Two Tier / Double Pricing For Farang

[Maigo6]

If the Thais whined more Thailand would not be a 3rd world country.

And the majority of us lot wouldn't freeking well be here!!!!!!!

Edited April 5, 2008 by Maigo6

[bendix]

Bendix .. are you seriously expecting us to believe that you have NEVER EXPERIENCED TWO TIER PRICING IN THAILAND ---- NEVER!?

Please do try to keep things within the realms of believability.

Not that I'm aware of. I don't go to national parks. I buy my clothes from regular stores, although I have had some suits made and those, of course, are a process of negotiation and barter so who's to know if Thais get the cheaper. I buy my food from supermarkets. The missus goes to the wetmarkets now and again, and she's in charge of buying things like DVDs. I buy petrol from petrol stations. I pay my mobile phone bill to AIS, and so far as I know they don't screen my name to add a farang surcharge.

I pay the meter rate on the taxi.

I eat in half decent restaurants. When we go for noodles etc, I go with 'er indoors and she never intimates we're being screwed. Of course, she could be in on the whole conspiracy, being a damned native an' all.

I'm struggling to see where I can have experienced this double pricing, based on my life here.

I suppose I do suffer from one aspect of two tier pricing. My salary is significantly higher here than it would be if an equally competent Thai citizen was doing my job, but if you don't tell anyone promise i won't either.

[Maigo6]

I suppose I do suffer from one aspect of two tier pricing. My salary is significantly higher here than it would be if an equally competent Thai citizen was doing my job, but if you don't tell anyone promise i won't either.

Good reply Bendix.

And I take it you are not wearing Saffron tinted glasses either.

[jubby]

I wasn't going to post, but it is uncanny how much I see it the same way as Neeraham's post.

It wasn't always like that and its been a Journey and an up hill struggle sometimes ;-)

I actually enjoy it sometimes, I always get at least two quotes for big Items, for example If I want a brush cutter I ask a price from a local Thai shop who always quotes me a crazy expensive price which make me smile, for some reason, and who never seems to sell anything. I now put this down to the 'Thai way' rather than think he's just stupid and ignorant and lacking totally in Business sense. I then go to another supplier who is I think of Chinese/Thai stock who seems to give me a discount on the local Thai price because I always pay him cash immediately. I do sometimes send the wife or family for a quote and I have been known to walk away from Tourist attractions instead of paying the Tourist price.

I'll be back in Thailand in a months time after a short working trip back to the 'Rat Race' in the UK where people of every race, creed, colour and sexual orientation appear to pay over the top for absolutely everything.

I'd rather take my Chances the 'Thai way' ;-)

[Huey]

Just pay what is asked.

Problem solved

Wow Don, I know some guys around my old neighborhood that would LOVE you to come walking down the street. Damm what a chump. Anyway look just because some people don't mind being extored dosn't mean everyone dose.

And for thouse of us with a spine, it dosn't matter were we travel we still respect ourselves and won't lightly tolorate the type of racist bullsh*&^! you so eagrly bend over for. Can we change the system, probably not, can we mabey get some places to change, mostlikely, can we make ourselves aware, definetly.

I will try to bring something like Guest Houses "fairprice website" back up. So for thouse of us that don't like being screwed over, we can know which places to go to that consider us as equals.

[PadThaiGuy]

Bendix .. are you seriously expecting us to believe that you have NEVER EXPERIENCED TWO TIER PRICING IN THAILAND ---- NEVER!?

Please do try to keep things within the realms of believability.

Not that I'm aware of. I don't go to national parks. I buy my clothes from regular stores, although I have had some suits made and those, of course, are a process of negotiation and barter so who's to know if Thais get the cheaper. I buy my food from supermarkets. The missus goes to the wetmarkets now and again, and she's in charge of buying things like DVDs. I buy petrol from petrol stations. I pay my mobile phone bill to AIS, and so far as I know they don't screen my name to add a farang surcharge.

I pay the meter rate on the taxi.

I eat in half decent restaurants. When we go for noodles etc, I go with 'er indoors and she never intimates we're being screwed. Of course, she could be in on the whole conspiracy, being a damned native an' all.

I'm struggling to see where I can have experienced this double pricing, based on my life here.

I suppose I do suffer from one aspect of two tier pricing. My salary is significantly higher here than it would be if an equally competent Thai citizen was doing my job, but if you don't tell anyone promise i won't either.

Now that's funny. A guy that lives in Suk condo, drives himself to his office, hangs out in shopping centers and nice restaurants, went to a dinner show or two, pays his own phone bill and somehow considers himself an authority of all things Thai and insults anybody that doesn't share his point of view..

