Home Grown Debts

[dutch]

How do you want to call it? A loan?

If you steel, you steel !

In Europe there is reasonable (?) welfare system available.

Not nice to go there and ask for help that you (most of the times ) have to pay back.

[dutch]

Sorry.

Please read steel= steal

[Jowels]

I rarely post on this board, but over the past couple of months I've followed the trials and tribulations of Scamp's life in Thailand.

I don't know the guy and I wouldn't like to make too many generalizations, however his posts suggest he suffers regular cashflow problems and lets face it he has a somewhat chequered work history. Will he be able to stick around in Thailand for the seven years that his debt will be 'active'? Nobody knows what the future holds and there's every chance he'll find himself back in the UK next year needing credit facilities. The amount he owes is so small that he would be a fool not to repay it.

[paully]

The debts probably been written off by now, if it hasnt you can wait the customary 7 years and it will be written off by then.

A good friend of mine worked in a debt collecting agency back in blighty (dont hold that against him tho ) he told me that most debts get written off within a year or two if they cant make contact with the person who owes...

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

Interesting Wolfie, where do the 7 years come into it, on another thread, I got the idea that the debt is there for all time in the UK.

More info?

Cheers.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

The limitation period for all claims arising out of a simple contract (ie: not, for example, a mortgage or a guarantee) in UK law is six years. In other words, if the bank or lender - or someone to whom your debt has been sold or 'factored' - has not started a claim in court against you within 6 years, any claim will be time-barred. It's not a criminal law matter, only a civil law dispute as long as you have made at least one repayment instalment [there would be no 'intention to permanently deprive' the lender of his money, which is required for theft in criminal law]. So, following this, your credit blacklisting officially lasts for six years. It isn't six years for the lender to claim from the date you signed the original agreement to borrow the money/start using the credit card, but six years after the debt fell due or you refused to pay it. Debts are usually written off if repayment is not forthcoming, although the lender could try to start bankruptcy proceedings against you if your debt was large enough and you were still in the UK.

[Flummoxed]

In Europe there is reasonable (?) welfare system available.

Sure, if you're a lesbian ethnic minority with 2 kids and an alchoholic partner... or an asylum seeker.

When I was at the bottom (and I swear I'll never let myself be there again, whatever the cost) I was ignored my the welfare system and was allowed to go streetside. Don't insult me by saying otherwise. Welfare is set up for single Mum council estate produce and immigrants. If you're a single bloke with no kids, you've got no chance. You've only got yourself to rely on.

[Wolfie]

Debts are usually written off if repayment is not forthcoming, although the lender could try to start bankruptcy proceedings against you if your debt was large enough and you were still in the UK.

FYI:

14,000 sterling is the minimum for monies owed to decalre personal bankruptcy

If you owe 13,999 sterling or less, you are not able to decalre bankruptcy

[Sydney_Tom]

Hello Thai Visa Forum, I will start my first post here

Nobody forces to apply for a card and nobody forces to buy anything.

Thats not entirely true.

There are many cases of "unsolicited credit" where a credit provider will give consumer credit as an offer or promotion.

What is very common in Australia and the UK, is the "credit binge", where someone is sent an offer in the post, and all you have to do is sign it and send it back.

I was in this case 10 years ago when my wife and I got this offer from a Bank in the UK, signed it, sent it back, and we got a credit card with a 25,000 pound credit limit. Now I know they never checked to see who I worked for, or any assets. Now I had a job that I could support that level of personal gearing, but, they had no idea, who I really worked for, or what I was paid, particularly since the company I worked for, my family owned and they weren't customers of the bank.

There are many other companies doing the same thing.

Now, In Australia when they launched "Bankcard", which is now nearly defunct, the banks sent these credit cards to almost anyone who fitted the customer profile. Didn't matter if the ages and occupations were wrong. They just wanted consumers with their bankcards in their hands.

So of course no one "forces" you to have credit, they just pressure you alot.

So whose fault is it really, the consumer, who doesn't have a huge amount of will-power of the credit provider who knows 10 - 15 % of their loans book will be bad within 2 years.

