob, my wife is Malaysian with long hair and a western husband so she would have been seen as a bar girl, and my French friend and his wife wear fishing trousers and look like the authors despised back packers (they are actually goat farmers from Provence).

However, had the author taken the time to get over his preconceptions and strike up a conversation with us, I could have informed him that McGill Uni. (the uni where the article first appeared) was once a client of mine in the advertising company where I worked at the time. That would have surprised him......

Oh well.

[Boo]

the article sounds like it was written by a pretentious snob who had already formed his opinion before getting on the plane in his own country. Should have stayed at home & saved himself the upset & money

[highdiver]

the article sounds like it was written by a pretentious snob who had already formed his opinion before getting on the plane in his own country. Should have stayed at home & saved himself the upset & money

true words of wisdom

[ClaudeFeller]

Why some of you have problems with something the author saw during his journey? Writing is all about a personal impression of the moment, not more.

[somchai jones]

Why some of you have problems with something the author saw during his journey? Writing is all about a personal impression of the moment, not more.

I have no problems with what he supposedly saw, I am merely giving my opinion on the way he interpreted it.

Like Boo, I feel it was not in fact his impression of the moment but a preconceived notion.

My arguement is more with his seemingly established views of his fellow human beings than his impressions on any one journey.

Chock Dee my friend.

Edited January 24, 2008 by somchai jones

[mattias33]

Why some of you have problems with something the author saw during his journey? Writing is all about a personal impression of the moment, not more.

When you put your personal oppinions in a public messageboard, thats when you agreed (possible even want) to be commented on.