Govt Faces No-confidence

[george]

Opposition to file no-confidence motion against PM, cabinet members

BANGKOK: -- The opposition Democrat Party has resolved to lodge a no-confidence motion against Prime Minister Samak Sundaravej and several other members of his cabinet within the current extraordinary parliamentary session, Democrat Party leader Abhisit Vejjajiva announced Sunday.

The Opposition party planned to submit the censure motion to House Speaker Chai Chidchob so that it could possibly be put in the floor debate within the current extraordinary session, scheduled to last until the end of this month.

Mr. Abhisit charged that the People Power Party-led coalition government had deliberately slowed down the 2009 Budget Bill until the last week of this month only to avert the censure debate.

The Opposition leader said the planned censure debate, which is to be followed by votes of confidence either for or against the Samak Administration, will be lodged on grounds that the premier and several of his cabinet members had had failures which he said should be considered detrimental to the country and the people's interests.

Among the alleged failures held accountable by the Samak government was the Bangkok Mass Transit Authority's plans to procure 6,000 NGV-fueled, air-conditioned buses and decommissioning of non-air-conditioned buses, according to the Democrat party leader.

All Democrat MPs were obliged to sign the no-confidence motion at parliament Tuesday (June 17), he said.

The Democrats' latest move against the Samak government emerged after the premier had earlier rejected the desperate call for him to endorse an earlier-sought general debate which might have been scheduled under the constitution's article 179.

Mr. Samak earlier explained that floor debate on the budget bill would likely be such a time-consuming session that there would be no time left for subsequent debate.

--TNA 2008-06-16

[alex_aka_P]

opposition Democrat Party has resolved to lodge a no-confidence motion against Prime Minister Samak Sundaravej and several other members of his cabinet within the current extraordinary parliamentary session

Empty spaces - what are we living for?

Abandoned places - I guess we know the score..

On and on! Does anybody know what we are looking for??

Another hero - another mindless crime.

Behind the curtain, in the pantomime.

Hold the line!

Does anybody want to take it anymore?

The Show must go on! The Show must go on!©

[candoman89]

HE11 I don't know anybody who has any confidence in any of these clowns.

Bunch of idiots.

[bratpack]

Could be tears of a clown soon.

[pumpuiman]

Yeah, what a screw up....the government wants to procure a more fuel efficient and comfortable transportation system for the public....shameful.

Fuel is 40 baht per liter and it's a 100 <deleted> degrees outside, or haven't the Democrats noticed?

Or is this about corruption?

If you live in a glass house..............

[Plus]

Yeah, what a screw up....the government wants to procure a more fuel efficient and comfortable transportation system for the public....shameful

Yeah, they should probably bring it up - where the progress on mass transit systems? It's not only fuel efficient and comfortable, but it's supposed to jump start private investment and improve overall confidence.

Instead they spend time on knee jerk "solutions" like introducing E85 while there isn't a single car in the country that can run on it and prices are too low for producers to make any profit.

[Shotime]

I was watching the King on TV the other night. It looked pretty recent. He was talking so low that you almost couldn't hear him or understand him if you could speak Thai. The look on his face said it all. It was sad. A Thai friend said he's not happy with what's going on.

Brilliant political move. This should add at least 10% to the decline in tourism. Almost every day they shoot themselves in the foot.

Edited June 16, 2008 by Shotime

[h90]

Yeah, what a screw up....the government wants to procure a more fuel efficient and comfortable transportation system for the public....shameful.

Fuel is 40 baht per liter and it's a 100 <deleted> degrees outside, or haven't the Democrats noticed?

Or is this about corruption?

If you live in a glass house..............

the question is the contract an who get the profit.....Not the idea is wrong the way they do it.

[sriracha john]

The PM is being as irresponsible and uncooperative with the Upper House version as much as he is with the Lower House...

House debate continues despite PM's no-show

The 61 senators who support the motion for a general debate by the Senate on the country's problems insisted on Monday they would continue with the plan.

The senators said the debate would continue as planned even though Prime Minister Samak Sundaravej hinted he might not show up for it.

However, some senators still expressed hope the premier would appear for the Upper House debate.

"It's the senators' right according to the Constitution, and it's the government's duty to offer explanations. We are waiting for an official reply from the prime minister. We are still confident that he will come," said Phetchaburi Senator Sumon Sutawiriyawat.

Pornphan Bunyarataphan, an appointed senator, said she believed the government would offer an explanation to the senators' queries. "We are trying to address people's sufferings, we are not creating trouble. The Constitution allows us and there are no reasons why the government should reject our good intentions," she said.

Paiboon Nititawan, another appointed senator, said if the prime minister made it clear he would not show up for the debate, the 61 senators would on Thursday meet to discuss further action.

According to Article 161 of the Constitution, one-third of the 150 senators have the right to submit a motion for a general debate in which ministers are expected to provide factual information or explain important problems in connection with the administration of state affairs without a resolution to be passed.

The motion for the general debate under this section may only be submitted once in each session.

