Land Of Corruption

[Pierrot]

I read a lot of negative about our BiB, but are they really that bad ?

I've NEVER been fined or arrested for an offence I didn't commit

I've SOMETIME been fined for an offence that I did commit

I've MANY TIME neither been fined or arrested for an offence that would normally deserves a fine (traffic violation).

Now I would like to hear of the experience of people who have been fined or arrested for an offence they didn't commit. The rules are the following :

- It should be you, not someone you know, or a story you've heard or read.

- If doesn't matter if other people weren't fined or arrested for a similar offence at the same time. As they say in the song, I you do the crime, you do the time.

Now let's hear some horror stories ….

[Beardog]

I can't say I have ever been able to buy my way out of a ticket to a pattaya cop yet, But if you make a contribution to the land office or electric company your que changes from 3 weeks - 2 months to 1-2 days. I would say a definite yes on upper government in Sattahib jurisdiction. Especially if you land is near a train when they do the survey on our land the train official made no bones about telling my girl it is customary to give him 1000 baht for lunch for doing his job. If that isn't blatant corruption I don't know what is!

[damo]

Once whilst standing outside Sanam Luang I flicked a ciggarette but into the gutter. The little brown maggot wasted no time, with poor English he gave me a 2 two fingered jesture, thats when the missus came back. She said the fine is 2000 baht but I did'nt see him writing up a ticket so I just pulled out 200 baht and bye bye maggot.

The sad side of corruption is much higher up, the people who fail to implement policies and procedures to eliminate lower level corruption, those guys are getting thier end too.

DAMO.

[koheesti]

Last week I took a taxi from BKK to Pattaya. Just outside of Pattaya we got pulled over. The taxi driver protested then slipped the cop 100 baht and we were off. I don't know whether the taxi driver broke the law or not but the cop sure gave in rather quickly.

[Pierrot]

I can't say I have ever been able to buy my way out of a ticket to a pattaya cop yet, But if you make a contribution to the land office or electric company your que changes from 3 weeks - 2 months to 1-2 days. I would say a definite yes on upper government in Sattahib jurisdiction. Especially if you land is near a train when they do the survey on our land the train official made no bones about telling my girl it is customary to give him 1000 baht for lunch for doing his job. If that isn't blatant corruption I don't know what is!

My question was more about being unjustly targeted by the police for just being a falang.

But you’re absolutely right, this is corruption.

[12DrinkMore]

Once whilst standing outside Sanam Luang I flicked a ciggarette but into the gutter.

You should have been fined the full 2,000 Baht. Litterbug.

[Who, me ?]

Once whilst standing outside Sanam Luang I flicked a ciggarette but into the gutter.

You should have been fined the full 2,000 Baht. Litterbug.

agreed !

[TopDogger]

Once whilst standing outside Sanam Luang I flicked a ciggarette but into the gutter.

You should have been fined the full 2,000 Baht. Litterbug.

agreed !

Yeah, you should have put it in one of the numerous litter bin's along there...

[way2muchcoffee]

Driving on the elevated expressway coming into town near Bang Na I was pulled at the final toll booth. An officer was standing there. He looked at my new vehicle and started to walk away. Then he looked through the windshield right into my eyes, saw that I was a Westerner, turned around and walked to my window. He stated that I had been speeding. This wasn't true as I had intentionally been driving at the proper speed of 80 kph. It was either 500 bt or a trip to the station.

This was not an isolated incident. I've been pulled 5 times. Only one of those times was I actually guilty of anything. One of those times was a random check upcountry and we drove away without having to pay anything. The other four times I was made to pay 500 bt each time. So the stats for me are: 2 honest cops versus 3 lying and thieving cops.

Edited August 26, 2008 by way2muchcoffee

[PhilHarries]

A colleague and I were driving through Chonburi when we were pulled over by a cop on a motorbike for jumping a red light. Well we never saw any red traffic lights, in fact the only red light we passed was in the massage parlour window. We offered him the standard 200 Baht and he jumped back like a scalded cat, "No, no" he said "you go Chonburi police station". We feigned ignorance of the location of the police station so he told us to follow him and he led us round the corner to the police box. Once we got inside he was all smiles and said "You buy drink for my friend and me?" so we once again profferred the "donation" which was snapped up so quick we never saw the going of it.

