Marrying My (thai) Gf In The Us

[iyah]

Hi,

I'm a US citizen. My GF and I plan on going to the US to visit in a few months for a couple weeks. We will try to get her a tourist visa of some kind. Would it be possible to marry her while we're overthere eventhough she is not a US citizen. Also, we plan on going back to live there (in the US) a couple years from now. From my understanding, we would have to try to get her a 'fiancee' visa at that point, meaning that we would have to get married within 3 months of our arrival in the country. So if indeed it is possible to marry her while on our 2 weeks visit, would it make it any easier (or not) for us to get her a long term visa (and eventually citizenship) 2 years down the line when we decide to go settle there. Hope this is clear.

Thanks in advance for your help

[Mario2008]

The rules probably depends on the state where you plan to marry. Better check the website of the state where you plan to marry, to see which documents your girlfriend needs to show in the US. Don't forget to have them notorized by the US-embassy in BKK.

[maccaroni man]

The rules probably depends on the state where you plan to marry. Better check the website of the state where you plan to marry, to see which documents your girlfriend needs to show in the US. Don't forget to have them notorized by the US-embassy in BKK.

spot on, each state has it's own laws. nevada is an easy place to get married to anyone

[iyah]

Thanks. I'm a California resident.

[TheSoiLawyer]

Hi,

I saw you were looking to bring a Thai gf into the USA for the purposes of marriage. First, its likely that she will be turned down for a tourist visa because the b1/b2 visas are highly subjective and have a rejection rate around 95%. Should you get lucky and obtain the tourist visa and get her to the states and marry soon thereafter it is possible that USCIS (immigration) could view this set of events as an attempt to defraud the immigration department. I'm not saying it will happen I'm just saying it might and I wouldn't want to take that kind of risk. The best bet for taking someone you intend to marry to the us is the k1 fiancee visa. The K1 visa was specifically designed for this purpose and is probably your best bet all around. You are probably saying who am I to be saying this, I am a licensed US Attorney and Member of the American Immigration Lawyers Association. I've had a bit of experience dealing with this stuff. I wrote a bit about the problems with the tourist visa here:

http://www.thai-visas.com/node/8

Hope this helped,

Best

The Soi Lawyer

[Thanyaburi Mac]

Hi,

I saw you were looking to bring a Thai gf into the USA for the purposes of marriage. First, its likely that she will be turned down for a tourist visa because the b1/b2 visas are highly subjective and have a rejection rate around 95%. Should you get lucky and obtain the tourist visa and get her to the states and marry soon thereafter it is possible that USCIS (immigration) could view this set of events as an attempt to defraud the immigration department. I'm not saying it will happen I'm just saying it might and I wouldn't want to take that kind of risk. The best bet for taking someone you intend to marry to the us is the k1 fiancee visa. The K1 visa was specifically designed for this purpose and is probably your best bet all around. You are probably saying who am I to be saying this, I am a licensed US Attorney and Member of the American Immigration Lawyers Association. I've had a bit of experience dealing with this stuff. I wrote a bit about the problems with the tourist visa here:

http://www.thai-visas.com/node/8

Hope this helped,

Best

The Soi Lawyer

Wow, a whopin' 95%!! ?? Where'd you get that statistic? I thought the APPROVAL rate was more on the order of 80%-90%.

I'll have to do some checking on this and report back.

Mac

[iyah]

Thanks Soi Lawyer. A 95% rejection rate!! My gf has a steady job (and would get a letter from her employer), but that's about it. If your figures are correct, sounds like i would have to go for a fiancee visa, but i didn't intend to marry and spend more than a couple weeks in the States for this trip..maybe i'm gonna have to change my plans then. Now i just have to hope that my gf will be given a fiancee visa.

[pumpuiman]

Thanks Soi Lawyer. A 95% rejection rate!! My gf has a steady job (and would get a letter from her employer), but that's about it. If your figures are correct, sounds like i would have to go for a fiancee visa, but i didn't intend to marry and spend more than a couple weeks in the States for this trip..maybe i'm gonna have to change my plans then. Now i just have to hope that my gf will be given a fiancee visa.

There is lots of information on this site about obtaining a fiance visa, have a look around. It is a lot of work....prepare yourself to start tearing your hair out.

Start now by saving every scrap of information supporting your relationship..phone bills..e-mails..letters..etc.

Take lots of photo's of yourselves together..print location and date on the back of each photo.

The USCIS website has all the info and links to forms....and a phone "help line" which comes in handy.

It can be done....I did it....but takes many months and mountains of paperwork to accomplish.

Good luck

[iyah]

Ya, i'm looking into it right now. We've been together for over 3 years now and have lots of pics and what not to prove it. But ya, the whole process seems tedious and time consuming.

I think we're still gonna try to get her a tourist visa first and if we fail, we'll go for the fiancee visa.

Did you say that in order to get HER a tourist visa I also had to prove that I have good reasons for coming back to the country (Thailand)? Where did I get into the picture? I don't quiet get this (and see no mention of it on the Embassy website). Thanks for your help.

[Martian]

Ya, i'm looking into it right now. We've been together for over 3 years now and have lots of pics and what not to prove it. But ya, the whole process seems tedious and time consuming.

I think we're still gonna try to get her a tourist visa first and if we fail, we'll go for the fiancee visa.

Did you say that in order to get HER a tourist visa I also had to prove that I have good reasons for coming back to the country (Thailand)? Where did I get into the picture? I don't quiet get this (and see no mention of it on the Embassy website). Thanks for your help.

In order for any Thai, especially a poo-ying, to get a tourist visa you must show an overwhelming reason that the petitioner will return. Unfair as it might seem, as usual, those who have abused the privilege before have made it more difficult for those who try to follow.

