Trip Back Home To Meet The Parents In Kk For Song Kran

[OlRedEyes]

As quoted in a message to me: "No matter what your tilak tells you, her family will always come first.........not you."

OK, I promised an update, and now I have one after a six hours long talk-meeting last night and into the early morning hours with my TGF, the lady in question in this post... And, while this is still an evolving story, all I can say to all the "dump her" and "scam artist" advocates is... AMAZING THAILAND!!!!

We spent most of the early going talking about what had been happening with her since we returned from KK almost a week ago. And I discovered, by her account, that she'd been really upset, crying, depressed about two things: 1) fearing that I was going to leave her because of what her family had said about 1M baht for the new house, and 2) gossip she had started hearing second-hand from people in her village saying she must have been working as a bar girl in BKK or Pattaya because she'd been seen with a farang (me) in KK (and since the few other mixed couples in her village began as BG-monger matches).

We talked our way through those things, and then I got the first of two shockers.... 1) her family for some time had been pressing her to return to their village in KK to take a government job near there, a job her father had helped arrange for her. And, she informed me that just after we had left KK, the employer had contacted her father and told him, and he then told her this week, that they were now offering her the job near KK. I felt my heart falling at that point, but then the real bigger surprise came... She informed me that she had no intention of moving back to her village, and despite her family's/parent's wishes, that she wanted to stay here in BKK and continue working here in her office job. So, while understanding that her family may still continue to pressure her and nothing is final yet, at least I began to think...Hey, this young Thai lady is showing some signs of resolve and independence.

But, we weren't done yet. By now, this was some hours into the discussion, and we hadn't talked at all about the house issue, so I began steering our talk in that direction. And I found that, apparently, of all the things she'd talked with her Mom about in the past week, the issue of the house wasn't much among them. It was all what was happening with her, and me, in the wake of our visit. So, at that point, since I wasn't going to hear more from the family on that point, I began talking to her about my own ideas, as shaped by all the advice and discussion here.....

...that I'm prepared to get married in the future if she and I stay happy together, but not any sooner a year from our original meeting; that I'm committed to taking care of her; that I'm perfectly capable of buying a condo or a house in BKK or elsewhere for she and I after we are married, as may fit with things in our life; that I'm willing to have a wedding ceremony and some reasonable sin sod; but that I'm not willing now or in the future to build a 1M baht house for her parents that basically she and I would rarely live in.

At that point, I got my second and even bigger but good shock of the night. She proceeded to repeat for me that she really was more interested in us staying together and getting married eventually, and that her parents were more interested in the house issue, as I already knew. But she then informed me that, when she really loves someone, she needs to do the right thing for that, that that's the most important thing for her. And that if we were married, she'd see her responsibility to be first toward me as her husband, and second to her family. So, she said to my great surprise, that she was fine with my general ideas as mentioned above, and she was prepared to go against her parents' wishes on the house issue, and that she planned soon on talking with them and explaining the situation and what she wanted to do about it. To which, I said to myself, AMAZING THAILAND......

So, as I said above, this is still an evolving story. And, maybe what she promised and pledged last night will fade or she'll be collared by her family on their the job/location issue or the house issue. But for now, this lady is showing me the kind of spirit and commitment that made me believe since I met her, for many other reasons, that she's a keeper. And if she's willing to stand by me, and keep the focus on our future together, then I'm prepared to stand by her also....

Time will tell....

Tread carefully, and very, very slowly is my feeling. You don't just yank a big fish in, you play it till it's tired, then you reel it in. Having met initial resistance, this could be used as an effective tactic....

[Lite Beer]

Time will tell....

Tread carefully, and very, very slowly is my feeling. You don't just yank a big fish in, you play it till it's tired, then you reel it in. Having met initial resistance, this could be used as an effective tactic....

Don't put too much bait on the hook.

[sibeymai]

Time will tell....

Tread carefully, and very, very slowly is my feeling. You don't just yank a big fish in, you play it till it's tired, then you reel it in. Having met initial resistance, this could be used as an effective tactic....

Don't put too much bait on the hook.

I may be too cynical but I see a game plan evolving here. Some things just don't ring true.