- The Nation

[Insight]

Yeah, what a screw up....the government wants to procure a more fuel efficient and comfortable transportation system for the public....shameful.

Fuel is 40 baht per liter and it's a 100 <deleted> degrees outside, or haven't the Democrats noticed?

Or is this about corruption?

If you live in a glass house..............

the question is the contract an who get the profit.....Not the idea is wrong the way they do it.

And the dems are squeaky clean?

Please, we all know that you HAVE to be corrupt to advance in politics in Thailand. If you don't believe that, take off your rosy glasses.

If not guilty of corruption themselves, they are guilty by association.

By not condemning the lowest forms of corruption (you think Abhisit never saw a cop collect money instead of issuing a ticket?) they are all guilty in my opinion.

It's a smoke show...and you can bet Abhasit is doing this for personal gain...not saintly goodness.

Yawn. Although I did briefly buy into this argument at one point, and regretfully.

The guys in charge right now are the most blatant gang of corrupt, self-serving clowns you could ever ask for. Their every move smacks of covering their own greedy needs, and yet we have to listen to this same "the Democrats are corrupt to" trot, as if they're even close to being on the same level. Utter rubbish. It's the only line of defense the PPP have got, beyond blatantly buying the vote.

Yes, politics is tainted in Thailand, but please don't even try and bring Abhsit down to the same level as these scum. Pick out a single indiscretion from Abhsit, and I'll show you ten times more from the PPP in the equal amount of days.

My only condemnation of the Democrats is not doing more in the north-east to prevent utter <deleted> like this being perpetuated.

[h90]

Yeah, what a screw up....the government wants to procure a more fuel efficient and comfortable transportation system for the public....shameful.

Fuel is 40 baht per liter and it's a 100 <deleted> degrees outside, or haven't the Democrats noticed?

Or is this about corruption?

If you live in a glass house..............

the question is the contract an who get the profit.....Not the idea is wrong the way they do it.

And the dems are squeaky clean?

Please, we all know that you HAVE to be corrupt to advance in politics in Thailand. If you don't believe that, take off your rosy glasses.

If not guilty of corruption themselves, they are guilty by association.

By not condemning the lowest forms of corruption (you think Abhisit never saw a cop collect money instead of issuing a ticket?) they are all guilty in my opinion.

It's a smoke show...and you can bet Abhasit is doing this for personal gain...not saintly goodness.

Yawn. Although I did briefly buy into this argument at one point, and regretfully.

The guys in charge right now are the most blatant gang of corrupt, self-serving clowns you could ever ask for. Their every move smacks of covering their own greedy needs, and yet we have to listen to this same "the Democrats are corrupt to" trot, as if they're even close to being on the same level. Utter rubbish. It's the only line of defense the PPP have got, beyond blatantly buying the vote.

Yes, politics is tainted in Thailand, but please don't even try and bring Abhsit down to the same level as these scum. Pick out a single indiscretion from Abhsit, and I'll show you ten times more from the PPP in the equal amount of days.

My only condemnation of the Democrats is not doing more in the north-east to prevent utter <deleted> like this being perpetuated.

Insight: Just ignore such postings.....

There is corruption

all politicians are corrupt so Abhisit is the same bad

Abhisit is speaking about the corruption only for the personal gain

conclusio: Abhisit is the bad guy.

thats just plain nonsense what pumpuiman is posting here

[sriracha john]

Democrats to take government to task

Censure motion against Samak to be filed today

The Democrats will file their censure motion against the PM and six key PPP cabinet ministers today, but they fear the government will deliberately stall the debate. PM Samak yesterday avoided commenting on the motion, announced by the Democrat Party on Sunday. But PM's Office Minister Chusak Sirinin criticised the Democrats' no-confidence move as inappropriate because the government is only six months into its tenure. Chusak said the PPP took office when the country was in crisis and the opposition should allow more time for the government to prove its competence. The Democrats will hand the motion to House Speaker Chai Chidchob today. Chai, a PPP member, has to put it on the agenda within seven days. A Democrat source said some PPP members were pressing Samak to delay his decision on whether to accept the Democrat challenge until the special session ends. Democrat secretary-general Suthep Thaugsuban said the opposition did not expect to overthrow the government, given the coalition's firm control of parliament. The main focus was on the inefficiency of the administration, especially in tackling economic problems. The Democrats will lodge two separate censure motions. One, based on Article 158 of the constitution, will be filed against the PM. The other, based on Article 15, will be filed against six other cabinet ministers.

Continued here:

http://www.bangkokpost.com/News/17Jun2008_news01.php

====================================================================

The six cabinet ministers are Deputy Prime Minister and Finance Minister Surapong Suebwonglee, Deputy Prime Minister and Commerce Minister Mingkwan Saengsuwan, Foreign Minister Noppadon Pattama, Justice Minister Sompong Amornwiwat, Deputy Transport Minister Songsak Thongsri, and Interior Minister Chalerm Yoobamrung.

[pumpuiman]

Yeah, what a screw up....the government wants to procure a more fuel efficient and comfortable transportation system for the public....shameful.