If you do get your girl a tourist visa, DO NOT GET MARRIED while in the USA. As the lawyer mentioned, and I will be stronger, they will look at it as an attempt to circumvent the immigration laws and most likely will negatively affect any future attempts to bring her here permanently.

Take the time to get the K-1 when the time is right. You don't want to do this until you two are ready to settle in the USA because there are further residency requirements to procure and maintain a permanent resident card (green card). Cannot be out of the USA for more than 6 months in one year (can file an I-131 or something for up to 2 year absence) and immigration is getting tough on people who, although are legal with their green cards, are out of the country too much appearing not to intend to reside in the USA.

I know this stuff as I have almost completed the gamut. My wife takes her oath of citizenship in 3 weeks, then on to passport and we have finished! But I can tell you, immigration is very nasty and on the lookout for those trying to marry or work on a tourist visa and it is better to be patient and do the right thing at the right time.

Marry her in Thailand with all the ceremony and parties that go along with it BUT DON"T register the marriage with the Thai government and she will still be considered your Fiancee in the eyes of the USA immigration laws. If you do register the marriage, you will have to apply for a 10 year non-imm visa or marriage visa which is immigration type and historically can take twice as long as the K-1. That's why people are choosing the K-1. It also gives you a 3 month window to see if your sweetie really can live in the USA. One never knows and it is much easier to send a girlfriend back than to have to get a divorce etc.

Good luck! The system does work, but as you said, can be tedious and does take a lot of effort. I am amazed that my wife and I are finally where we are!

Regards,

Martian

Edited September 4, 2008 by Martian

[iyah]

Thanks Martian for taking the time to answer my questions. So basically, it is not possible for her to visit the States in order to decide if she likes it enough to settle there a couple years from now? And once we decide to go for the fiancee visa, its gonna be months before she is allowed to leave the country (the US) once in. Right?

[thaihome]

If you are living in Thailand and have strong ties, i.e. work permit, visa extension, letter from employer saying you have a long term job, then there is a very good chance your GF can get a tourist visa by showing her ties to you.

The soilawyer guy may be a licensed US Attorney and Member of the American Immigration Lawyers Association, but he doesn’t appear to know much about tourist visas.

If you are living in Thailand and have strong ties, i.e. work permit, visa extension, letter from employer saying you have a long term job, then there is a very good chance your GF can get a tourist visa by showing her ties to you.

The soilawyer guy may be a licensed US Attorney and Member of the American Immigration Lawyers Association, but he doesn’t appear to know much about tourist visas.

Go for the tourist visa. Do not get married in the US. Once you come back to Thailand, you can get married and when you decide to move to the US, you can file the I-130 spouse petition in Bangkok and it will be approved in about 3-4 months. If you have been married for over 2 years at that point, her green card will not have any conditions on it.

TH

[pumpuiman]

Thanks Martian for taking the time to answer my questions. So basically, it is not possible for her to visit the States in order to decide if she likes it enough to settle there a couple years from now? And once we decide to go for the fiancee visa, its gonna be months before she is allowed to leave the country (the US) once in. Right?

She can leave the U.S. anytime she wants. The fiance visa is good for 90 days....if she is OK with the states, you can marry her within the 90 day period. If she decides she doesn't like the U.S. she can leave anytime during that 90 day period.

Once married, you then go about getting her conditional residence. Leaving the U.S. soon after marriage could hurt your chances for residence status,and could result in her being denied re-entry and having to start the whole process over again. You can apply for permission to leave (advance parole)....but it does not guarantee that she will be allowed re-entry to the U.S.......Even if the permission is granted (no kidding, we looked in to it and decided the risk was too great)

So your looking at spending some serious time in the U.S. after marriage, if you want to avoid problems.

Starting to pull your hair out yet?

[SoCal]

Thaihome gives some good advice. I think most are ignoring your specific situation.

Doing a K1 would be a waste of money and time, as all you are really trying to acheive is a tourist visa, and returning to Thailand after the visit.

I don't really agree that it would be bad to marry in the US. Foreigners do it all the time. As long as you leave as scheduled, and don't attempt to stay in the US, there is no reason for the USCIS to hold this against you in the future. It's not like its hard to overstay once you are in, and circumvent the system if that is what you want to do. I think the bearing is not on where you marry, but rather if you keep the terms of your entry visa.

It is true that tourist visas are not easy, and not sure how they will regard her as your girlfriend. When I got my wife's visa I documented heavily on my return, as she had very little proof to show.

End of the day K1 or K3 may be the only way to go, but would definitely go the tourist route first.

Once you are married, and want to return to live in the US, go the I-130 route with Homeland Security. It is much quicker.

Good Luck

[TheSoiLawyer]

If you are living in Thailand and have strong ties, i.e. work permit, visa extension, letter from employer saying you have a long term job, then there is a very good chance your GF can get a tourist visa by showing her ties to you.

The soilawyer guy may be a licensed US Attorney and Member of the American Immigration Lawyers Association, but he doesn't appear to know much about tourist visas.

If you are living in Thailand and have strong ties, i.e. work permit, visa extension, letter from employer saying you have a long term job, then there is a very good chance your GF can get a tourist visa by showing her ties to you.

The soilawyer guy may be a licensed US Attorney and Member of the American Immigration Lawyers Association, but he doesn't appear to know much about tourist visas.

Go for the tourist visa. Do not get married in the US. Once you come back to Thailand, you can get married and when you decide to move to the US, you can file the I-130 spouse petition in Bangkok and it will be approved in about 3-4 months. If you have been married for over 2 years at that point, her green card will not have any conditions on it.

