Shooting In Our Village

[Charlieben]

I am looking for some advice as to handle this situation...

My Thai wife and I live in a Quality House Village which has a good secure, family oriented, environment. Out of nearly 400 homes I think we have the one with the neighbour that is the 'odd one out'. He is supposed to have 4 massage parlours (so he told us), and comes across as a bit of a thai mafia style.

After listening to many many arguments between him and his wife, it finally came to an exclamation mark last night, with the husband firing 4 shots out in the soi at about 7:30pm. After hearing this I went down to see what had happened, found his wife out the front of their place, baby in arms, sitting on the driveway crying. I was going to ask her if she was ok, when I looked over into the house and saw the husband holding a pistol, at which point I quickly went back to my own place to phone my wife and get her to call the police.

During this time the couple continued to argue (screaming at the top of their lungs), about 10 mins had elapsed, and I heard their car start up. Once again, I went outside to see what was happening. The wife was now at the end of the soi, and the husband was heading towards her in the car. I stood out in the middle of the soi in front of my house, so the husband could see I was watching, hoping to deter him from doing something stupid.

When he reached her he opened the car door, got out, pulled out his gun again, cocked the trigger and pointed it at her head. I could not believe what I was seeing. Only one brave security guard stood by to observe, the rest just took off. By they way, there are many parents and children in the streets at this time. He did not shoot her, but dragged her back to their house, arguing continued, a load thud, then nothing.

By this time I am frantically calling my wife saying where are the bloody police, it must have been a half hour by now. She ends up having to get them from the police station, and bring them to our house.

When they get here, they were pathetic, so casual about something that is so serious, just a husband wife argument they said. They told us they could do nothing as they did not see it 1st hand they could only ring his doorbell, and ask him to come out. I could not beleive this, they have multiple witnesses, spent cartridges on the ground. After a few attempts they were actually going to leave. At this point I got very angry, and we basically had to bully the police into persisting to get the shooter out of his house, and down to the station. From what my wife overheard they took his gun away from him.

We shouldn't have to put up with this in our environment, nobody, in any country, should have to.

What Thai laws has he broken?, what are the penalties?, how can I best handle this?

My wife wants to keep a low profile, but fcuked if i'm going to cower in my own home, especially since he would be the only one of his sort in the village. It's actually become a very sour issue between my wife and I.

Any advice?

[TerryLH]

Which do you treasure most?

A: Acting stupidly (in a situation you don't know enough about), or

B: Your wife.

Pick one and get on with it.

Do you think that your interference will go over well with your gun toting neighbor?

Do you think the police will get there faster when someone calls them to say you've been shot?

Edited July 9, 2009 by TerryLH

[Mosha]

As the 1 st reply hints stay out of it. I had 3 people I know who were hired guns within 6 kms of where I live. One got shot by coughcoughpolice police last month one is retired, and one is awaiting trial for killing Dale Henry. Look that up. The last one rides past our home daily. Learn to cope, unless the threats are to your IMMEDIATE family, it's not your business. You'll live longer.

[phazey]

Any advice?

Yeah, not a bad first post. keep it up.

[Charlieben]

It's not as if we live in some dodgy neighbourhood, this gated village is extremely family orientated. Also, it's not as if I am acting like a hero, bare minimum I would say.

'None of my business', I beg to differ. This is my neighbourhood. I should have the right to not put up with that. Is that really an acceptable standard of living for Thai's?

[mrtoad]

Any advice?

Move house, or stay quiet. I suspect that your neighbour is pretty well connected, hence the reason that the police seem reluctant to do anything. In a situation like this, listen to the local, even though you know it's wrong, you are in Thailand.

[mrtoad]

It's not as if we live in some dodgy neighbourhood, this gated village is extremely family orientated. Also, it's not as if I am acting like a hero, bare minimum I would say.

'None of my business', I beg to differ. This is my neighbourhood. I should have the right to not put up with that. Is that really an acceptable standard of living for Thai's?

Up to you.

[Datsun240Z]

Welcome to Thailand, still can't believe why Thai woman bash on farang men.....if they rather want something like this?

Just don't interfair with it. Especially if he has a gun here. Police won't do anything, get used to it.

[G54]

You should know that your interference in this as a foreigner is not going to pull any weight. Connections are worth so much here and if he has some and you do not, then, as the foreigner you are going to be the one on the receiving end of trouble.