What do you think ?

[dutch]

As they pressure you with smoking (!?)

As they pressure you with drinking (!?)

As they pressure you with drugs (!?)

Just blame everybody except yourself.

[Flummoxed]

As they pressure you with smoking (!?)

As they pressure you with drinking  (!?)

As they pressure you with drugs    (!?)

Just blame everybody except yourself.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

... and the credit card companies moan they have bad debtors. Blame everyone except their lending policy.

[Flummoxed]

Debts are usually written off if repayment is not forthcoming, although the lender could try to start bankruptcy proceedings against you if your debt was large enough and you were still in the UK.

FYI:

14,000 sterling is the minimum for monies owed to decalre personal bankruptcy

If you owe 13,999 sterling or less, you are not able to decalre bankruptcy

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

I'll sent them a quid.

[Khutan]

As they pressure you with smoking (!?)

As they pressure you with drinking  (!?)

As they pressure you with drugs     (!?)

Just blame everybody except yourself.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

I like the Debit cards, and I will stick with them.

BUT

The CC Company I used to use (paid off and forgotten now) had a wine club and also offered cigars.

I am sure they are a source of the junk email that offers Viagra.

So in a manner of speaking yes. If not pressure, then cohersion.

[GuestHouse]

A Definition

Some people loose but a looser is someone who brings it on himself and refuses to see his contribution to his life's problems.

I am absolutely sure people who can't sort their sh1t back home are bound to &lt;deleted&gt; up in Thailand.

Then they bleat on about it being someone esle who stuffed them.

Like get your head on and sort your sh1t.

[chuchok]

In business, if I have ever been late paying somebody, I let them know before. Communication is everything. I believe that you have to walk this earth with your head high.

[jingjingna]

Scamp,

If you are worried that within the next six years or so there might come a time that you will have to return home then perhaps it is better you try to repay the debt, if not then don't worry about it!

Many moons ago I got into debt, owing my cc company roughly two thousand quid and I buggered off to Europe where I lived and worked and visited the U.K quite often.

After about five or six years I returned to there and had no problems whatsoever in opening a bank account and getting credit. I was older and wiser and new that I could not go down that slippery slope again.

Upto you, hope you're able to solve this problem either way.

[SoCal]

Integrity is fine if you have the money to 'spare'.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

What a great model for life. Please do the world a favor and don't have kids.

Ravisher, Flumoxxed, Scamp, Jing, what makes you think that the rest of the world owes you a free lunch? You think credit companies just take the loss from losers who don't repay their debts? No, they pass it on to the average consumer in terms of higher credit charges. I severely doubt you used this credit to buy a loaf of bread because you were starving to death. You had your good time, now like any other hang over, deal with it.

As pointed out earlier, the credit card companies will work with you, even reducing the principal.

You really have no excuse, unless you are no better than a petty thief who would sell his integrity for a pint.

[The Gentleman Scamp]

*Rubs chin for a couple of minutes then clears throat*

Guesthouse, people who flee to Thailand to run away from problems back home are probably running away from a little more than sixteen hundred quid.

I am out here because I love it here and I am among like minded people, I have more going for me here than I do back home and I have more motivation than I do back home.

I've been pretty 50/50 on this which is why I posted it, and considering I am on a return ticket which reaches limitus maximus in May, I'll forget about it for now and sort it out then.

I'm only about two, maybe three payments behind and I told mum to give them a 'not known at this address - don't know where the bugger is, he owes me millions' story, and it is just that: A fib.

For the record I get on with my brothers, my father is most concerned about this but never e-mails or calls because his father never did with him.

My father is 70 on Sunday and so is HRH The King, who I haven't heard anything from either but I do at least have a huge amount of respect for him.

