Xangsamhua Posted June 29, 2009 Share Posted June 29, 2009 It seems Bangkok and the South regard Thaksin as a self-serving mendacious crook and the northeast and northwest see him as a saviour. The country is divided and Thaksin and/or those who brought about his downfall (he also brought it down himself, according to the courts) is the divisor. Should Thailand ostracize/marginalize the divisor or one or the other of the divided sectors? It's a problem. Is Thailand at a stalemate as far as democratic government is concerned, i.e. there's no solution - win-win or win-lose? Are we going to see another military coup before long? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
hammered Posted June 29, 2009 Share Posted June 29, 2009 It seems Bangkok and the South regard Thaksin as a self-serving mendacious crook and the northeast and northwest see him as a saviour. The country is divided and Thaksin and/or those who brought about his downfall (he also brought it down himself, according to the courts) is the divisor. Should Thailand ostracize/marginalize the divisor or one or the other of the divided sectors? It's a problem. Is Thailand at a stalemate as far as democratic government is concerned, i.e. there's no solution - win-win or win-lose? Are we going to see another military coup before long? Few people are addressing the glaring problem of a huge regional divide on this issue. You can basically draw a line across the country. There is no simple answer. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
animatic Posted June 29, 2009 Share Posted June 29, 2009 I see reams and reams of leaflets calling for Taksins return have been thrown littering not only Sisaket city but every small village and bus stop throughout the province. They were dropped from microlight aircraft in and around the town. Incidentally, I attended the rally held by the PTP party and they were very critical about visa regulations causing difficulties, particularly to Westerners. Both parties fielded strong candidates with powerful campaigns but the support for Thaksin and his return to Thailand is uppermost in the majority of peoples' minds here. And if banned means banned, then this election should be over turned for using a banned pol to win it. Regardless if he is loved or not. Not saying it wasn't won properly by the standards in use today, only that the standards are sub-standard. I don'y see this as a slap at Abhisit, we always knew there are still blinded Thaksin lovers up country, just that the Chart Thai guys can't make a fight of it. Frustrating isn't it that Thais keep on voting in a way we don't approve of.There's a word for it..what is it now, oh yes...democracy. Seriously even the most partisan zealots don't share your view that the election was somehow suspect. No personally frustrating, but frustrating for those Thais in OTHER parts of Thailand that got screwed by Thaksin when he was in office for not voting for him. And that is verifiable fact. And comes from Thaksin's own words. The standards used are sub-standard in some areas. If this had truly been fair without banned influence being brandished, at worst it would have been closer. Democracy is not gerrymandered or bought with influence that is banned from the game. Hence my sub-standard regulation comments. Of course there was no Democrat running so it means nothing towards Abhisits side. Banned is banned, end of argument. Unless you approve of banned politicians using their influence to win elections for others? Seems that might be the case. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jitenshaman Posted June 29, 2009 Share Posted June 29, 2009 Frustrating isn't it that Thais keep on voting in a way we don't approve of.There's a word for it..what is it now, oh yes...democracy. I know, folks back up in the northeast really miss those good old democratic days, when one got paid 200 baht to go be democratic Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sriracha john Posted June 29, 2009 Author Share Posted June 29, 2009 Puea Thai Party beats Chart Thai Pattana Party in Sisaket by-election SISAKET, 29 June 2009 (NNT) – The Opposition Puea Thai Party won the by-election yesterday in the northeastern province of Sisaket. Puea Thai Party candidate Surachart Charnpradit beat his rival from the coalition Chart Thai Pattana Party, Sakulthip Angkhasakulkiat, by 47,892 votes. The victory increases the number of Puea Thai Party MPs to 188. The voter turnout was 210,610 or 61.80% with 5 complaints on electoral fraud. The Election Commission said it will finish investigating the complaints within one week. -- NNT 2009-06-29 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sriracha john Posted June 29, 2009 Author Share Posted June 29, 2009 EC to review legality of former PM's phone-in during by-election BANGKOK, 29 June 2009 (NNT) – The Election Commission (EC) will probe a phone-in by deposed Prime Minister Thaksin Shinawatra to his supporters during the recent by-election in Sisaket province. EC member Sodsri Sattayathum said Thaksin's phone-in to anti-government protesters in Sisaket province during the past weekend's by-election might be considered inappropriate persuasion and endorsement of the opposition Puea Thai Party. Ms Sodsri said a special committee had been formed to review the matter. However, she commented that the accusation of voter persuasion might be offensive to the voters. -- NNT 2009-06-29 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
