Honda Vtr 2010

[Richard-BKK]

Neverdie,

Don't worry Honda also announced that they stopped the production of the CBR150R and all motorcycles without Fuel-injection will not be available at dealerships after next month.

[JonnyF]

I like the look of the VTR. Well suited for Thailand, kind of like an alternative/upmarket version of the Boxer 250.

If it's released at the 110-120k mark it should do well. Any more than that and the er6n looks a better option for fans of naked/upright bikes.

[PeaceBlondie]

No comparing the 231 Boxer with the Honda twin 250.

[JonnyF]

No comparing the 231 Boxer with the Honda twin 250.

If they release the Honda at the same price as the Boxer then a head to head comparison would be worthwhile.

Of course, the Honda will be the better bike, and that is why it will cost at least 50% more.

[Powerband]

...am i the only one that thinks the VTR is ugly?

fairing kit please, im too lazy to make one myself (although i can)

[dave_boo]

I like the look of the VTR. Well suited for Thailand, kind of like an alternative/upmarket version of the Boxer 250.

If it's released at the 110-120k mark it should do well. Any more than that and the er6n looks a better option for fans of naked/upright bikes.

I think that actually at that price (which I believe is a bit optimistic) it would surely trounce Boxer sales and likely erode ER-6N sales over the short run. The average purchasing power of forum members dwarfs that of the average Thai's. Even forum members who are on teacher's salaries are looking at 3-4 month's worth of salary to purchase at your price; compare that to the 200-ish average Thai salary---that's some 20 month's worth of salary. Bump up the price to an ER-6N's level and a Thai would need some 40 months. A huge investment and for looks alone the baby Monster (to not mince words) seems a much better value. Of course eventually those riders will want to move up; unless Honda gets on the ball they'll lose the momentum they're sure to build if this bike is ever released.

...am i the only one that thinks the VTR is ugly?

fairing kit please, im too lazy to make one myself (although i can)

I don't think it's ugly; there's always the Ninja if you want a faired bike.....

[Powerband]

I like the 1st pic in the 1st post, bu to me the 2nd pic looks like its afflicted with something on the tail end...tail looks like a hanging turd.

That being said , i'll probably end up buying one.

[Richard-BKK]

No comparing the 231 Boxer with the Honda twin 250.

All indications are that Honda will also introducing a single-cylinder 250cc class motorcycle, which has an actual combustion volume of 223cc with SOHC 2-valves and a compression ratio of 9.2:1. The overall engine specifications of this 223cc engine are very similar to the Tiger Boxer 250RS, with the exception that Honda is using its PGM-FI (fuel-injection) to fuel the motorcycle.

Edited February 19, 2010 by Richard-BKK

[dave_boo]

All indications are that Honda will also introducing a single-cylinder 250cc class motorcycle, which has an actual combustion volume of 223cc with SOHC 2-valves and a compression ratio of 9.2:1. The overall engine specifications of this 223cc engine are very similar to the Tiger Boxer 250RS, with the exception that Honda is using its PGM-FI (fuel-injection) to fuel the motorcycle.

What style? The Honda Rebel (CMX250) or Nighthawk(CB250)? What price point?

[Richard-BKK]

The Honda Rebel and Nighthawk are both 250cc motorcycles, and I'm confident that Honda is going for a 223cc single-cylinder motorcycle. Honda Thailand worked hard on developing and fine-tuning a fuel-injection system for Honda's good old 223cc engine (used all over Asia from Japan to India).

For the style of the single-cylinder motorcycle, I can only guess. The 223cc engine developed is good for a sporty all-rounder, simple Motard/enduro, or a relaxed cruiser style motorcycle.

For Honda it would not make much sense to remove the 64,000 Baht CBR150 and 80,000 Baht Honda Phantom by replacing them with a 140,000 Baht motorcycle. Therefore, based on the information I was told, I think that Honda is more going to be a direct competitor to Tiger motorcycles with a 223cc machine. Of course Kawasaki will also see business slipping if Honda is selling +/-80 to 90,000 Baht 250cc class motorcycles.

Honda Thailand is also sub-contracting manufacturers for equipment to make 21” spoke-wheels, this can be a indication that Honda is making a Honda Wave with very large wheels or (more likely) is getting ready to produce an enduro/trail machine.

Anyway, all indications are that the Honda booth at the 31th Bangkok Motorshow 2010 would be a place of much innovation and renewal... Some will say that should be after 4-years showing nothing much exciting...

Edited February 20, 2010 by Richard-BKK

[jackcorbett]

From what i've read, the twin cylinder V twin Honda might or might not offer to the THailand market is a real threat to the 250 Kawasaki Ninja as it offers nearly the same horsepower but better around town performance as the power comes on at lower revs. However....the Rebel as shown on Honda's web site is a very basic twin cylinder "entry level" machine that is around 17 horsepower from what I've seen in various figures. That's the same horsepower as a 200 c.c. single cylinder Phantom.

