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The Real Thailand Vs Your Thailand


dondraper

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I reject the notion that deprivation is superior to consumption. Where did this silly modern idea come from?

I guess, partially from the fact that deprivation does not wreck the world - consumption does

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OP, ".....I love the fact........that everyone is so poor..". I'm not sure how to take that, but regardless, this is an interesting topic.

I met my GF on the internet years ago. When I finally flew to BKK, she drove 5 hours to pick me up, then took me around the country in her car.

I've never been a "tourist" type of tourist and always prefer to get off the beaten track. It was unavoidable at times to go to the tourist hot-spots (a night or two on Koh Chang and a night in Pattaya on the way back to BKK, a few days in BKK etc) and the difference between the touristy places and the non-tourist places was significant.

It's not just that the "real" places didn't have the two-price system or sleazy-looking sex tourists holding hands with minors (I was shocked in Pattaya!), it was the genuiness of the people.

There was also the novelty of people pointing, "Farang, farang!"...funny that. I got into the habit of it myself whenever we were in a small 99.99% Thai town and saw another white man, hehe.

I can't say that I'm an experienced Siamophile, but I do love the Thailand unsullied by foreign values, interference, and sleaze.

Some pleasant memories wandering on my own while the GF attended to the family business:

Walking past a group of old men sitting on the sidewalk playing maak rook. Seeing the open jawed suprise of a shopkeeper when I walked into a shop selling traditional Thai instruments (What's HE doing here???). The amusement of the bystanders when I unthinkingly asked a samlor to take me somewhere (I'm not fat, but at 85 kg I was a burden...I felt guilty afterwards...the tip must have made it worth it for him though :D ). Once I stopped and asked a group of school kids for directions to an internet cafe...they pointed and tried to explain. I took off in the direction, but inadvertantly walked right past the cafe....the kids must have been watching me, because one of them ran after me and took me back to the right place....kind and considerate. Outside a bar at closing time there was a fight...some strangers who had been talking to me insisted that I don't go and look, probably for my own safety. I went to Mae Sot with GF's brother to deliver 2500 dozen eggs, what a white-knuckled drive that was! Meeting Burmese workers, drinking beer with the locals. Locals shouting me beers at 7 am at a street vendor's bbq because of the novelty to them of a farang eating the extra spicy sauce they had. Asking a waiter to take my bottle of Johnny Walker over to the only other occupied table in the restaurant and then joining the group of soccer players for alot of spontaneous laughter as none could speak English very well, and I only had a small phrase book. Another night, being taken home (my GF's home...they were giving me a lift only) by 2 drunk katoys on one motorbike...that was scary...all 3 of us drunk and on a small bike.....it must have been hilarious to any onlookers.....gosh I could go on. Very pleasant reminisces of non-tourist Thailand.

Yes I agree 100% Places like Pattaya are nothing like Thailand. Pattaya is modeled on western society and caters for farangs. These people who go to Pattaya will return home and tell thier experiences of visiting another country and meeting the people. "Went to Thailand sat on a bar stool, drank the local whiskey, didn't have to venture out as the locals are so friendly the women come to me in the bar. The pizza, KFC and McDonalds in Thailand is good."

.....right on :D pattaya is never going to be thailand. it's more a clone of kasbah, cairo, castro street, sf.,42nd st.,nyc, ginza,tokyo, soho , london, hongkong or bali - all on a minature scale. all the glitz but no substance (mostly) - in the soul when locals and foreigners meet on walking street, :) just like geylang in singapore... :D yes, the ilma la douces are poor and the relationships "developed" are summarised mostly in dollars and cents....of course, nothing wrong with that if no one gets hurt at the end of the day. its all about the pyramids of sacrifices that different income grouips have to make :D

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I reject the notion that deprivation is superior to consumption. Where did this silly modern idea come from?

I guess, partially from the fact that deprivation does not wreck the world - consumption does

True, but VERY few people will give up consumptionism for deprivation if given a choice. Most people will accept what ever is easiest and most convenient. The tremendous growth in fast food products in Thailand is an example. Those that CHOOSE a form of deprivation usually only dabble at it for a short time, and normally have something to go back to later. Very few people choose to become monks.