The major one is that she will place her husband above her parents. It rarely happens that a girl will place her husband before her parents, even less so a farang, and even less so still an Isaan girl doing so. After all, she's working in BKK and owes her parents big time for the schooling which has given her the opportunity to do so

Then there's the rumours of her being a BG, of her having to sort out the problems with the expectations of her parents regarding the move back to KK for work, these all seem to be softening you up for some sympathy.

Something like "I've had to do x, y, z for you because I love you. If you love me you'll do a. b, c for me" could be coming. I've certainly known some Isaan women who are capable of such intricate games. The house won't be talked about again for a while, but there could be lesser items coming.

As OlRedEyes said, it could be the play before the catch.

Of course, I hope it is not as I suspect, and do wish you well.

Edited April 24, 2008 by sibeymai

[bergen]

jfchandler

Glad to hear you're happy with the present situation. Hope the future will be happy as well, and wish you all the best!

[Gary A]

It's actually a simple thing. Just follow your heart and instincts. Just don't spend more than you can afford to walk away from. Good luck.

[bubblehead]

As quoted in a message to me: "No matter what your tilak tells you, her family will always come first.........not you."

OK, I promised an update, and now I have one after a six hours long talk-meeting last night and into the early morning hours with my TGF, the lady in question in this post... And, while this is still an evolving story, all I can say to all the "dump her" and "scam artist" advocates is... AMAZING THAILAND!!!!

We spent most of the early going talking about what had been happening with her since we returned from KK almost a week ago. And I discovered, by her account, that she'd been really upset, crying, depressed about two things: 1) fearing that I was going to leave her because of what her family had said about 1M baht for the new house, and 2) gossip she had started hearing second-hand from people in her village saying she must have been working as a bar girl in BKK or Pattaya because she'd been seen with a farang (me) in KK (and since the few other mixed couples in her village began as BG-monger matches).

We talked our way through those things, and then I got the first of two shockers.... 1) her family for some time had been pressing her to return to their village in KK to take a government job near there, a job her father had helped arrange for her. And, she informed me that just after we had left KK, the employer had contacted her father and told him, and he then told her this week, that they were now offering her the job near KK. I felt my heart falling at that point, but then the real bigger surprise came... She informed me that she had no intention of moving back to her village, and despite her family's/parent's wishes, that she wanted to stay here in BKK and continue working here in her office job. So, while understanding that her family may still continue to pressure her and nothing is final yet, at least I began to think...Hey, this young Thai lady is showing some signs of resolve and independence.

But, we weren't done yet. By now, this was some hours into the discussion, and we hadn't talked at all about the house issue, so I began steering our talk in that direction. And I found that, apparently, of all the things she'd talked with her Mom about in the past week, the issue of the house wasn't much among them. It was all what was happening with her, and me, in the wake of our visit. So, at that point, since I wasn't going to hear more from the family on that point, I began talking to her about my own ideas, as shaped by all the advice and discussion here.....

...that I'm prepared to get married in the future if she and I stay happy together, but not any sooner a year from our original meeting; that I'm committed to taking care of her; that I'm perfectly capable of buying a condo or a house in BKK or elsewhere for she and I after we are married, as may fit with things in our life; that I'm willing to have a wedding ceremony and some reasonable sin sod; but that I'm not willing now or in the future to build a 1M baht house for her parents that basically she and I would rarely live in.

At that point, I got my second and even bigger but good shock of the night. She proceeded to repeat for me that she really was more interested in us staying together and getting married eventually, and that her parents were more interested in the house issue, as I already knew. But she then informed me that, when she really loves someone, she needs to do the right thing for that, that that's the most important thing for her. And that if we were married, she'd see her responsibility to be first toward me as her husband, and second to her family. So, she said to my great surprise, that she was fine with my general ideas as mentioned above, and she was prepared to go against her parents' wishes on the house issue, and that she planned soon on talking with them and explaining the situation and what she wanted to do about it. To which, I said to myself, AMAZING THAILAND......

So, as I said above, this is still an evolving story. And, maybe what she promised and pledged last night will fade or she'll be collared by her family on their the job/location issue or the house issue. But for now, this lady is showing me the kind of spirit and commitment that made me believe since I met her, for many other reasons, that she's a keeper. And if she's willing to stand by me, and keep the focus on our future together, then I'm prepared to stand by her also....

Time will tell....

