How Thailand Has Changed My Life

[DaveTheCanadian]

i'd like to say 'hello' to everyone here as i am a new member. i have been reading many forums concerning visas, immigration, work permits, ex-pat life, etc. in thailand over the last month or so and i feel that this site is a great source of information for those looking. the members possess valuable knowledge and experience to help others in their plans abroad and they give good advice as well.

here is my story...

i have known my TG for almost 1 year and we have been traveling SE Asia for the last 6 months. we applied for a temporary visitor visa for her into canada last month and we were denied (of course!) even though our intent was for her to meet my family and friends, experience my life there and return back (with me) to thailand. we have accepted the reasons for their decision and have recently given up submitting again with more documents and letters, even though her financial and employment situation has not changed. we know that this will not change the outcome of their decision and possibly add to the record of visa denials.

we have been discussing other options for us to continue our lives together as we have encountered a huge challenge in our relationship. we want to do this process correctly and honestly as our relationship has been based on the same reasoning. we are considering marriage in thailand and to apply for permanent residence for her in canada after. is there anyone with advice as to how families/friends have reacted to a decision like the one i am about to make. i'm not second guessing myself here, my feelings for my TG are true and my intentions are honest. it's just that there are many other people that will be affected by a decision like this. any support/advice/experiences would help greatly!

thank you.

[qwertz]

It's a big step you're considering with all sorts of attendant complications.

You do right by consulting this forum; check out the others too, there are many posts about similar situations to yours.

And above all, think long and hard before you act.

[Dokkaebi]

Hi Dave,

If you choose to marry someone, regardless of the circumstanaces, you do not need a moral opinion from anyone, least of all an internet forum.

[MrIrrisistable]

Why not, some people go to church for guidance and help.....I know which source I would trust.

[JSixpack]

Well, you could simply ask the family and friends!

The visa rejection could be a warning sign. Evidently she doesn't have a position, assets, and relationships that would compel her to return to Thailand.

If all you've done is travel for 6 mos, then you've been on holiday. That ain't the real world. Be very, very cautious. Good intentions are often just taken advantage of.

My suggestion is, live in Thailand for a while. Don't marry her yet. Give her a couple years or more of working in a real job and building assets and see how stable the relationship really is. You could go through a Buddhist ceremony only (many Thais themselves do), but don't tell any Immigration officers. If she's worried about security in case of your death (a common excuse), take out a life insurance policy but make sure she knows that it won't pay if your death is suspicious.

Go back to Canada and apply to bring her over on a fiance visa (I'm just assuming Canada works like the USA).

You can later try Australia if you just want her to see a Western country. I don't know for sure, but I have the impression that it's easier for a Thai to travel there.

Good luck.

Edited May 17, 2008 by JSixpack

[villagefarang]

The wife and I did not tell anyone or ask anyone's opinion or permission. Just trotted down to the local Amphur, in Bangkok, with our paperwork and did the dead.

Next month we celebrate nine years of marriage and eleven years together. We got her a "green card" and used it for several years before surrendering it just last year and moving up to Chiang Rai. Of course I had more than twenty years experience in Thailand before we got married. That helped, I'm sure, in my making informed choices.

Not saying things will work out as well for you, but it isn't "all" as bad as the whiners and naysayers might lead you to believe. Work it out between the two of you and be confident that you can deal with whatever comes up.

Edited May 17, 2008 by villagefarang

[mahtin]

The wife and I did not tell anyone or ask anyone's opinion or permission. Just trotted down to the local Amphur, in Bangkok, with our paperwork and did the dead.

Next month we celebrate nine years of marriage and eleven years together. We got her a "green card" and used it for several years before surrendering it just last year and moving up to Chiang Rai. Of course I had more than twenty years experience in Thailand before we got married. That helped, I'm sure, in my making informed choices.

Not saying things will work out as well for you, but it isn't "all" as bad as the whiners and naysayers might lead you to believe. Work it out between the two of you and be confident that you can deal with whatever comes up.

Absolutely.

My first tgf was in 74, but didn't marry one till the turn of the millennium. Coming up to ten great years together - it can work!

[lannarebirth]

I would say try to get the 6 month tourist visa again. I have to believe your preparation was not very good and that you should work on that more for the next one.

