Cell-phone Chaos: Connection Crisis Easing

[george]

CELL-PHONE CHAOS: Connection crisis easing

Root cause of call-failure problem still a mystery; ICT officials to ask TOT to expand its trunk network next week

BANGKOK: -- The problem of mobile-phone call connection failures that has plagued users over the past few weeks seems to be easing.

However, nobody knows if the problem will arise again or if current efforts to tackle the problem will get to the root cause.

Kanawat Wasinsungworn, vice minister for Information and Communications Technology, said yesterday that he would meet with TOT Corp executives on Monday and ask them to expand the company’s trunk network, in an effort to tackle the problem.

He said he had been advised TOT’s congested trunk network was one cause of the millions of failed connections across different networks.

All cellular networks in Thailand are connected through TOT’s trunk network.

A vast number of Total Access Communication (DTAC) and TA Orange customers complained that they could not make calls to subscribers of Advanced Info Service (AIS) over the past few weeks, but in many cases could still receive calls from AIS subscribers.

Many claimed AIS was blocking their calls to its network.

AIS executives strongly denied the charge, saying the problem stemmed from DTAC and TA Orange promotions that encouraged their customers to make a large number of calls.

Wichian Mektrakarn, AIS executive vice president for operations, reaffirmed yesterday that the company never blocked calls.

AIS has already checked its network and found it to be functioning well, he said.

He suggested DTAC check to see if the problem stemmed from its network.

Athueck Asavanund, vice chairman of True Corp, a parent of TA Orange, said he was checking call-traffic statistics from TA Orange’s network to AIS and DTAC’s networks over the past few weeks, after TA Orange customers complained they could not connect to AIS’ network.

While TOT has yet to expand its trunk network, several DTAC customers said yesterday that the problem was easing – but only during some periods of the day.

Rianchai Reowilaisuk, a member of the National Telecommunications Commission (NTC), told The Nation yesterday that as the holder of AIS’ concession contract and the collector of access charges from DTAC and TA Orange, it was TOT’s responsibility to tackle the problem.

The access charge is the fee DTAC and TA Orange, who are concessionaires of CAT Telecom Co, have to pay TOT for using its trunk network to connect with different networks.

Many affected mobile-phone users earlier asked the NTC, the industry regulator, to look into the matter.

But the NTC said the problem was beyond its power, as mobile-phone operators were not under its licence.

--The Nation 2005-04-22

[Maejo Man]

"AIS executives strongly denied the charge, saying the problem stemmed from DTAC and TA Orange promotions that encouraged their customers to make a large number of calls."

Isn't that what business is all about, getting your customers to spend more money?

AIS do similar promotions! I think the head waiter is a trifle miffed about competition, having had a monopoly for so many years

[Orion76]

Isn't that what business is all about, getting your customers to spend more money?

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

If you don't have the resources to handle the sudden increase in call volume then that's not good business.

[DaveYo]

Wrong-----> if the call volume suddenly took a sky hop out to space, it does not matter whether or not you have enough resources to handle it. It is a phenomenom so to speak, and each carrier has their own frequencies for their product.

The big problem here is only one company is handling all the call volumes from 3 carriers. This is a disaster waiting to happen. They should divide the trunk network and split it out so the overload does not happen again. After this is done, then TOT can have the extra trunk network to handle all overloads as your backup thus making the system almost fail safe.

Again try explaining this to Thai people is like trying to explain yourself to some frickin elephant of who you are etc.

Daveyo

[sand]

Would be intertesting to know what has been proved to be the real cause. According to the first post it seems TOT agreed that their network is congested? not sure.

AIS and DTAC etc all checking thier individual networks?? They would all seem to be ok if the problem was the routes between the networks.

Same old saga with other licenced operators OLO networks where the route cause if often the link between the OLO switches.

If the link/links between the OLO switches had errors or noise , these would auto busy and block incoming and outgoing traffic. Which as it all points to i/c to AIS this would seem more likely? DTAC customers have been able to contact Orange custs all ok ?? more info needed ?

It seems no one is monitoring the traffic overflows on either network. This problem should have been nipped in the bud with the first amount of failed calls and the reason established. But try getting the OLO to accept the fault is with them. haa.

