Best Options For Teaching In Bangkok, Without A Degree!

[Ivantheterrible]

Hey all,

I know this has probably been asked in various forms many times before, so I'll start by saying, sorry for bringing it up yet again.

I've actually been living here in Bangkok for almost a year already now, but haven't done any teaching here, or even looked in to it, but now I may be interested.

I don't have a degree OR a CELTA.

I do have a tesol/tefl certificate and some teaching experience in China.

What kind of work, if any, can I expect to get?

What kind of salary could I expect per hour/week/month? (I know it isn't that much)

Are there any agencies that can set up 1 on 1 teaching?

Are there language mills or what have you that I could kind of walk in and teach a class here a class there on a pay per class basis?

I'd be looking for something like one of the above, preferably the first one, and am less interested in teaching an entire class of students. But if that's what the best option is I can easily do it, I have before after all.

I don't have super high expectations, just let me know what I can expect with no degree and that's all I'm looking for.

Edited February 17, 2010 by Ivantheterrible

[Scott]

You might want to check the pinned threads at the top of the forum, especially about qualifications. Some of the new regulations may have an impact on you and it seems that the job market is not as employee-friendly as it was before.

Hopefully some posters will give you more specific information.

[mizzi39]

I have a few friends working in Bangkok minus degrees. They make between 35,000-40,000 baht per month and were hired through an agency (teaching in private schools with a high teacher turn over rate) The agency helps out with their visa runs, but cannot get them WP's, so it means going to Lao when their Tourist Visa's run out and applying for new ones.

They are not "above board" (legal), which could be a potential problem if immigration decided to make a "surprise" visit, but no problems thus far.

As you make your way out of Bangkok to more rural areas the criteria changes. I know many teachers without degrees who have WP and are totally legal. All it usually takes is for a director to write a kind letter to the TC stating that the teacher is an "asset to the program" and said teacher gets a letter back to take to immigration and the labor office.

It all comes down to "supply and demand". Their is simply not enough teachers who want to teach in the more rural areas to satisfy the demand, thus the change in criteria.

Good luck with your search.

Edited February 18, 2010 by mizzi39

[somluck]

Not trying to be the wet blanket but 40K per month is too little to survive on in bangkok

[Scott]

You might also want to have a look at this pinned topic about the Teacher's License: http://www.thaivisa.com/forum/Teacher-Lice...25#entry3331436

The waivers are good for two years and there is a limit to how many times you can get a waiver.

[tonititan]

Not trying to be the wet blanket but 40K per month is too little to survive on in bangkok

I think that's a whole different issue, which has already been debated on TV. Many would say that it is plenty. That's probably not an issue for this person, though, because he/she has been living in Bangkok for a year. He/she should have a good idea of what salary is livable.

[mizzi39]

Not trying to be the wet blanket but 40K per month is too little to survive on in bangkok

Really? My then girlfriend (now my wife) and I did it rather comfortably on just above 40K baht per month. We had a very nice apartment in Ramkhumhang, since she was going to RU and trying to finish up her degree at the time. Ramkhumhang is not too far from downtown BKK. I never felt financially "deprived" nor did she.

Of course how much a person needs to live depends on that persons "indulgences".

We have been living in the sticks for the past couple of years. Sure, less to do, although the indulgences are there for those who choose to partake and like BKK, your baht will be pissed away rather quickly, but in the sticks everyday expenses are halved. Example: 3K baht-5K baht monthly for a house.

in the end It's all relative.

Edited February 18, 2010 by mizzi39

[SeanMoran]

Not trying to be the wet blanket but 40K per month is too little to survive on in bangkok

Really? My then girlfriend (now my wife) and I did it rather comfortably on just above 40K baht per month. We had a very nice apartment in Ramkhumhang, since she was going to RU and trying to finish up her degree at the time. Ramkhumhang is not too far from downtown BKK. I never felt financially "deprived" nor did she.

Of course how much a person needs to live depends on that persons "indulgences".

We have been living in the sticks for the past couple of years. Sure, less to do, although the indulgences are there for people who choose to partake, but expenses are halved. Example: 3K baht-5K baht monthly for a house.

in the end It's all relative.

Yep, 30,000 is plenty enough for air-cond apartments, nice restaurants, beers and smokes in abundance, but kon diao except for your birthday. No matter what skills and experience you might have, however, or whether you can do the actual job in a blackboarded classroom with 50 Mattayom 3 teenagers and a few ceiling fans at the start of the academic year in May, you won't get 30,000 per month without that little piece of paperwork.

