Anti-Red Shirts Protest Grows

[MellowYellow]

Rainman,

You are a pretty reasonable guy. But I ask you, exactly who were the redshirts supposed to attack when everyone was busy running away from them trying to avoid a fight?

Now that they have worn out their welcome, and the good people of Bangkok are getting tired of their constant attempts to antagonize them, what do you expect to happen? A protest is supposed to be about advertising your cause and getting people to join you voluntarily. The red shirts now believe that a protest should be about causing maximum inconvenience and inhibiting the rights of all those who disagree with their opinion. There is no need to tie up traffic by yet another march to advertise their misguided opinion. Am I really innocent of violence if my sole intention is to keep taunting you until you lash out?

So yes, the pink shirts may be a bit more frustrated than the red shirts were when they first arrived. But that is only because they are trying to defend their rights and their home. I guarantee you if the PAD had marched into a remote Issan village completely peaceful and started disrupting people's lives by blocking roads these "peaceful" red protesters you mention would have turned violent much sooner than it took for the pink shirts to come out in force. Bangkokians have been overly tolerant of the red miscreants already.

It is time for the reds to go home. There is nothing to be gained by them sticking around. If they don't leave, and the police don't start limiting these senseless parades, the pink shirts will continue to grow in number until things really do become violent. And it isn't the pink shirts fault either. You can only push the good Bangkok people so far before they start pushing back.

The red shirts now believe that a protest should be about causing maximum inconvenience and inhibiting the rights of all those who disagree with their opinion. There is no need to tie up traffic by yet another march to advertise their misguided opinion.

Where were you and your righteous outrage 14-16 months ago when The PAD engaged in far greater disruption, seizing multiple government buildings and airports?

I guarantee you if the PAD had marched into a remote Issan village completely peaceful and started disrupting people's lives by blocking roads these "peaceful" red protesters you mention would have turned violent much sooner than it took for the pink shirts to come out in force.

OH! You guarantee? Well then I shall pay special attention to your statement then since you guarantee it.

When the seat of national government is in some remote Issan village, then, maybe your argument might have some validity or sense.

their misguided opinion...

the red miscreants...

If they don't leave,...things really do become violent...

And it isn't the pink shirts fault either

Solid plan.

Dehumanize those that disagree with you, then make excuses for your violent response.

Then, forgo all blame in advance, because you know, they are less than human "misguided miscreants" and "had it coming."

Edited April 2, 2010 by MellowYellow

[gregb]

Solid plan.

Dehumanize those that disagree with you, then make excuses for your violent response.

Then, forgo all blame in advance, because you know, they are less than human "misguided miscreants" and "had it coming."

Your characterization and selective quoting is clever but ultimately futile. Yes, the reds are miscreants, in the same way that all juvenile bullies are miscreants. Children are still human. Just incapable of understanding the consequences and of accepting responsibility for their actions. They need more guidance from those more mature. I believe this characterizes the red shirts extremely well. Nobody dehumanized anyone, except for the red shirts who somehow do not believe that anyone is allowed to have an opinion contrary to theirs.

I don't advocate violence. I advise the red shirts to leave in order to avoid violence because the good people of Bangkok are getting tired of their constant antagonism and irritation. They have had their say. We all heard them and were very patient. There is nothing left to be gained by antagonizing innocent Bangkokians further. It is now time for them to leave.

[MellowYellow]

Solid plan.

Dehumanize those that disagree with you, then make excuses for your violent response.

Then, forgo all blame in advance, because you know, they are less than human "misguided miscreants" and "had it coming."

Your characterization and selective quoting is clever but ultimately futile. Yes, the reds are miscreants, in the same way that all juvenile bullies are miscreants. Children are still human. Just incapable of understanding the consequences and of accepting responsibility for their actions. They need more guidance from those more mature. I believe this characterizes the red shirts extremely well. Nobody dehumanized anyone, except for the red shirts who somehow do not believe that anyone is allowed to have an opinion contrary to theirs.

I don't advocate violence. I advise the red shirts to leave in order to avoid violence because the good people of Bangkok are getting tired of their constant antagonism and irritation. They have had their say. We all heard them and were very patient. There is nothing left to be gained by antagonizing innocent Bangkokians further. It is now time for them to leave.

Bactrack as much as you want.

Your words.