I don't care what anyone says but it is impossible to have such a in depth conversation as you describe it with a Thai lady, i don't care how educated you say she is. This business of her changing jobs is bullsh1t. A Thai will NEVER put you before her family. WAKE UP

[abdulrahman]

It's actually a simple thing. Just follow your heart and instincts. Just don't spend more than you can afford to walk away from. Good luck.

And if your GF/wife is 20+ years younger,you just have to spend that little extra!

[jfchandler]

Of course... silly me!!!!!! You must be right...I was dreaming when we spent from 9 pm last night to 3 am this morning talking about all these things, in depth, nonstop....

Or.. maybe..just maybe... could it be you're seeing the wrong kinds of Thai ladies????

About the job thing... time will tell... I'll find out about that... long before my one-year timeframe for deciding about marriage arrives... So...I don't think... I'm taking any risk there....

PS - You might consider more carefully, before you go blithely throwing around the kind of indictment of Thai women you laid out below. Some of them, I'd venture, are a whole lot sharper than many farang guys!!!!

I don't care what anyone says but it is impossible to have such a in depth conversation as you describe it with a Thai lady, i don't care how educated you say she is. This business of her changing jobs is bullsh1t. A Thai will NEVER put you before her family. WAKE UP

[welsh1]

Just returned from a Song Kran trip to KK with my TGF where I wanted to (and did) meet her parents and family for the first time. It was a VERY interesting experience, and I could REALLY use some advice from the veteran Isan hands here --- my basic question is.... How reasonable/normal is their request????

First... some background.... I live in BKK, mid 40s, and I met the lady (mid 20s, never married, no children) a few months ago. She is a university graduate and working an office job in BKK now, but her family (Mom, Dad (a school teacher) and relatives) lives in a small village about an hour outside KK city. She never has had anything to do with the bar scene or P4P... I think she's great and beautiful, and we made a good couple together. When we're together, I always cover our expenses as the man.. But she's never asked me for any money or to pay for anything, and sometimes instead wants to pay for things herself (such as shopping) from her own salary money.

So, we stayed at the Kosa Hotel, and her family (Mom, Dad and two aunts) drove into town. We met together at the hotel for about two hours talking and getting to know, and then went for dinner together. They wanted to go to MK at the nearby mall, and I paid of course. And then after dinner, I bought a bottle of Johnnie Walker Black as a gift for her father, since I wanted to get a greeting gift for the family. By my TGF's account that night, the meeting and evening went fine, and she told me her parents liked me and were happy.

So the next morning, we're staying in the hotel and the family has gone back to their village, and my GF is talking on the phone with her mom. Then, off the phone, and quiet quiet, not talking any more. Then hugging me and crying crying.... Finally, after about an hour of coaxing, she finally tells me her family doesn't think I can "take care" of her. Then more more talking, and finally the next day, she tells me her Mom told her the family doesn't want her to see me any more at all. All of this, I find pretty strange and shocking, since I'm not lacking in resources, and have a professional career and demeanor... not a scruffy backpacker.

So, while not expert in the ways of Isan, I have learned a bit during my time in Thailand, so I ask the GF to put two questions to her family: why do they think I can't "take care" for her, and what can I do to make the family feel comfortable with us as a couple? More phone calls and talking, and then finally the answer is relayed: the family has an old house (western, not rural Thai style), but they want me to build a new house for the family in their village on their land, assuming we get married. And the idea is, the parents would live there, and there'd also be a place for the GF and I when we come from BKK to stay in the village at times.

It also seems, my TGF has an aunt in the village (late 30s, two children, divorced from Thai husband) who recently has acquired an English BF. And while I'm not sure they are actually married, the TGF tells me he has just finished building a new two bedroom house for him and the lady and her children that cost above 1 million baht. So, my GF tells me that everyone in her family and the village would be happy if I did the same like that, about 1 million baht.

So, my GF's basic idea (after talking to her family) is we would get married and I'd pay to build the house for her family. The family wouldn't be looking for any sin sod (other than the house) and wouldn't need to have a wedding ceremony/party or baht gold, etc. Now, at 1 million baht, that works out to about $32,000 U.S., which is well within my ability to afford.