All in all, the telecoms here is not bad considereing. Other countries are a lot worse. Just a tad unstable.......like the DNS connexions from TRUE etc ....um another story.............

oh well....

[Phil Conners]

Yes, a lot of other third world countries have worse telco infrastructures.

Not any first world to my knowledge. Correct me.

[astral]

Wrong-----> if the call volume suddenly took a sky hop out to space, it does not matter whether or not you have enough resources to handle it.   It is a phenomenom so to speak, and each carrier has their own frequencies for their product.  

The big problem here is only one company is handling all the call volumes from 3 carriers.   This is a disaster waiting to happen.  They should divide the trunk network and split it out so the overload does not happen again.  After this is done, then TOT can have the extra trunk network to handle all overloads as your backup thus making the system almost fail safe.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

What about the management ability?

Planning ahead to handle predicted growth, and contingency plans for the

possible explosive growth that has occurred?

Is the word "plan" even in the Thai vocabulary?

[RamTodatry]

Can we discuss issues without disparaging other people of other nationalities. Just because we are more vocal than others does not give us that right.

LIVE AND LET LIVE.....PLEASE....

Why do we have to rant and rave. Can we be more decent. Or maybe I am missing the point of a DORUM.....

[Teach]

CELL-PHONE CHAOS: Connection crisis easing

Root cause of call-failure problem still a mystery; ICT officials to ask TOT to expand its trunk network next week

BANGKOK: -- The problem of mobile-phone call connection failures that has plagued users over the past few weeks seems to be easing.

However, nobody knows if the problem will arise again or if current efforts to tackle the problem will get to the root cause.

Kanawat Wasinsungworn, vice minister for Information and Communications Technology, said yesterday that he would meet with TOT Corp executives on Monday and ask them to expand the company’s trunk network, in an effort to tackle the problem.

He said he had been advised TOT’s congested trunk network was one cause of the millions of failed connections across different networks.

All cellular networks in Thailand are connected through TOT’s trunk network.

A vast number of Total Access Communication (DTAC) and TA Orange customers complained that they could not make calls to subscribers of Advanced Info Service (AIS) over the past few weeks, but in many cases could still receive calls from AIS subscribers.

Many claimed AIS was blocking their calls to its network.

AIS executives strongly denied the charge, saying the problem stemmed from DTAC and TA Orange promotions that encouraged their customers to make a large number of calls.

Wichian Mektrakarn, AIS executive vice president for operations, reaffirmed yesterday that the company never blocked calls.

AIS has already checked its network and found it to be functioning well, he said.

He suggested DTAC check to see if the problem stemmed from its network.

Athueck Asavanund, vice chairman of True Corp, a parent of TA Orange, said he was checking call-traffic statistics from TA Orange’s network to AIS and DTAC’s networks over the past few weeks, after TA Orange customers complained they could not connect to AIS’ network.

While TOT has yet to expand its trunk network, several DTAC customers said yesterday that the problem was easing – but only during some periods of the day.

Rianchai Reowilaisuk, a member of the National Telecommunications Commission (NTC), told The Nation yesterday that as the holder of AIS’ concession contract and the collector of access charges from DTAC and TA Orange, it was TOT’s responsibility to tackle the problem.

The access charge is the fee DTAC and TA Orange, who are concessionaires of CAT Telecom Co, have to pay TOT for using its trunk network to connect with different networks.

Many affected mobile-phone users earlier asked the NTC, the industry regulator, to look into the matter.

But the NTC said the problem was beyond its power, as mobile-phone operators were not under its licence.

--The Nation 2005-04-22

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

Appears to me that they have managed to find a more natural way to prevent signals getting through whenever they choose!!!!!!

Perhaps now we don't have to register our respective cell numbers/passports numbers with the bill.

T.

[hardy1943]

CELL-PHONE CHAOS: Connection crisis easing

Root cause of call-failure problem still a mystery; ICT officials to ask TOT to expand its trunk network next week

BANGKOK: -- The problem of mobile-phone call connection failures that has plagued users over the past few weeks seems to be easing.