[britmaveric]

Scampy will do what he will do, but if I recall he asked for advice. I live by a creed that I always pay my debts however big or small. I personally wouldn't feel good about defaulting, but then again that was how I was raised. However if the situation arises that basic needs can't be met then obviously you have to put your debts on the back burner until you can properly pay them. I think Scampy is doing alright now, so I dare say he isnt in dire straits any longer- the miniumum can't be all that much on that little of a balance? In the end you have to do right by yourself - however there are always consequences which ever route you pursue.

[Pablo H]

GS, if I was you I would hold out.

If you intend to go back to the UK then you may have a problem, but since you say you love Thailand and you have work there why would you wish to go back?

The post about surviving is quite correct, you hear people on here who seem to be disgusted with people who run from debt. These people have probably never been at 'rock bottom' financially so I wouldn't pay too much attention to them as they know f*#k all.

Do yourself a favour, forget about the return ticket you have for May 05, keep working and try to put a little away each month for a rainy day. If the need arises you can always buy a one way ticket back to Blighty fairly cheap. It sounds to me that you want to stay in Thailand, forget about the debt and get on with it.

[SoCal]

Ravisher,

Come from modest beginnings. Had several down times in my life as well. Life for me was anything but easy.

Personally think that it is these times, and how you handle them, that make you stronger and a better man.

That's okay Ravisher. You view yourself as an animal, and I as something more.

[GuestHouse]

Like where does this come from ..

.... sh1t happened in my life, I had this really bad time, I tried to build a fortune but wound up building a bomb that went off in my face, the CC Company shat on me.....

... But it's alright now, I dumped the debt and cleared off while the forgot about me, came back, took advantage of the credit system, made my money..... I'm alright now!

The fact is:

The system works because people take responsibilty.

The Fact is:

It does matter to walk through life with your head held up

The Fact is:

If you have no nothing in life you can choose to have dignity - But if dignity doesn't matter to you then you'll neither understand or apreciate that.

And for what it matters - I have had times when I have had NO money, when I have had to sell personal possetions to get by and when I have had to go looking for work, any work to get by.

I've dug ditches, picked patatoes, cleaned in a chicken slaughter house, worked behind bars, stacked shelves in a supermarket and driven a taxi to get by. I have never claimed any money of the state and I have always paid my bills - part of whcih includes a percentage to cover people who refuse to take responsibilities for their own mistakes.

I've said it before and I'll say it again.

People who run from problems back home eventually &lt;deleted&gt; up in Thailand

And then what do they do.... run back home for the welfare state or the national health to look after them.

Some people loose and some people are loosers.

As for running cassinos - we are doing well aren't we?! So when a punter runs out of money, what do you do Show him the door, write him a line or think - Hey Dude, I know where you are at, I've been there, here's a loan out of my own wallet.

...... Ah but that's YOUR money isn't it!

Again.

Thailand where the worst of the west meets the worst of the east.

[Flummoxed]

Just to clarify...

eing at rock bottom is a state of homelesness, absolutely broke, alone, look like a vagrant so no one will employ you.etc etc etc.....

Having 'small personal posessions' or trinkets to pawn or sell is not rock bottom. Some of you just don't have a clue.

[boris]

A Definition

Some people loose but a looser is someone who brings it on himself and refuses to see his contribution to his life's problems.

I am absolutely sure people who can't sort their sh1t back home are bound to &lt;deleted&gt; up in Thailand.

Then they bleat on about it being someone esle who stuffed them.

Like get your head on and sort your sh1t.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

Moronic response. Talking here from my own experiences. When in Australia back in the 1960's I was a young man looking to make my fortune... Ihad a bad accident and was blown up in an explosion. 54 stitches in my left arm and 14 in my right. I could not work for three months, had no money, no dole, no nothing. I stole from cars to pay the rent and eat. Later in life in my early 40's I need to borrow from the bank to start a business and got into debt with a CC company. I was struggling like heII just to 'survive'. I wrote the story earlier, so no need to repeat it here. I tried with 'integrity' to pay the money back, but they sold the depts to Collection Agencies.

&lt;deleted&gt; the Collection Agencies. Lowest scum I know of.

Right now, I manage the most successful casino in Europe and have a Gold Credit Card from the SAME company.