Fuel is 40 baht per liter and it's a 100 <deleted> degrees outside, or haven't the Democrats noticed?

Or is this about corruption?

If you live in a glass house..............

the question is the contract an who get the profit.....Not the idea is wrong the way they do it.

And the dems are squeaky clean?

Please, we all know that you HAVE to be corrupt to advance in politics in Thailand. If you don't believe that, take off your rosy glasses.

If not guilty of corruption themselves, they are guilty by association.

By not condemning the lowest forms of corruption (you think Abhisit never saw a cop collect money instead of issuing a ticket?) they are all guilty in my opinion.

It's a smoke show...and you can bet Abhasit is doing this for personal gain...not saintly goodness.

Yawn. Although I did briefly buy into this argument at one point, and regretfully.

The guys in charge right now are the most blatant gang of corrupt, self-serving clowns you could ever ask for. Their every move smacks of covering their own greedy needs, and yet we have to listen to this same "the Democrats are corrupt to" trot, as if they're even close to being on the same level. Utter rubbish. It's the only line of defense the PPP have got, beyond blatantly buying the vote.

Yes, politics is tainted in Thailand, but please don't even try and bring Abhsit down to the same level as these scum. Pick out a single indiscretion from Abhsit, and I'll show you ten times more from the PPP in the equal amount of days.

My only condemnation of the Democrats is not doing more in the north-east to prevent utter <deleted> like this being perpetuated.

Insight: Just ignore such postings.....

There is corruption

all politicians are corrupt so Abhisit is the same bad

Abhisit is speaking about the corruption only for the personal gain

conclusio: Abhisit is the bad guy.

thats just plain nonsense what pumpuiman is posting here

So Abhisit is just a little corrupt?

And John Lennon's just a little bit dead.

It's the pot calling the kettle black, pure and simple.

I am not defending the completely corrupt PPP here....but I am saying they are all corrupt, and removing one will produce a giant sucking sound as the vacuum is filled.

Nonsense is believing one corrupt politician is better than another corrupt politician.

[Insight]

Yeah, what a screw up....the government wants to procure a more fuel efficient and comfortable transportation system for the public....shameful.

Fuel is 40 baht per liter and it's a 100 <deleted> degrees outside, or haven't the Democrats noticed?

Or is this about corruption?

If you live in a glass house..............

the question is the contract an who get the profit.....Not the idea is wrong the way they do it.

And the dems are squeaky clean?

Please, we all know that you HAVE to be corrupt to advance in politics in Thailand. If you don't believe that, take off your rosy glasses.

If not guilty of corruption themselves, they are guilty by association.

By not condemning the lowest forms of corruption (you think Abhisit never saw a cop collect money instead of issuing a ticket?) they are all guilty in my opinion.

It's a smoke show...and you can bet Abhasit is doing this for personal gain...not saintly goodness.

Yawn. Although I did briefly buy into this argument at one point, and regretfully.

The guys in charge right now are the most blatant gang of corrupt, self-serving clowns you could ever ask for. Their every move smacks of covering their own greedy needs, and yet we have to listen to this same "the Democrats are corrupt to" trot, as if they're even close to being on the same level. Utter rubbish. It's the only line of defense the PPP have got, beyond blatantly buying the vote.

Yes, politics is tainted in Thailand, but please don't even try and bring Abhsit down to the same level as these scum. Pick out a single indiscretion from Abhsit, and I'll show you ten times more from the PPP in the equal amount of days.

My only condemnation of the Democrats is not doing more in the north-east to prevent utter <deleted> like this being perpetuated.

Insight: Just ignore such postings.....

There is corruption

all politicians are corrupt so Abhisit is the same bad

Abhisit is speaking about the corruption only for the personal gain

conclusio: Abhisit is the bad guy.

thats just plain nonsense what pumpuiman is posting here

So Abhisit is just a little corrupt?

And John Lennon's just a little bit dead.

It's the pot calling the kettle black, pure and simple.

I am not defending the completely corrupt PPP here....but I am saying they are all corrupt, and removing one will produce a giant sucking sound as the vacuum is filled.

Nonsense is believing one corrupt politician is better than another corrupt politician.

Can you identify one single bit of evidence of Abhsit being involved in corruption on any level? I'm keen to see this.

[hammered]

Democrats to take government to task

Censure motion against Samak to be filed today

The Democrats will file their censure motion against the PM and six key PPP cabinet ministers today, but they fear the government will deliberately stall the debate. PM Samak yesterday avoided commenting on the motion, announced by the Democrat Party on Sunday. But PM's Office Minister Chusak Sirinin criticised the Democrats' no-confidence move as inappropriate because the government is only six months into its tenure. Chusak said the PPP took office when the country was in crisis and the opposition should allow more time for the government to prove its competence. The Democrats will hand the motion to House Speaker Chai Chidchob today. Chai, a PPP member, has to put it on the agenda within seven days. A Democrat source said some PPP members were pressing Samak to delay his decision on whether to accept the Democrat challenge until the special session ends. Democrat secretary-general Suthep Thaugsuban said the opposition did not expect to overthrow the government, given the coalition's firm control of parliament. The main focus was on the inefficiency of the administration, especially in tackling economic problems. The Democrats will lodge two separate censure motions. One, based on Article 158 of the constitution, will be filed against the PM. The other, based on Article 15, will be filed against six other cabinet ministers.