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There is always talk in these types of web communities from expats who have obtained a higher knowledge of Thailand and Thai people than the other foreigners living here via the discovery of what is commonly referred to as 'The Real Thailand'. This experience is traditionally described in terms of emotional and spiritual connections formed with Thai citizens. Eek hints at it in this post:

"As a side note..some men who may be attracted to the more superficial side of Thailand may wonder why others (men too, not just women) would come to Thailand. They may not see or know another side to Thailand. Their lives are in the tourist hotspots and perched on various barstools. If they actually got out there and looked around the place, they may see another side. A side where people actually treat each other with some respect"

I thought it would be interesting to hear what everyone's Thailand is. My Thailand is not very different from my America. Its primarily based on the consumption of food and women. I do not have much, if any, desire to form emotional or spiritual friendships with Thai people beyond my spouse. The best things about Thailand to me, are that everything is cheap, everyone is shorter than I am, the locals are subservient, you don't have to worry about getting robbed or attacked if you don't go looking for it, everywhere you go there are establishments setup for the purpose of male relaxation and they do a very good job at providing that service, the food is delicious, I do not have any problems communicating what I need to communicate to the locals while at the same time not being burdened by knowing what anyone else is saying. I love the fact that everyone smiles so much, the girls are so pretty and available and that everyone is so poor. I love that I do not have to work hard at all to live an awesome, worry free life style here.

What is your Thailand?

55555, everyone is shorter ? Top marks for the honesty.

Anyway my Thialand- Laid back attitude(rented scooter-no brakes, no problem), fun driving, minimal road rage, way less beaurocracy in daily life, way less lawsuit paranoia, the unforced femininity of the women(not like macho western girls), work ethic(everythings open), lots of lieing to smoothen daily life out, the exchange rate, more practical pharmacys, the weather if its not too hot, lots of counterfiet merchandise, currupt cops( atleast you can pay your way out of trouble) the list goes on and on...

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Btw, here is what I look like incase you see me out on the town and want to buy me a shot of rye.

don-draper.jpg

Hmm…the forehead is a bit too big for me, and I don't like a smoker..I can see a ciggy there

Can't see the bottom half well, for all I know it could look like a butterball.

Also…you do look a bit stuck-up, all-that!!…with the "SP" personality (judging from the pix and posts)……a bit turn off - for me.

Btw…not everyone is poor, and throwing ourselves at any first available farang we see. Many of us do have better pick among our own local boys…..better looking, loving, considerate, caring, not a butterfly, not full of themselves,…similar ages & socioeconomic…..etcs

There are plenty of them, single & available!!!

And

Ooh you would be quite surprised how many of us (both white and darker skin tone…also anything in between)…are much richer than a lot of farangs over here.

So don't flatter yourself too much when in thailand…yeah

Those are also another side of the real Thailand, and want to pass them along

Just in case you don't understand the local language well, and some looks you may be getting.

Well you did ask…about the real Thailand.

Just want to contribute something.. :)

Lady, the guy is joking around.

Edited by sokal
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Yes I agree 100% Places like Pattaya are nothing like Thailand. Pattaya is modeled on western society and caters for farangs. These people who go to Pattaya will return home and tell thier experiences of visiting another country and meeting the people. "Went to Thailand sat on a bar stool, drank the local whiskey, didn't have to venture out as the locals are so friendly the women come to me in the bar. The pizza, KFC and McDonalds in Thailand is good."

I disagree, Pattaya is UNIQUE to Thailand. There are very few other places like it in the world... if any. But, is it the ONLY example of Thailand? Of course not, but it is part of a mosaic that makes up the entire country. Comparing Pattaya to Sakhon Nakhon or Ayutthaya is like comparing chalk and cheese.

Unfortunately, the news makers of the world like to portray the seedier part of life because it sells, and in that degree they are successful in their portrayal of Thailand. Everyone in countries outside Thailand hear of the sex tourism business and very little else, and yet that is just a miniscule part of a wonderful country. In Canada and the USA it is just as bad, if not worse. It's only different because North Americans are hypocrites about it.