In my book it is a case of Integrity v's Intelligence. Not always best to go with the former. Integrity is fine if you have the money to 'spare'. If you do not have the money to 'spare' then it is intelligent to use that money to further yourself.

So take your pick. Integrity, or Intelligence.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

Let me get this intelligence vs integrity issue straight.If I was down on my luck and had no money to "spare" and found a way to defraud the casino you manage, you would encourage this? You probably wouldn't because my theft would harm your own interests.It's all very well to say &lt;deleted&gt; the debt collection agencies but actually these set ups have an important job to do, not least in the gaming industry by the way..Fact is people like you and Gentleman Scamp whine and plead about life's misfortunes, but seem very relaxed about recommending or taking steps (eg reneging on debts) that harm other people.

[ZOVOX]

This thread sounds like a famous monty python sketch , where everybody's comparing how humble and poor a background they come from. The truth is EVERYBODY has a breaking point where they will do something dishonest; it's that some have a higher threshold than others.

As for those people who talk about defrauding the system, people who do not pay off the loans are part of the system: Credit companies know that a certain percentage of the money they lend out will not be paid back.

As to the original poster, it's only a small amount, and whatever you decide to do, don't have sleepless nights over it - the credit card company people certainly won't be !!

[GuestHouse]

And it is painfully obvious that you know &lt;deleted&gt; all about managing a casino either

Isn't there something in the laws governing cassinos regarding employees not having a criminal record?

Well I don't know, I admit I know not a lot about cassinos.

But I still maintain.

People who run from problems back home eventually &lt;deleted&gt; up in Thailand

And then what do they do.... run back home for the welfare state or the national health to look after them.

And I still maintain

If you have no nothing in life you can choose to have dignity - But if dignity doesn't matter to you then you'll neither understand or apreciate that.

I can hardly expect people who advise others to skip their debts to understand that, it simply smacks of a lack of personal morals.

Perhaps a Cassino seems the perfect job. But I don't know, I know not a lot about cassinos.

Proffiting from a vice, cloaked in respectability - perhaps?!

[billd766]

Sometimes you can lose your job and if you are over say 50 for example, it is not always that easy to get another job even in your own country, let alone another country.

However if you keep in contact with the CC companies they can sometime help a lot as long as you make an offer and try to stick to it.

If your circumstances change for the better and you can pay a little more, most of the time they will help.

[Flummoxed]

The few British Expats I know that have had fiscal problems back home (not only those that are in Thailand) have done very well for themselves. I guess I just don't mix with losers.

[Flummoxed]

Sometimes you can lose your job and if you are over say 50 for example, it is not always that easy to get another job even in your own country, let alone another country.

However if you keep in contact with the CC companies they can sometime help a lot as long as you make an offer and try to stick to it.

If your circumstances change for the better and you can pay a little more, most of the time they will help.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

This is simply not true.

The debt is very quickly sold on to independant agencies who lose no sleep over their mothods. Infact, the debt collection agency methods became so bad, the UK government had to bring in new laws and guidlines in an attempt to control them, including - they must not embarass the debtor in front of their neighbours - they must not use threatening behavior etc etc... as is so often the case in England, rules like this are unenforceable and ignored.

[Flummoxed]

... and another thing...

I can't remember the exact figure but something like 30 or 40 percent of UK adults will wind up with black marks against their credit score. In America, personal debt is going skywards. In Thailand, personal borrowing is reaching stratospheric levels.

Are you saying all these people are losers? Sure, some of them borrow irresponsibly ut for many, credit is a means for them to get by and it's temting to put the school uniform for your kids on the plastic etc etc etc.

Really, some of you are clueless about the real world.

[GuestHouse]

Really, some of you are clueless about the real world.

While others are clueless about personal responsibilty.

But is my world anyless real than yours?

Of course it is not.

[dr_Pat_Pong]

Really, some of you are clueless about the real world.

While others are clueless about personal responsibilty.

But is my world anyless real than yours?

Of course it is not.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

Even I, as your right wing cultural attache, agree with your summation.