samgrowth Posted June 29, 2009 Share Posted June 29, 2009 Frustrating isn't it that Thais keep on voting in a way we don't approve of. Keep voting for the wrong party? The right party that Thai voters must vote for is PAD. Oops, I keep forgetting that PAD is not a political party. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
hammered Posted June 29, 2009 Share Posted June 29, 2009 Frustrating isn't it that Thais keep on voting in a way we don't approve of. Keep voting for the wrong party? The right party that Thai voters must vote for is PAD. Oops, I keep forgetting that PAD is not a political party. Tis now. Just hasnt stood in elections yet, if they ever will..... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
grandpops Posted June 29, 2009 Share Posted June 29, 2009 Keeping the numbers in perspective... it was only just last January when Puea Thai Party was defeated in 14 out of 19 by-elections... Puea Thai Party Leader Yongyut Vichaidit Puea Thai Party to single out new Leader this week Puea Thai Party Leader cited the Party’s not being prepared and its core leaders banned from politics as main causes for the Party's winning only five seats in the MPs' by-election on Sunday (January 11), adding he was prepared to step down for the Party's new Leader to be Opposition Leader in the House of Representatives. Puea Thai Party Leader Yongyut Vichaidit today attributed his Party's winning a mere five MPs from Sunday's by-election, from a total 19 politicians fielded to contest the election, which was short of its target btw, the Puea Thai Party has still not selected a new Party Leader nor Opposition Leader It's so your precious courts cannot ban him!! They really are running rings round the Abhisits backers arn't they. Technically they are not the Opposition as they won more votes and were gerrymandered out. Thaksin is becoming a big asset again now as Thais are getting the chance to compare life under Abhisit and army meddling to what life was like when Thaksin was taking the country foward. Corruption now much worse than anything you blinkered zealots could accuse Thaksin of. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sriracha john Posted June 30, 2009 Author Share Posted June 30, 2009 Corruption now much worse than anything you blinkered zealots could accuse Thaksin of. hahahahaha... spend some time in Thailand. No way is it anywhere near what Thaksin's unprecedented corruption entailed... If Thaksin is committed to seek Royal Pardon, then he should know the first step is to humble himself before the rule of law instead of acting like he is above the law.Former Philippines President Joseph Estrada served time during his graft trial, hence the justification for the pardon following his conviction. Thaksin's idol Nelson Mandela of South Africa spent decades behind bars before staging a political comeback. On top of the two-year jail verdict issued last year, Thaksin has yet to be tried for 17 other cases. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
webfact Posted June 30, 2009 Share Posted June 30, 2009 Other parties' MPs plan to defect to join Pheu Thai, it claims MPs have been contacting the Pheu Thai Party and asking to join it after its second victory in the northeastern MP by-election, Pheu Thai key member Apiwan Wiriyachai said Monday. The party would be open for all MPs except those who left when the group of Newin Chidchob defected to join the Democrat government, said Apiwan - who is also a Deputy House Speaker. According to the official result of Sunday's by-election, Pheu Thai candidate Surachart Charnpradit defeated Chart Thai Pattana's Sakulthip Angkasakulkiat by 124,327 votes to 76,435. The turnout was 61.8 per cent, with 3.8 per cent of votes invalid. -- The Nation 2009/06/30 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
animatic Posted June 30, 2009 Share Posted June 30, 2009 EC to review legality of former PM's phone-in during by-election BANGKOK, 29 June 2009 (NNT) – The Election Commission (EC) will probe a phone-in by deposed Prime Minister Thaksin Shinawatra to his supporters during the recent by-election in Sisaket province. EC member Sodsri Sattayathum said Thaksin's phone-in to anti-government protesters in Sisaket province during the past weekend's by-election might be considered inappropriate persuasion and endorsement of the opposition Puea Thai Party. Ms Sodsri said a special committee had been formed to review the matter. However, she commented that the accusation of voter persuasion might be offensive to the voters. -- NNT 2009-06-29 Interesting development. Maybe banned IS banned after all? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