Continued here:

http://www.bangkokpost.com/News/17Jun2008_news01.php

====================================================================

The six cabinet ministers are Deputy Prime Minister and Finance Minister Surapong Suebwonglee, Deputy Prime Minister and Commerce Minister Mingkwan Saengsuwan, Foreign Minister Noppadon Pattama, Justice Minister Sompong Amornwiwat, Deputy Transport Minister Songsak Thongsri, and Interior Minister Chalerm Yoobamrung.

This move should be applauded by even the supporters of the government as it is the democratic (and constitutional) way to check the performance of the government although it remains moot whether the government and in particularly the PM believe there should be any check and balance mechanism on the government. Those that want to see functioning democracy in Thailand still it seems have a long wait ahead while politcal power even through elections (or through other power grabs) remains in the hands of a generation and class of people who will brook no criticsm at all.

Still what is actually happening now in wider terms and in spite of being close to dangerous may eventually lead to a situtation where something closer to a functional democracy exists. Right now we see on one side the idea that elected government should be able to do anything it wants completely unchecked and if any check and balance mechanism is to exist it should be completely under government control versus on the other side if we cant win elections we want a check and balance mechanism so strong that a government cant function and one that the government will have no say at all on the make up of. Obviously both these extremes are not exactly going to be good for the people of a country or its stable progression and something in between is what is needed, and where that should be is really what an honest debate should be about.

In the meantime we will maybe see a censure debate if it is allowed.

[Shotime]

They are all crooks. Someone said they don't play the game right, but they have the right idea. I'm not sure if there is a "right" way to play that "game.' They understand their crooks, it's really a matter of how much they want to steal. Yes, there are such "little" crooks, and, unforunately, Lennon is dead. Some cities use the banner "Corrupt but Content." You have to be corrupt to play. It's everywhere. Corruption, I mean. They raised the price of rice here. The PM is a TV cook, right?

Edited June 17, 2008 by Shotime

[sriracha john]

In the meantime we will maybe see a censure debate if it is allowed.

As everything is running so smoothly, there's no rush for a censure debate.... August will be fine.

House Speaker to have final say on the scheduling of censure debate: Somchai

House Speaker Chai Chidchob will have the final say whether the censure debate can happen at this session or the next one, Deputy Prime Minister Somchai Wongsawat said on Tuesday.

"The opposition's motion of no confidence will not expire at the closing of the extraordinary House session but the censure debate might be delayed to the next session," Somchai said.

The House deliberation on the Budget Bill is scheduled to end on June 27 and the next session following recess will start in August.

- The Nation

[hammered]

In the meantime we will maybe see a censure debate if it is allowed.

As everything is running so smoothly, there's no rush for a censure debate.... August will be fine.

House Speaker to have final say on the scheduling of censure debate: Somchai

House Speaker Chai Chidchob will have the final say whether the censure debate can happen at this session or the next one, Deputy Prime Minister Somchai Wongsawat said on Tuesday.

"The opposition's motion of no confidence will not expire at the closing of the extraordinary House session but the censure debate might be delayed to the next session," Somchai said.

The House deliberation on the Budget Bill is scheduled to end on June 27 and the next session following recess will start in August.

- The Nation

A lot of this is about divisions in the PPP. There are 20 odd factions and pressure between them is growing. In recent and upcoming PAO elections PPP factions are fighting each other for local representation, and it is not nice. In particular the Newin faction (as always) is looking for advantage over its PPP rival factions to achieve complete victory locally. Some factions are very hungry while others ally for politcal advatage and to remain well fed. There are rumours that even the parties patron is not so happy as these pressing issues threaten to undermine a nicely planned project.

A censure debate could cause the PPP problems not because of the Democrats or their coalition allies but because the internal divisions are currently at a state where if things are handled badly they could cause severe damage to the party with barely hidden in-fighting becoming very public. This also makes the issue any cabinet reshuffle dynamite as right now it would be nigh on impossible to keep the factions happy if a reshuffle of even a few seats were needed. Of course leaving things to August could just buy time but it could also allow for divisons to be dampened down a little as projects are launched and hence differences at least temporarily become issues of lesser import and maybe hunger is abated to soem degree for those factions currently being starved.

Edited June 17, 2008 by hammered

[sriracha john]

A lot of this is about divisions in the PPP.

There are 20 odd factions and pressure between them is growing.

the internal divisions are currently at a state where if things are handled badly they could cause severe damage to the party with barely hidden in-fighting becoming very public.

This also makes the issue any cabinet reshuffle dynamite as right now it would be nigh on impossible to keep the factions happy if a reshuffle of even a few seats were needed.

