stiggy Posted June 20, 2008 Share Posted June 20, 2008 I personally believe that in principal Tourist volunteers are a good idea,The tag police is misleading and open to abuse. My largest concern is the lack of vetting procedure,I know of one such volunteer that has a criminal resume fagan would be proud of,he has served time for some crimes run away from others. People in Thailand (expats) trusted him due to his charm uniform and position he has since conned a few and is now wanted by the BIB. Im aware that always you will find bad people in any group, but for this position surely the BIB should check at least with embassy of applicant. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sriracha john Posted June 20, 2008 Share Posted June 20, 2008 Do the farang (or foreigner) police volunteers have the legally-required work permits or work permit exemption letters? We've established they don't in Pattaya and Chiang Mai. What about Samui? So I take it then that we can add Samui to "no have" list. I suppose it's too much to expect the police to actually follow the law. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SamuiRes Posted June 20, 2008 Share Posted June 20, 2008 I was at a meeting a few weeks ago organised by the Tourist Police to explain their function and that of the Volunteers. I met half a dozen of the Volunteers, some of whom I knew previously. They admitted that when the scheme was first started they did get a number of people joining for the wrong reasons, but they were soon weeded out. The Tourist Police should have a complement of 22 but only have (or had then) 10 and they had 12 Volunteers. The Volunteers have no powers of arrest and are there purely to assist ANY foreigner on the island including residents if called upon. They are understaffed and therefore the ability to man the office on the Lake Road full time is not easy. The other issue that was raised was that the 1155 emergency number currently only connects to the Tourist Police in Bangkok and they are trying to get that changed - but even the Police can have problems with beurocracy here. The number to use is 077 414 198. They do serve a useful purpose and speak a multitude of languages which for tourists in particular is somewhat comforting conversing in their own language rather than being misunderstood by the Thai Police. Give credit where credit is due. Some of these people have full time jobs as well and give up part of their free time to put something back to the island. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
koheesti Posted June 20, 2008 Share Posted June 20, 2008 I suppose it's too much to expect the police to actually follow the law. Considering where we are talking about, I nominate this as the funniest post so far this year. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sriracha john Posted June 20, 2008 Share Posted June 20, 2008 If the police volunteers ever decide to get legal and comply with the law (the whole purpose they're volunteering is to uphold the law, one might presume) they should consult with... The lowest I've seen for a private company was 10K.About 1 month ago, we had problems to make Khon Kaen accept 12K for a British guy, manager. But it worked after a lot of talk. We did 2 work permits with NO SALARY, volunteer workers for a foundation about a week ago. so it is indeed possible... why they'd rather break the law when it is possible not to makes one question their judgement on other matters. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gatorade Posted June 20, 2008 Share Posted June 20, 2008 If the police volunteers ever decide to get legal and comply with the law (the whole purpose they're volunteering is to uphold the law, one might presume) they should consult with...The lowest I've seen for a private company was 10K.About 1 month ago, we had problems to make Khon Kaen accept 12K for a British guy, manager. But it worked after a lot of talk. We did 2 work permits with NO SALARY, volunteer workers for a foundation about a week ago. so it is indeed possible... why they'd rather break the law when it is possible not to makes one question their judgement on other matters. You seem to be grasping at straws to try and prove a dubious point.o Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BigC Posted June 20, 2008 Share Posted June 20, 2008 Nice quote SJ--and so true.These discussions always go this route and always end up getting closed because people can't seem to help themselves and not start flaming each other. so itis fair to say that forang police are not wanted powers or no powers Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BusyBee123 Posted June 20, 2008 Share Posted June 20, 2008 tourist reps are all they are so why affiliate them with the police, if a farang is lost or stranded in samui it doesn't take much to gain advice from a local, expat or even fellow tourist so there is no need for them whatsoever Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