However, nobody knows if the problem will arise again or if current efforts to tackle the problem will get to the root cause.

Kanawat Wasinsungworn, vice minister for Information and Communications Technology, said yesterday that he would meet with TOT Corp executives on Monday and ask them to expand the company’s trunk network, in an effort to tackle the problem.

He said he had been advised TOT’s congested trunk network was one cause of the millions of failed connections across different networks.

All cellular networks in Thailand are connected through TOT’s trunk network.

A vast number of Total Access Communication (DTAC) and TA Orange customers complained that they could not make calls to subscribers of Advanced Info Service (AIS) over the past few weeks, but in many cases could still receive calls from AIS subscribers.

Many claimed AIS was blocking their calls to its network.

AIS executives strongly denied the charge, saying the problem stemmed from DTAC and TA Orange promotions that encouraged their customers to make a large number of calls.

Wichian Mektrakarn, AIS executive vice president for operations, reaffirmed yesterday that the company never blocked calls.

AIS has already checked its network and found it to be functioning well, he said.

He suggested DTAC check to see if the problem stemmed from its network.

Athueck Asavanund, vice chairman of True Corp, a parent of TA Orange, said he was checking call-traffic statistics from TA Orange’s network to AIS and DTAC’s networks over the past few weeks, after TA Orange customers complained they could not connect to AIS’ network.

While TOT has yet to expand its trunk network, several DTAC customers said yesterday that the problem was easing – but only during some periods of the day.

Rianchai Reowilaisuk, a member of the National Telecommunications Commission (NTC), told The Nation yesterday that as the holder of AIS’ concession contract and the collector of access charges from DTAC and TA Orange, it was TOT’s responsibility to tackle the problem.

The access charge is the fee DTAC and TA Orange, who are concessionaires of CAT Telecom Co, have to pay TOT for using its trunk network to connect with different networks.

Many affected mobile-phone users earlier asked the NTC, the industry regulator, to look into the matter.

But the NTC said the problem was beyond its power, as mobile-phone operators were not under its licence.

--The Nation 2005-04-22

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

Appears to me that they have managed to find a more natural way to prevent signals getting through whenever they choose!!!!!!

Perhaps now we don't have to register our respective cell numbers/passports numbers with the bill.

T.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

[hardy1943]

How are they going to trace anything.Thailands phone system is still in the STONE AGE.Ever tried to make a call from the U.S. most the time one can not even got thru.

[yuyi]

Can we discuss issues without disparaging other people of other nationalities.  Just because we are more vocal than others does not give us that right.

LIVE AND LET LIVE.....PLEASE....

Why do we have to rant and rave.  Can we be more decent.  Or maybe I am missing the point of a DORUM.....

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

Oh come on, we cannot talk about the Thai mobile-phone call connection failures and avoid using the words Thai and Thailand. This mess is in Thailand, managed by Thais, and shows the very typical chaos, mess, lack of planning, and fxxck up by a monopoly organization we see here in this wonderful country so very often.

This has nothing to do with the nationality of the posters. It sucks, and why hiding it? Living here and loving Thailand gives us the right to say what we see.

As citizens of this globe we can speak freely about what we see on this globe. May be you come to Thailand and live here a while, and you will see and understand the typical Thai way of business. You might start to rant too

It is also a possibly positive effect of our ranting, that we might explain on the way to our neighbors and friends here what can easily be done better, to their benefit. It is independent of nationality to feel angry if your calls fail permanently. Learning that it does not have to be this way is a first step to action to make it better.

Or is it that you do not like that some people say that Mr. Toxin does not like the competition for his AIS cashcow? Well, that's a fact, like it or not.

Thanks to Orange, Dtac and Hutch we can phone now for 1 baht / minute. Before, Mr. Toxin got 3 to 5 baht / minute. It does not surprise me that now these bad boys get some weird problems. He needs to show a reason to stay with AIS and to pay more. It is too obvious who has an interest that Dtac and Orange have problems, and that these problems stay for a while.