When the six chosen (as well as the obvious PM) are looked at, the likelihood that something could be "handled badly" is tremendous... Chalerm? Noppadope? The "New Cabinet" thread is chockful of their shortcomings since assuming their chairs of power. When the Democrats have already stated:

The main focus was on the inefficiency of the administration

those 2 yokels especially come to the fore as their job-specific inefficiency is among the worst. Noppadope spent the first 2 months doing nothing at the Foreign Ministry that wasn't Thaksin-related.

The need to find Cabinet seat replacements for them if things are "handled badly" at the censure is potentially very high.

and..this is all even before touching on the state of the economy, which is another focus of the debate.

Edited June 17, 2008 by sriracha john

[Khun Jean]

Another proof this constitution is much beter than the previous one.

[sriracha john]

Perhaps we won't have to wait until August, afterall...

Democrats Forge ahead with No Confidence Motion against Ruling Coalition

The Democrat Party is forging ahead with its plan to submit a no confidence motion against the ruling government coalition despite the Prime Minister’s clear signal that the government will not agree to the request.

The Party Secretary-General also dismissed the astrological importance of July 2nd as claimed by former premier Thaksin Shinawatra.

The Democrats called a meeting this morning among its party executives to discuss the necessary preparations for the plan to file a no confidence motion against the government. Signatures of party members will be collected to sanction the motion which will then be submitted to the House Speaker.

Democrat Party Secretary-General Suthep Thaugsuban said the party will refer to two particular clauses of the Constitution. They will use Article 158 to call for a censure debate on the Prime Minister while using Article 159 to censure individual Cabinet ministers.

However, if the motion is dismissed by the government, the party will proceed with other Parliamentary means to push for a censure debate. The opposition could join hands with Senators and use Article 129 to file a motion to convene another non-ordinary Parliamentary session. At least one-third of the MPs and Senators must support the move for the motion to be valid.

Prime Minister Samak Sundaravej has earlier said there’s not enough time during the current non-ordinary Parliamentary session for the censure debate to take place. Suthep said the Democrats do not mean for the censure motion to prevent the government from dissolving the House, but he insisted a House dissolution would only exacerbate the current problems.

In response to a cryptic comment made by former prime minister Thaksin Shinawatra about July 2nd being the date on which national conflicts will be resolved, Suthep says that’s unlikely. He adds astrology cannot influence politics. But Suthep did say he believes July 8th will be an important date for Thai politics. That’s the date on which a ruling will be handed down on the election fraud case against former House speaker Yongyuth Tiyapairat. Under the current Constitution a guilty verdict could very well lead to the dissolution of the People Power Party.

The Democrat Party is expected to submit the motion for the censure debate tomorrow.

- Thailand Outlook (today)

[plachon]

Yeah, what a screw up....the government wants to procure a more fuel efficient and comfortable transportation system for the public....shameful.

Fuel is 40 baht per liter and it's a 100 <deleted> degrees outside, or haven't the Democrats noticed?

Or is this about corruption?

If you live in a glass house..............

the question is the contract an who get the profit.....Not the idea is wrong the way they do it.

And the dems are squeaky clean?

Please, we all know that you HAVE to be corrupt to advance in politics in Thailand. If you don't believe that, take off your rosy glasses.

If not guilty of corruption themselves, they are guilty by association.

By not condemning the lowest forms of corruption (you think Abhisit never saw a cop collect money instead of issuing a ticket?) they are all guilty in my opinion.

It's a smoke show...and you can bet Abhasit is doing this for personal gain...not saintly goodness.

Yawn. Although I did briefly buy into this argument at one point, and regretfully.

The guys in charge right now are the most blatant gang of corrupt, self-serving clowns you could ever ask for. Their every move smacks of covering their own greedy needs, and yet we have to listen to this same "the Democrats are corrupt to" trot, as if they're even close to being on the same level. Utter rubbish. It's the only line of defense the PPP have got, beyond blatantly buying the vote.

Yes, politics is tainted in Thailand, but please don't even try and bring Abhsit down to the same level as these scum. Pick out a single indiscretion from Abhsit, and I'll show you ten times more from the PPP in the equal amount of days.

My only condemnation of the Democrats is not doing more in the north-east to prevent utter <deleted> like this being perpetuated.

I think the problem in the NE is that PPP/TRT have such a stranglehold over local politics in most districts that the Democrats can't get a toe-hold in to even establish a local party office. The same situation would exist in the South I would imagine, where the Democrats hold in virtually unassailable, and as Chris Baker (I think) said after the last election (or was it a by-election?) that the Democrats could field a kitchen mop and it would still get voted in to power.

I would not put it past the local PPP/TRT mafiosa to conduct a campaign of intimidation and possible violence, if there was a serious attempt by the Democrats to get a decent toe-hold in Isaan, as can be seen by the readiness that the TRT and now, PPP, can whistle up a rent-a-mob from the boondocks or slums, whenever they perceive there's a threat to their hegemony. Thus "doing more" is not an easy option, when the tables are so slanted in Isaan.