It is hard enough to get 'crazies' moved out in places like the UK with ASBOS and evidence. What real chance do you think you have of doing something about this?

Advice? Sell up and move out. Leave it to the Thai people to sort the problem. You and yours come first.

[imaneggspurt]

It's not as if we live in some dodgy neighbourhood, this gated village is extremely family orientated. Also, it's not as if I am acting like a hero, bare minimum I would say.

'None of my business', I beg to differ. This is my neighbourhood. I should have the right to not put up with that. Is that really an acceptable standard of living for Thai's?

well it wasnt !,....".It's not as if we live in some dodgy neighbourhood," ...my advice, be very careful with some thais, especially ones with a gun !, it may be that the police know him ? thais are very clicky,.if he realises you called the police i think you may have some problems ahead,dont forget you are a farang, you have no rights to do anyhing ( in their eyes ) i wish you luck, but hope you dont need it,.

[imaneggspurt]

You should know that your interference in this as a foreigner is not going to pull any weight. Connections are worth so much here and if he has some and you do not, then, as the foreigner you are going to be the one on the receiving end of trouble.

It is hard enough to get 'crazies' moved out in places like the UK with ASBOS and evidence. What real chance do you think you have of doing something about this?

Advice? Sell up and move out. Leave it to the Thai people to sort the problem. You and yours come first.

my feelings entirely,good area or not the family must have top priority,with this nutcase about i wouldnt feel safe after calling the police on him,

[pattaya_girl]

Thai people just hate getting involved with trouble, they hate it so much, i would say that most of them would sit back and watch someone get hurt rather than get involved.

As for us Farangs, even if we are advised to not get involved, its very hard when it looks like someone is going to get seriously hurt. I think you did the right thing in letting him see you, and of course getting the Police, at least now it might be down on record, and if there are further problems, the police might remember.

Good luck to you, and lets hope this Mafia man's Gun breaks so he cannot threaten his Lady anymore. He must not be very strong to have to scare someone with a Gun - the Loser.

[highlander76]

Listen to your wife you are in Thailand never get involved in someone elses marriage agruments, if he is thai mafia thai police will do f"ck all

[Charlieben]

Seems to be a common thread of shut up and don't say anything. It's a pity because it's a pretty poor reflection on Thai society.

This would be an easy one to sort out back home, he's not so tough, actually very pathetic.

What sort of man points a loaded gun at their wife?

What sort of man fires bullets into a neighbourhood full of kids?

What sort of man turns off all the lights in the house, and hides when the police come knocking - I doubt he's well connected with our local police, otherwise he wouldn't have cowered in his house.

Can you imagine how fast this clown would be sorted out back in the west. I am sure that 99% of people (thai) in the village feel the same way as I do, but don't want to get involved. If everyone backed each here, he'd fold like a cheap suit. Doubt he'd take on the whole village.

I know what Thai's are like when it comes to this stuff, but how much does it take?, how well do the odds have to be stacked in your favour before you step up to the plate?

I mean this is pathetic, do we have to wait until someone's kid cops a bullet in the noodle from this guy before something is done.

[highlander76]

Seems to be a common thread of shut up and don't say anything. It's a pity because it's a pretty poor reflection on Thai society.

This would be an easy one to sort out back home, he's not so tough, actually very pathetic.

What sort of man points a loaded gun at their wife?

What sort of man fires bullets into a neighbourhood full of kids?

What sort of man turns off all the lights in the house, and hides when the police come knocking - I doubt he's well connected with our local police, otherwise he wouldn't have cowered in his house.

Can you imagine how fast this clown would be sorted out back in the west. I am sure that 99% of people (thai) in the village feel the same way as I do, but don't want to get involved. If everyone backed each here, he'd fold like a cheap suit. Doubt he'd take on the whole village.

I know what Thai's are like when it comes to this stuff, but how much does it take?, how well do the odds have to be stacked in your favour before you step up to the plate?

I mean this is pathetic, do we have to wait until someone's kid cops a bullet in the noodle from this guy before something is done.

Sad but true

[imaneggspurt]

Seems to be a common thread of shut up and don't say anything. It's a pity because it's a pretty poor reflection on Thai society.

This would be an easy one to sort out back home, he's not so tough, actually very pathetic.

What sort of man points a loaded gun at their wife?

What sort of man fires bullets into a neighbourhood full of kids?