garro Posted June 20, 2008 Share Posted June 20, 2008 What is it with people? The Thai police get condemned for not doing enough to help tourists, but when they do implement something it gets criticised because of people's petty jealousy. The police must think that foreigners are just a bunch of whining ingrates. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BigC Posted June 21, 2008 Share Posted June 21, 2008 What is it with people? The Thai police get condemned for not doing enough to help tourists, but when they do implement something it gets criticised because of people's petty jealousy. The police must think that foreigners are just a bunch of whining ingrates. been here for 5 yearsseen alot of changes never needed a tourist policeman or woman. they would be better off if they called themselves somethign different. like Govment Toursit Information Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sriracha john Posted June 21, 2008 Share Posted June 21, 2008 tourist reps are all they are so why affiliate them with the police, if a farang is lost or stranded in samui it doesn't take much to gain advice from a local, expat or even fellow tourist so there is no need for them whatsoever If they were only pointing out the nearest toilet to hapless tourists, that's one thing, but if they are anything like Pattaya's version of the tourist police volunteers, they get deeply involved in far more clandestine operations including prostitution and narcotics trafficking as undercover agents (as reported by the news and a Pattaya police volunteer in a now deleted post). PATTAYA VOLUNTEER POLICE INDULGE IN UZBEK STING OPERATION Undercover Pattaya Tourist Police pretended to solicit sex from foreign women. Four women from Republic of Uzbekistan were arrested. On the 22nd May 2007, at 02:30 am, Pol. Lt. Col. Withichart Luensukan, Tourist Police Inspector of Pattaya, and his team, planned an operation to nab Uzbek Prostitutes around the night time entertainment areas. The undercover Pattaya Tourist Police officers managed to arrest four ladies who were offering their services. The foreign undercover officers made arrangements with the four Uzbek women for sexual services at the Pattaya Inn Hotel, Soi B.J., Walking Street, South Pattaya, Nongprue, Banglamung, Chonburi, Rooms 203, 206 and 207. When the love making sessions were concluded, the prostitutes asked for 2,000 baht each. The undercover representatives gave a total of 8,000 baht to the women, and the police placed them under arrest. - Pattaya Daily News / May 22, 2007 ------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------ UNDERCOVER STING NETS THREE MORE UZBEK PROSTITUTES The Pattaya Immigration Police sent foreign undercover police volunteers, in a sting operation, to purchase sexual services from Uzbek women. The police managed to nab three Uzbek prostitutes and two Thai men, who were their agents. On 20 September 2007, at 2 AM, Police Colonel Ithiphol Ithisarn-ronachai, Pattaya Immigration Superintendent was informed of a Thai agency that provided Uzbek prostitutes to clients in Pattaya City. Pattaya Immigration set up a sting operation, along with Police Lieutenant Colonel Prasart Kemaprasit, Central Immigration Investigator, and sent three foreign undercover police volunteers to arrange for female prostitutes from the Thai agency. The three foreign undercover volunteers, with 4500 baht in their pockets, met with Mr. Sathaporn Jaiyos (39), from Utaradit Province, and Mr. Amornsit Chainam (33), from Ubonrachathani Province, in front of the V.C. Hotel, in South Pattaya, to buy sexual services from three Uzbek women. - Pattaya Daily News / September 21, 2007 ---------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------- We are different though because we are out in the field which means we encounter many things such as fights, robberies and other cases that carry elements of danger which is why our group wear utility belts containing items that we are permitted to use under close supervision from the Tourist Police. ============================================================================ I recognize there may be differences in how operations are handled in different communties and thus am asking for information purposes; do these sort of operations occur on Samui? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
garro Posted June 21, 2008 Share Posted June 21, 2008 (edited) What is it with people? The Thai police get condemned for not doing enough to help tourists, but when they do implement something it gets criticised because of people's petty jealousy. The police must think that foreigners are just a bunch of whining ingrates. been here for 5 yearsseen alot of changes never needed a tourist policeman or woman. they would be better off if they called themselves somethign different. like Govment Toursit Information I don't see why it should matter what they are called so long as they are doing something useful. Are you afraid that they might be thinking that they are better than other westerners here - if so that's just childish. Many countries have volunteer police to help bridge the gap between communities. I would be more worried about the 'undercover western police' - those volunteers who see it as their duty to spy on and report other westerners for minor infringement of the laws