[hammered]

Yeah, what a screw up....the government wants to procure a more fuel efficient and comfortable transportation system for the public....shameful.

Fuel is 40 baht per liter and it's a 100 <deleted> degrees outside, or haven't the Democrats noticed?

Or is this about corruption?

If you live in a glass house..............

the question is the contract an who get the profit.....Not the idea is wrong the way they do it.

And the dems are squeaky clean?

Please, we all know that you HAVE to be corrupt to advance in politics in Thailand. If you don't believe that, take off your rosy glasses.

If not guilty of corruption themselves, they are guilty by association.

By not condemning the lowest forms of corruption (you think Abhisit never saw a cop collect money instead of issuing a ticket?) they are all guilty in my opinion.

It's a smoke show...and you can bet Abhasit is doing this for personal gain...not saintly goodness.

Yawn. Although I did briefly buy into this argument at one point, and regretfully.

The guys in charge right now are the most blatant gang of corrupt, self-serving clowns you could ever ask for. Their every move smacks of covering their own greedy needs, and yet we have to listen to this same "the Democrats are corrupt to" trot, as if they're even close to being on the same level. Utter rubbish. It's the only line of defense the PPP have got, beyond blatantly buying the vote.

Yes, politics is tainted in Thailand, but please don't even try and bring Abhsit down to the same level as these scum. Pick out a single indiscretion from Abhsit, and I'll show you ten times more from the PPP in the equal amount of days.

My only condemnation of the Democrats is not doing more in the north-east to prevent utter <deleted> like this being perpetuated.

I think the problem in the NE is that PPP/TRT have such a stranglehold over local politics in most districts that the Democrats can't get a toe-hold in to even establish a local party office. The same situation would exist in the South I would imagine, where the Democrats hold in virtually unassailable, and as Chris Baker (I think) said after the last election (or was it a by-election?) that the Democrats could field a kitchen mop and it would still get voted in to power.

I would not put it past the local PPP/TRT mafiosa to conduct a campaign of intimidation and possible violence, if there was a serious attempt by the Democrats to get a decent toe-hold in Isaan, as can be seen by the readiness that the TRT and now, PPP, can whistle up a rent-a-mob from the boondocks or slums, whenever they perceive there's a threat to their hegemony. Thus "doing more" is not an easy option, when the tables are so slanted in Isaan.

Indeed one huge challenge for the democrats is getting past the TRT (oops should that be PPP) networks, mafia and many of the supposedly neutral village headmen and kamnan in the north east and north who not only use constant mantras of Thaksin did..... , which to differing degrees are true, but also and often to a far greater degree spread constant and usually false information on Democrat plans as well as demonizing them as those who will take away everything you have. In some areas I am aware of the Dems would face intimidation or potential violence if they attempted to organise. It is all about power. Quite difficult for the Dems.

A weird off shoot of this situation is that it is only the Dems who would even think of making the changes to education that would empower the poor more. Those who people now vote for wouldnt want to risk upsetting the apple cart while the Dems need to upset the apple cart. A weird irony.

[Insight]

Thanks for the feedback plachon & hammered - quite interesting.

I've always thought one of the first things the Democrats should do if they make it in to power any time soon is introduce a state pension, with sufficient checks and balances to make sure the cash isn't going to the wrong hands. Okay, it's a big (or perhaps monumental) task, but it'll do two things:

* Devalue the value of a vote. What's a one-off 200-500 baht when there's a regular income of (erm...) 500 baht plus every month?

* Dispel a good deal of rumors about the evils of the Democrats.

Could be being massively unrealistic here, but would it really be a drain on state coffers?

[sriracha john]

CENSURE MOTION

PM faces grilling on 9 points

Democrats to also target seven other Cabinet members for their failures

The opposition Democrat Party yesterday resolved to file a censure motion against Prime Minister and Defence Minister Samak Sundaravej and seven other Cabinet members.

After a meeting that lasted more than four hours, the Democrats agreed to nine points dealing with mistakes or wrongdoings allegedly committed by Samak during his past four months in office, Democrat spokesman Ong-art Klampaiboon said.

They include Samak's loyal services to an unnamed politician who has lost power, appointment of poorly qualified people to his Cabinet, negligence of the plight of residents in the violence-hit deep South, indifference to the country's worsening problems, and lack of leadership.

Also targeted in the censure motion are two deputy premiers - Mingkwan Sangsuwan and Surapong Suebwonglee - who also serve as Commerce Minister and Finance Minister, respectively.

The other targeted Cabinet members are Foreign Minister Noppadon Pattama, Transport Minister Santi Prompat, Deputy Transport Minister Songsak Thongsri, Interior Minister Chalerm Yoobamrung and Justice Minister Sompong Amornwiwat.

The opposition held Mingkwan responsible for higher commodity prices, Surapong for the worsening economic problems and Santi and Songsak for alleged corruption within the Bangkok Mass Transit Authority. Sompong was linked to personnel mismanagement in the Justice Ministry.

