Thai Man Seen Beating Young Thai Woman,

[ScubaBuddha]

There again with the "Perhaps" and the "Maybe's" Because she is not screaming for help just let him go at her? You people make me sick. You're all cowards in my book. You do nothing to help a woman being beaten in public then you are as low as the man doing the beating. Perhaps he was trying to rob her and she was too scared to yell out. Perhaps she knew a further harder beating would ensue if she did. It is not "Thai culture" to beat your wife or gf in public, or private. It is simply wrong no matter where you are. You have been here so long you seem to have lost your moral objectivity.

Thank you to those who still give a shit about other people.

First of all with the nick: "ScubaBUDDHA" don't speak about culture.

Find yourself a new name which is not ScubaJesus and not ScubaAlaha.

than sit yourself down and recognize that you are not the center of the world or the worldpolice nor the USA is.

Than read some history. Always the Americans went with very good intentions in conflicts (therefore we love the Americans) and every time it was not appreciated by the conflict partners and it ended with cruel and murdering millions of people, in Vietnam, Afghanistan and Iraq (therefore the USA is hated).

Neither you nor the USA are the judge here or anywhere else who tells this is right this is wrong. It is simply not your business.

As I explained to you in the other thread where you said the same thing, I had it initially ScubaBuddha but it didn't take or was changed, I'm not sure why. I asked to have it changed shortly after and got no response, so I just asked again and sbk changed it back for me, so are you happy now?

I want to help a woman makes me center of the world. That's pretty funny. The rest of your post about America and worldpolice is nonsensical and irrelevant so I won't respond, except to say that it's nonsensical and irrelevant.

Carry on beating your women freely h90, just hope I don't catch you.

Thank you all who decided to post your support. I feel better about my actions, the same about certain things within Thai culture, and less so with the ex. Oh well, at least she's my ex.

Edited December 1, 2009 by ScubaBuddha

[h90]

There again with the "Perhaps" and the "Maybe's" Because she is not screaming for help just let him go at her? You people make me sick. You're all cowards in my book. You do nothing to help a woman being beaten in public then you are as low as the man doing the beating. Perhaps he was trying to rob her and she was too scared to yell out. Perhaps she knew a further harder beating would ensue if she did. It is not "Thai culture" to beat your wife or gf in public, or private. It is simply wrong no matter where you are. You have been here so long you seem to have lost your moral objectivity.

Thank you to those who still give a shit about other people.

First of all with the nick: "ScubaBUDDHA" don't speak about culture.

Find yourself a new name which is not ScubaJesus and not ScubaAlaha.

than sit yourself down and recognize that you are not the center of the world or the worldpolice nor the USA is.

Than read some history. Always the Americans went with very good intentions in conflicts (therefore we love the Americans) and every time it was not appreciated by the conflict partners and it ended with cruel and murdering millions of people, in Vietnam, Afghanistan and Iraq (therefore the USA is hated).

Neither you nor the USA are the judge here or anywhere else who tells this is right this is wrong. It is simply not your business.

As I explained to you in the other thread where you said the same thing, I had it initially ScubaBuddha but it didn't take or was changed, I'm not sure why. I asked to have it changed shortly after and got no response, so I just asked again and sbk changed it back for me, so are you happy now?

I want to help a woman makes me center of the world. That's pretty funny. The rest of your post about America and worldpolice is nonsensical and irrelevant so I won't respond, except to say that it's nonsensical and irrelevant.

Carry on beating your women freely h90, just hope I don't catch you.

nice: you don't agree with me, not even willing to think about it. And as I don't agree with you call me a violent criminal and threat me with violence.....(not very(scuba)Buddha like)

I think you wrote that without thinking, because if you are serious about that, than you are nothing better than the guy you describe.

[JimsKnight]

How do you really know she didn't deserve it?

Im not going to say what should be done or what can be done, and what the outcome will be

everyone has different idea of how much they are willing to risk

but for anyone to suggest that a woman deserves to be beaten is just wrong.

no one deserves to be treated like that, regardless of what she has done.

if she really did something terrible, and a man takes it upon himself to beat her, then he is worse than her. and for a man who was not involved in the scene (hence she did nothing to him) to suggest it, is the lowest of all morality in my opinion.

its because of attitudes like this that so much violence against women continue on an everyday basis. I never thought Id have to encounter such a man personally.

I agree with you.

the situation here with regards domestic violence is not good at all and the general air of apathy and acceptance equally poor. I have also never heard of BIB getting involved, as they are not interested. i can'tsee any of this changing

Well, as wrong as beating as a woman is the cops don't get involved with very good reason.