Nothing selective about it.

Your entire quote is there for everyone to see.

Oh, you meant something so very nice by "miscreant"?

Leave it out.

Stop pretending you meant anything different.

Any reasonable person can see what you are saying.

Its your BS, just own it.

Edited April 2, 2010 by MellowYellow

[gregb]

Its your BS, just own it.

I take ownership of everything I say. I do not believe I have backtracked on anything.

The red shirts are miscreants. They need to leave. I support the pink shirts who are in favour of peace. I do not support the red shirts who are intent on antagonizing people until they evoke a violent response.

[yoshiwara]

@ JD and his mate: I prefer pompousness/presumptuousness to spinelessness/complacency any day.

You are full of hot air, mate. I gave you the chance to meet up and have an face-to-face discussion about all of this, but you didn't show. Obviously, you prefer to stick your head in the sand and entertain your fantasies about the righteousness of the yellow-shirted fascist movement and fire off snide remarks from behind the safety of a keyboard.

Now, it's up to you to go find out the truth for yourself, if you are not too complacent. I'm done trying to convince you.

AND regarding farang protesters @ the Red Shirt Rally- I was on the back of one of the trucks with several other internationals. You aren't going to learn very much sitting in your lounge room passively absorbing information. If you support the PAD so much, get out there and get amongst them!

You certainly do.

[beammeup]

Give it up gregb, he doesn't like reason or logic. They woun't go home cos Mr T hasn't got what he wants yet.

[maccaroni man]

@ JD and his mate: I prefer pompousness/presumptuousness to spinelessness/complacency any day.

You are full of hot air, mate. I gave you the chance to meet up and have an face-to-face discussion about all of this, but you didn't show. Obviously, you prefer to stick your head in the sand and entertain your fantasies about the righteousness of the yellow-shirted fascist movement and fire off snide remarks from behind the safety of a keyboard.

Now, it's up to you to go find out the truth for yourself, if you are not too complacent. I'm done trying to convince you.

AND regarding farang protesters @ the Red Shirt Rally- I was on the back of one of the trucks with several other internationals. You aren't going to learn very much sitting in your lounge room passively absorbing information. If you support the PAD so much, get out there and get amongst them!

You certainly do.

funny the only red shirts i have seen on samui have been white people; wonder where their gf is from

[lannarebirth]

You just couldn't make this stuff up. All of Thailand taking a trip down the Rabbit Hole:

Jatuporn vows to lead protesters to besiege BMA

BANGKOK: -- Jatuporn Promphan vowed Saturday morning to lead protesters to besiege the Bangkok Metropolitan Administration's headquarters.

He said the protesters were dissatisfied that the BMA took sample of protesters' blood for testing without permission and announced that the blood sample's was contaminated with HIV and other dangerous viruses.

Edited April 3, 2010 by lannarebirth

[frodo]

You just couldn't make this stuff up. All of Thailand taking a trip down the Rabbit Hole:

Jatuporn vows to lead protesters to besiege BMA

BANGKOK: -- Jatuporn Promphan vowed Saturday morning to lead protesters to besiege the Bangkok Metropolitan Administration's headquarters.

He said the protesters were dissatisfied that the BMA took sample of protesters' blood for testing without permission and announced that the blood sample's was contaminated with HIV and other dangerous viruses.

Unbelievable. Once they throw it, it's in the "public domain". I guess they feel "proletariat blood" can not be infected?

I read as well that Veera is now showing his true colors by stating that violence will probably occur due to their own frustration. Nothing but empty promises to the world. Water cannons and tear gas ready?

[hammered]

Is there a discussion thread for today or do we use this one by defualt?

[Netfan]

Veera threatens to burn NACC head office

BANGKOK: -- Veera Musigapong, a red-shirt leader, told the protesters at the Phan Fah Bridge Saturday morning that he may lead them to rally at the head office of the National Anti-Corruption Commission.

He said the protesters might have to use violent mean like setting fire to the office because the NACC has been using double standard law enforcement.

Veera said the red-shirt movement might have to use violent means to establish a new Thai state.

Ok, all you Thaksin/Red supporters, start defending this statement........