I brought a Lao girl I'd known two weeks to Bangkok to the Canadian Embassy and got her a 6 month visa and I'm not even a Canadian, though I do have PR there. Figure out what it is they want to see on a successful application and make sure it's on there.

Edited May 17, 2008 by lannarebirth

[Ray1167]

You can later try Australia if you just want her to see a Western country. I don't know for sure, but I have the impression that it's easier for a Thai to travel there. Good luck.

NO ! No , and No !

It certainly is not . Unless you want to pay for her to study at a university there . Or you yourself are an Australian . Tourist visas for non-married Thai girls are notoriously difficult in Australia , almost impossible .

[Sakeopete]

I hate to admit this but as Canadians we are far more trusting of people and get stung easier. I agree with JSixpack's (post #05) please read it again and take the relationship slow. Thai women are the best in the world at making a guy feel like a million bucks, then taking him for all he is worth. I have been with my wife for 7 years now and couldn't be happier but after seeing guys in the nearby villages getting burnt regularly I took it slow. Luckily m wife never pushed for a fast marriage nor asked for a house/car. I have taken my wife twice to Canada and a visa was no problem, 24 hrs to obtain a Canadian and USA visa.

[Tony Clifton]

Give it time, let the relationship age a bit. Get to know the country better in the meantime, it's not for everyone...

Although my wife has a good education and work history and even though we are both currently willingly unemployed, I was allowed to sponsor her and she was granted permanent residency this week. We married in 2004 and have a 4 month old boy. We're moving out within a few months and I just can't stand this place anymore.

[disgruntled]

Well, I would suggest that you live in Thailand as if you are married prior to actually getting married. Life as a tourist which is all fun is nothing like life as a husband. If you want to make a choice which you will be happy with the rest of your life then take a year to live together under conditions which involve normal stress. Don't let today's feelings fool you. Take your time and do the right thing.

[Ijustwannateach]

^I'd agree with Disgruntled.

A friend of a family member of mine recently went through the whole stereotypical thing; not with a Thai but with a Vietnamese woman. Still, the pattern was the usual one: lovey dovey when on tourist visits; everything looked good until the marriage; then the complicated visa process to get her to the States (not unusually she already had relatives there)- and then the problems: she stayed with her sister until the guy threatened to divorce her, then was pressuring him to buy a house for her near her family, etc., etc. All the usual trouble signs were there, and even though my family member was not particularly experienced in dating Southeast Asian women he knew things weren't right with his friend's marriage.

That doesn't mean your lady is like this, but it makes things a lot clearer if you can see her as she is at home- and if she seems happy about this- over extended periods before you make big expensive leaps to get her in your life there. Of course, you may not be able to do this because of your own job, and so forth. It's not easy- good luck, and your mileage may vary.

"S"

[wamberal]

Why not, some people go to church for guidance and help.....I know which source I would trust.

Have you ever been part of a church community? I have, for many years, and the people I have met are invariably good people whose guidance and help I would trust ...... far more than I would trust strangers on a faceless, anonymous, internet forum. However, to each his own.

[j0hnga1t]

DaveTheCanadian,

I'm in the US and have been dating a Thai girl I met in Saipan while she was out there working.  She is now finishing a bachelors degree in Thai traditional medicine at a college in Bangkok and I visit her every chance I get.  I have the same worries you have.  My brother and sister are happy for me (thought they haven't met her yet).  My friends are 50/50.  Some say she only wants my money; however, she doesn't know my net worth.  Other's are happy.  I get both opinions from my Thai friends too, but they are in bad marriages.  They married young. One had an abuse spouse and the other has a lazy spouse who is obese and wont take care of himself (he gives her freedom, but no love).

The best advice I got is to get a prenup and see how things go.  Someone else told me that no matter what others say, you have to make your own decision.  Follow your heart...not your little head.  Also read the book Thailand Fever, it gives a great perspective on Thai culture (along with the expectations) and Western culture.  You need to know what your are getting into...

Good Luck

[JSixpack]

You can later try Australia if you just want her to see a Western country. I don't know for sure, but I have the impression that it's easier for a Thai to travel there. Good luck.

NO ! No , and No !

It certainly is not . Unless you want to pay for her to study at a university there . Or you yourself are an Australian . Tourist visas for non-married Thai girls are notoriously difficult in Australia , almost impossible .

Thanks for the accurate information.

[rixalex]

Why not, some people go to church for guidance and help.....I know which source I would trust.