Domestic call-outs are what every cop (in the world) hates for reasons that include the 'victim' turning on the policeman involved in mediating.

It also, at the end of the day, is a private matter that the guy and the girl have to sort out. If you want the cops to come running everytime a couple start arguing you end up with the big-police-states we've got in Euro-land. If the cops were as 'good' as Farang land a lot of us wouldn't want to live here...

[ScubaBuddha]

How do you really know she didn't deserve it?

Im not going to say what should be done or what can be done, and what the outcome will be

everyone has different idea of how much they are willing to risk

but for anyone to suggest that a woman deserves to be beaten is just wrong.

no one deserves to be treated like that, regardless of what she has done.

if she really did something terrible, and a man takes it upon himself to beat her, then he is worse than her. and for a man who was not involved in the scene (hence she did nothing to him) to suggest it, is the lowest of all morality in my opinion.

its because of attitudes like this that so much violence against women continue on an everyday basis. I never thought Id have to encounter such a man personally.

I agree with you.

the situation here with regards domestic violence is not good at all and the general air of apathy and acceptance equally poor. I have also never heard of BIB getting involved, as they are not interested. i can'tsee any of this changing

Well, as wrong as beating as a woman is the cops don't get involved with very good reason.

Domestic call-outs are what every cop (in the world) hates for reasons that include the 'victim' turning on the policeman involved in mediating.

It also, at the end of the day, is a private matter that the guy and the girl have to sort out. If you want the cops to come running everytime a couple start arguing you end up with the big-police-states we've got in Euro-land. If the cops were as 'good' as Farang land a lot of us wouldn't want to live here...

Jim, your downplaying the indecent a bit. This was not an argument. The guy was physically attacking her. She was screaming crying, but not at all in a way that seemed argumentative to him if that makes sense. She couldn't even make eye contact with him. This thing was one sided. She was cowering. Her body English said it all. You have to had seen it to know what I mean. It was clear to me she just wanted to get away from him. I couldn't tell but he may have taken her motorbike keys. They were in the middle of no where. There was nowhere for her to run. She was helpless. Nobody was stopping to help. And I am not really concerned whether the cops like domestic disputes or not. It's their job. Believe me I know. They were always the most stressful calls I got.

Edited December 1, 2009 by ScubaBuddha

[ScubaBuddha]

nice: you don't agree with me, not even willing to think about it. And as I don't agree with you call me a violent criminal and threat me with violence.....(not very(scuba)Buddha like)

I think you wrote that without thinking, because if you are serious about that, than you are nothing better than the guy you describe.

Am I serious about taking some action when I see a man beating a woman, including the use of force? I think I have made the answer to that question quite clear. Violence against women and children is a hot button issue for me and I have little patience with people who commit it or condone it. Anyway, I wasn't "threatening you with violence" I merely stated a fact I am not a person who will sit back and let a man beat up a woman in front of me. That usually means I will summon authorities, but if it gets too serious then I may intervene myself and I may use force, as I would expect any self respecting man. That in no way makes me "nothing better that the guy I describe." The ability to empathize is in fact "very(scuba)Buddha like."

[parallaxtech]

A very simple solution: Report that a farang has parked his mercedes and is now beating a woman. BIB will be there in nanoseconds!

[smint]

I have to get this off my chest or I feel like I am going to explode... ...

Hi there, reading this thread, as an Asian, and someone who has grew up in Asia all my life, I might have to differ with your opinion. Yes, I've only been in Thailand for a little while, but I can understand how you feel, and also perhaps guess why your ex Thai gf refuses to help you, bystanders don't do anything etc.

Of course, this is an unfortunate incident, and I also believe that no human should be beating another person - no matter male/female whatever. But you have to remember not everyone thinks so. And these values might change with the circumstances as well.

There isn't much of an emphasis of "human rights" or "abuse of a woman or a child" thing here. This society lives by a totally different set of rules, and I believe that we simply cannot apply Western rules or American rules to anything that you see. Yes, there is non-interference. And yes, there is less of the law - not much 'suing', and the laws are there as a general guide, many are just simply not followed, this is the way it is. In my opinion, the rules are not to be applied to everything in the whole of thailand - how many police officers are there, and how big is thailand? And you have to remember Thailand is not a 'developed, Westernised' country, and the basic thing to do is to respect the culture and rules, customs of the country.

Maybe I'm the only one here to think this way, but I think you should not interfere because first you don't know their culture, and you don't know what's happening, you've only been there for 5 minutes, plus, you don't know the language enough to call in the police or call some bystanders in and communicate your point effectively. (your point, basically, is that she is being abused, but that generates from "Western eyes", but in "Thai eyes", it might not be the same thing. You might make it worse instead of helping the lady.)