What sort of man turns off all the lights in the house, and hides when the police come knocking - I doubt he's well connected with our local police, otherwise he wouldn't have cowered in his house.

Can you imagine how fast this clown would be sorted out back in the west. I am sure that 99% of people (thai) in the village feel the same way as I do, but don't want to get involved. If everyone backed each here, he'd fold like a cheap suit. Doubt he'd take on the whole village.

I know what Thai's are like when it comes to this stuff, but how much does it take?, how well do the odds have to be stacked in your favour before you step up to the plate?

I mean this is pathetic, do we have to wait until someone's kid cops a bullet in the noodle from this guy before something is done.

"What sort of man points a loaded gun at their wife?

What sort of man fires bullets into a neighbourhood full of kids? " Answer ,A dangerous one, and the scary bit is as ive said before when they are mad they dont consider the consequences,.Safety first remember

[kurnell]

Very easy to say 'pack up and leave', and very, very unhelpful.

If you have invested time and effort in Thailand, bought a house and planned a future (like I have, and probably Charlieben too), then packing up and moving ain't a great option just because some pathetic local, with small nuts is trying to show what a man he is by assaulting a woman with a child.

Hopefully we can keep this thread open long enough so that someone with some useful advice can comment, rather than more of the same nonsense written above.

My advice would be to talk to the neighbors and get a little coalition going to decide how best to deal with the idiot. I am sure some of the families with kids would be very keen to see the back of him. With 400 houses in the village he cannot be the only bloke with connections, if in fact he has. With any luck, a local with higher connections will do the job for you.

[pattaya_girl]

I did'nt think it was nonsense, this is a forum, where one can express there views.

[norwayeagle]

Get urself this 1.

......(jokiing)

[imaneggspurt]

Very easy to say 'pack up and leave', and very, very unhelpful.

If you have invested time and effort in Thailand, bought a house and planned a future (like I have, and probably Charlieben too), then packing up and moving ain't a great option just because some pathetic local, with small nuts is trying to show what a man he is by assaulting a woman with a child.

Hopefully we can keep this thread open long enough so that someone with some useful advice can comment, rather than more of the same nonsense written above.

My advice would be to talk to the neighbors and get a little coalition going to decide how best to deal with the idiot. I am sure some of the families with kids would be very keen to see the back of him. With 400 houses in the village he cannot be the only bloke with connections, if in fact he has. With any luck, a local with higher connections will do the job for you.

Thats the logical western approach, and there lies the problem,.by the way hes not pathetic with small nuts, hes a lunatic with a gun, in the west ive never been a coward and would always stand my ground, but thats in the west, not here in the "wild west ",.i wouldnt sleep easy with him for a neighbor would you ? ......and as for knocking on doors trying to form a commitee to get rid of him ,well lets hope he dosent hear about it,.,the truth is there is no easy answer, it may be a one off and its all forgotten,then again a dog that bites once dosent usually stop there,...

[Orac]

Charlieben,

Has this man had any specific trouble with yourself or other neighbours in the past ? Also would be interested to know how long you have been neighbours.

If he is not a DIRECT threat to yourself I would take your wifes advice and not get involved - if it is a problem between him and his wife it is up to her to take some action or, at the very least, ask for some help. As for talking to other neighbours about it, and there is no direct threat to you or them, I would be vary wary about word getting back to him as, if he is dangerous enough to point a gun at his wifes head, then I wouldn't fancy your chances.

Orac

[Maizefarmer]

I am looking for some advice as to handle this situation...

My Thai wife and I live in a Quality House Village which has a good secure, family oriented, environment. Out of nearly 400 homes I think we have the one with the neighbour that is the 'odd one out'. He is supposed to have 4 massage parlours (so he told us), and comes across as a bit of a thai mafia style.

After listening to many many arguments between him and his wife, it finally came to an exclamation mark last night, with the husband firing 4 shots out in the soi at about 7:30pm. After hearing this I went down to see what had happened, found his wife out the front of their place, baby in arms, sitting on the driveway crying. I was going to ask her if she was ok, when I looked over into the house and saw the husband holding a pistol, at which point I quickly went back to my own place to phone my wife and get her to call the police.

During this time the couple continued to argue (screaming at the top of their lungs), about 10 mins had elapsed, and I heard their car start up. Once again, I went outside to see what was happening. The wife was now at the end of the soi, and the husband was heading towards her in the car. I stood out in the middle of the soi in front of my house, so the husband could see I was watching, hoping to deter him from doing something stupid.

