Hypothetical Question: Would The Bib Really Try And Stop A Shooting?

[submaniac]

This is just a hypothetical question that I had, and I was wondering what people thought. The impetus behind this post is that another unfortunate TV members child was struck by a stray bullet after a gunfight between Thais. I am sorry to bring it up, and I am glad that the child is alright, but it really got me thinking because there were apparently reports of people shooting at each immediately prior to the bullet striking the child. The question that begs to be asked is that if there were reports of people shooting at each other, why didn't the police show up and try and stop it. In the west, reports of a shooting, and the police are there immediately. But TiT, and all suspicious deaths are chalked up to 'suicide', and a police colonel could be shot in the head by one of Chalerm's sons, and no one (and not the other cops who were there) saw a thing.

In Thailand, the police are not well paid, and probably don't have the best equipment (I doubt they have the state of the art bulletproof vests, and some of the guns I see on the police look like real antiques to me). Furthermore it is one thing to hassle someone (like asking for a bribe) when you have a gun and they don't. But it is another thing to run into someone who also had a gun and was capable of 'causing problems'. If the situation were one where that the criminal also had a gun, and was fully capable of killing the cop, whether the BiB would really do anything to try and stop it, or would just chill out until it was over. And the hypothetical situation I am thinking of is if there was a shootout (like between gangs or something) and police were there, if you think they would jump in the fray and shoot back, or if they would not want to risk their own necks and just sit it out until the criminals finished shooting at each other. I am thinking of it, and I really do not know how the police would react.

[Huey]

I think it depends on if the BiB where on the take and knew in advance. If they did not and it was just some random gold store robbery by an unknown to them, then the BiB would tear their azzes right up. I don't think the cops are punks and they would probably want the face gained by catching the guy.

[dumball]

I think it depends on if the BiB where on the take and knew in advance. If they did not and it was just some random gold store robbery by an unknown to them, then the BiB would tear their azzes right up. I don't think the cops are punks and they would probably want the face gained by catching the guy.

Is that right ? Judging by multiple comments here on TV in a large variety of scenarios , is not the role of BiB hypothetical in itself ? No , the cops do not appear to be punks , just an incompetant bunch of rip off artists with no clue what a real police officer is supposed to do , like , mmmmmm , enforce the law , of the land that is .

[JUDAS]

Interesting you mention this now submaniac. About a week ago I was watching the Thai news with the wife. There was some CCTV footage of a robbery at a gold shop, believe it was in Krabi ( wife has just confirmed that ). Armed robbers come in with handguns and uniformed police officer comes from the back of the store and engages the robbers. Police officer died and if I remember correctly one suspect injured and the other shot dead.

Goes to show that some of the BIB are prepared to put their life on the line.

[Huey]

Thank You Judas, I'm no big cop fan but apparently Dumball never went to somplace were police TRUELY don't give a f*. The cops here do as good a job as any givin the circumstances.

[dave_boo]

It's wrong to lump groups of people together because they simply are not homogenous.

However, I'd bet that the majority of Thai coppers, especially those who are higher up in the hierarchy and presumably got their jobs at the behest of their family name/connections would not try and stop a shooting. They'd risk too much for too little gain. Also, the apparent lack of Thai's empathy towards total strangers would seem to preclude any action taken by those previously listed.

On the other hand, I'm sure there's a subset who would go all Rambo given the chance. And I'd be willing to bet that they're young, from a non-connected family, and most likely know the people involved.

It could be me being cynical, but I'm a bit jaded when I see the low value that human life has here in addition to the laissez-faire attitude taken.

[submaniac]

Armed robbers come in with handguns and uniformed police officer comes from the back of the store and engages the robbers. Police officer died and if I remember correctly one suspect injured and the other shot dead.

Goes to show that some of the BIB are prepared to put their life on the line.

Wow. Thanks for the news tidbit. Frankly I am a little surprised that the cop did anything. But ther eis one thing that makes me a little cynical. The POlice officer "came from the back of the store". Well, what was he doing in the back of the store? It makes me think that the shop being robbed could have belonged to his friends or family, and it may not be the same reaction if it is a complete stranger doing all this.

[phaethon]

Not shooting related, but similar...

I'm sitting in a Patong restaurant near the beach having breakfast when I hear a commotion across the street where the beach police cabin is. I look over my shoulder and see the BIB, at least half a dozen, all jump onto their motorcycles and take off in a hurry. I glance around and check out the escape route and potential cover in case there is a shoot out and return to my meal. Several minutes later the manager of the (hotel) restaurant went out to investigate - he came running back shouting "Big wave coming, big wave coming!" and we all high-tailed it to the roof. You know the rest...

I'll never forget the sight of those coppers fleeing the scene without warning anyone.

[submaniac]

Not shooting related, but similar...