Plus, this type of "abuse" might be happening everywhere. To you, an American / Westerner it might be abuse, but to them it might not be. Asians beat their kids when their kids do wrong but Westerners don't. Westerners would be shocked when these things happen, and question it confidently - "What?! What the hel_l? This is BS!" and express themselves freely, confidently, while Asians are more subdued - they don't like this type of behaviour, not at all, in my opinion. I'm using a lot of stereotypes here here, but I hope it's clearer for you know... or not?

Yes, no one likes to witness these kind of behaviour, I think even Thais won't like it, but somehow something serious or unfortunate might have happened to warrant that kind of behaviour, and as someone living in a foreign country, I don't think calling the cops or interfering would be the smartest thing to do..

You can call me apathetic, uncaring, whatever, but that's how me, an Asian brought up in Asia all her life, thinks.

Finally, by saying "Back in the states, where I was a cop, I would have this guy on the ground in cuffs quickly," ; " She refuses and gives me the same line of BS" ; "All non-sense of course."

ain't gonna get much respect from Thais, or other Asians, reading this thread, especially if you are representing yourself as someone from America or representing "American / Western culture".

Please correct me if I'm wrong, I'm still learning always, thank you.

Regards

Edited December 1, 2009 by smint

[ScubaBuddha]

^smint, thank you for your input.

[cognos]

i would have intervened, but thats my knee jerk reaction style, plus as a man who was sexually abused as a kid, i have an over abundance of empathy for victims, perceived or otherwise..but i would play it by ear.. i taught woodwork in the prison system for 7 years, dealing with murderers and sex offenders, so i am a bit street smart, and have some ability to read situations as they escalate or do not..

[manarak]

smint, very good post.

reflects my position exactly.

I wouldn't have intervened too, except if the beating was so severe as to wound the girl.

In think that in the west we do go overboard when cuffing people just because of a slapping.

Wounds are another story, but a slap?

[Jimjim]

Pack your bags, OP.

[certified]

This is why some Thai women have such a positive image of farangs. All of them know someone that has been slapped around in public, and by their own comparisons we come out looking very good. It reminds me of the time I saw an Arab man slapping his daughter across the face several times and I ran out to stop it. The wife began kissing my hand, but I'll never forget the look that the small daughter had given me. She looked at me like I was the first person who cared enough for her to try to help. If you have the guts, and want to stop what you think is cruel treatment, jump in there and be a man. I did it once and I'll do it again. You have to live with yourself. What if you were the one being beaten and no one had the nerve to help you. You define yourself by the choices you make. If you don't have what it takes then keep walking and say this is not my business, I don't want to get involved. Life is full of tests, someday you might need unconditional help from a total stranger who is willing to risk his or her own safety to help you.

[cognos]

a certified good guy..in my books

[fantuzi]

There again with the "Perhaps" and the "Maybe's" Because she is not screaming for help just let him go at her? You people make me sick. You're all cowards in my book. You do nothing to help a woman being beaten in public then you are as low as the man doing the beating. Perhaps he was trying to rob her and she was too scared to yell out. Perhaps she knew a further harder beating would ensue if she did. It is not "Thai culture" to beat your wife or gf in public, or private. It is simply wrong no matter where you are. You have been here so long you seem to have lost your moral objectivity.

Thank you to those who still give a shit about other people.

First of all with the nick: "ScubaBUDDHA" don't speak about culture.

Find yourself a new name which is not ScubaJesus and not ScubaAlaha.

than sit yourself down and recognize that you are not the center of the world or the worldpolice nor the USA is.

Than read some history. Always the Americans went with very good intentions in conflicts (therefore we love the Americans) and every time it was not appreciated by the conflict partners and it ended with cruel and murdering millions of people, in Vietnam, Afghanistan and Iraq (therefore the USA is hated).

Neither you nor the USA are the judge here or anywhere else who tells this is right this is wrong. It is simply not your business.

h90! - couple of weeks ago I did the same - and I criticised Scubabuddha for his nick.

Then I had landed in the country where Buddha was born.

First - I noticed:"Buddha Air",then half a dozen of bars with name:"Buddha Bar".

I think - this is not any issue for Buddha followers!? is it for you?

He can have his "scubabuddha" - no problem at all,but I like more - "scubaninja"!

[Kitsch22]

...