hammered Posted June 30, 2009 Share Posted June 30, 2009 EC to review legality of former PM's phone-in during by-election BANGKOK, 29 June 2009 (NNT) – The Election Commission (EC) will probe a phone-in by deposed Prime Minister Thaksin Shinawatra to his supporters during the recent by-election in Sisaket province. EC member Sodsri Sattayathum said Thaksin's phone-in to anti-government protesters in Sisaket province during the past weekend's by-election might be considered inappropriate persuasion and endorsement of the opposition Puea Thai Party. Ms Sodsri said a special committee had been formed to review the matter. However, she commented that the accusation of voter persuasion might be offensive to the voters. -- NNT 2009-06-29 Interesting development. Maybe banned IS banned after all? However, the only way to stop Thaksin influencing elections may well be to not have elections! Everyone knows PTP or whatever they become next are Thaksin's party and canvassers make it quite clear. At the end of the day support/sympathy for Thaksin cannot be legislated or judged away. Even if he were to end up in jail he would retain a lot of support. That is reality that cannot be denied whether people like it or not. At some point the country has to move on and that still means finding a set of things the majority can agree over. It increasingly looks like Thaksin cannot be taken completely out of the equation and at some point must be accomodated in some way unless of course rumours of his cancer are real. It increasingly looks like those sided with him politcally (PTP MPs and red shirts) cannot break ranks even if they want to as it is his pulling power rather than theirs that is paramount. It also looks like nobody has the ability to deliver a knock out blow and so this will become a long drawn out war of attrition with bad ramifications for the country or a deal of some kind must be cobbled together. That obviosuly everyone doesnt want to be on the losing side is maybe a positive as deal ensure their are no losers. It is all going to make for interesting times and no doubt it will go wrong. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
HagenvonTronje Posted June 30, 2009 Share Posted June 30, 2009 Banned is banned, end of argument. Unless you approve of banned politicians using their influence to win elections for others? Seems that might be the case. what means banned actually? the banned person can not be an party executive for that period or run for elections. there was an interesting interview a couple of moth ago with Sodsri Satayathum, a member of the EC concerning that issue. here in The Nation. there have been also a couple of accusation towards the government of working together with banned politicans. hereby the EC took a soft approach and didn't saw big problems, instead of argue banned is banned. period. a similar discussion we had already http://www.thaivisa.com/forum/Puea-Thai-Cl...eo-t262835.html everybody can file a complaint and the EC will look into the issue. let's wait what the outcome will be. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
nitecm Posted June 30, 2009 Share Posted June 30, 2009 It also looks like nobody has the ability to deliver a knock out blow and so this will become a long drawn out war of attrition with bad ramifications for the country or a deal of some kind must be cobbled together. That obviosuly everyone doesnt want to be on the losing side is maybe a positive as deal ensure their are no losers. It is all going to make for interesting times and no doubt it will go wrong. It always has a way to solve. Can and can not is always under the table Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
animatic Posted June 30, 2009 Share Posted June 30, 2009 The ancient chinese curse says: "May you live in interesting times." This certainly could be called the chinese putting the proverb to good use... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
grandpops Posted June 30, 2009 Share Posted June 30, 2009 It also looks like nobody has the ability to deliver a knock out blow and so this will become a long drawn out war of attrition with bad ramifications for the country or a deal of some kind must be cobbled together. That obviosuly everyone doesnt want to be on the losing side is maybe a positive as deal ensure their are no losers.It is all going to make for interesting times and no doubt it will go wrong. It always has a way to solve. Can and can not is always under the table TRT, Thaksin, PTP whatever is the name of the day after Army interference are more than capable of delivering a knock out blow at the ballot box. The incredible amount of interference in the elction after the coup, the state of emergency remaining in parts of the north so they could block canvassing radio and tv stations, the banning of parties and politicians, AND, AND AND what is