out of petty jealousy. These guys don't wear a uniform. Edited June 21, 2008 by garro Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sriracha john Posted June 21, 2008 Share Posted June 21, 2008 (edited) What is it with people? The Thai police get condemned for not doing enough to help tourists, but when they do implement something it gets criticised because of people's petty jealousy. The police must think that foreigners are just a bunch of whining ingrates. What's wrong with expecting them to "implement something" in a transparent and legal manner? An opportunity to turn the generally-negative impressions of the police into something positive is cast aside and it only exacerbates that already negative impression when laws are disregarded, questionable screening is conducted, and a veil of secrecy shrouds their dubious activities that includes all sorts of police scenarios and far surpasses that of the "helpful tourist guide." That would more accurately reflect the basis for criticisms rather than something based on "petty jealousy." Edited June 21, 2008 by sriracha john Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
imaneggspurt Posted June 21, 2008 Share Posted June 21, 2008 ok, ok, why not... I checked the web site... So I get these people aren't getting paid ? Why on earth would someone want to volunteer ? They like the uniform,. ,. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
garro Posted June 21, 2008 Share Posted June 21, 2008 (edited) Sriracha John, It is the informants and snitches who do not join the volunteer police who would worry me more. How a country decides to operate its law enforcement is surely a matter of internal affairs, and I am not sure if any country does this transparently and fully within their own laws. Often governments justify this by claiming that the ends justify the means - I am not really in a position to judge this. I am sure that a small contingent of foreigners dressed up as Thai police officers is the least thing to worry about when it comes to law enforcement in this country. If something more sinister was occurring I doubt that they would put them in uniform, stick their personal information on websites, or have them marching up and down streets in tourist areas. Perhaps they do occasionally use them as part of sting operations for convenience sake, but they could just as easily pick any tourist to help them in this - I am sure that there would be no shortage of volunteers. At least this way there may be some accountability. Edited June 21, 2008 by garro Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PoorSucker Posted June 21, 2008 Share Posted June 21, 2008 ok, ok, why not... I checked the web site... So I get these people aren't getting paid ? Why on earth would someone want to volunteer ? When applying for permanent residency you must write a letter to Immigration, detailing your contribution to Thai society. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
garro Posted June 21, 2008 Share Posted June 21, 2008 ok, ok, why not... I checked the web site... So I get these people aren't getting paid ? Why on earth would someone want to volunteer ? When applying for permanent residency you must write a letter to Immigration, detailing your contribution to Thai society. Very good point. This would indeed look good on a residency/citizenship application. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
peperobi Posted June 21, 2008 Share Posted June 21, 2008 For lunch, I went to macdonalds, in chaweng, from bophut where I live... I don't go to chaweng really often so I'm sure this subject has been discussed many times here, but that's the first time I noticed it:On the way to chaweng road, we passed 5 or 6 tourist police officers... all faraangs !!! some had a black shirt saying "volunteer" in the back, some had a white shirt, and looked more like NSW cops (for those who know what i'm talking about)... What are they really ? Are they entitled to stop me while I'm speeding - I mean driving - my car ? 'cause they don't look like they'd let me get away with a coupla red bills... Anyway I was just wondering, because I was surprised to see a red haired faraang cop girl here... sorry if this subject has been discussed before. Hi, i'm a former tourist police volunteer. The volunteer are only translator in uniform, so don't worry even some of them have a behauvior like a sheriff. The most of them are people that geting boring because they have nothing to do. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
peperobi Posted June 21, 2008 Share Posted June 21, 2008 Thank you. So, I'll ask the proverbial question yet again in one of these threads. Do the farang (or foreigner) police volunteers have the legally-required work permits or work permit exemption letters? We've established they don't in Pattaya and Chiang Mai. What about Samui? Yes/No the farang police volunteer have a WP if they are working some where, some of them do have a retirement visa but anymore nobody check it out. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