Than read some history. Always the Americans went with very good intentions in conflicts (therefore we love the Americans) and every time it was not appreciated by the conflict partners and it ended with cruel and murdering millions of people, in Vietnam, Afghanistan and Iraq (therefore the USA is hated).

Neither you nor the USA are the judge here or anywhere else who tells this is right this is wrong. It is simply not your business.

I think we appreciate the help the Americans gave us.

Of course we appreciate it. And we also recognize it as a spectacularly clear example of the Americans taking the sensible course and keeping out of a fight (that was not theirs) for as long as possible. They became parties only when (a) the Japanese bombed Pearl Harbor and ( Hitler declared war on the USA. Regrettably, today's Americans have been force-fed the John Wayne version of events, which does not have very much to do with reality. As a result they (or some of them) now think that they have a God-given right (the comparison with fundamentalist missionaries is compelling) to force their worldview, their systems of social organisation, and their laws and hence their decadence on Thailand and the rest of the world. In this they may succeed or they may fail; at present it is not looking too good for them, worldwide. I take solace from the fact that if they do succeed, at least it will not be in my lifetime. My own feeling is that in the longer term it is more likely that Thailand will end up as a satellite of China than as of USA; I find it extraordinary difficult to decide for myself which of those two outcomes I would prefer. At the moment, in terms of probability, the Chinese are in the lead by a short head. Their culture and mind-set are so much more similar, you see.

[roundeye]

Hopefully the Scubabuddhas of the world far outnumber the stoneys.

what the heck is a "scubabuddha"?????????

[Starlifter]

Perhaps in this digital age someone in a similar situation might use a cell phone or other type recording device to record the incident. The question would be if you would get close enough so the perpetrator would know he is being recorded. If so he may 1. stop hitting the female. 2. stop hitting the female and begin hitting you. 3. Ask if you plan on posting the beat down on You Boob. On a serious note, I think many would fear being filmed and leave. If so it doesn't guarantee that the female would not go back to him and start the whole cycle over again.

[sceadugenga]

Hopefully the Scubabuddhas of the world far outnumber the stoneys.

what the heck is a "scubabuddha"?????????

They're closely related to the sceadugengan.

[neverdie]

smint, very good post.

reflects my position exactly.

I wouldn't have intervened too, except if the beating was so severe as to wound the girl.

In think that in the west we do go overboard when cuffing people just because of a slapping.

Wounds are another story, but a slap?

I liked smint's post too.

I don't understand what you are talking about when you use the word 'slap'. The OP didnt describe what he saw as 'a slap' and of course you seem to forget that a large man could kill a small woman or child with a 'slap' depending on the situation of course.

So, using your theory of 'slap' being okay, how do we define what a slap is and how much force can be used when slapping, how do we measure this.

Any man that thinks it is acceptable to slap a woman around is probably too gutless and weedy to be trying to slap another man around, yes/no?

[neverdie]

Hopefully the Scubabuddhas of the world far outnumber the stoneys.

what the heck is a "scubabuddha"?????????

They're closely related to the sceadugengan.

What, they have two heads & a hunched back?

[sceadugenga]

I am neither a campanologist nor a Tasmanian.

Edited December 2, 2009 by sceadugenga

[ScubaBuddha]

h90! - couple of weeks ago I did the same - and I criticised Scubabuddha for his nick.

Then I had landed in the country where Buddha was born.

First - I noticed:"Buddha Air",then half a dozen of bars with name:"Buddha Bar".

I think - this is not any issue for Buddha followers!? is it for you?

He can have his "scubabuddha" - no problem at all,but I like more - "scubaninja"!

Oops, sorry I thought h90 was the one who mentioned it before. Like I said to fantuzi the first time, I had checked around with Thai's and Buddhist farang expats and didn't find any opposition to the term. (And fantuzi you will notice I got admin to capitilize the B as I had tried to do before.) It certianly isn't intended to be derogatory. I saw there is a "Buddha View" dive shop, and lots of other similar use of the word. I would think it would be just as offensive as "ScubaGod" and I doubt many people would have issue with that, other than it sounds conceded. I chose ScubaBuddha because I like the alliteration, and I am a scuba instructor in a Buddhism country, and when I started studying Buddhist many years ago when I first came to Thailand I found so many of the principles to really reflect who I am. In my mind my nic is a sign of respect to Buddha and Buddhism. Most people end up calling me scubabubbles or scobydooby anyway. ScubaNinja came about when I bought my Kawasaki Ninja650R, but now that's sadly gone.

So was it in Nepal where you landed and saw these names then? That is believed to be Buddha's birthplace.

Edited December 2, 2009 by ScubaBuddha

[manarak]

smint, very good post.

reflects my position exactly.