But, as much as I like/love this lady, the way her family handled the situation really has put me off. I remember someone saying that when you marry a Thai lady, you don't just marry her, you also marry her family. So basically, the family doesn't care if their daughter has a formal wedding or a wedding party or baht gold or whatever. They care if her husband builds a house for the family. And more than anything else, they seem concerned that whatever we do "shows" to everyone else in the village that their daughter married a farang who can take care....

I'm not sure what to do about all this... I think this lady is a keeper for me... But, the family gives me the creeps.... And, add to that, the fact that basically I'd have no legal ownership/rights to the KK house that I'd paid to build, because of the laws in Thailand re farang property ownership...and all the horror stories about those kinds of situations.

Or, maybe I'm just not understanding of the normal custom for an Isan family about these things... Help!!!!!!!

Same old story

I married my wife and and she work in wales for nearly 5 years

I save up money for here and when we finally come to thailand to live

she have here own money to build her own house

and if the family not like me tuff Sh..

dont give in to crocodile tears

all the best

[bubblehead]

Of course... silly me!!!!!! You must be right...I was dreaming when we spent from 9 pm last night to 3 am this morning talking about all these things, in depth, nonstop....

You were talking and she was going errr!!!

[welsh1]

Just returned from a Song Kran trip to KK with my TGF where I wanted to (and did) meet her parents and family for the first time. It was a VERY interesting experience, and I could REALLY use some advice from the veteran Isan hands here --- my basic question is.... How reasonable/normal is their request????

First... some background.... I live in BKK, mid 40s, and I met the lady (mid 20s, never married, no children) a few months ago. She is a university graduate and working an office job in BKK now, but her family (Mom, Dad (a school teacher) and relatives) lives in a small village about an hour outside KK city. She never has had anything to do with the bar scene or P4P... I think she's great and beautiful, and we made a good couple together. When we're together, I always cover our expenses as the man.. But she's never asked me for any money or to pay for anything, and sometimes instead wants to pay for things herself (such as shopping) from her own salary money.

So, we stayed at the Kosa Hotel, and her family (Mom, Dad and two aunts) drove into town. We met together at the hotel for about two hours talking and getting to know, and then went for dinner together. They wanted to go to MK at the nearby mall, and I paid of course. And then after dinner, I bought a bottle of Johnnie Walker Black as a gift for her father, since I wanted to get a greeting gift for the family. By my TGF's account that night, the meeting and evening went fine, and she told me her parents liked me and were happy.

So the next morning, we're staying in the hotel and the family has gone back to their village, and my GF is talking on the phone with her mom. Then, off the phone, and quiet quiet, not talking any more. Then hugging me and crying crying.... Finally, after about an hour of coaxing, she finally tells me her family doesn't think I can "take care" of her. Then more more talking, and finally the next day, she tells me her Mom told her the family doesn't want her to see me any more at all. All of this, I find pretty strange and shocking, since I'm not lacking in resources, and have a professional career and demeanor... not a scruffy backpacker.

So, while not expert in the ways of Isan, I have learned a bit during my time in Thailand, so I ask the GF to put two questions to her family: why do they think I can't "take care" for her, and what can I do to make the family feel comfortable with us as a couple? More phone calls and talking, and then finally the answer is relayed: the family has an old house (western, not rural Thai style), but they want me to build a new house for the family in their village on their land, assuming we get married. And the idea is, the parents would live there, and there'd also be a place for the GF and I when we come from BKK to stay in the village at times.

It also seems, my TGF has an aunt in the village (late 30s, two children, divorced from Thai husband) who recently has acquired an English BF. And while I'm not sure they are actually married, the TGF tells me he has just finished building a new two bedroom house for him and the lady and her children that cost above 1 million baht. So, my GF tells me that everyone in her family and the village would be happy if I did the same like that, about 1 million baht.

So, my GF's basic idea (after talking to her family) is we would get married and I'd pay to build the house for her family. The family wouldn't be looking for any sin sod (other than the house) and wouldn't need to have a wedding ceremony/party or baht gold, etc. Now, at 1 million baht, that works out to about $32,000 U.S., which is well within my ability to afford.

But, as much as I like/love this lady, the way her family handled the situation really has put me off. I remember someone saying that when you marry a Thai lady, you don't just marry her, you also marry her family. So basically, the family doesn't care if their daughter has a formal wedding or a wedding party or baht gold or whatever. They care if her husband builds a house for the family. And more than anything else, they seem concerned that whatever we do "shows" to everyone else in the village that their daughter married a farang who can take care....