Noppadon was targeted for his "mistakes" involving the latest dispute with Cambodia over the Preah Vihear Temple and Chalerm for his "inefficiency" in dealing with the violence in the deep South and alleged abuse of authority over his order to disrupt broadcast signals from ASTV.

Opposition chief whip Sathit Wongnongtoey today will submit a censure motion to House Speaker Chai Chidchob, said a spokesman.

Ong-art said the opposition believed the no-confidence debate could take place before the end of the current extraordinary parliamentary session on June 28.

House Speaker Chai yesterday said the timing of the censure debate would depend on whether coalition and opposition whips could reach an agreement on time allocations between the budgetary deliberation and the no-confidence motion.

"Upon receiving the opposition's motion, I will need only three days for checking and to notify the government before proceeding to put the motion on the House agenda," Chai said. He played down the allegation he might side with the government in stalling the debate. "I am strictly neutral on the matter of a censure debate," he said. The priority for the extraordinary House session is the passage of the Budget Bill, which will reach the floor for deliberation from June 25-26, he said.

If the coalition and opposition whips can agree to squeeze the censure into part of the time slot for the budget debate, then the grilling of the government will take place before the closing of the extraordinary session, he said.

Meanwhile, the Cabinet yesterday endorsed a draft Royal Decree scheduling June 28 as the last day of the current extraordinary parliamentary session, deputy Government Spokesman Nattawut Saikua said.

The Cabinet also acknowledged the prime minister's decision not to respond to queries by senators at the Senate general debate on national problems that was scheduled for next Monday, said the deputy spokesman. Samak instructed the relevant agencies to reply accordingly to the Senate's Secretariat. His excuse is that Cabinet members will be too busy with the budget-bill debate during that period.

- The Nation (today)

[clausewitz]

The opposition held Mingkwan responsible for higher commodity prices,

Yep Mingwan made the price of oil go up for .

By the way, how did he do that?

[Old Man River]

The opposition held Mingkwan responsible for higher commodity prices,

Yep Mingwan made the price of oil go up for .

By the way, how did he do that?

Commodities cover more than just oil. The point is to get Mingwan talking. While he might not last until the debate, which may well not be for another few months anyway, Mingwan's strength has been in marketing and public relations. His main contributions to the country of Thailand as its Commerce Minister so far have been “Dollars for durian”, “T-Pop and talok", rice “The new oil”, and suggesting Thailand patent it's Full Moon Parties.

Now, given the above, if you were in the opposition wouldn't you want to get him in front of the nation to talk about his role as Commerce Minister?

[sriracha john]

a government in disarray....

House Speaker Sparks Chaos in Meeting

A number of the opposition MPs staged a walkout at the today's Lower House meeting today in a protest against the speaker's decision to resume the meeting despite the quorum not having been met.

House Speaker Chai Chidchob called for a break from the Lower Chamber meeting to deliberate the Constitution's organic draft bill on the Auditor General's Office, which kicked off around 9:30am, as the group lacked the minimum number of members required to conduct the meeting, with only 226 members present.

The meeting re-convened at around 10:10am with the House Speaker affirming that six additional ruling coalition MPs have reported to him outside the chamber during the break, thus making the meeting meet the quorum of 235 MPs.

His decision displeased the Democrat MPs as they demanded a quorum count again to make sure it is met. The Democrat's MPs subsequently tried to launch a veto against the decision, citing that the House speaker violated the requirements on Parliamentary meetings.

However, the Democrat's demand received no response. Chai claimed the chamber needed to provide speedy deliberation on several draft bills.

The refusal led to a number of Democrat MPs walking out of the meeting in a protest against the House Speaker's decision.

Suphan Buri MP from the coalition Chart Thai Party, Nstthawut Prasertsuwan, later suggested to the House Speaker that the MPs who reserve the right to launch a veto should be allowed to express their viewpoints and that the Speaker does not have the power to disregard the regulations for the House meetings.

Meanwhile, Chart Thai Party Leader, Banharn Silapa-archa said chaos was sparked when the House Speaker ordered the members to report themselves during the meeting though they had already reported themselves before the meeting.

Banhan called on the House Speaker to cancel the order but Chai explained his order was not for the Lower House members to report themselves during the meeting but when voting.

Chai claimed the failure to meet the quorum would result in problems on the issuance of the organic draft bill on the Governor of Auditor General's Office, as the same draft bill approved by the now defunct National Legislative Assembly was nullified by the Constitution Court.

- Thailand Outlook

[sriracha john]

Opposition challenges govt; files no-confidence motion against PM, 7 ministers

BANGKOK, June 18 (TNA) – Thailand's opposition Democrat party on Wednesday morning 'threw down the gauntlet', directly challenging the government of Prime Minister Samak Sundaravej and his Peoples Power Party (PPP) by lodging a no-confidence motion in parliament.

Some observers believe that move, only against Samak and his party associates, also aims to separate the premier from his coalition partners. *although the House Speaker seems to be doing the most effective job with that task*

The rising political temperature in the Thai capital marked the increasing pressure from the Opposition -- filing a motion of no-confidence against Prime Minister in parliament -- designed to speed the process of bringing down the government.