TH

I know enough about tourist visas to know one thing: the tourist visa at the end of the day is SUBJECTIVE, you can show up with all of the documentation in the world and you could, i stress could, be denied for very capricious reasons. I'm not saying don't try for it, but I got the impression from the original posting here that he was interested in marrying her in the states and I wanted to explain the difference between the B1/B2 (tourist/business) and the K1 (Fiancee). If your intention is to get married the tourist visa is not the way to go. I apologize if mentioning my credentials offended anyone as that was not my intention.

As far as advance parole I wrote a bit about this issue here:

http://www.thai-visas.com/node/11

Hope this sheds some light on the issue.

TSL

[Thanyaburi Mac]

If you are living in Thailand and have strong ties, i.e. work permit, visa extension, letter from employer saying you have a long term job, then there is a very good chance your GF can get a tourist visa by showing her ties to you.

The soilawyer guy may be a licensed US Attorney and Member of the American Immigration Lawyers Association, but he doesn't appear to know much about tourist visas.

If you are living in Thailand and have strong ties, i.e. work permit, visa extension, letter from employer saying you have a long term job, then there is a very good chance your GF can get a tourist visa by showing her ties to you.

The soilawyer guy may be a licensed US Attorney and Member of the American Immigration Lawyers Association, but he doesn't appear to know much about tourist visas.

Go for the tourist visa. Do not get married in the US. Once you come back to Thailand, you can get married and when you decide to move to the US, you can file the I-130 spouse petition in Bangkok and it will be approved in about 3-4 months. If you have been married for over 2 years at that point, her green card will not have any conditions on it.

TH

I know enough about tourist visas to know one thing: the tourist visa at the end of the day is SUBJECTIVE, you can show up with all of the documentation in the world and you could, i stress could, be denied for very capricious reasons. I'm not saying don't try for it, but I got the impression from the original posting here that he was interested in marrying her in the states and I wanted to explain the difference between the B1/B2 (tourist/business) and the K1 (Fiancee). If your intention is to get married the tourist visa is not the way to go. I apologize if mentioning my credentials offended anyone as that was not my intention.

As far as advance parole I wrote a bit about this issue here:

http://www.thai-visas.com/node/11

Hope this sheds some light on the issue.

TSL

Regarding marriage in the U.S. while Thai girlfriend is there on a tourist, B1/B2, visa, not really a problem I think.

1999 she and I were in the U.S. and got married there. At the time she had a 10-year multiple entry visa, and no intention to live in the U.S. Me, I'm retired here in the LoS.

2006 time for her to get a new tourist visa. Main Qs at the interview related to my status in Thailand and her intent NOT to attempt to remain in the U.S. and apply for Adjustment of Status to PRA, or Green Card holder. Not illegal, mind you, but not very popular with CIS or the Consulate that issued the tourist visa. She got a new 10-year visa.

NOTE: It is improper (don't want to say "illegal") for a Consular officer to issue a tourist visa to an "intended immigrant," thus all the Qs to satisfy themselves that the applicant does indeed intend to return to the LoS, or where ever.

Mac

[maccaroni man]

Ya, i'm looking into it right now. We've been together for over 3 years now and have lots of pics and what not to prove it. But ya, the whole process seems tedious and time consuming.

I think we're still gonna try to get her a tourist visa first and if we fail, we'll go for the fiancee visa.

Did you say that in order to get HER a tourist visa I also had to prove that I have good reasons for coming back to the country (Thailand)? Where did I get into the picture? I don't quiet get this (and see no mention of it on the Embassy website). Thanks for your help.

If you do get your girl a tourist visa, DO NOT GET MARRIED while in the USA. As the lawyer mentioned, and I will be stronger, they will look at it as an attempt to circumvent the immigration laws and most likely will negatively affect any future attempts to bring her here permanently.

Regards,

Martian

I don't know how my TGF got her visa but when it was issued it was for 10yrs. We had been together for 3 yrs and were married in the states. Immigration has never had an issue with this.

[Martian]

Ya, i'm looking into it right now. We've been together for over 3 years now and have lots of pics and what not to prove it. But ya, the whole process seems tedious and time consuming.

I think we're still gonna try to get her a tourist visa first and if we fail, we'll go for the fiancee visa.

Did you say that in order to get HER a tourist visa I also had to prove that I have good reasons for coming back to the country (Thailand)? Where did I get into the picture? I don't quiet get this (and see no mention of it on the Embassy website). Thanks for your help.

If you do get your girl a tourist visa, DO NOT GET MARRIED while in the USA. As the lawyer mentioned, and I will be stronger, they will look at it as an attempt to circumvent the immigration laws and most likely will negatively affect any future attempts to bring her here permanently.

Regards,

Martian

I don't know how my TGF got her visa but when it was issued it was for 10yrs. We had been together for 3 yrs and were married in the states. Immigration has never had an issue with this.

There's two points here. Just as SoiLawyer has explained, immigration doesn't take it lightly when someone gets married while on a tourist visa UNLESS it can proved without a doubt that the two parties met during the visit and had no prior relationship..this is generally speaking. I'm sure the exception is that someone finds a smooth trip going this route, but most don't. That point was targeted more towards those people who use tourist visa to get married AND stay (my bad) although marrying on a tourist visa, even though returning in the time permitted, is still frowned upon (possible permanent consequences). I wouldn't take the chance.

Secondly, it historically takes longer to get a "marriage visa", whatever designation that is than to get the K-1. So better not to marry in the USA if future visa time frame is important. #2a: the K-1 really does give one or the couple time to see if it is going to work. The K-1 visa really shouldn't be pursued unless you are trying to settle for some time in the USA (as I said in my first post for someone who missed that). As someone else said, in your situation, it could be a waste of time and money BUT might get her entry if that is your short term goal. I have no experience with or have ever heard any talk on this board about: What if we don't get married on the K-1 visa, return within the permitted time and then try the same visa a year or so later? That would be an interesting thread to hear anyone's experience with something like that.