I wouldn't have intervened too, except if the beating was so severe as to wound the girl.

In think that in the west we do go overboard when cuffing people just because of a slapping.

Wounds are another story, but a slap?

I liked smint's post too.

I don't understand what you are talking about when you use the word 'slap'. The OP didnt describe what he saw as 'a slap' and of course you seem to forget that a large man could kill a small woman or child with a 'slap' depending on the situation of course.

So, using your theory of 'slap' being okay, how do we define what a slap is and how much force can be used when slapping, how do we measure this.

Any man that thinks it is acceptable to slap a woman around is probably too gutless and weedy to be trying to slap another man around, yes/no?

My writing about a slap had nothing to do with the OP, but rather with the opinions of some posters.

In the west, police are quick to arrest anyone because of any kind of physical violence, and in some countries it is even forbidden for parents to slap their children's butts to punish them.

My definition of a slap is a hit / beating with the open hand, causing some immediate but rapidly fading pain but not causing any wounds or blue marks. So - nothing serious.

I do not think "slapping someone around" is okay, because that supposes repeated, willful beating.

I do think a single slap or a pair of slaps in rapid succession can happen in heated arguments, and I do not think this should lead to prosecution or anything if the slaps didn't cause any durable harm.

BTW, in western countries women also slap men. So this works the other way around too.

I never slapped or beat anybody (except my children's bottom a couple of times), and I never beat another man (so far).

I hope it will never happen.

To come back to the OP, judging from what he told about the incident, the girl being beaten or slapped was sitting on her motorbike. So the beating was not strong enough for her to fall or to drive away, so it could not be truly severe, especially as she then drove slowly towards the guy while crying.

As I wrote earlier I consider "slapping around" to be wrong, but the consequences of the beating described by the OP did not seem to me to be severe enough to warrant an intervention in their domestic problems.

Edited December 2, 2009 by manarak

[neverdie]

and in some countries it is even forbidden for parents to slap their children's butts to punish them.

slightly off topic I know, but what country is that?

[Kitsch22]

and in some countries it is even forbidden for parents to slap their children's butts to punish them.

slightly off topic I know, but what country is that?

Back on topic, the Thais have a saying: "Rak wua hai phuuk. Rak luuk hai dtii" (If you love your cow you should tether it. If you love your child you should beat it)

That should have the PC brigade positively foaming at the mouth.

[Saiyan]

I related the Op’s story to my wife (thai) up to the point of stopping and observing the beating and asked her to continue the story.

She said that she would have phoned 1300. A program started by the daughter of the prince, Pra Ong Pa, who has a master’s degree in law, who take violence against women and children very seriously, and will react against any perpetrators with dire consequences. They in turn would take it up with the nearest police station and demand an investigation.

She also said that if a woman was molested and reported this to the police and their response was inappropriate or inadequate the name of the police officer was to be reported to this organisation for further action.

This scenario might just change the general attitude of the police if this is so.

[manarak]

and in some countries it is even forbidden for parents to slap their children's butts to punish them.

slightly off topic I know, but what country is that?

one of the countries is Germany.

[MSingh]

OP : Can anyone help my understand this before I pack my bags and head home?

If you honestly, honestly, honetsly feel that strongly about this situation & refuse to mind your own Business in the future if you see things like this happening here, then that really is your only choice...

I too am sick to death with minding my own Business over things that are just plain wrong, it's not how i was brought up, i have morals & some of the stuff that goes on here goes against everything i was brought up to believe in & the " Thai Culture " excuse simply never has in the past & certainly doesn't cut it with me today & i no longer want to live in a Society like this so i'm doing something about it, slowly but surely..

Hence my plotting my escape on a daily basis currently..

[tropo]

Foreigners who come here to live should consider themselves as mere spectators. Enjoy what you can and ignore the rest, or leave.

"Mind your own business and walk away" was the best response here.

[tropo]

I too am sick to death with minding my own Business over things that are just plain wrong, it's not how i was brought up, i have morals & some of the stuff that goes on here goes against everything i was brought up to believe in & the " Thai Culture " excuse simply never has in the past & certainly doesn't cut it with me today & i no longer want to live in a Society like this so i'm doing something about it, slowly but surely..

You sound just like the old puritanical missionaries who traveled the world to impose their morals and beliefs on other people.

You have your own personal morals and codes of conduct and your own ideas of what is right and "plain wrong". Stop trying to be a missionary.

You can't change a thing in Thailand, so you have 2 options, ignore it or leave.

Why did you come here in the first place? Did you not expect that things would be different?