[bendix]

Now that's funny. A guy that lives in Suk condo, drives himself to his office, hangs out in shopping centers and nice restaurants, went to a dinner show or two, pays his own phone bill and somehow considers himself an authority of all things Thai and insults anybody that doesn't share his point of view..

I'm sorry, but is my expat experience any less valid than that of the english teacher, or the retiree living in Khon Kaen? Don't all individual expat experiences contribute, in one way or another, to the sum total of expat life?

My experiences aren't unique. There are thousands of expats like me.

Seriously, PTG, you are so bitter, that it's getting a bit embarassing to read your posts. I'm sorry if my life seems a bit better than yours. If you would like some advice on how to improve your own experiences here, I'd be happy to help if I can.

[pliny]

And what about farang who wish to visit for 2 weeks and are admitted without any visa requirement whereas Thai who wish to reciprocate have to pay an average of $100 for an application with no guarantee of success?

And what happens to the upwardly mobile Thai who tries to buy a condo in lower Suk? Heck, he pays the going rate and who set the market in that burgh? Isaan farmer or foreign investor/retiree/multinational employee/expat dip or NGO fatcat?

Sure you get ripped off in a Pattaya baht bus, visiting tourist sites and national parks but who cares except the penny wise but pound foolish cheapskate losers.

What does piss me off is the moment one has delusions that a successful business can be operated there is always a Thai who is waiting in the wings to exploit you for whatever he can get away with whether it be a landlord, accountant, the entire Thai bureaucracy, police or envious competitor. But that's another story.

[Naam]

I know that two tier/double pricing topic has been discussed many times before on Thai Visa forums, but, I would like to know if any actions, such as a class action lawsuit could be brought upon establishments who are doing this.

the best way is to have a Federal Judge in South Dakota issue a relevant ruling. thai establishments which practice double pricing will shake with fear

[FBN]

In South Africa, game parks and lodges have quickly latched on to the foreign tourist dollars and increased their prices accordingly. Due to economies of scale and exchange rates, these local establishments, which have been supported by the local people long before "tourist" dollars came along, are so expensive now that the locals have been priced out of the market. So much so that the average family can no more afford to go to many of the game parks and farms that once was a traditional holiday.

Agree that some of the practices in Thailand are not above board but the above is a fact and I fully support a system where local residents have an advantage.

As a resident in Thailand, you are able to get lower pricing if you negotiate and watch the special deals from local travel agents. Over the past 10 years in Thailand, the amount of money I have "lost" due to this is of no consequence.

[Naam]

Just pay what is asked.

Problem solved

Wow Don, I know some guys around my old neighborhood that would LOVE you to come walking down the street. Damm what a chump. Anyway look just because some people don't mind being extored dosn't mean everyone dose.

And for thouse of us with a spine, it dosn't matter were we travel we still respect ourselves and won't lightly tolorate the type of racist bullsh*&^! you so eagrly bend over for. Can we change the system, probably not, can we mabey get some places to change, mostlikely, can we make ourselves aware, definetly.

I will try to bring something like Guest Houses "fairprice website" back up. So for thouse of us that don't like being screwed over, we can know which places to go to that consider us as equals.

but with a little effort "we" can change our spelling

[Huey]

The simple fact is that I live here, so I am more likely to see or feel the injustices here on a regular basis than any other country. TIT.

Actualy I see LESS here than I do in my own country, in 7 years no Thai people ever called me nigger or tried to be me up over the color of my skin. However I would almost rather a decent scrap than to pay 3 times more for something over this racsit pricing bulls^%&

Edited April 5, 2008 by Huey

[Naam]

Please join me in BOYCOTTING GOLF COURSES with 2-tier pricing "special rates for THAI only". Doesn't matter if you have a resident permit, driving license, work permit or swim in money. ### If you are not thai by birth, boycott these golf courses! ###

i will as i have always considered it quite ridiculous that grown up men are trying to put little balls in small holes with inadequate but very expensive tools

[Huey]

Just pay what is asked.

Problem solved

Wow Don, I know some guys around my old neighborhood that would LOVE you to come walking down the street. Damm what a chump. Anyway look just because some people don't mind being extored dosn't mean everyone dose.

And for thouse of us with a spine, it dosn't matter were we travel we still respect ourselves and won't lightly tolorate the type of racist bullsh*&^! you so eagrly bend over for. Can we change the system, probably not, can we mabey get some places to change, mostlikely, can we make ourselves aware, definetly.

I will try to bring something like Guest Houses "fairprice website" back up. So for thouse of us that don't like being screwed over, we can know which places to go to that consider us as equals.

but with a little effort "we" can change our spelling

Will you give me a medal or a cookie if I have perfect spelling? LOL, what mabey a gold star Yes I know I spell like a 6yr old with ADD *shrug*

[bendix]

Foreigners are co-erced into coming to Thailand by the Tourist Association of Thailand with their Amazing Thailand advertisements.