I'm not sure what to do about all this... I think this lady is a keeper for me... But, the family gives me the creeps.... And, add to that, the fact that basically I'd have no legal ownership/rights to the KK house that I'd paid to build, because of the laws in Thailand re farang property ownership...and all the horror stories about those kinds of situations.

Or, maybe I'm just not understanding of the normal custom for an Isan family about these things... Help!!!!!!!

Do what i did got married and my wife live and work in wales for 5 years

i save up here money for her and when we come to live in thailand last year

she have her own money to build her own house..job done..

and if any family think me no good ..tuff sh##

crocodile tears dont fall for it

or you will be falling forever..good luck..

[Joe Walshe]

I don't think anyone can advise you on this important matter. Hopefully you have some friends here who could meet up with both of you and maybe give a more objective opinion.

One thing I would say though is; This forum comprises a wide range of characters and personalities.

You've got the guys who's experience of Thai women comes from bar girls and talking to other farangs about their experience of bar girls. These guys tend to be bitter, have a low opinion of all Thais and would consider all Thai women as being gold diggers. They can exchange an infinite amount of stories of farangs who have been conned and ripped off by Thai women.

You then have the other guys who have met Thai women through work, college etc. and have had good experiences. A lot of guys on this forum seem to have married as well as you can anywhere.

On a very simplistic level it is not logical or in my view possible that all Thai women are so bad. Prior to my own marriage (see photo album) I dated many Thai women. I typically met them at Universities. I had no bad experiences with any of them.

[DNPBC0]

I completely agree with Joe. Just remember - it's basically a medieval morality play involving two very different cultures in which you, your girl friend and her family get to write the script. Do it carefully, with wisdom and openness

[blue eyes]

I like you Joe.You are a real person.Not a "bubblehead"

[Pseacraft]

I've been married to my Isaan girl for 8 years and have two great little ones with her. She puts OUR family ahead of the others. It has never been a question of doubt about her values, she hates to spend "my" money and still has issues with the concept of "our" money. Most of here relatives respect her position that our family comes first and only then if we can will we help them. The only family "emergencies" we will respond to is taking care of Yai. She was raised by her Yai and not her parents who treated her like dirt. They found out rather quick like that I am not an ATM machine. So it is not impossible to find quality Isaan ladies. There are plenty out there, but there are those who are gold diggers, many that may surprise you, an example would be my wife's former best friend, former for a good reason!

Just do what you feel is right. Only you can truly judge her and her motives. The family could just be testing you but I really think it's a face problem.

Good luck to you!

Eric

And I met my wife in College in the US, she was working and paying her way through with no support from her family. They only helped with the airfare.

[PaddyThai]

I like you Joe.You are a real person.Not a "bubblehead"

I like you too Blue eyes.

[wineman]

Sorry to say this, but obviously a scam by the family and your TGF. Turn your back on them, walk away, and put it down to experience.

[TopDogger]

3 months and she/her family is already wanting 1 million baht out of you...........

Try to see it from an outsiders perspective..

[jfchandler]

Wanting...perhaps... but clearly not getting...

So, now we see how the future goes... All I can say is, since she and I had our talk the other night, she's been great... And I haven't heard peepers of anything more from the family...

So for the time being, I'm a happy man... Nothing to complain about...in this neighborhood.

3 months and she/her family is already wanting 1 million baht out of you...........

Try to see it from an outsiders perspective..

[TopDogger]

Well, start as you mean to go on etc.

[hagler]

First... some background.... I live in BKK, mid 40s, and I met the lady (mid 20s, never married, no children) a few months ago.

Enough said, game over. Move on people there is nothing to see here...

[Lite Beer]

Wanting...perhaps... but clearly not getting...

So, now we see how the future goes... All I can say is, since she and I had our talk the other night, she's been great... And I haven't heard peepers of anything more from the family...

So for the time being, I'm a happy man... Nothing to complain about...in this neighborhood.