Of course, as you mentioned the 250 c.c. Rebel and Nighthawk only has 223 cc's. I find these two machines to be very unexciting and therefore feel anything that's closely based on them will not be competitive with a 250 Ninja. From what I've read a "250 c.c. Rebel" will do about 75 miles an hour on the top end whereas the Ninja will do 95 to 100 miles an hour.

[Richard-BKK]

The single-cylinder 223cc motorcycle, which Honda Thailand is likely to introduce doesn't exclude the introduction of the Honda VTR250, which in Japan is the real growth pleaser... it sells much better then the Kawasaki Ninja 250R (I was told, by Japanese Honda guy).

[neverdie]

Good riddance I say to dirty clagged up old carbies & hello blocked fuel injectors.

[katabeachbum]

Good riddance I say to dirty clagged up old carbies & hello blocked fuel injectors.

welcome to injection, which just about nobody in LOS knows how to repair. It does fail sometimes, just as carbs

[dave_boo]

The Honda Rebel and Nighthawk are both 250cc motorcycles, and I'm confident that Honda is going for a 223cc single-cylinder motorcycle. Honda Thailand worked hard on developing and fine-tuning a fuel-injection system for Honda's good old 223cc engine (used all over Asia from Japan to India).

For the style of the single-cylinder motorcycle, I can only guess. The 223cc engine developed is good for a sporty all-rounder, simple Motard/enduro, or a relaxed cruiser style motorcycle.

For Honda it would not make much sense to remove the 64,000 Baht CBR150 and 80,000 Baht Honda Phantom by replacing them with a 140,000 Baht motorcycle. Therefore, based on the information I was told, I think that Honda is more going to be a direct competitor to Tiger motorcycles with a 223cc machine. Of course Kawasaki will also see business slipping if Honda is selling +/-80 to 90,000 Baht 250cc class motorcycles.

Honda Thailand is also sub-contracting manufacturers for equipment to make 21” spoke-wheels, this can be a indication that Honda is making a Honda Wave with very large wheels or (more likely) is getting ready to produce an enduro/trail machine.

Anyway, all indications are that the Honda booth at the 31th Bangkok Motorshow 2010 would be a place of much innovation and renewal... Some will say that should be after 4-years showing nothing much exciting...

I'm sorry, I thought that they used a 234cc engine which IIRC is inline with Tiger's offering. It's also my understanding that they offer some 20 BHP from the factory; not bad for an engine that's pushing 27 years.

If in fact it's a Hero Honda Karisma you can colour me unimpressed. The specs I could find list all of 12.68 PS (17 BHP for Americans). Price isn't shabby at ~53 000 THB, although I believe that this is for the older carb'd model.

[Richard-BKK]

Here the information of the latest HeroHonda Karizma ZMR, for which the engine fueling was developed together with Honda Thailand. If you look at the engine specifications of the Honda XR230 you will see that the identical.

I not believe that the whole Karizma ZMR is coming to Thailand, but for the engine used to power the motorcycle its a different story. The new Indian 223cc with fuel-injection is not much more expensive then its carburettor predecessor. Also for the Thai market the bike needs to look a bit more modern. But I have the idea that Honda is planning to replace the CBR150R with something on the same price level, powered by a 223cc single-cylinder-engine.

To the engine characteristics, the new bike would probably be more an sporty-all-rounder then a sports bike. It could be a Motard style, and the engine has proven successful in Japan for both an enduro and motard style motorcycle.

[LivinLOS]

Neverdie,

Don't worry Honda also announced that they stopped the production of the CBR150R and all motorcycles without Fuel-injection will not be available at dealerships after next month.

Nouvo elegance ??

Seems hard to believe.. Or you mean Honda only ??

[Richard-BKK]

@LivinLOS

As you can read, Honda is well stop the manufacturing and sales of carburettor motorcycles. Seems I keep repeating myself for the last few years.

[gregchambers]

The CBR150 might be finished but Honda Thailand still make the fuel injected CBR125 which they sell in Europe, albeit at a rip-off price. This is very similar to the 150 so it is unlikely that they would put the 223cc engine in the chassis. Let's hope the VTR does happen as it will be superior to most other options, the only possible horror that Honda might style it to appeal to the Asian market like the horrible looking Yamaha 250 single in Malayasia (which is now sold in the UK as well)

[Curt1591]

Am I the only one who is concerned with the cast aluminum crankcase hanging protruding beneath the VTR?

Edited March 2, 2010 by Curt1591

[ttakata]

Am I the only one who is concerned with the cast aluminum crankcase hanging protruding beneath the VTR?