When he reached her he opened the car door, got out, pulled out his gun again, cocked the trigger and pointed it at her head. I could not believe what I was seeing. Only one brave security guard stood by to observe, the rest just took off. By they way, there are many parents and children in the streets at this time. He did not shoot her, but dragged her back to their house, arguing continued, a load thud, then nothing.

By this time I am frantically calling my wife saying where are the bloody police, it must have been a half hour by now. She ends up having to get them from the police station, and bring them to our house.

When they get here, they were pathetic, so casual about something that is so serious, just a husband wife argument they said. They told us they could do nothing as they did not see it 1st hand they could only ring his doorbell, and ask him to come out. I could not beleive this, they have multiple witnesses, spent cartridges on the ground. After a few attempts they were actually going to leave. At this point I got very angry, and we basically had to bully the police into persisting to get the shooter out of his house, and down to the station. From what my wife overheard they took his gun away from him.

We shouldn't have to put up with this in our environment, nobody, in any country, should have to.

What Thai laws has he broken?, what are the penalties?, how can I best handle this?

My wife wants to keep a low profile, but fcuked if i'm going to cower in my own home, especially since he would be the only one of his sort in the village. It's actually become a very sour issue between my wife and I.

Any advice?

Its called domestic violence - and its a problem in Thailand, but culturaly and traditional something that folk have not involved themselves with - and the police attitude? - unless a partner gets hurt, or makes a formal complaint they are very reluctant to get involved - its lots of paperwork which ultimately comes to nothing (read as: waste of their time), because in the absense of a complaint there is nothing they can do anyway.

[Datsun240Z]

Listen to your wife you are in Thailand never get involved in someone elses marriage agruments, if he is thai mafia thai police will do f"ck all

I agree, but if bullets are flying around.....

[Charlieben]

Thanks Kurnell, appreciated. It's obviously not that easy to just sell up and move. I sure those of you who own a house understand.

It would be great to hear if anyone has an idea on exactly what laws have been broken by his actions? I would have thought there were some very strict laws about firing a gun in public, and pointing a loaded weapon at someone.

[sbk]

As MF points out, it's domestic violence and police and neighbors are reluctant to get involved in domestic disputes. The general feeling is that what happens between a husband and his wife are their business. An attitude that was prevalent in the West not so long ago, so lets not all pat our backs on our superiority and how low Thai men are. Domestic violence (either against the wife or the husband) has been and still is a major problem in Asia and the west.

Solution? Not a whole heck of a lot, I am afraid. You cannot deal with this on your own and the police won't do anything until she's seriously injured and willing to press charges and most abused spouses are not willing to press charges, even in the west--that is why most western countries had to change the laws so that abusive partners could be charged by the police. Or she ends up dead and he is charged with murder. If you were friends with her I would suggest informing her family, but since it appears you do not know her at all, I don't know that you have any recourse to the law at all. It is really up to her to press charges.

Firing a gun in public is against the law, sure but so are alot of other things the police do nothing about.

[jackspratt]

I mean this is pathetic, do we have to wait until someone's kid cops a bullet in the noodle from this guy before something is done.

"What sort of man points a loaded gun at their wife?

What sort of man fires bullets into a neighbourhood full of kids? " Answer ,A dangerous one, and the scary bit is as ive said before when they are mad they dont consider the consequences,.Safety first remember

How about one of Thailand's finest BiB!

At 12:00 hrs. today on 4 July 2009, Pol. Colonel Prasong Kongpanya, an investigations officer with the Nong Khai provincial police, Meung district, was notified of a a shooting incident that took place at Baan Dao Reung, Tambol Song Hong, Meung district of Nong Khan province, and thus reported the incident to the local police commissioner.

Police subsequently went to the scene for investigation. The incident took place at House no. 112 Moo 6, Baan Reung, Tambol Song Hong, Meung district of Nong Khai.

Adjacent to the house were found large quantities of bloodstains; the injured had been taken to the Nong Khai hospital. It was later discovered that his name was Sarn Chaisarn, aged 12, residing in the same village. He had been shot with an 11 millimeter bullet in the center of the face, bullet lodged inside, and had earlier been reported in critical condition. Doctors attempted to resuscitate the victim but were unable to save him.