[Big Brian]

Having used the mobile service in Thailand, I was pretty impressed with service, apart from when calling the UK with my English SIM, cost a fortune..........I should have bought a 'local' SIM and used that. I certainly shall next time.

Most times I ring Thailand ( a mobile there) I do get through, so, the service can't be that bad?

Brian, Huddersfield, England.

[yuyi]

Having used the mobile service in Thailand, I was pretty impressed with service, apart from when calling the UK with my English SIM, cost a fortune..........I should have bought a 'local' SIM and used that. I certainly shall next time.

Most times I ring Thailand ( a mobile there) I do get through, so, the service can't be that bad?

Brian, Huddersfield, England.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

This story is not about calls from the U.K. not getting connected, but calls from the networks of dtac and orange in Thailand not getting connected when they call numbers in the network of AIS in Thailand , and that without a clear technical reason.

The networks of DTAC and Orange are excellent, DTAC even offers EDGE in central Thailand. AIS cannot, because they did apparently install a nice mixture of equipment from many different vendors, which allows them to offer GPRS, but not the faster EDGE, due to incompatibilities.

If you are not familiar with the situation in Thailand, then please be aware that AIS had a de facto monopoly for many years, making its owner, the current PM of Thailand, very rich. The recent competition by DTAC, Orange and Hutch is starting to hurt AIS, because they offer prices down to 1 baht / minute, while AIS still wants 3 to 5 baht. Huge savings for the user, and less cash for the PM.

[raslin]

Wrong-----> if the call volume suddenly took a sky hop out to space, it does not matter whether or not you have enough resources to handle it.  It is a phenomenom so to speak, and each carrier has their own frequencies for their product. 

The big problem here is only one company is handling all the call volumes from 3 carriers.  This is a disaster waiting to happen.  They should divide the trunk network and split it out so the overload does not happen again.  After this is done, then TOT can have the extra trunk network to handle all overloads as your backup thus making the system almost fail safe.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

What about the management ability?

Planning ahead to handle predicted growth, and contingency plans for the

possible explosive growth that has occurred?

Is the word "plan" even in the Thai vocabulary?

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

The Dean of a major Thai university explained it all to me. There is no Thai word for "planning" so the Thais borrow the English word "plan" and add

"ning" to it. It Thaii this means DO NOTHING.

So true!

[raro]

that's funny, on 21-04 I called DTAC call center and vented my frustration about the 90% failure quote when trying to call an AIS number and - suspecting a network overload - I offered to subscribe with someone else to ease their network traffic.

The guy at the call center had NO idea that there was a problem whatsoever and promised me a call from a technician within 24 hours. Yes, you guessed right, the technician never called. The next morning, first thing i saw was the Nation article about the phone chaos...just wonder whether they b*%&shit us on prupose at the call centters or whether they really have no clue at all...

Something else: If you run a business and subscribe with DTAC and you have trouble with the Withholding Tax because you're on direct debit from your bank account (I do not have time to cue up at 7/11s to pay utility bills), DTAC can give you a paper to indemnify you from any trouble with the revenue department. No, the call center has never heard about it. I have the mobile phone number of their Accounting Manager...PM me...

[yuyi]

that's funny, on 21-04 I called DTAC call center and vented my frustration about the 90% failure quote when trying to call an AIS number and  - suspecting a network overload - I offered to subscribe with someone else to ease their network traffic.

The guy at the call center had NO idea that there was a problem whatsoever and promised me a call from a technician within 24 hours. Yes, you guessed right, the technician never called. The next morning, first thing i saw was the Nation article about the phone chaos...just wonder whether they b*%&shit us on prupose at the call centters or whether they really have no clue at all...

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

This is not a special dtac problem, but typical for Thailand. Promised callbacks do get "forgotten" even in other countries

After a billing problem I did get the promised callback, once from the call center guy and again from his manager. The action promised by the manager did get noted clearly in my file, but then nobody took action.

Easy to fix with DTAC though. In their office in the Ex World Trade Center they do take care of it, and it works. They do even know what GPRS and EDGE is, can sell you EDGE pcmcia cards, and tell you exactly if the dtac station near you does already supports EDGE. (Even outside of bangkok, EDGE works from time to time. Hutch CDMA is much better though. ) There is even a technician present, which can check your GPRS connection (bring your notebook). What a pleasant surprise that was, and what a difference to the AIS service.