I'm sitting in a Patong restaurant near the beach having breakfast when I hear a commotion across the street where the beach police cabin is. I look over my shoulder and see the BIB, at least half a dozen, all jump onto their motorcycles and take off in a hurry. I glance around and check out the escape route and potential cover in case there is a shoot out and return to my meal. Several minutes later the manager of the (hotel) restaurant went out to investigate - he came running back shouting "Big wave coming, big wave coming!" and we all high-tailed it to the roof. You know the rest...

I'll never forget the sight of those coppers fleeing the scene without warning anyone.

This would be funny if it weren't tragic, and pathetic. I definately think it is on topic, and just shows that self preservation is more important, even if all that they needed to do was yell "big wave coming" as they were riding away.

[kmart]

Thank You Judas, I'm no big cop fan but apparently Dumball never went to somplace were police TRUELY don't give a f*. The cops here do as good a job as any givin the circumstances.

You are being very kind to them. I find the cynicism and ineptitude of the BiB here to be kind of a sick joke.

Would they try and stop a shooting? They probably started it in the first place.

[sassienie]

It all depends on who’s running the show here.

In Thailand, if the police were ordered to go in' what action is taken could depend on the individual officers involved rather than the force as a whole.

What matters here is what, if anything, comes *down* the chain of command from the CO.

For what I have seen myself, Police with antiquated equipment, required to purchase their own transport motorbikes etc and low wages, suggests that power, perks, and corruption is a main inceptive for those joining the police force.

Now if an order to proceed into a danger zone came from the command office and the police drag their feet instead of taking decisive action, than the motivation behind the order needs to be questioned.

Rather than public safety as the priority, it would seem that motivation may well be for financial gain or if the media becomes involved or for a PR stunt a police raid may go ahead to prove to the public that they are at risk and need the police thus justifying the (if any) Government's anti-crime measures, giving the semblance that as a whole, the police are doing a good job.

The bottom line is, the quality of police protection is a bit of a lottery here in Thailand, it depends on which area, how strong the motivation is from the top end of a particular police unit, the pride taken in the job by individual policemen, standards of police conduct and sense of duty set by commanding officers.

[Howsitgoin]

This is just a hypothetical question that I had, and I was wondering what people thought.

That question is so "hypothetical" that there is no answer.

It depends of course on the particular situation. One thing though - most "shoot outs" in real life don't last long enough for all the camera angles needed in a Hollywood movie, and the perpetrators usually won't wait around for police to arrive. That somewhat beats the purpose.

And yes, more than a few police do get involved in very dangerous situations here. It is an urban myth that police in Thailand only consists of greedy little incompetents - this could not be any further from reality.

[geriatrickid]

Training and Education.

Until the BiB get it, they will react based upon their given skillset.

If any of you recall the Columbine (USA) school shooting, the coroner's report showed that the police arrived quickly following the 1st reports. They assembled outside and waited for the SWAT and hostage negotiators to arrive. That was the standard operating procedure. While they waited, many kids were killed. The report that looked at the response was a watershed moment and changed police tactics.

Fast forward a decade to the Dawson College (Canada) shooting where a gunman went on a rampage. Police responding didn't wait for the special squads to respond, but went straight into the building to confront the shooter. The lesson from Columbine was followed and while one student was murdered, many others escaped alive because of quick intervention and the additional training the police across North America had undertaken in the years following Columbine.

If you look at the response now used in the UK and Australia, it follows the lessons learned from Columbine and their own tragedies. I doubt there will be a change in Thai police tactics until there is a Columbine event in Thailand and until coroner type inquiry reports are taken seriously.

Edited October 4, 2008 by geriatrickid

[lazeeboy]

Thank You Judas, I'm no big cop fan but apparently Dumball never went to somplace were police TRUELY don't give a f*. The cops here do as good a job as any givin the circumstances.

You are being very kind to them. I find the cynicism and ineptitude of the BiB here to be kind of a sick joke.

Would they try and stop a shooting? They probably started it in the first place.

[Moonrakers]

Not shooting related, but similar...

I'm sitting in a Patong restaurant near the beach having breakfast when I hear a commotion across the street where the beach police cabin is. I look over my shoulder and see the BIB, at least half a dozen, all jump onto their motorcycles and take off in a hurry. I glance around and check out the escape route and potential cover in case there is a shoot out and return to my meal. Several minutes later the manager of the (hotel) restaurant went out to investigate - he came running back shouting "Big wave coming, big wave coming!" and we all high-tailed it to the roof. You know the rest...

I'll never forget the sight of those coppers fleeing the scene without warning anyone.

I was in Phuket when the tsunami hit, the wife and I are very lucky to be here to be honest.

Anyway, whilst stood on the roof of the hotel, with wavers constantly coming in and out, I could see a copper running down beach road from building to building checking for emergency cases. He was very nearly caught by waves on several occasions. Very brave man.