In their investigation, police questioned the instigator of the incident, police senior sergeant major Pathomchai Sukwhaiya, aged 44, who was responsible for guarding a suspect as he was attached to the Nong Khai court at the time. From their investigations, police questioned Mrs. Soomla Wirasakdi, age 41, the boy's aunt. She told police that before the incident she had been transplanting rice seedlings behind the house belonging to the police sergeant major, which was a bit away form where the shooting took place. The child had been sitting playing in front of the house, but about thirty meters away.

All morning, she told investigators, there was loud shouting as the police sergeant major had been arguing with his wife, until approximately 11:00 a.m. At that time two men in a pickup truck, arrived to collect daily payment for debts the police sergeant major had incurred. They parked in front of the home and asked about payment of debt for purchase of a bicycle that the police officer's wife had bought. The daily debt payment was 200 Baht. But the discussions turned heated, with the police senior sergeant major cursing the two with vile language. They hurriedly turned about and jumped in the truck to leave.

As the truck was speeding off, the police sergeant major fired off two rounds at the men, but missed, with one stray bullet catching the young child instead. Police investigations and prosecution of the case continue, but it was learned that the sergeant major's wife had leased the bicycle without his knowledge and that the argument that morning was over the increasing debts incurred.

http://www.thekoratpost.com/headlines.html

[Charlieben]

Charlieben,

Has this man had any specific trouble with yourself or other neighbours in the past ? Also would be interested to know how long you have been neighbours.

If he is not a DIRECT threat to yourself I would take your wifes advice and not get involved - if it is a problem between him and his wife it is up to her to take some action or, at the very least, ask for some help. As for talking to other neighbours about it, and there is no direct threat to you or them, I would be vary wary about word getting back to him as, if he is dangerous enough to point a gun at his wifes head, then I wouldn't fancy your chances.

Orac

No trouble with the neighbours in the past, it's always big issues with his wife. The police have been around a few times to sort them out. Even 2 days ago the cops were here to sort out some issue they had with a previous nanny.

We have been neighbours for about 1.5 years.

As for a direct threat, I'm talking about public safety, who knows where one of these stray bullets will go? I personally don't feel scared of this guy as an individual. I don't understand exactly what issues he and his wife have, but she's no angel, and I'm sure she's doing a bit to set him off. Yes, I'm not 100% certain, but I can't see him turning his anger, like his does to his wife, directly onto me.

I think there is a difference between him getting pissed off for my calling out his stupid behaviour, and whatever his wife does to get him wound up. Yeah Yeah I know big call considering he has a gun, but that's how I assess it.

[cat5]

If the woman wants to protect herself then she should

a) file a complaint with the police herself

move out

Option (a) probably wouldn't have much effect and option ( will damage her finances.

Either way, it's not your problem.

Edited July 9, 2009 by cat5

[Charlieben]

Its called domestic violence - and its a problem in Thailand, but culturaly and traditional something that folk have not involved themselves with - and the police attitude? - unless a partner gets hurt, or makes a formal complaint they are very reluctant to get involved - its lots of paperwork which ultimately comes to nothing (read as: waste of their time), because in the absense of a complaint there is nothing they can do anyway.

Hear what you're saying, but even a 12 year old could work out that it's no longer just a domestic violence issue anymore, when you start spraying bullets around the neighbourhood - It's a HUGE public safety issue now.

If they want to kill each other, knock yourself out, and as many people are advising here, mind you own business, don't bring it out into the public.

[MSingh]

It's not as if we live in some dodgy neighbourhood, this gated village is extremely family orientated. Also, it's not as if I am acting like a hero, bare minimum I would say.

'None of my business', I beg to differ. This is my neighbourhood. I should have the right to not put up with that. Is that really an acceptable standard of living for Thai's?

Aha, here's where you go wrong..

Whether you listen or believe what i say is up to you, but it's the truth..

Forget everything that you learned growing up in your own Country, forget rights, you have little or none in Thailand.

Forget morals & manners, the majority are not recognised here.

Then best thing you can do, even if we both agree that it's not the right thing to do, is ignore it because it will ONLY end one way for you & that won't be getting a Bravery Award or " Villager of the Month " award from the Phu Yai Baan, you'll be hurt here in Thailand, because that's what they do..

Life's cheap here, yours included...

The reaction of the Old Bill should tell you everything about what protection you have here, none whatsoever..

Be careful Fella, & good luck..