[barky]

A plain answer to your question is yes. From top to bottom and back again. But, not all individuals are corrupt to be sure.

[tw25rw]

Once whilst standing outside Sanam Luang I flicked a ciggarette but into the gutter.

You should have been fined the full 2,000 Baht. Litterbug.

Too right. fuc_king filthy. I wish the police in the UK would do the same thing to people who do that like it's nothing.

[Soutpeel]

Captialism at its best..they want something..you dont the hassle...everybody walks away happy...

[Beardog]

I can't say I have ever been able to buy my way out of a ticket to a pattaya cop yet, But if you make a contribution to the land office or electric company your que changes from 3 weeks - 2 months to 1-2 days. I would say a definite yes on upper government in Sattahib jurisdiction. Especially if you land is near a train when they do the survey on our land the train official made no bones about telling my girl it is customary to give him 1000 baht for lunch for doing his job. If that isn't blatant corruption I don't know what is!

My question was more about being unjustly targeted by the police for just being a falang.

But you’re absolutely right, this is corruption.

Not at all the Thai people get jerked around by the land office electric & I am sure the dork with the train dept. The minute the Thai gal we bought the land from slipped the jokers 1000 baht (after getting fed up with waiting while there were only 2 other people in the office), we were qued within 10 minutes & completed the transaction within 20 minutes, Kind of like no tiki no laundry except no grease you wait. When it comes to the corruption thing- I believe they are an equal opportunity taker for all.

Even if you don't pay they take extra money from you in the form of a land reappraisal. Our land seemed to be re-evaluated by 130,000 a rai - Just enough land tax (I paid 1/2) to buy 2 new Honda waves. I can't say much is different in the U.S. though.

My boss could get an approval on plans almost immediately with $20,000 for the years vacation fund to the planning commision.Tough to bribe a cop in the U.S. I tried once & he advised me that this was a major crime & I could do time for saying it & I was quick to rephrase that I was in a hurry -could you pay the ticket for me. last time I tried that.

The most they would do here is say no & make you pay the fine.

[onnut]

Once whilst standing outside Sanam Luang I flicked a ciggarette but into the gutter.

You should have been fined the full 2,000 Baht. Litterbug.

Too right. fuc_king filthy. I wish the police in the UK would do the same thing to people who do that like it's nothing.

yeah right, do you think the english cops would just pick on the foreigners? because the Thais do throw there litter everywhere and I never see them get nabbed.

[damo]

Yeah I guess the reason BKK is so filthy is because of all those naughty naughty Farang flauting the lazy bib.

Ask a Thai woman if she has ever heard of police raping attractive young women and being apprehended, make sure you gauge her response.

Damo.

[Pierrot]

Ask a Thai woman if she has ever heard of police raping attractive young women and being apprehended, make sure you gauge her response.

Actually that is my point. "heard", yes a lot of people tell of stories they have "heard", but how many can speak of real, personnal experiences ? Not that many.

I also would like to add that since police check points have increased on major roads, I see less and less of these crazy pick-ups flashing their lights at less than 10m from my bumper when we're already driving at more than 120 on a road limited a 80. Paying a few hundred bahts from time to time is cheap price to pay for safer roads.

Edited August 27, 2008 by Pierrot

[torrenova]

If you drive 120 on a 90 then your fine is a speeding tax. Fair enough really. If some tosser or maggot (like that word) pulls you up only because you are western at a toll booth then give the bugger fuc_k all. You cannot have been speeding, he can't prove it and will likely just bugger off after you protest.

remember, all the time he is dealing with you he is not making money from other people.