Good Luck. JF And be careful

[Gary A]

People can laugh and joke about mercenary Thai women but it's not only in Thailand. A friend of mine in the US joined a dating club. He told me the ladies who contact him nearly come to the point of asking him for a financial statement. Where do you work, where do you live, do you own your home and what kind of car do you drive are just openers. Those women don't get the money up front, they get it when they take the guy to the cleaners during the divorce.

[jfchandler]

Here the guy gets it on the front end... In the states, he gets it in the rear end...so to speak...

Given my druthers, I'd rather get it up front here... I'm not much on rear end deals... hehehehehehe

Guess that's why I'm living Thailand!

[Lickey]

So, now we see how the future goes... All I can say is, since she and I had our talk the other night, she's been great... And I haven't heard peepers of anything more from the family...

Spratt to catch a Makerel maybe? Lull before the storm comes to mind as well, it seems her family is very much up-front, I asked a mate where he was going to build a house, he said a safe and resonable distance from her family, 25-40ks would stop constant visiting daily, eating all you paid for ect,

Because of my Mrs buisness we had to build near town center, and keeping to Thai tradition, [sort of] we put the roof on stlits, so we can have a private party without all the street walkers eating and drinking my money, selfish perhaps? private YES!!!

Im trying to say JF if you do go ahead with building ect, yes, the thai family is great, but after a while, when you want to watch TV or a quiet evening with the mrs, it can be near impossible with family close by,

Wish you all the best in whatever you decide, cheers.

[NowImEasy]

Well maybe everyone has had his say on this matter, but me. I remember a very similar thread some months back about sin sod, and the majority of the responses were negative. But in both discussions, little was said about the Issan culture of 'face'. If a falang comes to town and builds a house for he and his wife, this sets a standard for the others to follow. A farmer sends his daughter to college and expects to be repaid. So the falang that wants his daughter then has to build a bigger house than the last falang or that means his daughter is not worth as much as his neighbor's daughter, and he loses face. To us falangs, it's stupid, but the girl is bound by tradition to obey her family. But now, the young and educated Issan ladies know vastly more about the real world and are more willing to follow their own hearts (thank God). The lady will know that her family will always accept her and love her.

So my advise??? Keep the advise of all the elders on this site (I've read for years, but just joined). Be careful. But if I were to choose which path to take, based on my experience, keep this lady. Treat her well, and just maybe you will be happy for the rest of your life. BUT GET A PRE-NUP

[Gary A]

Well maybe everyone has had his say on this matter, but me. I remember a very similar thread some months back about sin sod, and the majority of the responses were negative. But in both discussions, little was said about the Issan culture of 'face'. If a falang comes to town and builds a house for he and his wife, this sets a standard for the others to follow. A farmer sends his daughter to college and expects to be repaid. So the falang that wants his daughter then has to build a bigger house than the last falang or that means his daughter is not worth as much as his neighbor's daughter, and he loses face. To us falangs, it's stupid, but the girl is bound by tradition to obey her family. But now, the young and educated Issan ladies know vastly more about the real world and are more willing to follow their own hearts (thank God). The lady will know that her family will always accept her and love her.

So my advise??? Keep the advise of all the elders on this site (I've read for years, but just joined). Be careful. But if I were to choose which path to take, based on my experience, keep this lady. Treat her well, and just maybe you will be happy for the rest of your life. BUT GET A PRE-NUP

Pay a lawyer for a useless pre-nup? Why? You can't own any property other than a vehicle and a condo. If you buy the condo and vehicle before you marry, they belong to you and she can't touch them. If you buy a house, you can't have it in your name and in fact must sign a document that you have no interest in the property. YES, I know there are going to be guys who will say you can own the house but not the land and can lease the land from your wife. The best bet is to not spend more than you can afford to walk away from. If it goes bad, just walk away.

[dauu]

People can laugh and joke about mercenary Thai women but it's not only in Thailand. A friend of mine in the US joined a dating club. He told me the ladies who contact him nearly come to the point of asking him for a financial statement. Where do you work, where do you live, do you own your home and what kind of car do you drive are just openers. Those women don't get the money up front, they get it when they take the guy to the cleaners during the divorce.

good one.i like this reply.

[bergen]

Well I think we all can lelax now ,.........seems like the op is handling the case well

[jfchandler]

AGRRED!!!! Nothing new to report....

Well I think we all can lelax now ,.........seems like the op is handling the case well