[Daren]

Check around! There are a few recent job postings on various web boards advertising jobs for those without degrees. As already stated the jobs usually range form 30 - 40k/month and some might not be in the best working conditions, but surely you're already aware of the fact you won't be getting a huge wad of cash in a cushy air-con room without the paper.

Feel free to PM me if you want a list of job boards.

I remember how successful and popular Hollow's 30k/month diary was -- maybe someone should do one on 40k? How much more comfortable is it? Maybe not a lot as the price of western food seems rise by the month!

[SeanMoran]

Check around! There are a few recent job postings on various web boards advertising jobs for those without degrees. As already stated the jobs usually range form 30 - 40k/month and some might not be in the best working conditions, but surely you're already aware of the fact you won't be getting a huge wad of cash in a cushy air-con room without the paper.

Feel free to PM me if you want a list of job boards.

I remember how successful and popular Hollow's 30k/month diary was -- maybe someone should do one on 40k? How much more comfortable is it? Maybe not a lot as the price of western food seems rise by the month!

Those might be desperadoes looking for long-nosed teachers, but the MoE won't give you a work permit unless you have a degree. I know from experience and help you not end up like I have.

[Somrak]

I asume Ivan likes to teach in Bangkok.

In the NO Khon Kaen/Udon i did hear, that the teachers at the university get 30-40k Bath a month.

But they become a "income-tax-paper"(?) for 50k, that the school can applay for the WP and visa extension.

[thunder30101]

Once again your wrong seanmoran, work permits have nothing to do with degrees, many people are working without degrees in thailand legally as has been stated many times before in this forum. You really need to think before you hit the button. People always seem to say how they cant live on 30-40k a month, how do you think the thais do it on much less ??? If you want to drink and whore every night then yes it isnt enough, but many people including myself do it quite happily.

[SeanMoran]

Once again your wrong seanmoran, work permits have nothing to do with degrees, many people are working without degrees in thailand legally as has been stated many times before in this forum. You really need to think before you hit the button. People always seem to say how they cant live on 30-40k a month, how do you think the thais do it on much less ??? If you want to drink and whore every night then yes it isnt enough, but many people including myself do it quite happily.

No. I came here in 2548 to accept a job I was offered, and only after I arrived, did I find out the truth about the MoE, and so my life was shattered. No degree = no work permit, unless you have some way to get around it. If you know how, then please feel free to get me a work permit over the coming weekend and I'll gladly buy you a beer for your efforts.

[Scott]

The law doesn't specifically require a degree. A school may require a degree, and a degree may be required for certain schools by the MOE. I know some bilingual schools are required to hire people with degrees.

Regulations are sometimes made up by the person enforcing them, and that may have been what you encountered.

There are a lot of people without degrees who have work permits. The new spanner in the works will be the Teacher's License and how that eventually is enforced.

You can take a look at this thread for further information on TL:

http://www.thaivisa.com/forum/Teacher-Lice...ing-t89409.html

How comfortably you can live depends on life-style.

[SeanMoran]

The law doesn't specifically require a degree. A school may require a degree, and a degree may be required for certain schools by the MOE. I know some bilingual schools are required to hire people with degrees.

Regulations are sometimes made up by the person enforcing them, and that may have been what you encountered.

There are a lot of people without degrees who have work permits. The new spanner in the works will be the Teacher's License and how that eventually is enforced.

You can take a look at this thread for further information on TL:

http://www.thaivisa.com/forum/Teacher-Lice...ing-t89409.html

How comfortably you can live depends on life-style.

Okay then Scott, get me a work permit.

[jdinasia]

I think you will find that NOBODY has EVER gotten a work permit from the Ministry of Education ... simply because they do not issue work permits as has been stated earlier on this thread.

Work permit information can be found here ... http://eng.mol.go.th/doe_service01.html

[PeaceBlondie]

Sean, I have a real BA degree and was told by my provincial Labour Dept. in Lamphun they had never issued a WP to a teacher. Years later they issued a WP to an undegreed teacher. Your mileage will differ.

[SeanMoran]

Sean, I have a real BA degree and was told by my provincial Labour Dept. in Lamphun they had never issued a WP to a teacher. Years later they issued a WP to an undegreed teacher. Your mileage will differ.