peperobi Posted June 21, 2008 Share Posted June 21, 2008 As I understand it, these volunteers are generally there to provide help for tourists, something I think we can all agree is necessary.Whether or not there are bad apples in the bunch hardly justifies tainting every single person who chooses to volunteer as some jackbooted gestapo out to throw their weight around. Some people do actually want to help others. Just a thought. You are right I leave the police because some of my collegues enjoy to play sheriff and here in Samui can be quite dangeros. no one thai will accept that some farang give some advice to them. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
peperobi Posted June 21, 2008 Share Posted June 21, 2008 I personally believe that in principal Tourist volunteers are a good idea,The tag police is misleading and open to abuse.My largest concern is the lack of vetting procedure,I know of one such volunteer that has a criminal resume fagan would be proud of,he has served time for some crimes run away from others. People in Thailand (expats) trusted him due to his charm uniform and position he has since conned a few and is now wanted by the BIB. Im aware that always you will find bad people in any group, but for this position surely the BIB should check at least with embassy of applicant. Right! then I know about few people here that leaving ther contry because they do some criminal business there... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
peperobi Posted June 21, 2008 Share Posted June 21, 2008 I was at a meeting a few weeks ago organised by the Tourist Police to explain their function and that of the Volunteers. I met half a dozen of the Volunteers, some of whom I knew previously. They admitted that when the scheme was first started they did get a number of people joining for the wrong reasons, but they were soon weeded out. The Tourist Police should have a complement of 22 but only have (or had then) 10 and they had 12 Volunteers. The Volunteers have no powers of arrest and are there purely to assist ANY foreigner on the island including residents if called upon. They are understaffed and therefore the ability to man the office on the Lake Road full time is not easy. The other issue that was raised was that the 1155 emergency number currently only connects to the Tourist Police in Bangkok and they are trying to get that changed - but even the Police can have problems with beurocracy here. The number to use is 077 414 198. They do serve a useful purpose and speak a multitude of languages which for tourists in particular is somewhat comforting conversing in their own language rather than being misunderstood by the Thai Police. Give credit where credit is due. Some of these people have full time jobs as well and give up part of their free time to put something back to the island. The idea was very good, the biggest problem is that nobody from the tourist police take the responsability for this squad. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
peperobi Posted June 21, 2008 Share Posted June 21, 2008 I think people who volunteer to help should be congratulated and not just a target for ridicule - which is most likely due to envy by the way. Great! But important is that they realize that they are not police officer.... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mattias33 Posted June 21, 2008 Share Posted June 21, 2008 Volunteer workers who is here to help us in tricky situations. Anywhere else in the world i bet foreigners living abroad would award these people. Offcourse on Thaivisa we go the other way and bash them the best we can instead. Patetic if you ask me. I´ve had only one experience with the T.P in Chaweng. An old friend of mine got a bit cheated on a rental contract for a house and we went down to the T.p and got all the best help we could possibly ask for. It really gave me the feeling that if i ever have problems again i will go there. It seemed like the Thai police-officers in the T.p office really listened to the foreign guys and the foreign guys really listened to us because we think the same way. At least i am very happy they are there. So, what are we bashing next, bars that give free food or people that help old ladies walk across the street? Get a life guys. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
peperobi Posted June 21, 2008 Share Posted June 21, 2008 I saw 3 of them from my shop tonight going to full moon party. Very hard faces, ugly uniform, escorting some VIP from BKK watching ravers.Why they don't go back home to enlist in the local police??? At least they can carry a real gun.... Please begin to realize that some of them try real to help the tourist on Samui. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sriracha john Posted June 21, 2008 Share Posted June 21, 2008 For lunch, I went to macdonalds, in chaweng, from bophut where I live... I don't go to chaweng really often so I'm sure this subject has been discussed many times here, but that's the first time I noticed it:On the way to chaweng road, we passed 5 or 6 tourist police officers... all faraangs !!! some had a black shirt saying "volunteer" in the back, some had a white shirt, and looked more like NSW cops (for those who know what i'm talking about)... What are they really ? Are they entitled to stop me while I'm speeding - I mean driving - my car ? 