North Americans are the biggest hypocrites on earth. Every news paper says SEX on the front cover, all girls that are older then 13 read Cosmo magasine that says SEX on the cover. Yahoo news has a SEX story on every day. SEX SEX SEX.

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Yes I agree 100% Places like Pattaya are nothing like Thailand. Pattaya is modeled on western society and caters for farangs. These people who go to Pattaya will return home and tell thier experiences of visiting another country and meeting the people. "Went to Thailand sat on a bar stool, drank the local whiskey, didn't have to venture out as the locals are so friendly the women come to me in the bar. The pizza, KFC and McDonalds in Thailand is good."

I disagree, Pattaya is UNIQUE to Thailand. There are very few other places like it in the world... if any. But, is it the ONLY example of Thailand? Of course not, but it is part of a mosaic that makes up the entire country. Comparing Pattaya to Sakhon Nakhon or Ayutthaya is like comparing chalk and cheese.

Unfortunately, the news makers of the world like to portray the seedier part of life because it sells, and in that degree they are successful in their portrayal of Thailand. Everyone in countries outside Thailand hear of the sex tourism business and very little else, and yet that is just a miniscule part of a wonderful country. In Canada and the USA it is just as bad, if not worse. It's only different because North Americans are hypocrites about it.

North Americans are the biggest hypocrites on earth. Every news paper says SEX on the front cover, all girls that are older then 13 read Cosmo magasine that says SEX on the cover. Yahoo news has a SEX story on every day. SEX SEX SEX.

What's wrong with sex above 18?

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Yes I agree 100% Places like Pattaya are nothing like Thailand. Pattaya is modeled on western society and caters for farangs. These people who go to Pattaya will return home and tell thier experiences of visiting another country and meeting the people. "Went to Thailand sat on a bar stool, drank the local whiskey, didn't have to venture out as the locals are so friendly the women come to me in the bar. The pizza, KFC and McDonalds in Thailand is good."

I disagree, Pattaya is UNIQUE to Thailand. There are very few other places like it in the world... if any. But, is it the ONLY example of Thailand? Of course not, but it is part of a mosaic that makes up the entire country. Comparing Pattaya to Sakhon Nakhon or Ayutthaya is like comparing chalk and cheese.

Unfortunately, the news makers of the world like to portray the seedier part of life because it sells, and in that degree they are successful in their portrayal of Thailand. Everyone in countries outside Thailand hear of the sex tourism business and very little else, and yet that is just a miniscule part of a wonderful country. In Canada and the USA it is just as bad, if not worse. It's only different because North Americans are hypocrites about it.

North Americans are the biggest hypocrites on earth. Every news paper says SEX on the front cover, all girls that are older then 13 read Cosmo magasine that says SEX on the cover. Yahoo news has a SEX story on every day. SEX SEX SEX.

What's wrong with sex above 18?

Nothing, I have a problem with the hypocracy, not the sex.

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I can't see the real Thailand because i'm dripping in fanny batter.

There's the superficial tourist Thailand, there's the "real" unsullied Thailand, and then there's the other Thailand for which "sullied" is an understatement: case in point.

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Nothing, I have a problem with the hypocracy, not the sex.

My point exactly. I see hypocracy everywhere in America... and that includes Canada. The Catholic church's standards are built on hypocracy. I see less of it in Thailand, but it still exists.

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I can't see the real Thailand because i'm dripping in fanny batter.

There's the superficial tourist Thailand, there's the "real" unsullied Thailand, and then there's the other Thailand for which "sullied" is an understatement: case in point.

There is an element that is in between the tourist Thailand and the cultural Thailand. Thailand is a compelling place to visit and live because there is less bureaucracy, less macho attitude and less lawsuit paranoia.

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I can't see the real Thailand because i'm dripping in fanny batter.

There's the superficial tourist Thailand, there's the "real" unsullied Thailand, and then there's the other Thailand for which "sullied" is an understatement: case in point.

There is an element that is in between the tourist Thailand and the cultural Thailand. Thailand is a compelling place to visit and live because there is less bureaucracy, (agree)

less macho attitude (much more in thailand than say Bali)

less lawsuit paranoia. (unless you are a politician)

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Btw, here is what I look like incase you see me out on the town and want to buy me a shot of rye.

don-draper.jpg

Hmm…the forehead is a bit too big for me, and I don't like a smoker..I can see a ciggy there

Can't see the bottom half well, for all I know it could look like a butterball.