At the same time, the People's Alliance for Democracy (PAD), a protest alliance born amid attempts to bring down the former government of Thaksin Shinawatra, currently demonstrating on Rajdamneon Avenue in front of the United National regional headquarters, carried its revised campaign against the government of Prime Minister Samak Sundaravej.

Marching on the Ministry of Foreign Affairs, the PAD called for the resignation of Foreign Minister Noppadon Pattama.

Both the Democrats and the PAD state their belief that the Samak government is a weak, ineffective and corrupt stand-in for the deposed government of Thaksin.

Despite a string of charges -- mainly dealing with alleged poor performance and failure to cope with the ongoing economic and other unresolved problems, the spokesman said, the core complaint may be that of offering apparent undue servitude to a previous government.

The Democrat Party's censure motion, aims to prompt government as well as opposition MPs to cast no-confidence votes against Samak and the seven other ministers after a marathon censure debate, expected to take place by June 28 or by the end of the current extraordinary House session.

Opposition party spokesman Ong-ard Khlampaibul said the seven cabinet portfolio bearers targeted alongside the premier included Deputy Prime Minister and Finance Minister Surapong Suebwonglee, Deputy Prime Minister and Commerce Minister Mingkhwan Saengsuwan, Transport Minister Santi Promphat, Deputy Transport Minister Songsak Thongsri, Justice Minister Sompong Amornwiwat, Foreign Minister Noppadon and Interior Minister Chalerm Yoobamrung.

Only a few Democrat MPs would take the floor to voice the censure charges against each of the seven ministers, he said.

The prime minister, concurrently head of the ruling People Power Party, will be grilled during the censure debate on grounds that he allegedly had run the country without visible leadership.

The Democrat charges say that the prime minister had "obviously" sought to serve hidden interests of a once-powerful person and endorsed constitutional amendment bids "only to return favours to a particular, hidden supporter" who stood behind Samak's political aims, rather than the prime minister himself.

The Democrats apparently referred to Samak's predecessor, deposed prime minister Thaksin Shinawatra, stating that Samak chose persons of poor judgment, incompetence and lack of expertise as members of his cabinet to run varied portfolios of government.

The opposition charges stated that the Samak cabinet members had vested personal and partisan interests which were inappropriately entangled with those of the country and people, and that Samak had allowed members of his cabinet to run the country in an aimless, random fashion resulting in failed government policies.

PM Samak, according to the Democrats, allowed members of his cabinet and other government officials to harm their adversaries and that he had openly acted in undue defence of his subordinates.

The prime minister continued to ignore the people's welfare in the face of rapidly rising costs of living and sustained economic hardship, the spokesman said, and failed to resolve the continuing violence in the insurgency-torn far South and did not, therefore, return peace and prosperity to the southernmost region.

[hammered]

a government in disarray....

House Speaker Sparks Chaos in Meeting

A number of the opposition MPs staged a walkout at the today's Lower House meeting today in a protest against the speaker's decision to resume the meeting despite the quorum not having been met.

House Speaker Chai Chidchob called for a break from the Lower Chamber meeting to deliberate the Constitution's organic draft bill on the Auditor General's Office, which kicked off around 9:30am, as the group lacked the minimum number of members required to conduct the meeting, with only 226 members present.

The meeting re-convened at around 10:10am with the House Speaker affirming that six additional ruling coalition MPs have reported to him outside the chamber during the break, thus making the meeting meet the quorum of 235 MPs.

His decision displeased the Democrat MPs as they demanded a quorum count again to make sure it is met. The Democrat's MPs subsequently tried to launch a veto against the decision, citing that the House speaker violated the requirements on Parliamentary meetings.

However, the Democrat's demand received no response. Chai claimed the chamber needed to provide speedy deliberation on several draft bills.

The refusal led to a number of Democrat MPs walking out of the meeting in a protest against the House Speaker's decision.

Suphan Buri MP from the coalition Chart Thai Party, Nstthawut Prasertsuwan, later suggested to the House Speaker that the MPs who reserve the right to launch a veto should be allowed to express their viewpoints and that the Speaker does not have the power to disregard the regulations for the House meetings.

Meanwhile, Chart Thai Party Leader, Banharn Silapa-archa said chaos was sparked when the House Speaker ordered the members to report themselves during the meeting though they had already reported themselves before the meeting.

Banhan called on the House Speaker to cancel the order but Chai explained his order was not for the Lower House members to report themselves during the meeting but when voting.

Chai claimed the failure to meet the quorum would result in problems on the issuance of the organic draft bill on the Governor of Auditor General's Office, as the same draft bill approved by the now defunct National Legislative Assembly was nullified by the Constitution Court.

- Thailand Outlook

This is the problem when you appoint people to positions based on their politcal favour in the party rather than their knowledge and ability to do the job. Still I doubt the octagenarian father of Newin will enjoy the loss of face by being basically called an idiot by a Chart Thai MP.

Piss up and brewery?