most interesting about this, The Democrats still couldn't win the election!!! The Army had to put PAD in to bat to remove two prime ministers, one for cooking on TV which I still find incredible, and seek the assistance of the most odious politician in the country. They will undoutedly unseat this lot and it just remains to be seen how much influence the enemies of democracy and their supporters feel they can get away with this time. Will they try again to influence the election? Will they ban partys from standing? or will they just ban elections? There is no democracy at the moment so its only a small step to outright dictatorship. Even they must be tiring of their puppets embarrasingly poor performance by now and considering a shift to the red camp. At some stage soon, they are going to have to make a deal with Thaksin as if they leave it too late, they run the risk of him coming back and outsting them once and for all! This appears more likely than Abhisit getting elected and the Thai politicians obvisouly sense something is in the air. Much as they have tried to ouster Thaksin, they would rather their snouts remain in the trough with him in power than have him remove their concessions. If it becomes clear they (PTP) are gaining the upper hand, support will snowball as it does here. PAD are only going to gain votes of wooly middle class who are in a real minority. As much as anything, many of this middle class elite (who are actually nearer in terms of wealth to the poorest farmers than they are to any of the real elite) have become unemployed and are thus not even middle class anymore. PS middle class in Thailand is well below unemployment benefit rates in the uk! So they are not that middle class. You could expect a minimum of 16k baht per month, plus all rent paid and travel expenses for getting around town. Thats just a single persons amount. Once you have children you are looking at many thousands more. Many many thousands more so give it a rest with this supposed intellegentsia. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
baht&sold Posted June 30, 2009 Share Posted June 30, 2009 Pheu Thai to fire 2 MPs The Pheu Thai Party is planning to fire two party MPs who have not resigned from the party but are planning to defect to join the Bhum Jai Thai Party. Pheu Thai Party spokesman Prompong Nopparit said the party would summons Sakhon Nakhon MP Chumpol Bunyai and Sara Buri MP Porapol Adireksarn. It wanted clarification of their actions after the party's disciplinary and ethical committee resolved the two broke the party's regulation number 49 for joining political activities of other parties, violating Article 106 (7). -- The Nation 30 June 2009 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
baht&sold Posted June 30, 2009 Share Posted June 30, 2009 Pheu Thai to fire 2 MPs It wanted clarification of their actions after the party's disciplinary and ethical committee resolved the two broke the party's regulation number 49 for joining political activities of other parties, violating Article 106 (7). Ah well, win a couple, lose a couple. Who'd have thunk it, Puea Thai apparently has an 'ETHICAL committee'... (one wonders if this is headed by proxy PM in waiting Chalerm?) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
nitecm Posted July 1, 2009 Share Posted July 1, 2009 Puea Thai takes aim at Newin stronghold The Puea Thai Party is banking on ousted prime minister Thaksin Shinawatra's phone-ins to help it win voter support in Newin Chidchob's political strongholds. Thaksin's speeches are expected to attract voters to gatherings in Buri Ram and Surin, which have been support bases for Mr Newin, a former aide to Thaksin. http://www.bangkokpost.com/news/local/1941...ewin-stronghold Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
HagenvonTronje Posted July 1, 2009 Share Posted July 1, 2009 Thaksin thanks Puea Thai by-election campaigning teams BANGKOK, 1 July 2009 (NNT) – Former Prime Minister Thaksin Shinawatra phoned-in talk to thank Puea Thai MPs and the election campaigning team in helping each other towards the two victories in the northeastern provinces by-elections. During the Puea Thai’s victory celebration of the by-elections, Mr Thaksin said he would make CDs on solutions to the economic woes for the Puea Thai party to be used in conducting policies and perform better, estimating that the Government would experience problems from the failure to solve the economic crisis within two to three months. Meanwhile, Puea Thai MPs Chairperson Police Captain Chalerm Yubamrung introduced Ms Yingluck Shinawatra, a sister of Mr Thaksin to the media, saying that he would like to support her to become the new Puea Thai party leader for her eligible qualification. However, Ms Yingluck had declined, citing that she was not fully ready for politics. -- NNT 1 July 2009 article here Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