Edited August 27, 2008 by torrenova

[roygsd]

And I hope in reply you explained it was customary if not mandatory for rarangs to report demands for money to his employers?

roy gsd

[Pierrot]

If you drive 120 on a 90 then your fine is a speeding tax. Fair enough really. If some tosser or maggot (like that word) pulls you up only because you are western at a toll booth then give the bugger fuc_k all. You cannot have been speeding, he can't prove it and will likely just bugger off after you protest.

remember, all the time he is dealing with you he is not making money from other people.

I wouldn't put it exactly in these terms but it's true that the amount of fine (if any) you will pay depends very much of your attitude when you open the window.

[Maigo6]

Corruption is accepted by Farangs when they benefit.

Corruption is frowned upon by Farangs when they don't benefit.

[PhilHarries]

Ask a Thai woman if she has ever heard of police raping attractive young women and being apprehended, make sure you gauge her response.

Actually that is my point. "heard", yes a lot of people tell of stories they have "heard", but how many can speak of real, personnal experiences ? Not that many.

I also would like to add that since police check points have increased on major roads, I see less and less of these crazy pick-ups flashing their lights at less than 10m from my bumper when we're already driving at more than 120 on a road limited a 80. Paying a few hundred bahts from time to time is cheap price to pay for safer roads.

Not sure what you mean by that. The bungs, as you know, go straight into the BiB's Secret Policeman's Ball fund thus do nothing for road safety. Official fines go where? Does anybody know? Maybe the BiB's Other Ball fund. Personally I doubt if the money finds it's way into the public purse, well I'd stake a month's money that a large proportion at least evaporates into "administrative charges".

[Pierrot]

Ask a Thai woman if she has ever heard of police raping attractive young women and being apprehended, make sure you gauge her response.

Actually that is my point. "heard", yes a lot of people tell of stories they have "heard", but how many can speak of real, personnal experiences ? Not that many.

I also would like to add that since police check points have increased on major roads, I see less and less of these crazy pick-ups flashing their lights at less than 10m from my bumper when we're already driving at more than 120 on a road limited a 80. Paying a few hundred bahts from time to time is cheap price to pay for safer roads.

Not sure what you mean by that. The bungs, as you know, go straight into the BiB's Secret Policeman's Ball fund thus do nothing for road safety. Official fines go where? Does anybody know? Maybe the BiB's Other Ball fund. Personally I doubt if the money finds it's way into the public purse, well I'd stake a month's money that a large proportion at least evaporates into "administrative charges".

What I mean is since they increase the number of police check, peopler drive slower. It means an increase of the number of time you may be stopped and fined, but on the overall, as it makes road safer, I'm ok with it.

I also noticed that when people see a pick up driving at the legal speed limit, they always think this guy should know something I don't, and everybody slow down until the next police check, or until they realize the guy is jsut looking for his way ...

[issanpaul]

I Realy do get Annoyed by some of the comments regarding Royal Thai police,Yes there is good and bad everywhere in the world,I for one know there not all corrupt beleive me,this is my second Thai Family now and yes there all Police but for sure are not bent/corrupt , yes there can waiver favours as an example we were driving to Buriram 2 weeks ago and i was initial driver but we needed gas at Khon Khen,Wife decided she would carry on driving as opposed to me , (thank you god) Police checkpoint later down road and we were stopped,Yes quite right for neither wearing seatbelts,there demand 400 baht (inside police checkpoint station official) Wife make telephone call to family (all Police) fine waivered , so yes this is a little corrupttion i suppoes but only scratch each others back within any Police Force i think

[pnustedt]

Two weeks ago I was stopped in a road block and told that I had been speeding and should pay Bt 200. I was doing 85kph in a 90 limit. The policeman was obviously surprised when I wound the window down so it was nothing to do with being a Foreigner. I replied with my speed and told him that I was entitled to drive on this road in the manner I was and that he had no justification to delay me and should allow me to proceed without further hindrance. He then went to get his boss, I got my camera out and starting photographing the scene.