[hammered]

It looks like the aim today is to shut down Bangkok. Drivers only in vehicles and all other red shirts on foot. That will maximise congestion. The speeches seem to be hinting at a big push but numebrs are reprotedly lower than they hoped for, which may also explain walk and dont sit in the cars. Quite a few theats towards different groups too

[siampolee]

Took blood samples without permission !!!!!!

Ye Gods the ultimate crime.

Indeed corruption by Thaksin, jumping bail along with all the other antics of Thaksin pale into insignificance compared to the heinous crime of taking blood without permission from the public areas surrounding the attacked structures.

Thaksin, Jutaporn , Veera and Weng along with Mao Tse Tung, Ill Kim, Ho Chi Min, Josef Stalin, Adolf Hitler, Pol Pot and the despicable Generals in Myanamar indeed have a somewhat distorted view of DEMOCRACY.

The truth of the matter is that it's all about Thaksin his money and to further his megalomaniac egotistical causes and lining the pockets of his toadying little acolytes and their cronies.

Surely by the rule of law Jatupon quotes is not the besieging of the B.M.A. without permission also a crime ?

I note now that arson attacks are considered a legal right and the inciting of a revolution by Veera

Or is it yet again I am above the law, I will inflict my will upon the people ?

Dammed peculiar slant on DEMOCRACY in my view.

Edited April 3, 2010 by siampolee

[frodo]

Weng is also saying to use violence.

From Tulsahit's tweet:

Dr Weng: "Don't get angry, do uses violence, Don't talk back"

All leaders are advocating violence today.

[Netfan]

So Weng, Jatuporn and Veera have all advocated violence today. Desperation. They sense the end is near, all their tactics have ended in failure so now its time to sacrifice the sheep. The govt should take these guys in / down / out at the first opportunity.

[siampolee]

The frustration factor is kicking in, now the true face is showing, indeed I wonder where the fugitive Thaksin is who leads from the back is today ?

Comfortable somewhere enjoying his pitiful existence whilst the common masses are in the front line.

Netfan.

Spot on comment , gloves off and the authorities should go for the throat, if they don't I feel that the good people of Bangkok will go for the Red Shirt brigade

Red Shirt Brigade ?

Perhaps it should be Red Shirt Bandits ?

Edited April 3, 2010 by siampolee

[bubba]

So Weng, Jatuporn and Veera have all advocated violence today. Desperation. They sense the end is near, all their tactics have ended in failure so now its time to sacrifice the sheep. The govt should take these guys in / down / out at the first opportunity.

Quoting from the news alert I just received:

Earlier Saturday, Veera told the protesters at the Phan Fah Bridge that he might lead them to rally at the head office of the National Anti-Corruption Commission.

He said the protesters might have to use violent mean like setting fire to the office because the NACC has been using double standard law enforcement.

Veera said the red-shirt movement might have to use violent means to establish a new Thai state.

Jatuporn Promphan told the crowd that he might lead them to besiege the Bangkok Metropolitan Administration's headquarters.

And then Weng says:

While the three had violent tone, weng Tojirakarn told the protesters to remain calm and refrain from using violent.

"Don't get angry, do not use violence, don't talk back," weng told the crowd.

So a question to the red shirt proponents here on the board:

Which version do you prefer?

[frodo]

So Weng, Jatuporn and Veera have all advocated violence today. Desperation. They sense the end is near, all their tactics have ended in failure so now its time to sacrifice the sheep. The govt should take these guys in / down / out at the first opportunity.

I agree, Netfan, and I don't know what the government is waiting for. Most have warrants out for their arrest stemming from various actions. Time to cut the heads off from the Hydra. I see that Arisiman is still walking around blathering away. They have numerous cases against him as well, one for not turning himself in yesterday for his crimes about burning Bangkok down.

[bubba]

And is not a statement like:

Veera said the red-shirt movement might have to use violent means to establish a new Thai state.

advocating violent overthrow of a government and treasonous?

Is this "new Thai state" the "Republic of Thailand" that I have heard a certain individual would like to be President of?

[hammered]

It is going to be a tense day and one wrong move by anyone and it could be very nasty

[Netfan]

Some might say advocating a "new Thai state" is already a wrong move.

"The blocking of the Rajprasong Intersection is seen as a measure to pressure the business sector, which came out against the movement's call for early House dissolution.

The stage faces to the Pratunam area and is located between the Erawan Shrine and the Police General Hospital.