animatic Posted July 1, 2009 Share Posted July 1, 2009 What a nice spin they put on the most likely drunken remarks made and refuted before witnesses within seconds of each utterance. And causing toute de suite, a grand swirl of denunciations and lacklustrous spinmeistering. No disarray and lack of leadership here, oh no. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
nitecm Posted July 2, 2009 Share Posted July 2, 2009 PM's visit to Buri Ram will be a contest to http://www.nationmultimedia.com/breakingnews/30106583/PMs-visit-to-Buri-Ram-will-be-a-contest-to-Thaksin -- The Nation 2 June 2009 If 2000 Baht will give to the those lost the job and the low income farmers...... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
hammered Posted July 3, 2009 Share Posted July 3, 2009 PM's visit to Buri Ram will be a contest to http://www.nationmultimedia.com/breakingnews/30106583/PMs-visit-to-Buri-Ram-will-be-a-contest-to-Thaksin -- The Nation 2 June 2009 If 2000 Baht will give to the those lost the job and the low income farmers...... Not exactly unfriendly territory as it is Newinland and iirc the Dems had an MP in Buri Ram not that long ago Interesting that Chavarit seems to see Abhisit as a politcal asset on the government side even in the Isaan. I was recently in the North (not Isaan) and was surprised that even though farmers didnt really like the government Abhisit was viewed in a lot better light even by hardline Thaksin lovers. Seemed weird to me but he definitely seems to be the governments strong point right now and is going to be sold as such. Cant see him doing a Thaksin though. He isnt narcissistic enough even if he ends up dishing out largesse way beyond Thaksin his lack of narcissm will mitigate against the creation of a Thaksin like image Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sbk Posted July 3, 2009 Share Posted July 3, 2009 Posts have been deleted. Enough with the petty bickering please. Suspensions are going to get handed out if this continues. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DaleBlue Posted July 3, 2009 Share Posted July 3, 2009 I hope no egg throwing in Buri Ram. I really like Mark. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
nitecm Posted July 3, 2009 Share Posted July 3, 2009 Not exactly unfriendly territory as it is Newinland and iirc the Dems had an MP in Buri Ram not that long ago Interesting that Chavarit seems to see Abhisit as a politcal asset on the government side even in the Isaan. I was recently in the North (not Isaan) and was surprised that even though farmers didnt really like the government Abhisit was viewed in a lot better light even by hardline Thaksin lovers. Seemed weird to me but he definitely seems to be the governments strong point right now and is going to be sold as such. Cant see him doing a Thaksin though. He isnt narcissistic enough even if he ends up dishing out largesse way beyond Thaksin his lack of narcissm will mitigate against the creation of a Thaksin like image Agree but his partner can use the resouces to penetrate their network Around 40 % did not turn up to vote .They may be working in other places or no bother at all .I felt that these people were mostly stay at the towns and they are sick of politic . So what is the chance of PAD ? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
animatic Posted July 5, 2009 Share Posted July 5, 2009 40% not turning out. Not a surprise. Working else where would explain a large percentage of that no doubt. Even with the down turn of tourism, there are still MANY workers down this way and not registered at the local Ampur as residents, but obviously here. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
hammered Posted July 5, 2009 Share Posted July 5, 2009 That the urban working class are still registered to vote by land papers in a province far away and for MPs who dont know, understand or care for their issues is something amny miss. This disenfrachised group need to be reincluded in Thailand's future by being allowed to voite for MPs where they actually live and work rather than at the piece of land they remain tied to in archaic feudal fashion. The PAD party wont do well but they will decrease the Dems number of seats imho which is probably the aim as now that creates pressure. The Dems also have internal problems Newin will try to use the largesse to do better in the Isaan but it will take time and not be to the liking of Isaan Dems - they have seats in Ubon, Yasothon and Amnat Charoen as well as on the Isaan lists. Newin needs time to create optimim conditions. PTP dont want him to have time and it seems Isaan Dems dont either. Interesting politics. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
otherstuff1957 Posted July 5, 2009 Share Posted July 5, 2009 ^That's a very good point. Many people who work and live in Bangkok are still registered with upcountry Amphurs. They live here, but they are counted as residents of Nakhon Wherever and vote for MPs up there (if they vote at all). Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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