Someone else made a very valid point about her getting her a tourist visa if you can show a compelling reason that YOU have to return. This is exactly what happened to me and my wife in 2001. We wanted to do what you are wanting to do (make short trip to USA for Thanksgiving and marry) so I filed a K-1 and the embassy staff figured out it wouldn't work because we weren't staying in the USA after the marriage and instead determined I had a strong reason to return (job assignment) and in the end issued my girl a tourist visa. The K-1 was kept on file, unbelievably, for 3 years at the embassy and all I had to do was every few months send an email requesting to keep the case open and in the end provide updated paperwork and it was issued when the time was right for us. My wife will be a citizen in less than 2 weeks.

It is a tedious but doable trip but doing it right is the way to go even if you suffer disappointment in the beginning. Keep focus on the long range goal and go step by step. Patience! There are many good posters here that occasionally disagree on interpretations and have different experiences, but everyone has good intentions, and tries to provide accurate answers even if it isn't what one is hoping to hear.

Good luck with your pursuit!

Regards,

Martian

Edited September 6, 2008 by Martian

[dingdongrb]

My personal experience:

I met my Thai wife (GF at the time) in 2000. It was decided in 2004 we would pursue getting her to the USA on a K1 (Fiancé) visa. Don’t let folks scare you about the process unless you are the type of person that could not do a US tax return (long form) as it is probably equivalent of doing 5 of these. Yes, it depends on the wait times at the USCIS Service Center you apply at how long the process may take. At that time, once we submitted all the paperwork it took about 8 months for my wife’s interview at the US Embassy in BKK. If you get that far I highly suggest going to that interview with her as it makes a big difference in their judgment whether to grant her the visa or not. The day that we went there were about 12 girls doing the interview process and only 3 were granted the visa.

Once my wife got the visa she went to the USA with me and we got married one month later in Las Vegas. It’s a very easy process as hundreds of people are married in Clark County every day. It’s such a big business there are touts outside the courthouse where marriage licenses are provided trying to get you to sign up for your wedding at their chapel.

After we got married I submitted the I-485 application seeking Permanent Residence. After this was received and processed, we went through another interview at the local USCIS office (Denver) my wife was granted PR but with conditions for 2 years. While living in Colorado for two years my wife obtained a social security card and worked a part time job to meet new friends and have something to do while I was at work every day.

Before the conditions of PR were removed we moved to Thailand. My job brought me here. After we got here to Thailand and the time came we filed I-751 to remove the conditions on PR. I wrote a very lengthy letter to USCIS regarding my situation living as an expat in Thailand but still wanting to remove the conditions from the PR so that when we move back to the USA my wife could go back in without going through a visa process again. I just spoke to a USCIS officer on the phone last month, there is no problem doing what I (or my wife) have done as far as leaving the USA. That officer said that my petition to remove conditions will stay open (although they will not further process it until we move back to the USA), my wife can get back into the USA using the ‘receipt’ provided by the USCIS for the PR removal, and her expired PR card. The officer said that I could also make an appointment with the State Dept at the US Embassy in BKK and see if perhaps they would process the I-751 in BKK. The officer says that it entirely up to them if they would or not. If not then my wife would have to wait until returning to the USA for the process to continue. But in summary our application is still open assured by the officer I spoke with on the phone and she had stated to me that it could possibly remain open for years to come. I would get notification if they do decide that they wish to close it. If that happens then I would probably have to take the route of obtaining a visa to take a spouse to the USA.

Sorry for the long story but now you have TRUE info firsthand of my experience…. No BS & no rumors.

One other note: While living in LOS if you want to get a 1 year visa extension based on being married to a Thai, it is much easier to get this if you marry the Thai in the USA rather than here in LOS.

[Thanyaburi Mac]

My personal experience:

I met my Thai wife (GF at the time) in 2000. It was decided in 2004 we would pursue getting her to the USA on a K1 (Fiancé) visa. Don’t let folks scare you about the process unless you are the type of person that could not do a US tax return (long form) as it is probably equivalent of doing 5 of these. Yes, it depends on the wait times at the USCIS Service Center you apply at how long the process may take. At that time, once we submitted all the paperwork it took about 8 months for my wife’s interview at the US Embassy in BKK. If you get that far I highly suggest going to that interview with her as it makes a big difference in their judgment whether to grant her the visa or not. The day that we went there were about 12 girls doing the interview process and only 3 were granted the visa.

Once my wife got the visa she went to the USA with me and we got married one month later in Las Vegas. It’s a very easy process as hundreds of people are married in Clark County every day. It’s such a big business there are touts outside the courthouse where marriage licenses are provided trying to get you to sign up for your wedding at their chapel.

After we got married I submitted the I-485 application seeking Permanent Residence. After this was received and processed, we went through another interview at the local USCIS office (Denver) my wife was granted PR but with conditions for 2 years. While living in Colorado for two years my wife obtained a social security card and worked a part time job to meet new friends and have something to do while I was at work every day.

Before the conditions of PR were removed we moved to Thailand. My job brought me here. After we got here to Thailand and the time came we filed I-751 to remove the conditions on PR. I wrote a very lengthy letter to USCIS regarding my situation living as an expat in Thailand but still wanting to remove the conditions from the PR so that when we move back to the USA my wife could go back in without going through a visa process again. I just spoke to a USCIS officer on the phone last month, there is no problem doing what I (or my wife) have done as far as leaving the USA. That officer said that my petition to remove conditions will stay open (although they will not further process it until we move back to the USA), my wife can get back into the USA using the ‘receipt’ provided by the USCIS for the PR removal, and her expired PR card. The officer said that I could also make an appointment with the State Dept at the US Embassy in BKK and see if perhaps they would process the I-751 in BKK. The officer says that it entirely up to them if they would or not. If not then my wife would have to wait until returning to the USA for the process to continue. But in summary our application is still open assured by the officer I spoke with on the phone and she had stated to me that it could possibly remain open for years to come. I would get notification if they do decide that they wish to close it. If that happens then I would probably have to take the route of obtaining a visa to take a spouse to the USA.