It does look low but if you like the VTR, don't sweat it.

The VTR and Ninja 250 probably have similar height tires and look at how low the Ninja's bodywork is.

Just don't go jumping off curbs and speed bumps.

[Curt1591]

Am I the only one who is concerned with the cast aluminum crankcase hanging protruding beneath the VTR?

It does look low but if you like the VTR, don't sweat it.

The VTR and Ninja 250 probably have similar height tires and look at how low the Ninja's bodywork is.

Just don't go jumping off curbs and speed bumps.

In Bangkok, that's often easier said than done!

[gregchambers]

I expect the suspension will be set for the average weight Thai man, around 65kgs, so may need stronger springs if you weigh more than that. Both bikes get away with being so low because they are so narrow and will not scrape in the corners but it is a good point about pot-holes in Bangkok...

[jonwilly]

Always luvved the VTR and became an enthusiast for the 250 90 degree Vee Twine engine when I first rode a Honda Castect.

If Honda introduce an injected VTR complete with Proper plates they have made one sale already.

Don't know if all the above is just talk but strangely my Thai Biker friends where talking about an injected VTR.

john

Will give up my 600 cc Hornet, getting a bit heavy for my advancing age.

[BigBikeBKK]

Always luvved the VTR and became an enthusiast for the 250 90 degree Vee Twine engine when I first rode a Honda Castect.

If Honda introduce an injected VTR complete with Proper plates they have made one sale already.

Don't know if all the above is just talk but strangely my Thai Biker friends where talking about an injected VTR.

john

Will give up my 600 cc Hornet, getting a bit heavy for my advancing age.

Ooooh! Have you got a legal plated 600cc Honda Hornet? I would LOVE to get my hands on one of those- PLEASE let me know if/when you decide to sell and I will make you a very good offer. Happy Trials! Tony

[Garry]

I expect the suspension will be set for the average weight Thai man, around 65kgs, so may need stronger springs if you weigh more than that. Both bikes get away with being so low because they are so narrow and will not scrape in the corners but it is a good point about pot-holes in Bangkok...

I kind off always thought that all small bikes sold in Thailand were set up to take the weight of the whole family: Mum & dad, couple of kids and the groceries

Edited March 24, 2010 by Garry

[dave_boo]

I expect the suspension will be set for the average weight Thai man, around 65kgs, so may need stronger springs if you weigh more than that. Both bikes get away with being so low because they are so narrow and will not scrape in the corners but it is a good point about pot-holes in Bangkok...

I kind off always thought that all small bikes sold in Thailand were set up to take the weight of the whole family: Mum & dad, couple of kids and the groceries

At least for the Ninja 250 it was way undersprung for my fat arse. Major bottoming of the forks on rougher sections of road and just a general vaugeness told me that if Kawasaki did spring it for all those, they must have used midgets for their metric. Race Tech has a nice selection of springs that let me get the bike to where it should be for me however....

[BigBikeBKK]

I expect the suspension will be set for the average weight Thai man, around 65kgs, so may need stronger springs if you weigh more than that. Both bikes get away with being so low because they are so narrow and will not scrape in the corners but it is a good point about pot-holes in Bangkok...

I kind off always thought that all small bikes sold in Thailand were set up to take the weight of the whole family: Mum & dad, couple of kids and the groceries

At least for the Ninja 250 it was way undersprung for my fat arse. Major bottoming of the forks on rougher sections of road and just a general vaugeness told me that if Kawasaki did spring it for all those, they must have used midgets for their metric. Race Tech has a nice selection of springs that let me get the bike to where it should be for me however....

Aye but the Ninjette 250R is the best selling motorcycle in the US and is aimed and newbies, girls and shorties and you DO weigh a bit more than the average Thai...

A guy your size should probably be on a bigger bike...

[dave_boo]

Aye but the Ninjette 250R is the best selling motorcycle in the US and is aimed and newbies, girls and shorties and you DO weigh a bit more than the average Thai...

A guy your size should probably be on a bigger bike...

Best selling in the US or best selling Kawi in the US (honestly...I couldn't find the data either way)? And I'm not fat, I'm big boned.

And I'll get a bigger bike when this Honduh whore can walk into a dealership and get an XL700 or a Honda Hornet (CB600F).

[ttakata]

Went to the motor show hoping the VTR250 would be there, nope.

No CBR150 or its replacement either.

Actually nothing worthwhile as far as smaller bikes go.

The big VFR was there, but only a rare few will be affording these.

I'm sure there are many good reasons why Honda is not putting out bikes I want, but right now I think Honda Thailand is lame.

I would love to see Yamaha or really Kawasaki take more of Honda's marketshare.

I always thought of Kawasaki as the worst of the Japanese brands in America, but they're doing a great job here by making the ER6, Ninjas, and D-Trackers locally.