Have you ever been part of a church community? I have, for many years, and the people I have met are invariably good people whose guidance and help I would trust ...... far more than I would trust strangers on a faceless, anonymous, internet forum. However, to each his own.

But whereas few people would make the mistake of thinking that everything on this forum was true, some fall into the trap of thinking that people of the church always speak the gospel.

(sorry )

[Seizhin]

Take a deep breath, and take it slow.

Somethings that are brilliant might be stupid when your mind's fresh.

So, I'd advise you to think carefully about that.

Whatever you do, good luck.

[wamberal]

But whereas few people would make the mistake of thinking that everything on this forum was true, some fall into the trap of thinking that people of the church always speak the gospel.

(sorry )

Is this from your own personal experience in a church community? If so, I am sorry for that, but I repeat again that I have been part of christian communities for many years, and the people in them are just like you and me in many ways, but they do try to love each other and support each other in ways that are not always the norm in society as a whole.

[MrIrrisistable]

Yeah like catholic priests come to mind.

Never did get to become an alter boy....lucky me I guess.

[wileycoyote]

I would trust your own feelings .

Good Luck

Wiley Coyote

[twix38]

Don't marry!

Never marry for other reasons than love and at least 2 years of solid relationship experiences.

Would you marry like this to a Canadian girl just to get a visa or whatever etc?

Normal rules do still apply in Thailand. It's just that many foreigners take leave of their senses when the Thai lady is sooooo sweet, attentive and loving. It's also often bullshit and equally true, but 6 months to marry is the ultimate serves you right!

[a99az]

I would do what your hart tells you to do, BUT do think about it and extend you friendship for a bit before getting married.

I am happy with my Thai wife and child who are now with me in Spain but we intend to return to our home in Thailand soon as we can.

[scotwumman]

Give it time, let the relationship age a bit. Get to know the country better in the meantime, it's not for everyone...

Although my wife has a good education and work history and even though we are both currently willingly unemployed, I was allowed to sponsor her and she was granted permanent residency this week. We married in 2004 and have a 4 month old boy. We're moving out within a few months and I just can't stand this place anymore.

i

You seem determined to go. I will miss your posts unless you decide to keep looking in as I tend to do from a distance. All the best to you

[blakegeee]

Definitely take it slow, so you know 100% what you have. I agree that its a bad idea to marry for any reason other than just love. Somebody mentioned a fiance visa. As you probably already learned, Canada does not have "Fiance Visa's". The options are either a 3 month tourist visa (extendable in Canada), or a residence visa. The residence visa is apparantly easier to get as this eliminates their major concern of her not returning to Thailand. This type of visa doesn't take as long as it used to. Now it only takes about 6 months, although I heard that it takes about 6 months just to get through all the paperwork first. So all in all, it will probably take a year to get it sorted out. And it is not required that you are married for her to get a residence visa.

If you try again for the tourist visa, you might get it. My Thai fiance just got her second tourist visa to come to Canada again, 2 out of 2! The angle we took was writing 2 letters. One letter was more personal from me to Sai inviting her to Canada. The other letter was more formal from me to the Cdn Embassy confirming my invitation to her. It clarified that I will take care of all her expenses while here, give her a place to stay, etc. Just make sure you cover any concerns that they may have. For the first visa, we said that right after she has christmas in Canada, she wants to go back to Thailand right away to celebrate the new year in her village which is very important to her. The second visa that she just got, the letter said that after her 3 months in Canada, Sai and I will be returning to Thailand together. They are very concerned about Thai people not returning, so give them some details about her returning. Provide as much evidence as you can about what she has in Thailand to bring her back. List all her family members, kids are good if she has any, a business licence if she has one, or a letter from her employer giving her a 3 month holiday "but no longer"! You might even show her bike ownership. I also put money into Sai's bank and she brought her bank statement showing that I already gave her a few thousand to use while in Canada. I also provided my bank statements and tax assessments to prove that I have the necessary funds. Obviously, they are concerned about her being a burden on our system, so prove that you can afford this. Also, if you are applying for a tourist visa, talk about being a tourist. Mention about her meeting your family because thats nice, but also make it sound like she actually wants to be a tourist, you will go sight-seeing etc. If it sounds like its only about family than they will tell you that you should apply for a residence visa. We have been successful twice now and Canada is really tough for Thais to get visas. So if you have any other questions, just let me know.

