Debt Collection

[qualtrough]

I have a registered company here in Thailand and assisted another farang who has a business here for about a five month period. I stopped the arrangement in December and in January he acknowledged by email that he owed me approx. 2000 USD and would pay me within the week. Since that time I have had about a dozen different promises, each time the proposed money transfer failed due to bank goof-ups, missing bank details, you name it. Most recently he has reacknowledged by e-mail that he owes me the sum and promises to pay by the end of the month. I am certain that this is BS as well.

Any suggestions on any options? I know it is not a huge sum, but it is the principal that bugs me. I would be willing to spend some time and effort just to dog him even if the odds of collecting were slim. Please skip any suggestions involving violence, threats of violence, hit men, etc.!

[ray23]

I have a registered company here in Thailand and assisted another farang who has a business here for about a five month period. I stopped the arrangement in December and in January he acknowledged by email that he owed me approx. 2000 USD and would pay me within the week. Since that time I have had about a dozen different promises, each time the proposed money transfer failed due to bank goof-ups, missing bank details, you name it. Most recently he has reacknowledged by e-mail  that he owes me the sum and promises to pay by the end of the month. I am certain that this is BS as well.

Any suggestions on any options? I know it is not a huge sum, but it is the principal that bugs me. I would be willing to spend some time and effort just to dog him even if the odds of collecting were slim. Please skip any suggestions involving violence, threats of violence, hit men, etc.!

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

Principle does not pay the bills, ethier except the loss and move on or try to recover whatever you can through the courts. There are really not a lot of options. Since he is a farrang, he might not want the attention of the courts and pay up if he can. If he can't pay no matter what you do no money is no money.

[~G~]

I have a registered company here in Thailand and assisted another farang who has a business here for about a five month period. I stopped the arrangement in December and in January he acknowledged by email that he owed me approx. 2000 USD and would pay me within the week. Since that time I have had about a dozen different promises, each time the proposed money transfer failed due to bank goof-ups, missing bank details, you name it. Most recently he has reacknowledged by e-mail  that he owes me the sum and promises to pay by the end of the month. I am certain that this is BS as well.

Any suggestions on any options? I know it is not a huge sum, but it is the principal that bugs me. I would be willing to spend some time and effort just to dog him even if the odds of collecting were slim. Please skip any suggestions involving violence, threats of violence, hit men, etc.!

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

Is it one major principle that bugs you or 2,000 small green priciples?

You did not mention whether you're in Thailand right now or not. I assume not. Start by sending him a letter from lawyer.

Edited April 7, 2005 by ~G~

[paulfr]

You cannot get blood from a stone.

If he just went under in business, he may not be able to pay you and still eat.

Patience is the key in collection after persistence.

The bright side is he is responding to you and making statements confirming his debt.

Have you suggested he pay you $200/week for 10 weeks or let him pick some numbers he can live with ??

Have you given him an incentive to pay in full now, like .... pay me now and I will take $1600 ... offer is good for one week.

When you see him, do you ask for half the money he has in his pocket like a judge will ?

It's only 3 months so far. Lots of business debts hang on for much longer.

Also does he have any assets like a car, motorbike or condo ?

You could ask for the title as security for your loan.

[qualtrough]

I am in Thailand, he is in another city here. He is still in business. He does have assets in the form of finished product. The 2000 was already negotiated down. I am pretty sure he has no intention of paying. Rather than just say that he keeps lying about trying to make transfers and running into problems. Once, twice--maybe. Ten times--I don't think so. . I have no problem working with a lawyer, but what do I need to establish that he owes me the money and promised to pay? I have four or five invoices he did pay, and two that he didnt't, and a number of e-mails from him in which he acknowledges the debt and the invoice numbers and promises to pay it.

Thanks to all who have responded so far.

[sting01]

if I was you, but I am not, I will simply go to meet him, physically, and ask him to sign a paper, where all we be written.