[tracer0]

Having used the mobile service in Thailand, I was pretty impressed with service, apart from when calling the UK with my English SIM, cost a fortune..........I should have bought a 'local' SIM and used that. I certainly shall next time.

Most times I ring Thailand ( a mobile there) I do get through, so, the service can't be that bad?

Brian, Huddersfield, England.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

This story is not about calls from the U.K. not getting connected, but calls from the networks of dtac and orange in Thailand not getting connected when they call numbers in the network of AIS in Thailand , and that without a clear technical reason.

The networks of DTAC and Orange are excellent, DTAC even offers EDGE in central Thailand. AIS cannot, because they did apparently install a nice mixture of equipment from many different vendors, which allows them to offer GPRS, but not the faster EDGE, due to incompatibilities.

If you are not familiar with the situation in Thailand, then please be aware that AIS had a de facto monopoly for many years, making its owner, the current PM of Thailand, very rich. The recent competition by DTAC, Orange and Hutch is starting to hurt AIS, because they offer prices down to 1 baht / minute, while AIS still wants 3 to 5 baht. Huge savings for the user, and less cash for the PM.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

When we had the Tsunami and were left high and dry on a mountain top watching through a telescope Thais going fishing, eating etc as normal and 'unidentfied gangs' robbing evacuated places, it was amazing we could call europe but not anywhere else. Now there was an explanation but at even a normal blackout, AIS drowns from power loss at 16.00.

I think they are using a military addon to chop connections so that only locally important calls get passed. ...

[penzman]

Wrong-----> if the call volume suddenly took a sky hop out to space, it does not matter whether or not you have enough resources to handle it.   It is a phenomenom so to speak, and each carrier has their own frequencies for their product.  

The big problem here is only one company is handling all the call volumes from 3 carriers.   This is a disaster waiting to happen.  They should divide the trunk network and split it out so the overload does not happen again.  After this is done, then TOT can have the extra trunk network to handle all overloads as your backup thus making the system almost fail safe.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

What about the management ability?

Planning ahead to handle predicted growth, and contingency plans for the

possible explosive growth that has occurred?

Is the word "plan" even in the Thai vocabulary?

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

Planning ahead? Predicted growth?

I just turned on the tap, no water (Monday to Thursday only)... And they are building dozens of new villages around here... I'd call them to talk about all this but the phone doesn't work!

[Anon999]

How are they going to trace anything.Thailands phone system is still in the STONE AGE.Ever tried to make a call from the U.S. most the time one can not even got thru.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

No, but call a mobile in Thailand from England every day and frequently get connection problems, either not connecting or my gf not being able to hear me but I can always here her.

Anyone else have similar problems?

[PeaceBlondie]

My biggest frustration on phone service in northern Thailand is trying to call out to the real world, outside of Thailand. Repeatedly, I've resorted to my mobile and paid 40 baht/minute because the landline doesn't work. I try various combinations of 007, 008 and prefixes of 1 or 11 before the country code...nothing. And God forbid that you should ask a Thai how to call outside of Thailand; apparently it would cause them to become a farang.

[randersn]

No, but call a mobile in Thailand from England every day and frequently get connection problems, either not connecting or my gf not being able to hear me but I can always here her.

Anyone else have similar problems?

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

Yes, same problems constantly, calling from Korea--no connection, one-way hearing. But now a worse problem, I get busy signals almost all the time and when I do connect, I reach a different party, not the number I'm trying to call. I'm trying to call a cell phone, so I dial the country code (66) + the cell phone code (60) + the six-digit phone number, same as I've always done in the past. Unfortunately, I get hold of someone I don't know. Since I don't speak Thai, I have no idea how to ask what number it is that I've actually reached. Any suggestions or is this just part of the recent phone problems?

Edited May 2, 2005 by randersn

[joebuzzard]

Still having problems with this. Can't connect to AIS numbers. Get the busy signal for most of the calls. Have called DTAC about and they promise to get back with me.