Oh ya, make sure you have a return plane ticket booked for her before you go to the embassy. This seems stupid but is apparently very important. In Thailand, the travel shops can get you a confirmed ticket without the shop having to pay any deposit. If you have a friend in the business, they will do it for no charge as it costs them nothing other than time. Otherwise, just tell the shop your situation and I am sure they will do it for a small fee. Just explain you need to show a confirmed ticket but may have to cancel it so you don't way to pay till after she gets visa.

Edited May 18, 2008 by blakegeee

[sweetchariot]

Have you ever been part of a church community? I have, for many years, and the people I have met are invariably good people whose guidance and help I would trust ...... far more than I would trust strangers on a faceless, anonymous, internet forum. However, to each his own.

I have mate, as a choirboy. Fortunately I never had this kind of sh1t that appears in the papers on a weekly basis.

http://www.timesonline.co.uk/tol/news/uk/c...icle1880463.ece

I read something last week that put it in perspective for me:

The richest organisation in the world, which has a huge house on many a street corner. They would rather let the homeless sleep on the streets than use their many great halls.

Why? Because they don't trust them. They are too scared they will nick the communion wine, or some candlesticks.

Hmmm...

Religion and politics are not a good subject in a bar, or in a forum, but you started it.

Edited May 18, 2008 by sweetchariot

[qwertz]

Have you ever been part of a church community? I have, for many years, and the people I have met are invariably good people whose guidance and help I would trust ...... far more than I would trust strangers on a faceless, anonymous, internet forum. However, to each his own.

I have mate, as a choirboy. Fortunately I never had this kind of sh1t that appears in the papers on a weekly basis.

http://www.timesonline.co.uk/tol/news/uk/c...icle1880463.ece

I read something last week that put it in perspective for me:

The richest organisation in the world, which has a huge house on many a street corner. They would rather let the homeless sleep on the streets than use their many great halls.

Why? Because they don't trust them. They are too scared they will nick the communion wine, or some candlesticks.

Hmmm...

Religion and politics are not a good subject in a bar, or in a forum, but you started it.

The only two subjects I bar from debates in my classes.

[JC4U]

Have you ever been part of a church community? I have, for many years, and the people I have met are invariably good people whose guidance and help I would trust ...... far more than I would trust strangers on a faceless, anonymous, internet forum. However, to each his own.

I have mate, as a choirboy. Fortunately I never had this kind of sh1t that appears in the papers on a weekly basis.

http://www.timesonline.co.uk/tol/news/uk/c...icle1880463.ece

I read something last week that put it in perspective for me:

The richest organisation in the world, which has a huge house on many a street corner. They would rather let the homeless sleep on the streets than use their many great halls.

Why? Because they don't trust them. They are too scared they will nick the communion wine, or some candlesticks.

Hmmm...

Religion and politics are not a good subject in a bar, or in a forum, but you started it.

The only two subjects I bar from debates in my classes.

Sorry Sweetchariot

I couldn't help myself.

You seemed to have answered your own questions, (after WHY?) where I really do think you should have just left it as a question... Or was this what you read somewhere that really enlightened your perspective by giving you both the questions and the answers?

Whilst I don't really have the exact answers I could mention a few things worth considering (after your why?):

1. A sacred/consecrated site of worship - much like indigenous/Indian communities, Buddhist and many more religions have. These places are kept sacred and whilst being robed would obviously disappoint any person, I think it has more to do with the sacredness of the areas. A place where many more people (including the poor and homeless) can come and worship, pray to what they believe in.

2. Following your comment that the Church is the richest organisation in the world, how do you know what they do or don’t do... Do you know all of Microsoft’s affairs; in fact do you know all the affairs of any organisation other than maybe your own.

3. Do they need to be public on how charitable they are... Do you expect that they would drive themselves broke through charity to appease your needs to see them give. What I’m saying is that maybe they are being more charitable than you know or maybe even want to know.

Just a thought...

Edited May 22, 2008 by JC4U

[alexandrine1258]

As stupid as it may sound "listen to your heart"

marriage is something you shouldn't do because you feel obliged to but because of true love!

[happyending]

siam not change me, kup

same same before, laaooo

who say me changing i boxing, mah mah

he said

putting on his jacket backwards

and riding off down the wrong side of the road

with family of 4 aboard

to the beach, to eat som tam and swim fully clothed