Co-erced? Are we really co-erced to come here?

My my . .

You do know what 'coerce' means, don't you?

[MengWan]

Finally, all this discussion is worthless ...

Regarding discriminations, one can be against or favorable, it is not new under this world.

That's all, I keep my judgment and vow to myself never discriminate people in any way !

And sorry for some, I love Thaïland, but not the criminals, not the drug dealers, not the assassins etc ...

Is it so abnormal ?

NB:The most disgusting this pratice was to me was when I had to pay the tuk-tuk "falang-price" for the (thai, family) children because I took them to the swimming-pool to have some fun ...

[YoungFarang13]

you should voice your opinion by not patronizing those establishments. but if you just curse quietly and pay up because you dont want to go home, well then, you ARE the reason double pricing exists.

i am paying 30%+ tax to the USA government, while others are getting money handed to them, I guess double pricing is rampant in the West too.

[YoungFarang13]

i cant imagine Japanese people complaining about this. i guess its a different mindset of western 'equality' or rather, the desire to bitch and moan about everything.

[YoungFarang13]

i think every business deserves the right to restrict membership and charge surcharges. if you dont like it, go somewhere else.

[way2muchcoffee]

Or perhaps it's just the belief that all people should be treated equally regardless of race, creed, or color.

Or possibly it is a reaction to the horrors of Nazi Germany, U.S. Slavery, the general mistreatment of indigenous populations the world over, ethnic cleansing, racial profiling, and countless other similar atrocities that are natural extensions of racist and discriminatory policies.

People are sensitive to discriminatory practices, even small ones, because we have seen the harm they have, do, and will continue to cause.

Edited April 5, 2008 by way2muchcoffee

[Huey]

i think every business deserves the right to restrict membership and charge surcharges. if you dont like it, go somewhere else.

In THAILAND, apparently there is no law against it so sure, why not... I'm not about changing the way things are done by a hand full of these dirty peasents. No rather I would like there to be a place to go that exposes these cretens before hand so if your not comfortable with paying more because of the color of your skin/passport, you can avoid it. Otherwise, pay what ever they tell you to pay *shrug* I didn't have to work to earn YOUR money.

[Huey]

Or perhaps it's just the belief that all people should be treated equally regardless of race, creed, or color.

Or possibly it is a reaction to the horrors of Nazi Germany, U.S. Slavery, the general mistreatment of indigenous populations the world over, ethnic cleansing, racial profiling, and countless other similar atrocities that are natural extensions of racist and discriminatory policies.

People are sensitive to discriminatory practices, even small ones, because we have seen the harm they have, do, and will continue to cause.

Spot On, if you grow up with it your probably gonna be a lil more sensetive too it.

[Ijustwannateach]

Nearly every time I go to one of these two-tier places, it's usually under the auspices of one governmental organisation or another and I pay nothing... The rare few exceptions when I'm under my own flag I show one piece of official paperwork or another and I pay the local rate. I admit I've only been on-my-own to the national parks, and I haven't tried yet with the fully commercial places like the Crocodile Farm. I know that not everyone has these options, so I don't frown on those who wish to avoid them on principle. They certainly vary a lot in terms of value for money (if one is paying the full rate) and given all of Thailand's other tourist-image problems they could use a reputation for transparency and doing things the right way in what, after all, is supposed to be part of their *real* attraction for tourists.

"S"

[bendix]

[quote name='way2muchcoffee' date='2008-04-05 22:52:42' post='1911060'

Or possibly it is a reaction to the horrors of Nazi Germany, U.S. Slavery, the general mistreatment of indigenous populations the world over, ethnic cleansing, racial profiling, and countless other similar atrocities that are natural extensions of racist and discriminatory policies.

Christ, I've heard it all now. Don't you think you're stretching the point a bit. We're talking about paying a couple of dollars extra to see a freakin waterfall, not the extermination of 6 million jews.

Perhaps you're drinking way too much coffee

[sweetchariot]

I actually quite enjoy it. When friends and family come to visit I take great pleasure in showing them my Thai priced entry ticket compared to their tourist priced ticket.

Learn to speak a little bit of Thai (I speak very little, but enough to surprise the cashier at these venues), and get some official paperwork - a driving license is sufficient. Then you will pay the Thai price at 95% of these venues, and you won't get ripped off by the vendors either.

Double pricing is aimed at tourists who still think the farang price is cheap anyway. If you live here and still get fleeced then som naam naa

[sweetchariot]

Nearly every time I go to one of these two-tier places, it's usually under the auspices of one governmental organisation or another and I pay nothing... The rare few exceptions when I'm under my own flag I show one piece of official paperwork or another and I pay the local rate. I admit I've only been on-my-own to the national parks, and I haven't tried yet with the fully commercial places like the Crocodile Farm. I know that not everyone has these options, so I don't frown on those who wish to avoid them on principle. They certainly vary a lot in terms of value for money (if one is paying the full rate) and given all of Thailand's other tourist-image problems they could use a reputation for transparency and doing things the right way in what, after all, is supposed to be part of their *real* attraction for tourists.