Also…you do look a bit stuck-up, all-that!!…with the "SP" personality (judging from the pix and posts)……a bit turn off - for me.

Btw…not everyone is poor, and throwing ourselves at any first available farang we see. Many of us do have better pick among our own local boys…..better looking, loving, considerate, caring, not a butterfly, not full of themselves,…similar ages & socioeconomic…..etcs

There are plenty of them, single & available!!!

And

Ooh you would be quite surprised how many of us (both white and darker skin tone…also anything in between)…are much richer than a lot of farangs over here.

So don't flatter yourself too much when in thailand…yeah

Those are also another side of the real Thailand, and want to pass them along

Just in case you don't understand the local language well, and some looks you may be getting.

Well you did ask…about the real Thailand.

Just want to contribute something.. :)

Lady, the guy is joking around.

Dude…chill out…I was just joking about his pix, couldn’t you tell?… (but not the rest of my post tho) :D

Ofcourse I know that’s not him. In a matter of fact, I haven’t seen any farangs here even come close to “THAT” around "a real thailand".

A specimen like that just don’t normally drop from the sky over Thailand looking for “a pretty woman”, if you get my drift.

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I know that's not him. In a matter of fact, I haven't seen any farangs here even come close to "THAT" around "a real thailand".

A specimen like that just don't normally drop from the sky over Thailand looking for "a pretty woman", if you get my drift.

You trying to say ALL of us farang arent really hansum or something??????????

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Btw, here is what I look like incase you see me out on the town and want to buy me a shot of rye.

don-draper.jpg

Hmm…the forehead is a bit too big for me, and I don't like a smoker..I can see a ciggy there

Can't see the bottom half well, for all I know it could look like a butterball.

Also…you do look a bit stuck-up, all-that!!…with the "SP" personality (judging from the pix and posts)……a bit turn off - for me.

Btw…not everyone is poor, and throwing ourselves at any first available farang we see. Many of us do have better pick among our own local boys…..better looking, loving, considerate, caring, not a butterfly, not full of themselves,…similar ages & socioeconomic…..etcs

There are plenty of them, single & available!!!

And

Ooh you would be quite surprised how many of us (both white and darker skin tone…also anything in between)…are much richer than a lot of farangs over here.

So don't flatter yourself too much when in thailand…yeah

Those are also another side of the real Thailand, and want to pass them along

Just in case you don't understand the local language well, and some looks you may be getting.

Well you did ask…about the real Thailand.

Just want to contribute something.. :)

Lady, the guy is joking around.

Dude…chill out…I was just joking about his pix, couldn't you tell?… (but not the rest of my post tho) :D

Ofcourse I know that's not him. In a matter of fact, I haven't seen any farangs here even come close to "THAT" around "a real thailand".

A specimen like that just don't normally drop from the sky over Thailand looking for "a pretty woman", if you get my drift.

I do get your drift, it seems like I am one of the few clean cut guys that go to Thailand. If your Thai I hope you understand that not all farags are like what you see in Thailand. Farangland has many sexy man.

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OH YES! You have pictured the REAL Thailand perfectly without having to add a word! Well done!

Eh, no he hasn't. Read my post above. No more than a duck pond in a village green is the real (sorry, 'REAL') England.

Yes I did read your post, and found it very interesting. Lets beg to differ. I suppose that no matter how a foreigner tries to identify himself with or even recognise the real Thailand it will in the long run be virtually impossible. As has been widely (and I belive correctly) pointed out in these posts, it has a great deal to do with what the individual belives to be REAL and what is not.

Personally I do not believe that the 'girlie' scenario and the entertainment scene etc. represents the real Thailand at all, althought unfortunately with many foreigners that perception appears synonimous. I have lost count of the number of times I have invited friends to come and stay with me and their first reaction is "Im not into bar girls, child sex etc"

I love Thailand from my perspective, albeit different to others!

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I have lost count of the number of times I have invited friends to come and stay with me and their first reaction is "Im not into bar girls, child sex etc"

When my brother came over a couple of years back I asked him if he wanted to come to our small part of the country, he refused saying that he wouldn't be comfortable in the jungle.