Sorry for the long story but now you have TRUE info firsthand of my experience…. No BS & no rumors.

One other note: While living in LOS if you want to get a 1 year visa extension based on being married to a Thai, it is much easier to get this if you marry the Thai in the USA rather than here in LOS.

Hmmm, pondering. If your wife's Green Card, PRA status, has expired and she doesn't have a Re-entry permit for the U.S. seems to me she'd have to apply for an SB-1 RETURNING RESIDENT VISA, as described below.

Mac

http://travel.state.gov/visa/immigrants/info/info_1333.html

Returning Resident Alien

A permanent resident alien returning to the United States from a visit abroad of less than a year may apply for readmission by presenting an Alien Registration Receipt Card ("green card") to the immigration authorities at a port of entry. The one-year time limitation does not apply to the spouse or child of a member of the Armed Forces of the United States, or of a civilian employee of the U.S. Government stationed abroad pursuant to official orders. In this case, the spouse or child must present the card mentioned above, not have relinquished residence, and be preceding or accompanying the member or employee, or be following to join the member or employee in the United States within four months of the return of the member or employee.

A permanent resident alien who intends to remain abroad for more than a year should, at least 30 days prior to the proposed date of departure, apply while in the United States to the U.S. Citizenship and Immigration Services (USCIS) in the Department of Homeland Security for Reentry Permit. The permit is valid for two years and may not be extended. If such a permit is obtained the alien may use this card to reenter the United States within the period of validity. Every alien applying for readmission must satisfy the immigration authorities that he or she is eligible in all respects for admission.

A Reentry Permit does not preserve residence for naturalization purposes. An application for preservation of residence must be filed with USCIS prior to departure from the United States. Further information may be obtained from the USCIS office having jurisdiction over the alien''s place of residence in the United States.

Travel documents required for entry into foreign countries come within the jurisdiction of the government concerned; information on such matters should be requested from the representatives of those countries in the United States. A Reentry Permit contains space for visas issued by consular representatives of other countries.

Permanent resident aliens who are unable to return to the United States within the travel validity period of the Alien Registration Receipt Card, or the Reentry Permit, may apply to the nearest U.S. consular office for a special immigrant Returning Resident (SB-1) visa. To qualify for such status aliens must show:--

That they were lawful permanent residents when they departed the United States. -- That when they departed they intended to return to the United States and have maintained this intent: -- That they are returning from a temporary visit abroad and, if the stay was protracted, that it was caused by reasons beyond their control and for which they were not responsible; and -- That they are eligible for the immigrant visa in all other respects.

Applicants who wish to apply for Returning Resident (SB-1) visas should contact the nearest consular office well in advance of their intended travel (at least three months in advance, if possible) to permit sufficient time for visa processing.

If the returning Resident (SB-1) visa is refused on the grounds that the alien has given up his residence in the United States, it may or may not be possible to obtain a nonimmigrant visa, depending on whether the applicant has established a residence abroad to which he will return. If the applicant wishing to return to the United States cannot submit convincing evidence of compelling ties abroad he may have to apply for an immigrant visa on the same basis by which he immigrated originally, if that is possible.

xxxxxxxxxxxxxxx

[dingdongrb]

My personal experience:

I met my Thai wife (GF at the time) in 2000. It was decided in 2004 we would pursue getting her to the USA on a K1 (Fiancé) visa. Don’t let folks scare you about the process unless you are the type of person that could not do a US tax return (long form) as it is probably equivalent of doing 5 of these. Yes, it depends on the wait times at the USCIS Service Center you apply at how long the process may take. At that time, once we submitted all the paperwork it took about 8 months for my wife’s interview at the US Embassy in BKK. If you get that far I highly suggest going to that interview with her as it makes a big difference in their judgment whether to grant her the visa or not. The day that we went there were about 12 girls doing the interview process and only 3 were granted the visa.

Once my wife got the visa she went to the USA with me and we got married one month later in Las Vegas. It’s a very easy process as hundreds of people are married in Clark County every day. It’s such a big business there are touts outside the courthouse where marriage licenses are provided trying to get you to sign up for your wedding at their chapel.

After we got married I submitted the I-485 application seeking Permanent Residence. After this was received and processed, we went through another interview at the local USCIS office (Denver) my wife was granted PR but with conditions for 2 years. While living in Colorado for two years my wife obtained a social security card and worked a part time job to meet new friends and have something to do while I was at work every day.

Before the conditions of PR were removed we moved to Thailand. My job brought me here. After we got here to Thailand and the time came we filed I-751 to remove the conditions on PR. I wrote a very lengthy letter to USCIS regarding my situation living as an expat in Thailand but still wanting to remove the conditions from the PR so that when we move back to the USA my wife could go back in without going through a visa process again. I just spoke to a USCIS officer on the phone last month, there is no problem doing what I (or my wife) have done as far as leaving the USA. That officer said that my petition to remove conditions will stay open (although they will not further process it until we move back to the USA), my wife can get back into the USA using the ‘receipt’ provided by the USCIS for the PR removal, and her expired PR card. The officer said that I could also make an appointment with the State Dept at the US Embassy in BKK and see if perhaps they would process the I-751 in BKK. The officer says that it entirely up to them if they would or not. If not then my wife would have to wait until returning to the USA for the process to continue. But in summary our application is still open assured by the officer I spoke with on the phone and she had stated to me that it could possibly remain open for years to come. I would get notification if they do decide that they wish to close it. If that happens then I would probably have to take the route of obtaining a visa to take a spouse to the USA.