Also, you should make clear how he can pay you, bank is not always the right solution, one possibility is to buy jewellry, and then to pow/sell it, who knows where his money can come from, if you are not the only one in this case, he is simply trying to avoid to start any payment, because when it's starting the vultutres arrive and all dispear. I have no clue about his or your situation , maybe he is simply trying to avoid a bankrupcy.

The key in my opnion will be to have a paper with his sign, with that you can easily pressure him, and if he answer your mail and agree he must pay, I think you will have the paper easily.

[Khun Jean]

You are the one who has to stay polite and correct.

Is there is a way to find out his financial position? If he really has a hard time, an offer to pay it in small amounts can work good. You said the 2000 is alreay negotiated down. You should be asking the full price again because it was part of the deal that he pay on time, right? Give him a deadline until this amount is payable, after that it goes up.

What works well is to make a payment plan, and send it to him. With details of what will happen if he doesn't follow this plan. If the plan not works for him give him a deadline to suggest his own plan. Keep repeating what will happen if he don't pay. You know lawyers, court and the rest. There will be costs that he has to pay.

[aughie]

Does he have anything else of value? Is any of his inventory of value to you or could you sell it to others in order to recoup some money?

[chuchok]

If it was me, I'd front the prick face to face.It's amazing what you can get with a bit of confrontation.Telephone calls and e-mails are easy to screw around with somebody.

[Heng]

Use the Sikh method. This is in no way generalizing for ALL Sikhs by the way. Some of the more successful moneylenders around. More than a few have built their way up from working as security guards to owning swaths of land off Sukhumvit through textiles AND money lending. "Hey, how are you today? How's business? You don't have my money today? No problem, you can just pay me tomorrow. I'll be back tomorrow." Be ready to do this for anywhere between 10 and 1000+ days in a row without ever losing your cool (no threats required, just be annoyingly polite and persistent). They'll pay you eventually, even if it's just because the daily sight of your turban is starting to make them go crazy.

[ray23]

Use the Sikh method.  This is in no way generalizing for ALL Sikhs by the way.    Some of the more successful moneylenders around.  More than a few have built their way up from working as security guards to owning swaths of land off Sukhumvit through textiles AND money lending.    "Hey, how are you today?  How's business?  You don't have my money today?  No problem, you can just pay me tomorrow.  I'll be back tomorrow."      Be ready to do this for anywhere between 10 and 1000+ days in a row without ever losing your cool (no threats required, just be annoyingly polite and persistent).    They'll pay you eventually, even if it's just because the daily sight of your turban is starting to make them go crazy.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

Man I love the turban I have to try that with the Thia who owes me for 400K, the first settlement conference is Monday, don't suppose I would offend my attorney. LOL

[Harmonica]

I have a registered company here in Thailand and assisted another farang who has a business here for about a five month period. I stopped the arrangement in December and in January he acknowledged by email that he owed me approx. 2000 USD and would pay me within the week. Since that time I have had about a dozen different promises, each time the proposed money transfer failed due to bank goof-ups, missing bank details, you name it. Most recently he has reacknowledged by e-mail  that he owes me the sum and promises to pay by the end of the month. I am certain that this is BS as well.

Any suggestions on any options? I know it is not a huge sum, but it is the principal that bugs me. I would be willing to spend some time and effort just to dog him even if the odds of collecting were slim. Please skip any suggestions involving violence, threats of violence, hit men, etc.!

And what if he is reading this thread?

[~G~]

I have a registered company here in Thailand and assisted another farang who has a business here for about a five month period. I stopped the arrangement in December and in January he acknowledged by email that he owed me approx. 2000 USD and would pay me within the week. Since that time I have had about a dozen different promises, each time the proposed money transfer failed due to bank goof-ups, missing bank details, you name it. Most recently he has reacknowledged by e-mail  that he owes me the sum and promises to pay by the end of the month. I am certain that this is BS as well.