I understand mate. Most of my dreams don't go near that understanding I have of the reality, that I cannot work as a teacher anymore in this country because I have suddenly after 15 years teaching English become formally unqualified. I'll just be a good old-fashioned tourist now until my savings run out and I die, and good luck to Thailand in finding decent teachers of English after that. What you give is what you will get.

[PeaceBlondie]

You can get hired legally somewhere in Thailand, supposedly.

[cdnvic]

One post deleted for excessive profanity. If you think that changing the spelling slightly changes everything, don't get upset that you can't find a job teaching English.

[thunder30101]

Sean with your attitude that you display on your many posts here on tv I dont see anyone hiring you anywhere.

[Ijustwannateach]

Ivan, welcome to the forum. You need to check out many of the pinned threads, esp. Questions About Qualifications. You've got a lot of reading to do.

Sean, I presume you had a life before you came to Thailand, and maybe you can still have one after Thailand, too. It may be true that you have run out of options for teaching, and perhaps even working, in Thailand- and it does seem as if things are getting generally harder (though still not impossible) for language teachers without degrees- but times do change. I suggest that you look for what possibilities there are, do extra work as necessary to keep up your income, and possibly invest in a local or distance qualification to put yourself back into the game. It's not so surprising that a teacher would be expected to have an interest in ongoing education, after all. Check the pinned thread on that.

Many of your recent posts have exhibited a rather macabre focus on your own death. It's hard for me to relate to such pessimism surrounding a job setback. Perhaps you need to consult some trusted friend or counsellor about your state of mind.

[mizzi39]

OK, I will say it one more time. I know 3 non degree teachers who have WP's (1 who works in my department), and there are possibly more. The Govt. school that i teach at is the biggest in the province, with over 3,500 students, and multiple programs including EP.

Although they may not have degrees, all 3 have over 10 years teaching experience, and all 3 are in their mid to late 50's.

[Scott]

jd you know full well what I am talking about and I consider your post to be an attempt to derail the thread. The MOE writes a letter for the prospective teacher to Immigration/embassy/consular officer. This is submitted with the registration papers of the school (either before or during the process). The visa is issued. Then the Work Permit. For teachers, I've never known of anyone who got to step 3 without going through step one.

If the MOE says you need a degree, then you need a degree. If the MOE says nothing about a degree and issues the letter, then you don't need a degree.

[jdinasia]

Scott ---

My reply was in response to SeanMoran .. not you. SeanMoran keeps talking about the MoE issuing WP's and they do not do that. There was no attempt to derail the thread as I agree with you.

[Scott]

Your point is taken, JD.

[jfchandler]

Profanity and talk of death...in a thread about teaching options for BKK??? Amazing!!!!

But seriously, here are the various levels of qualification that I can envision for someone wanting to teach here, in my ordering of qualification...

Perhaps it's too much to expect for TV, but it would be great if someone with some degree of knowledge might recap the general prospects for each... I've given my guestimates, and would be happy to be corrected...

--Home country teaching credential, univ. degree and TEFL/TESOL certif...

I assume you're golden

--Univ degree and teaching credential OR TEFL/TESOL

I assume you're close to golden

--University degree only

I assume you can get a teaching job and a work permit, depending on where and who the employer is.

--No univ degree, but have TEFL/TESOL certif.

I assume you can get some job, but prospects and likelihood of WP are iffy...

--Nothing...

I assume you likely won't get a real job teaching, but you might become a member of Parliament...

As I said above, for those who think they are in the know, please correct me if the above has gone astray... It likely would be useful for folks to know...

[Scott]

It's a little difficult to argue with your assessment. Seems fair and you seem rather knowledgeable on the issues.

[ozzieovaseas]

We all know and have heard of people with no degrees having jobs here thats for sure.

But the info i got from a text and talk school agent was that you definately need a degree to satisfy the legal requirements of a work permit. The person telling me this was doing himself no favours as he lost a potential sale/customer from his honesty.

Anyway I hope that he was wrong as if it is now possible to get a work permit without a degree then i could rethink my options.

Regardless of case facts, ive noticed that over 90% of teaching jobs advertised on the more well known sites require a degree+tesol as a minimum requirement. It seems the ones that dont advertise this have forgotten to put it in the add and will ask you if you have a degree when you ring them.

[jdinasia]

I know I have several friends working with a T.L. waiver and they have work permits ... I also have friends that have never applied for a T.L. and they have work permits and no degrees, so ......

I'll be hiring someone in the next week and a degree is not mandatory and a work permit will be provided.

(PS -- I am NOT recruiting from here! Don't bother PMing )