I told the boss that I was not speeding, he then said that I was driving dangerously and in an erratic manner. My wife was with me and he asked her why I was taking photographs - she replied that I was a western journalist. He then said I could proceed but "take more care" to which I replied that his officer needs to go to an optician - and all ended with giggles.

[wolf5370]

I actually don't mind the police tea-fine really (for minor traffic offences). I think, as someone inferred, in some ways it works. Yeah, the cop get the money, but I rather have that than the govt putting speed cameras everywhere and banning you after four tickets (and needlessly reducing the speed to make sure more people get caught) - as in the UK. This p!sses me off - paying into the coffers of the local Govt just for them to blow on stupid things. BiB get very low wages and often have to buy their own kit too. So, the Govt saves money (fines work like tips), courts are freed up for more serious crimes and we get a small wrist smack (what's 500 baht anyway - compare that to the fines in the west and points on your license too - causing insurance hikes etc and if enough points loss of driving privileges and perhaps even your job).

I do think BiB get away with committing crimes - which I think is very bad - but same the whole world over pretty much (cops look out for cops). They also are 'allowed' to have sideline businesses that is counterproductive to their jobs (owning bars etc). I think this should be clamped down on as it leads to more serious corruption - like getting rid of the competition and allowing their own businesses to flout the law.

Personally, I don't drive in Thailand at all. My father-in-law was a naval officer and he has a sticker in this window that advertises the fact (military insignia used as a pass into navy bases/navy parking/whatever). Anyway, the cops never pull us over - the sometimes start to, but when they spot the sticker, we always get waved on by. The cops are careful who they take on.

I also know a police major that leaves his hat (with scrambled egg all over - AKA gold braid) on his parcel shelf. He can then park anywhere he wants because no cop has the guts to ticket it!

By the way, only tea-money I have given to the BiBs was to get me nephew-in-law released for not wearing a crash helmet - he got as far as being arrested and charged, so wasn't cheap - the fact a Farang had anything to do with the 'persuader' was hidden to keep the price down, but his was released with just a warning - twice! (this also p!sses me off as I bought him a really good crash helmet - which he promptly sold) - I told him if it happens again he's on his own, and it hasn't happened since - though he is married with a kid now, so has probably grown out of it (of more likely can't afford the bike anymore)

Edited August 27, 2008 by wolf5370

[Maigo6]

Let's put it this way, would you rather give a Cop 200 Baht and drive away, or would you prefer to go to court for speeding, lose your license or Points added, expensive insurance .............etc etc ?

I think the answer is , pay the 200, I also believe that every man here that has ever been nicked for a driving offence in the western world wishes that he could do the same back home.

As the Police are well paid back home, there is no need for them to take such punitive ammounts, that's the only reason corruption isn't rampant throughout the ranks in UK for example.......

Yet when there is corruption, it's for major money, not for the price of a beer and a pack of smokes like it is in Thailand and other developing countries.

[Travel2003]

I find this topic almost Trolling/Flaming.

All users here know this country suffers due to the corruption here, like many other nations in the region.

No doubt.

We all know this.

But to start a thread where the main purpose is to find only negative things about a certain country???

Not even included the possibility to come up with good stuff?

Mods, are we not going a bit too far now?

[Heng]

There is indeed corruption all around. I am somewhat disappointed though that I'm not getting my share.

[Pierrot]

I find this topic almost Trolling/Flaming.

All users here know this country suffers due to the corruption here, like many other nations in the region.

No doubt.

We all know this.

But to start a thread where the main purpose is to find only negative things about a certain country???

Not even included the possibility to come up with good stuff?

Mods, are we not going a bit too far now?

Interesting Post.

What I've said:

I've NEVER been fined or arrested for an offence I didn't commit

I agree with police checks as they make roads safer because they force people to drive slower

There are many stories (myths) about corruption but there are not than many REAL stories.

And my point is that corruption is real but usually largely exaggerated and doesn't specifically target falangs.

Furthermore, the posts of this thread are so far very moderates by this forum standard.

Now if I say what I think of your post, you would understand what flaming is.

But if you want to come up with some "good stuff", you're most welcome !