The stage blocked nearly all lanes, leaving just one passable lane on the Rama IV road.

Police tried in vain to talk to the protester to stop blocking the main intersection."

BTW, <deleted>?? tried to talk them out of blocking the intersection? Where are the water cannons?

Edited April 3, 2010 by Netfan

[bubba]

Of all the "shirts" - red, blue, yellow, pink, or white, only one has officially endorsed a violent overthrow of a sitting government: red shirts.

Today's decision by the red shirt leaders is an historic one, and I pray it's not an ominous one.

[shawndoc]

And just to clarify, the Weng quote was to Not do violence. The original quote that went out on Twitter left the "not" part out by mistake.

[mazeltov]

3. Propoganda campaign. I want proof. Show me. Show me exact amounts. i am frigging sick of hearing this after having watched TRT squander huge amounts of money, my tax money, promoting themselves and their rubbish. The current govt have done little of the sort

here someome spend some time to collect figures and list numbers.

Ranking PM's Office ad spending by government, the result is:

Surayud/CNS (2007) 1,090 million baht

Abhisit/Democrat Party (2009 est.) 978 million baht

Thaksin/TRT (2005) 795 million baht

Thaksin/TRT-Surayud/CNS (2006) 787 million baht

Samak & Somchai/PPP (2008 est.) 712 million baht

Thaksin (2004) 561 million baht

Spending per month can fluctuate (possibly affecting the quarterly estimate above for 2008-9).

Also note that ad spending is only for the PM's Office and doesn't include other ministries, agencies, or state-owned enterprises.

source

read the full article, to see where the numbers are coming from and how they haw been established.

to declare " TRT squander huge amounts of money, my tax money, promoting themselves and their rubbish. The current govt have done little of the sort" must the result of some partial blindness, cognitive bias. TRT, Thaksin - most annoying for you and i can understand that someone is pissed off by that.

Abhisists and Dems activities in the propaganda field aren't much less, if not even more. but because Abhisit is less annoying for you, you don't see it. but is is there,and it is awful and ridiculous.

if you look the rubbish the Dems promoting - is it exactly the same. lot of people here are so obsessed with Thaksin and red shirt bashing, they don't see or realise what the Dems are doing.

imagine a PPP Finance Minister had in the middle of the 2008 political crisis declared that "he wants to continue his term as the finance minister for nine years". what your reaction would be? how had all the other experts on this board react? okay, we can only speculate about this because i didn't happen.

but what if the current Finance Minister Korn Chatikavanij, democrat and old classmate of Abhisit, says exactly the same? and he did it, just this week after the discussion about the parliament dissolution, Korn has nothing better to say than that he wants serve for more 9 years, wasting your tax money.

[johndpoole]

Veera threatens to burn NACC head office

BANGKOK: -- Veera Musigapong, a red-shirt leader, told the protesters at the Phan Fah Bridge Saturday morning that he may lead them to rally at the head office of the National Anti-Corruption Commission.

He said the protesters might have to use violent mean like setting fire to the office because the NACC has been using double standard law enforcement.

Veera said the red-shirt movement might have to use violent means to establish a new Thai state.

Ok, all you Thaksin/Red supporters, start defending this statement........

Today looks like it might be the day this gets ugly.

[johndpoole]

"Police estimated the initial turnout for the latest demonstration in the capital's old quarter at 45,000."

Is it now time to accept the leaders of the Red Shirts are lunatics?

[Scott]

A number of posts have been deleted which only have a quote from a previous post. If you wish to quote, then please respond. If you alter the quote in anyway, then please make sure that you note that the alteration (such as bold, strike out) is yours.

Thanks.

[hammered]

By the way, the unmentionable one has an interesting piece in its pring edition today on funding the rallies and the implications for some provinces local government budgets.

[johndpoole]

By the way, the unmentionable one has an interesting piece in its pring edition today on funding the rallies and the implications for some provinces local government budgets.

Who is the unmentionable one?

[anotherpeter]

So, everyone is calling everyone names ... grow up. There are more important issues here than a few names.

What do the red shirt supporters say about threats to burn down the NACC? And of threats of violence at the BMA, for, of all things, testing some public, not even individual, blood?

The reds are really showing what their form of DEMOCRACY is all about. Free speech, as long as it's only them saying. Threats of violence against anyone that disagrees.