Sorry for the long story but now you have TRUE info firsthand of my experience…. No BS & no rumors.

One other note: While living in LOS if you want to get a 1 year visa extension based on being married to a Thai, it is much easier to get this if you marry the Thai in the USA rather than here in LOS.

Hmmm, pondering. If your wife's Green Card, PRA status, has expired and she doesn't have a Re-entry permit for the U.S. seems to me she'd have to apply for an SB-1 RETURNING RESIDENT VISA, as described below.

Mac

http://travel.state.gov/visa/immigrants/info/info_1333.html

Returning Resident Alien

A permanent resident alien returning to the United States from a visit abroad of less than a year may apply for readmission by presenting an Alien Registration Receipt Card ("green card") to the immigration authorities at a port of entry. The one-year time limitation does not apply to the spouse or child of a member of the Armed Forces of the United States, or of a civilian employee of the U.S. Government stationed abroad pursuant to official orders. In this case, the spouse or child must present the card mentioned above, not have relinquished residence, and be preceding or accompanying the member or employee, or be following to join the member or employee in the United States within four months of the return of the member or employee.

A permanent resident alien who intends to remain abroad for more than a year should, at least 30 days prior to the proposed date of departure, apply while in the United States to the U.S. Citizenship and Immigration Services (USCIS) in the Department of Homeland Security for Reentry Permit. The permit is valid for two years and may not be extended. If such a permit is obtained the alien may use this card to reenter the United States within the period of validity. Every alien applying for readmission must satisfy the immigration authorities that he or she is eligible in all respects for admission.

A Reentry Permit does not preserve residence for naturalization purposes. An application for preservation of residence must be filed with USCIS prior to departure from the United States. Further information may be obtained from the USCIS office having jurisdiction over the alien''s place of residence in the United States.

Travel documents required for entry into foreign countries come within the jurisdiction of the government concerned; information on such matters should be requested from the representatives of those countries in the United States. A Reentry Permit contains space for visas issued by consular representatives of other countries.

Permanent resident aliens who are unable to return to the United States within the travel validity period of the Alien Registration Receipt Card, or the Reentry Permit, may apply to the nearest U.S. consular office for a special immigrant Returning Resident (SB-1) visa. To qualify for such status aliens must show:--

That they were lawful permanent residents when they departed the United States. -- That when they departed they intended to return to the United States and have maintained this intent: -- That they are returning from a temporary visit abroad and, if the stay was protracted, that it was caused by reasons beyond their control and for which they were not responsible; and -- That they are eligible for the immigrant visa in all other respects.

Applicants who wish to apply for Returning Resident (SB-1) visas should contact the nearest consular office well in advance of their intended travel (at least three months in advance, if possible) to permit sufficient time for visa processing.

If the returning Resident (SB-1) visa is refused on the grounds that the alien has given up his residence in the United States, it may or may not be possible to obtain a nonimmigrant visa, depending on whether the applicant has established a residence abroad to which he will return. If the applicant wishing to return to the United States cannot submit convincing evidence of compelling ties abroad he may have to apply for an immigrant visa on the same basis by which he immigrated originally, if that is possible.

xxxxxxxxxxxxxxx

I can only tell you about my wife's current situation as I know it. We have yet to try to go back to the USA since moving to LOS a little over a year ago. Just looked online regarding her case with removing conditions of permanent residency and it is still open and pending. Perhaps we will have problems when we try to go to the USA and perhaps not. Although probably before we go back (no plans at this time) I will contact the State Dept at the US Embassy in BKK and see if they will allow us to continue processing the I-751 here in LOS.

Believe what you will as the facts I have stated about our case are indeed facts.

[ronz28]

Our experience was that it was very easy for my Thai wife to travel over here on a tourist visa and then to get married in Texas with no problems but that was years ago. For more current information on how the USA immigration offices are working see the British Expats dot com website forum thread called Marriage Based Visas for those with an American spouse, or will soon be marrying an American citizen: K1, K3 etc. it is on that website at forumdisplay.php?f=35. You can also do searches of the site to find specific info about the local office you will deal with that the national office doesn't know or won't look up. I heard there was a slow down in processing about a year or two ago when they increased the requirements for passports so local workload conditions can also vary the responsiveness you will get from those people.

[thaihome]

...Secondly, it historically takes longer to get a "marriage visa", whatever designation that is than to get the K-1. So better not to marry in the USA if future visa time frame is important. #2a: the K-1 really does give one or the couple time to see if it is going to work. The K-1 visa really shouldn't be pursued unless you are trying to settle for some time in the USA (as I said in my first post for someone who missed that). As someone else said, in your situation, it could be a waste of time and money BUT might get her entry if that is your short term goal. I have no experience with or have ever heard any talk on this board about: What if we don't get married on the K-1 visa, return within the permitted time and then try the same visa a year or so later? That would be an interesting thread to hear anyone's experience with something like that.

Someone else made a very valid point about her getting her a tourist visa if you can show a compelling reason that YOU have to return. This is exactly what happened to me and my wife in 2001. We wanted to do what you are wanting to do (make short trip to USA for Thanksgiving and marry) so I filed a K-1 and the embassy staff figured out it wouldn't work because we weren't staying in the USA after the marriage and instead determined I had a strong reason to return (job assignment) and in the end issued my girl a tourist visa. The K-1 was kept on file, unbelievably, for 3 years at the embassy and all I had to do was every few months send an email requesting to keep the case open and in the end provide updated paperwork and it was issued when the time was right for us. My wife will be a citizen in less than 2 weeks.