'cause they don't look like they'd let me get away with a coupla red bills... Anyway I was just wondering, because I was surprised to see a red haired faraang cop girl here... sorry if this subject has been discussed before. Hi, i'm a former tourist police volunteer. The volunteer are only translator in uniform, so don't worry even some of them have a behauvior like a sheriff. The most of them are people that geting boring because they have nothing to do. I would imagine being enabled to act as a "john" in a prostitution bust operation or being an undercover buyer of drugs in a narcotics operation or just strutting about in non-undercover police outfits is certainly not boring. Thank you. So, I'll ask the proverbial question yet again in one of these threads. Do the farang (or foreigner) police volunteers have the legally-required work permits or work permit exemption letters? We've established they don't in Pattaya and Chiang Mai. What about Samui? Yes/No the farang police volunteer have a WP if they are working some where, some of them do have a retirement visa but anymore nobody check it out. Thank you very much for your honesty. We'll add a tick for "Samui" on the No-Have Work Permit For Police Work list. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
peperobi Posted June 21, 2008 Share Posted June 21, 2008 Nice quote SJ--and so true.These discussions always go this route and always end up getting closed because people can't seem to help themselves and not start flaming each other. so itis fair to say that forang police are not wanted powers or no powers They have no power, the idea was to have some forigner translator then a lot of people (Italian, german, france, russia etc.) are not able to speak english. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
garro Posted June 21, 2008 Share Posted June 21, 2008 For lunch, I went to macdonalds, in chaweng, from bophut where I live... I don't go to chaweng really often so I'm sure this subject has been discussed many times here, but that's the first time I noticed it:On the way to chaweng road, we passed 5 or 6 tourist police officers... all faraangs !!! some had a black shirt saying "volunteer" in the back, some had a white shirt, and looked more like NSW cops (for those who know what i'm talking about)... What are they really ? Are they entitled to stop me while I'm speeding - I mean driving - my car ? 'cause they don't look like they'd let me get away with a coupla red bills... Anyway I was just wondering, because I was surprised to see a red haired faraang cop girl here... sorry if this subject has been discussed before. Hi, i'm a former tourist police volunteer. The volunteer are only translator in uniform, so don't worry even some of them have a behauvior like a sheriff. The most of them are people that geting boring because they have nothing to do. I would imagine being enabled to act as a "john" in a prostitution bust operation or being an undercover buyer of drugs in a narcotics operation or just strutting about in non-undercover police outfits is certainly not boring. Thank you. So, I'll ask the proverbial question yet again in one of these threads. Do the farang (or foreigner) police volunteers have the legally-required work permits or work permit exemption letters? We've established they don't in Pattaya and Chiang Mai. What about Samui? Yes/No the farang police volunteer have a WP if they are working some where, some of them do have a retirement visa but anymore nobody check it out. Thank you very much for your honesty. We'll add a tick for "Samui" on the No-Have Work Permit For Police Work list. Perhaps if they have a volunteer immigration police force you would like to join Sriracha John - that way you would have a reason to worry about people having or not having work permits. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sriracha john Posted June 21, 2008 Share Posted June 21, 2008 (edited) For lunch, I went to macdonalds, in chaweng, from bophut where I live... I don't go to chaweng really often so I'm sure this subject has been discussed many times here, but that's the first time I noticed it:On the way to chaweng road, we passed 5 or 6 tourist police officers... all faraangs !!! some had a black shirt saying "volunteer" in the back, some had a white shirt, and looked more like NSW cops (for those who know what i'm talking about)... What are they really ? Are they entitled to stop me while I'm speeding - I mean driving - my car ? 