"S"

If you mean the Croc farm in Pattaya, then yes you will get Thai prices. Also Nong Nooch, Tiger Zoo in Sri Racha, Kao Keow Zoo, and every where else in the locale.

The only time they refused me was in Pattaya Park, when I went to take my niece on the 'rollercoaster'. Having been on a couple of rides already at Thai prices, they changed cashier so I had to go and find the missus to explain to them. Great fun when you have guests from home paying double.

We learnt a few months ago that they now have 3 (yes THREE) prices to go up Pattaya Park Tower. Me and the Missus went up and paid 100 baht (Thai price), and left my parents to finish their drink and follow us. I told them it was 200 baht each, but got a phone call when on the roof that they were trying to charge them 500.

We went down to find out what was going on, and the cashier explained because they were not accompanied by a Thai, that was the price.

How about a new thread discussing triple charging!

[way2muchcoffee]

Christ, I've heard it all now. Don't you think you're stretching the point a bit. We're talking about paying a couple of dollars extra to see a freakin waterfall, not the extermination of 6 million jews.

Perhaps you're drinking way too much coffee

LOL. Probably I've had a but much coffee, but maybe not. To be fair I should point out that you conveniently forgot my next sentence in your quote.

For the record I do not believe the governmental two-tier pricing is the only racism/discrimination in this country.

1) Discrimination against Foreigners in Business

2) Land Ownership issues

3) Visa Difficulties for Foreigners married to Thais

4) The application of fines for laws like littering (only seem to apply to westerners)

5) Two-tier pricing on goods, and other non-governmental services like taxis, clubs, etc.

6) Discrimination against Indians, Burmese, Cambodians, and other immigrants

7) Job Discrimination against dark-skinned Thais

8) Education discrimination against rural Thais

9) Age discrimination in employment

10) Gender discrimination in schools

11) Class discrimination in the legal consequences for lawbreakers

12) Class/Economic discrimination in the admission to certain government universities or high schools

13) Nepotism is a form of Job Discrimination

14) Cronyism is a form of Job and/or Economic Opportunity discrimination

I rather think the two-tier pricing is only the tip of the iceberg.

[way2muchcoffee]

Ranting and raving is either one of two things here:

1) Rational discussion on experiences that effect our lives in some way

2) Blowing off steam

In any case, I personally wouldn't avoid anywhere with two-tier pricing. It's all about the experience of seeing and doing things that I find life-enriching. I'm not going to shortchange my life experiences over a couple hundred baht.

[Huey]

Ranting and raving is either one of two things here:

1) Rational discussion on experiences that effect our lives in some way

2) Blowing off steam

In any case, I personally wouldn't avoid anywhere with two-tier pricing. It's all about the experience of seeing and doing things that I find life-enriching. I'm not going to shortchange my life experiences over a couple hundred baht.

I guess it all comes down to whats more enriching? Watching some crocs flop around in dirty water while some guy in a gaudy red suit plays with them. Or knowing you didn't compromise your integrity for a couple of hundred baht? Either way thats a personal question. For me, if someone is selling something that for everyone else is one price but for me, because of the color of my skin, or that of my passport, it's another price there is no way I'm gonna buy it. The world is a big place and the vast majority of people in it are good and decent. Can we not find someone else, who is not a greedy bigot to give our money too? I was poor for the early years of my life and now I do well for myself. So its not like a couple hundred baht is gonna be a big difference, its just that I can't enjoy myself knowing I helped some racist bastard by giving him my money. I just can't rest with it.

If other people can, so be it, but for those of you who's integrity is worth more than a couple hundred baht I hope to one day have a website that warns folks of these scum bags so we can avoid them.

[Old Man River]

i am paying 30%+ tax to the USA government, while others are getting money handed to them, I guess double pricing is rampant in the West too.

What you are referring to is US related only. The two tier pricing being discussed here is Thai/foreigner pricing. Now, if you have seen somewhere in the US where all US citizens pay one price and all non US citizens pay a higher price, then that would be the equivalent. Perhaps this does exist in the US, I just can't recall it.

Bendix, if you don't read Thai (I don't) then you probably weren't aware of the different pricing when you experienced it. The Grand Palace is a good example as are many other places where the Thai price is written in Thai (including the numbers) and the higher pricing in English. Yes, I know we make enough, but I just don't like the idea of double pricing. For me, it is outright discrimination, something I don't like at any level.