It is a tedious but doable trip but doing it right is the way to go even if you suffer disappointment in the beginning. Keep focus on the long range goal and go step by step. Patience! There are many good posters here that occasionally disagree on interpretations and have different experiences, but everyone has good intentions, and tries to provide accurate answers even if it isn't what one is hoping to hear.

Good luck with your pursuit!

Regards,

Martian

Note that the OP lives in Thailand. That makes being already married and filing the I-130 in Bangkok by far the fastest route to a green card.

Your applying for the K-1 for a short trip was based on misinformation and it seems you had difficult process becasue of that. The OP should go for the tourist visa based on him having ties to Thailand. When they return (or they can do it in the US on the tourist visa), and a few months before they go back to the US to live, they should file the I-130 in Bangkok to get her the green card.

You are trying to be helpful, but using your experience is confusing the situation.

TH

TH

[Martian]

...Secondly, it historically takes longer to get a "marriage visa", whatever designation that is than to get the K-1. So better not to marry in the USA if future visa time frame is important. #2a: the K-1 really does give one or the couple time to see if it is going to work. The K-1 visa really shouldn't be pursued unless you are trying to settle for some time in the USA (as I said in my first post for someone who missed that). As someone else said, in your situation, it could be a waste of time and money BUT might get her entry if that is your short term goal. I have no experience with or have ever heard any talk on this board about: What if we don't get married on the K-1 visa, return within the permitted time and then try the same visa a year or so later? That would be an interesting thread to hear anyone's experience with something like that.

Someone else made a very valid point about her getting her a tourist visa if you can show a compelling reason that YOU have to return. This is exactly what happened to me and my wife in 2001. We wanted to do what you are wanting to do (make short trip to USA for Thanksgiving and marry) so I filed a K-1 and the embassy staff figured out it wouldn't work because we weren't staying in the USA after the marriage and instead determined I had a strong reason to return (job assignment) and in the end issued my girl a tourist visa. The K-1 was kept on file, unbelievably, for 3 years at the embassy and all I had to do was every few months send an email requesting to keep the case open and in the end provide updated paperwork and it was issued when the time was right for us. My wife will be a citizen in less than 2 weeks.

It is a tedious but doable trip but doing it right is the way to go even if you suffer disappointment in the beginning. Keep focus on the long range goal and go step by step. Patience! There are many good posters here that occasionally disagree on interpretations and have different experiences, but everyone has good intentions, and tries to provide accurate answers even if it isn't what one is hoping to hear.

Good luck with your pursuit!

Regards,

Martian

Note that the OP lives in Thailand. That makes being already married and filing the I-130 in Bangkok by far the fastest route to a green card.

Your applying for the K-1 for a short trip was based on misinformation and it seems you had difficult process becasue of that. The OP should go for the tourist visa based on him having ties to Thailand. When they return (or they can do it in the US on the tourist visa), and a few months before they go back to the US to live, they should file the I-130 in Bangkok to get her the green card.

You are trying to be helpful, but using your experience is confusing the situation.

TH

TH

I guess that since you included some of my posting and then refer to the original poster, your comments are directed to me.

First off, my initial attempt to get the K-1 was based on my misunderstanding of the complete picture with regard to residency requirements after the marriage etc. (I've learned a lot in the 8 years since). That is where the embassy staff person was absolutely very helpful in explaining why that approach wouldn't work and arranged for my then girlfriend, now wife, to receive a tourist visa based on me having a compelling reason to return to Thailand (work assignment). I've pointed that out a couple times and even suggest that he use that approach in the second paragraph of the part of my post you quoted.

I didn't experience a difficult process at all. Quite to the contrary, it was just a matter of (timing) having to wait until we were going to go to the USA permanently to live and the Embassy kept my case open for almost 3 years (so I wouldn't have to start over). Again, the Embassy was quite accommodating.

I too believe that the OP's best route is to try and get a tourist visa based on him having a compelling reason to return, but still believe that marrying in the USA while on a tourist visa, whether staying or not, isn't advisable...up to them. However, if the tourist visa isn't issued and he does want to take her to the USA THEN he might try to go the Fiancee route just to gain her entry. Whether he marries then or not....up to them.

I don't have statistics or data to support my understanding but it is generally accepted (non urban myth) that marriage visas have historically taken significantly longer than K-1 visa's. It is also generally accepted that marrying on a tourist visa is not favorably looked upon by US immigration whether staying or not. The visa is for what it says....to tour. Up to them if they want to risk possible future complications or not.

I don't see what is so confusing about all that. I do understand that they live in Thailand AND don't plan on staying in the USA permanently anytime in the near future. I'm merely offering a different way to gain entry if the tourist visa fails in the end. If it was a matter of only wanting to get a marriage visa, then register a Thai marriage and get a visa based on that marriage and save the money and time going to the USA to marry, whether on a Fiancee or tourist visa. But I believe the OP is looking primarily to gain entry, the USA marriage is secondary.

The tedious part of my post was about the whole process from beginning to citizenship, which has gone like clockwork, not about gaining initial entry for my girlfriend. Patience is a very good virtue to have AND exude when dealing with Embassy and immigration officials. It can only help to get much more favorable results as opposed to acting frustrated and being critical of the people or process.

I wish the OP nothing but best of luck achieving whatever is the priority.

Regards,

Martian

Edited September 7, 2008 by Martian

[iyah]

Thanks y'all for the input. Basically i just wanted to go to the States with my GF for a quick visit to see how she likes it, and to see friends and family. Getting married while overthere isn't my priority (especially if it's illegal). I think we will still give the tourist visa a shot, but since i have been changing jobs every year or so while in thailand, i don't think I can show 'strong ties' or good reasons to come back here. If she doesn't get the tourist visa (very likely), we will then apply for a fiancee visa a few months from now.