Peoples perceptions of places they don't know are usually wrong. The touristy areas are not just girlie bars and rural Isaan is not just jungle, but you have to live in either place for some time to realise that.

In their own way they are both the real Thailand.

(see you at Yoons later Baz)

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OH YES! You have pictured the REAL Thailand perfectly without having to add a word! Well done!

Eh, no he hasn't. Read my post above. No more than a duck pond in a village green is the real (sorry, 'REAL') England.

Yes I did read your post, and found it very interesting. Lets beg to differ. I suppose that no matter how a foreigner tries to identify himself with or even recognise the real Thailand it will in the long run be virtually impossible. As has been widely (and I belive correctly) pointed out in these posts, it has a great deal to do with what the individual belives to be REAL and what is not.

Personally I do not believe that the 'girlie' scenario and the entertainment scene etc. represents the real Thailand at all, althought unfortunately with many foreigners that perception appears synonimous. I have lost count of the number of times I have invited friends to come and stay with me and their first reaction is "Im not into bar girls, child sex etc"

I love Thailand from my perspective, albeit different to others!

For the rice eaters of this world, Thailand is still one of those few places left

that carries on traditional family style rice farming, and I guess most people

have not experienced the fragrant scents of Khao Hom Mali during harvest time ...

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I have lost count of the number of times I have invited friends to come and stay with me and their first reaction is "Im not into bar girls, child sex etc"

When my brother came over a couple of years back I asked him if he wanted to come to our small part of the country, he refused saying that he wouldn't be comfortable in the jungle.

Peoples perceptions of places they don't know are usually wrong. The touristy areas are not just girlie bars and rural Isaan is not just jungle, but you have to live in either place for some time to realise that.

In their own way they are both the real Thailand.

Very true, Thaddeus. I've lost count of the people in Canada who think the same. It's not until the wanderers get over here that they see what Thailand is all about.

Riding my scoot through rural Thailand in the hot wind, wearing nothing but shorts and sandals, is not something I can do back home. We had about 2 weeks of that kind of weather in BC. In Thailand I can do it all year.

Ian_on_bike_1.sized.jpg

The same evening I can mix with a bunch of young Canadian friends less than half my age.

Tex_1.jpg

And there are places for the young folks to party and have fun as well. It ain't just for the old farts.

Spicey_3.jpg

But I'm still searching for the sick buffalo I hear so much about... :)

Water_buffalo_1.sized.jpg

Oh, and nice photos, JerryLee. Nice rich colours. Thanks for those

Edited by IanForbes
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It took me a long time to settle into to Thailand. I enjoy it now. But it took time.

I first started coming to Thailand in the 80’s. On my first night of excellent partying with a Canadian BKK veteran taking in the sites, I got the Bangkok bug on a tuk-tuk joy ride on the way back to the hotel– and I never got over it. The city was beautiful – even the dirt looked beautiful and natural. I followed up on this dream and moved to BKK in the mid-80’s, fell in love with a no-B.S. beauty and moved in with her young brother and grandmother. It was a great experience. After a job in the UK lured me away – with all the heartbreak – I kept coming back every three years or so. But my emphasis was always the same party places and tourist towns/resorts. For a while, I still found places though – even on Samui - where time just stopped and life couldn’t have been better (or cheaper). That was the 80’s.

Now, in the 21st century, I have been here for a few years and I started to get tired of the lifestyle and same ol’ places. I lived off of Sukhumvit in a great place but paid out the arse. One day, walking down Soi 4 and dropping in at my usual places and seeing the same ol’ Farangs with the same ol’ attitudes in the same ol’ bar stools – I decided to give it up. It turns out that this was the best thing I ever did.

We moved north of BKK and now have a beautiful and affordable baan with a balcony on a dead-end soi with a garden, fountain, dog, access to the river, and we are so much more content. I have everything I need on that soi – I even love the soi dogs and help take care of them.

I still have my few bars and restaurants where I leave my Black Label (ice costs 20 baht and the owners take good care of regular customers), eat huge, grilled prawns and great food for a song, and have my favourite massage places.