Any suggestions on any options? I know it is not a huge sum, but it is the principal that bugs me. I would be willing to spend some time and effort just to dog him even if the odds of collecting were slim. Please skip any suggestions involving violence, threats of violence, hit men, etc.!

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

And what if he is reading this thread?

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

So it's you, Harmonica! You shouldn't have played with this guy's money in the forex market! Come on, pay him back.

[pedro01]

I have a registered company here in Thailand and assisted another farang who has a business here for about a five month period. I stopped the arrangement in December and in January he acknowledged by email that he owed me approx. 2000 USD and would pay me within the week. Since that time I have had about a dozen different promises, each time the proposed money transfer failed due to bank goof-ups, missing bank details, you name it. Most recently he has reacknowledged by e-mail  that he owes me the sum and promises to pay by the end of the month. I am certain that this is BS as well.

Any suggestions on any options? I know it is not a huge sum, but it is the principal that bugs me. I would be willing to spend some time and effort just to dog him even if the odds of collecting were slim. Please skip any suggestions involving violence, threats of violence, hit men, etc.!

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

You are in a no-win situation.

If you take him to court for this sum - the court & lawyer fees will be higher than $2,000 plus you'll most likely have to pay your lawyer a % of any monies received. If you win, you can follow up & claim your costs (minus lawyers recovery fee). Does he have the funds/assets to pay this ? Is he now transferring assets into someone elses name before the court dates ? Can you wait 2-3 years to get the cash back through the courts ?

Legal execution department will take 10% of the auction price of any seized assets.

If you do take him to court - he'll probably just pay you as soon as he gets the court date, rather than go to court, in which case you still have some legal fees.

[ThaiPauly]

As I see it you have only 2 optios if you do not to involve any violence etc (on your part)

1. Go and see him and work out a re-payment schedule staring today with $50 and $50 a month until the debt is repaid, starting with $50 NOW. If he has no intention of paying you he will say that he would prefer to pay it in one lump sum, he is lying, if he cant pay you that small ammount, he has NO intention of paying you anything.

2. Sell the debt say for 60% of what you are owed, the aforementioned turbans would take this work on. You must get it in writing from them that they now OWN the debt in case anything were to happen to him. You wont get all of your money, but at least you may recover 60% of it. The only snag is ensuring they pay you once they have collected it. I had a case in the UK where a Company I was using as my debt collectors never gave me a penny of what they collected, went into liquidation and started doing the same to other under a similar name.

Litigation is a complete waste of time for that ammount out here.

Sorry to be the bearer of bad news, but I reckon while I owned a Company in the UK I lost at least 200,000 pounds to bad debtors, If they dont want to pay you they just dont, even if you win in court.

Makes No Sense to me!!

[lingling]

Please skip any suggestions involving violence, threats of violence, hit men, etc.!

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

Ehh, just forget about it. The only way you can collect money in these parts is through unpleasant methods. If you dislike those methods, better just write off the loss and spend your energy on something else.

[aughie]

He does have assets in the form of finished product.

I repeat does he have anything else of value? Is any of his inventory of value to you or could you sell it to others in order to recoup some money?

Does he have a credit card? Meet him and take him to a gold store.

[qualtrough]

Lots of good advice. Since we are somewhat far apart I cannot really waste time flying up there to bother him. I doubt very much that he would be interested in any payment plan other than the non-payment plan. The one idea that appeals to me is selling the debt. I think I would be willing to give it away just to know that he would be harassed for the rest of his life by a guy in a turban. I will report back at the end of the month to let you know if any money arrives. I have heard things are not going well with the business and that would be satisfaction enough.

[Ajarn]

If you choose to get serious, it seems you have the evidence for a criminal case against him. If the police agree to investigate (there might be suggestions for 'investigation expenses'), then they will first force him to come to the station for discussion with them. Once there, the will act as negotiators for you, but the message will soon be made clear that if there is no agreement, your friend will be arrested and held until he pays bail or goes completly through the court process. Most do whatever they need to for an agreement to happen.