'cause they don't look like they'd let me get away with a coupla red bills... Anyway I was just wondering, because I was surprised to see a red haired faraang cop girl here... sorry if this subject has been discussed before. Hi, i'm a former tourist police volunteer. The volunteer are only translator in uniform, so don't worry even some of them have a behauvior like a sheriff. The most of them are people that geting boring because they have nothing to do. I would imagine being enabled to act as a "john" in a prostitution bust operation or being an undercover buyer of drugs in a narcotics operation or just strutting about in non-undercover police outfits is certainly not boring. Thank you. So, I'll ask the proverbial question yet again in one of these threads. Do the farang (or foreigner) police volunteers have the legally-required work permits or work permit exemption letters? We've established they don't in Pattaya and Chiang Mai. What about Samui? Yes/No the farang police volunteer have a WP if they are working some where, some of them do have a retirement visa but anymore nobody check it out. Thank you very much for your honesty. We'll add a tick for "Samui" on the No-Have Work Permit For Police Work list. Perhaps if they have a volunteer immigration police force you would like to join Sriracha John - that way you would have a reason to worry about people having or not having work permits. Actually that would be with the Labour Ministry as they control work permits, but no thanks, I'm not interested in being a cop on any level. My focus is to educate the masses of their requirements and laws as many police volunteers and many other volunteers throughout the numerous threads are completely unaware of them (as was I when I was volunteer teaching at a government school). As it is repeatedly overlooked in subsequent posts, I'll reiterate that it's not about bashing volunteerism. Do I "worry" about the police volunteers? No. I'm not doing it so I'm not the one facing fine, jail, deportation, and blacklisting... The penalty for working without a valid work permit in Thailand is basically the same as for overstay:Jail, fine, deportation and possibly blacklisted from entering the Kingdom again. Read this info: http://www.thaivisa.com/303.0.html I repeat, there are NO exceptions. All foreigners need a valid work permit. About 200 western foreigners per year are deported for illegal work. Edited June 21, 2008 by sriracha john Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gatorade Posted June 21, 2008 Share Posted June 21, 2008 For lunch, I went to macdonalds, in chaweng, from bophut where I live... I don't go to chaweng really often so I'm sure this subject has been discussed many times here, but that's the first time I noticed it:On the way to chaweng road, we passed 5 or 6 tourist police officers... all faraangs !!! some had a black shirt saying "volunteer" in the back, some had a white shirt, and looked more like NSW cops (for those who know what i'm talking about)... What are they really ? Are they entitled to stop me while I'm speeding - I mean driving - my car ? 'cause they don't look like they'd let me get away with a coupla red bills... Anyway I was just wondering, because I was surprised to see a red haired faraang cop girl here... sorry if this subject has been discussed before. Hi, i'm a former tourist police volunteer. The volunteer are only translator in uniform, so don't worry even some of them have a behauvior like a sheriff. The most of them are people that geting boring because they have nothing to do. I would imagine being enabled to act as a "john" in a prostitution bust operation or being an undercover buyer of drugs in a narcotics operation or just strutting about in non-undercover police outfits is certainly not boring. Thank you. So, I'll ask the proverbial question yet again in one of these threads. Do the farang (or foreigner) police volunteers have the legally-required work permits or work permit exemption letters? We've established they don't in Pattaya and Chiang Mai. What about Samui? Yes/No the farang police volunteer have a WP if they are working some where, some of them do have a retirement visa but anymore nobody check it out. Thank you very much for your honesty. We'll add a tick for "Samui" on the No-Have Work Permit For Police Work list. Perhaps if they have a volunteer immigration police force you would like to join Sriracha John - that way you would have a reason to worry about people having or not having work permits. Actually that would be with the Labour Ministry as they control work permits, but no thanks, I'm not interested in being a cop on any level. My focus is to educate the masses of their requirements and laws as many police volunteers and many other volunteers throughout the numerous threads are completely unaware of them (as was I when I was volunteer teaching at a government school). As it is repeatedly overlooked in subsequent posts, I'll reiterate that it's not about bashing volunteerism. Do I "worry" about the police volunteers? No. I'm not doing it so I'm not the one facing fine, jail, deportation, and blacklisting... The penalty for working without a valid work permit in Thailand is basically the same as for overstay:Jail, fine, deportation and possibly blacklisted from entering the Kingdom again. Read this info: http://www.thaivisa.com/303.0.html I repeat, there are NO exceptions. All foreigners need a valid work permit. About 200 western foreigners per year are deported for illegal work. "No exceptions" What about retired Farang (over 50) who are on a retirement visa. Do they need a W/P? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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