Also, my GF suggested that she/we might be able to book a tour to the States for her (through a travel agency) which might make it easier for her to get a tourist visa..i'm not sure if i would want to go that far but we might dig a little into that.

[Martian]

Thanks y'all for the input. Basically i just wanted to go to the States with my GF for a quick visit to see how she likes it, and to see friends and family. Getting married while overthere isn't my priority (especially if it's illegal). I think we will still give the tourist visa a shot, but since i have been changing jobs every year or so while in thailand, i don't think I can show 'strong ties' or good reasons to come back here. If she doesn't get the tourist visa (very likely), we will then apply for a fiancee visa a few months from now.

Also, my GF suggested that she/we might be able to book a tour to the States for her (through a travel agency) which might make it easier for her to get a tourist visa..i'm not sure if i would want to go that far but we might dig a little into that.

Good luck to you and your sweetie. Just having a letter from your employee stating you are employed and are required to return may be enough (with supporting documents showing you two have a legitimate relationship). I'm not an Embassy employee so I don't know for sure but I think it's worth a try as far as the tourist visa goes. As I said before, if it doesn't work on the first submission, regroup, think of a new strategy (maybe the Fiancee visa) and then proceed however it might work into your plans. don't get discouraged.

Regards,

Martian

[iyah]

Yes, many thanks Martian. Thanks for your replies and support. We'll give the tourist visa a shot in a few months and i'll try to post an update for future refference.

T

[mdechgan]

I applied for a K1 visa for my GF. It took a long time and lots of documents, fees, and paperwork. Also many offices. Some paperwork had to be sent to the U.S.A., and they forward your documents to an office in Bangkok and they forward your documents again to the embassy counselate. I had to get my mother to sign notary a couple docs at thh embassy to prove support. Since I don't have a W2 or 1040 since working in Thailand. Oh we also had to get a health checkup at BNH and various vaccinations and x-rays.

During the interview, of course I went she asked a couple questions. I just answered saying we just want go to the U.S. for marriage ceremony in my hometown and come right back since I am employed in Bangkok. She just asked the if I plan to stay in Bkk. I said yes. She then told me if the K1 visa was what we wanted. She said if she issued the visa the whole point is for her to get married and immediately file a petition for residence in the U.S. My GF would also be required to stay in the U.S. and work for like 2 years no return until some immigrant visa is approved then a green card application which would cost thousand of dollars. I said no that is not what we want for the current time we just want to go to Los Angeles and get married and come back. She just took my GF's passport said come back tomorrow and you will get a 10 year visa which is better for you since my GF could travel in and out of the U.S. for 10 years. I asked if this would be a problem if we decided to immigrate back in a couple years. She said no problem the documents and fingerprints are on file and when you arrive in LAX the immigration officer will have some notice on the computer that a K1 visa was applied for but not needed. I could always petition again if we plan to immigrate later on since it was already approved in a way.

I think their is no problem getting married. By law marriage would actually make it easier for my GF to get a visa another 10 years later since she would be a legal spouse. However I think THAI registered marriages don't mean a thing. I've seen many couples rejected even though they were married in Thailand, I guess because you can always get divorced. But it does help if you want a THAI visa! Whatever happends thpugh don't get a divorce, this automatically would red flag her intentions of just marrying someone for a pass to the U.S.

So I do not see how getting a tourist visa and getting married would be illegal or a problem if the lady at the counselate recommended and told us to do it this way. It is also better for us since my GF would not have to be tied in the U.S. for like 2 years and travel freely. We also have no intention of immigrating to the U.S. for the time being.

To make it known both of us are young, about the same age and look like a real couple. My GF doesn't look like or dress a bar lady and I do not look like an old sex pervert. Which I think does help in the interview process. We also had proof, lots of it of our relationship. My mother petitioned the support documents and we had many family pictures including mine and hers together. Remember the entire process is subjective and it really helps if both of you are a real couple.

As for marriage in California I think each of you need 2 forms of ID passport and something else.

As for B1/B2 visas. I think the rejection rate is like 90%. I spent many hours and days in the embassy and I could tell you guys 1 out of 10 are approved. It also depends on the luck of the interview draw. In one aisle this guy would approve every single lady that was young, pretty and dressed sexy and reject everyone that was older, male or even looked very well off. The lady in the window next to her would reject all single women except for older women like in their 50s. The entire process in 100% subjective! Employer letter, bank statments don't mean a thing. My GF was rejected for one about 5 years ago.

Just imagine the free money the U.S. is making, $100 for every rejection! Many people I know were rejected no matter how big. However the best chances of obtaining a visa is a student visa. Most of my friends obtained them.

[mdechgan]

Also, my GF suggested that she/we might be able to book a tour to the States for her (through a travel agency) which might make it easier for her to get a tourist visa..i'm not sure if i would want to go that far but we might dig a little into that.

Oh we tried that and it doesn't mean a thing or help at all. The interviewer doesn't even look at the travel itinerary. In some cases rejection is before the question "When will you return?" I saw this one person actually his their employer representative and talk and explain about the company business trip to the U.S. including travel logs etc. The entire company was rejected! Booked plan tickets don't really help at all.

[iyah]

Might look into the student visa road then. If anyone has ever been involved in the process of getting one for his GF, would be great to hear about it.

So once in the US, my gf would have to wait something like 1 or 2 years before she's able to work there..is that correct?

Ya , the reason why we might wait a little to go the fiancee visa way is that it sounds like at that point there's no turning back (at least not before a couple years) for us and we are 'stuck' in the US for that time even if we do decide that Thailand is better/easier for us now. I'm definately interested in learning more about how to get a student visa for here. I have a feeling that the whole process (university fees etc) will be a little costly..

Thanks Mdechgan