I also stay away from Chiang Mai, Phuket, Pataya, Koh Chang and Koh Samui, etc. One time though, outside the walking streets in the centre of Chiang Mai – I developed a relationship with a family that turned into an almost spiritual, mind-quieting and priceless experience. The un-spoiled Thais are great.

I had some health problems and had to use the services of several doctors and overnight stays in the hospital, and in the end, the doctors developed personal relationships and kept up with my progress even after hours on their mobile phones, when necessary. Incredible, when compared to the West.

I love hopping over to the neighbouring countries (especially Vietnam) but I can’t imagine living in any of them (unless I had a good job) – in fact, I cant think of another country in the world I would rather live in. I think it is a great place now that I don’t do the normal tourist stuff and go to the normal tourist spots. Have you ever woken up at 8 in the morning and all the Germans have already thrown their towels on the beach and poolside chairs to reserve them for themselves after they get good and ready to finally go outside? So, concentrating on the simple life, avoiding the ‘unpleasant farangs’ and staying off the beaten track is key, in my opinion. And when I am in the West now, I miss my boiled rice in the morning and Thai food, in general. I can’t stand being away from here anymore. Even if I completely ran out of money here I would probably still make it okay – especially since I don’t really need a car.

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It took me a long time to settle into to Thailand. I enjoy it now. But it took time.

I first started coming to Thailand in the 80’s. On my first night of excellent partying with a Canadian BKK veteran taking in the sites, I got the Bangkok bug on a tuk-tuk joy ride on the way back to the hotel– and I never got over it. The city was beautiful – even the dirt looked beautiful and natural. I followed up on this dream and moved to BKK in the mid-80’s, fell in love with a no-B.S. beauty and moved in with her young brother and grandmother. It was a great experience. After a job in the UK lured me away – with all the heartbreak – I kept coming back every three years or so. But my emphasis was always the same party places and tourist towns/resorts. For a while, I still found places though – even on Samui - where time just stopped and life couldn’t have been better (or cheaper). That was the 80’s.

Now, in the 21st century, I have been here for a few years and I started to get tired of the lifestyle and same ol’ places. I lived off of Sukhumvit in a great place but paid out the arse. One day, walking down Soi 4 and dropping in at my usual places and seeing the same ol’ Farangs with the same ol’ attitudes in the same ol’ bar stools – I decided to give it up. It turns out that this was the best thing I ever did.

We moved north of BKK and now have a beautiful and affordable baan with a balcony on a dead-end soi with a garden, fountain, dog, access to the river, and we are so much more content. I have everything I need on that soi – I even love the soi dogs and help take care of them.

I still have my few bars and restaurants where I leave my Black Label (ice costs 20 baht and the owners take good care of regular customers), eat huge, grilled prawns and great food for a song, and have my favourite massage places.

I also stay away from Chiang Mai, Phuket, Pataya, Koh Chang and Koh Samui, etc. One time though, outside the walking streets in the centre of Chiang Mai – I developed a relationship with a family that turned into an almost spiritual, mind-quieting and priceless experience. The un-spoiled Thais are great.

I had some health problems and had to use the services of several doctors and overnight stays in the hospital, and in the end, the doctors developed personal relationships and kept up with my progress even after hours on their mobile phones, when necessary. Incredible, when compared to the West.

I love hopping over to the neighbouring countries (especially Vietnam) but I can’t imagine living in any of them (unless I had a good job) – in fact, I cant think of another country in the world I would rather live in. I think it is a great place now that I don’t do the normal tourist stuff and go to the normal tourist spots. Have you ever woken up at 8 in the morning and all the Germans have already thrown their towels on the beach and poolside chairs to reserve them for themselves after they get good and ready to finally go outside? So, concentrating on the simple life, avoiding the ‘unpleasant farangs’ and staying off the beaten track is key, in my opinion. And when I am in the West now, I miss my boiled rice in the morning and Thai food, in general. I can’t stand being away from here anymore. Even if I completely ran out of money here I would probably still make it okay – especially since I don’t really need a car.

looks like life on samui. at the end of the day "where ever you got there you are" holds true for all of us and if we are not happy here then we will not be happy there.

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