1997 Lexus Es 300 Automatic

[triffid]

I have a chance to buy this car privately. It appears to be in good condition for its age. I'd be really grateful for opinions on such a purchase.

- reliability and maintenance costs for the next few years and another 100,000 km

- how much more life free of serious trouble can such a car have left in it

- will it be easy or near impossible to sell in a few years

- what sort of price I might aim for to buy it

- would you have strong opinion for or against buying such a car

Given that I really want a trouble free few years my first reaction was that it's too old and has too many km on the clock. But I don't know how well these cars might carry the years and mileage.

My present car is a 2006 Mazda3 2 litre. It's in fine fettle even with the 100,00 km on the clock. The idea was to get a more comfortable car.

Edited May 14, 2010 by triffid

[MoonRiverOasis]

Given the monster mileage and assumed price, IMHO you'd definitely want a professional opionion on it's current health.

There's now a few companies specializing in unbiased used car testing in BKK - this is the only one that has an English language website AFAIK: http://www.testcar.co.th/english.benefits.php

[rixalex]

Given the monster mileage and assumed price, IMHO you'd definitely want a professional opionion on it's current health.

For a big car like that, not sure 200,000kms is what i would call "monster mileage". What is it, about 130,000 miles?

Heard that most of the taxis out there hit the million mark. Now that's what i call "monster"!

[Gary A]

I wouldn't touch it due to the 200,000 km. It may go another 200,000 but who knows. Being broke down on the Thailand roads is not my idea of fun.

[stingray]

Given the monster mileage and assumed price, IMHO you'd definitely want a professional opionion on it's current health.

For a big car like that, not sure 200,000kms is what i would call "monster mileage". What is it, about 130,000 miles?

Heard that most of the taxis out there hit the million mark. Now that's what i call "monster"!

What is a moster mileage? 200'k for a 13 year old car is not much. Specially not for a 3 liter V6. But the usual "panic makers" complaining again, if somewone try to get a nice car, instead of a boring Vios or Jazz. 200'k is 15'k per year, it's not much. This seller is at least honest. He could turn it back to 120'k easly and noone knows. I had a Toyota Crown with over 500'k and drove it for 2 years without any ,major troubles. 1997 ES 300 (V6 3 liter engine) will cost about 350 to 400'k (marked value). What do you expect? A new one have zero km on the ODO, but cost maybe 4 million. So you pay not even 10% for that used car, but it can be 80% good. "Go for it" if the condition is good.

Better to have a Lexus with 200'k, than a Jazz with 80'k. BTW, a automatic transmission for a ES 300 cost approx 25'k, if it fail. A tranny for a Jazz cost close to 100'k and many of them fail after 80'k.

All those Lexuses never have big problems. What could happen is failing of ODO and RPM meter. This is a common problem with Lexuses, can change the whole instrument panel if this problem occurs. Price about 5'k

Not a big deal.

Trust your self when you buy a car, more peaple you ask, more different opinion you get and after that you get onoly confused. I never asked someone (not even my wife) if i want to buy a car. Take it for a good testdrive, listen to the car and feel it. U can use a mecanic, but make sure that he check the car honest and not ask the sales person for a commission.

[WarpSpeed]

Top stuff Stinger...... Besides what is a Lexus? Toyota....So even swapping out the engine for another Toyota engine if required is not like when doing same in say a BMW or other which is common practice here and actually depreciates the car even more...

[MoonRiverOasis]

But the usual "panic makers" complaining again

I think you have may me confused for someone else - if not, please show me a single post where I have complained or scaremongered and I will humbly apologize.

In any case, there's has to be a reason why this car has lost 90% of it's new value (the market is never off by that much) - so I stand by my suggestion to have an independant, professional evaluation made of it's condition before moving forward with it.

Edited May 16, 2010 by MoonRiverOasis

[WarpSpeed]

^

[Hssl]

If its got full service history - grab it!

[WarpSpeed]

Actually post #10 should have had 2 of these ^^ not 1....

[stingray]

But the usual "panic makers" complaining again

I think you have may me confused for someone else - if not, please show me a single post where I have complained or scaremongered and I will humbly apologize.

In any case, there's has to be a reason why this car has lost 90% of it's new value (the market is never off by that much) - so I stand by my suggestion to have an independant, professional evaluation made of it's condition before moving forward with it.

No, it's nothing about you personal. There are many other peaple always complained about High mileage cars. The km shows on the ODO meter in LOS, you can never trust, specially on a car over 10 years, as there is no legal action, if someone changes the odometer readings. And most of older cars are changed. And 90% losing on value is not only for this car. All lexus ES 300 are around 350 to 450;k in the local marked, have nothing to do with someting wrong with the car. BTW i don't know how much the car of the topic starter costs. the 350 to 450 is just my expirience and guidance. Personally i would not buy if the car is over 400'k In US it would be 3'000 Dollar. But we are not in US. I personally not care about ODO meter readings, because they never sure. I care about the condition of a car and when i buy a car, i buy a car, not the story of a car. Specially in US, many peaple buy the story of the car, not the car. Beleving storys is not smart. Everbody can make up a story. Conditon is important. And i not interested in ODO meter readings. How do you know if they are real km or not. But with 200'k on the clock i can imagine, that they are real. If it have 120'k on the clock with a fake service history, i guess some of the "storybuyers" would buy it immidently. Condition is more important than Stories!

Edited May 17, 2010 by stingray

[losworld]

I'd have someone give it a once over and regarding actual mileage check for signs of wear in areas like brake pedal, door hinges, etc. to look for possible higher mileage than indicated. Personally I'd likely just hang onto the Mazda 3 as it should be better on mileage, easier to park, etc. The Lexus is really just a glorified Camry. Nice cars but not much in the handling or performance side. You know what you have in the Mazda 3 so why not just keep it?

[triffid]

Appreciate the coments of everyone - including those against buying it.

The circumstances surrounding this situation are very positive. Iy belongs to a prosperous person who owns several cars. He wants to give it to his niece - he feels better that she use this car for her weekly drives into the country to see family instead of her old Toyota Soluna. She is reluctant because she finds this car too big and expensive on petrol. She fancies my Mazda3. Her suggestion is that I sell her my car and buy the Lexus from her. She's hoping for a straight swap, but my car being a 2006 2 litre 5-door with 100,000 km I reckon it's worth more than the Lexus, so I'd want 100k baht difference. So on the whole I think there is bona fide on the seller's side. (He's a senior policeman and she's a very special friend of mine.)

I will follow up about the service history and then do some driving. I'm reluctant because I want to have a no fuss, no breakdowns, car. A final question: Is there good service, parts availablity and maintenance here for this Lexus? Would most Toyota garages be competent to look after it?

One very encouraging comment that I've taken on board is the inference that this car in normal condition and with normal maintenance can be good for another 200,00 km. Am I right?

Also that if in normal condition, I can drive it just as I would drive my Mazda, ie without needing to nurse it in any way. I hope that's right too.

[losworld]

No one can state a car is good for another 200k without seeing it and its service history. Has this car been using synthetic or regular oil (yes synthetic will last longer). How often was the oil changed? Was the radiator replaced (heavy strain on radiators in these hot climates), were transmission fluid replacements done every 100k at the very least? I'd be far more worried about the transmission than the engine as 200k on an original tranny is difficult in such a hot climate and a tranny could cost you as much or more than a motor.

I'd say these are the average life of various parts in this climate: engine if properly maintained should get 300k, transmission probably good for around 200k, radiator 200k. If these parts haven't been replace I think you can expect to do them fairly shortly. And don't forget alternator, fuel pump and other various parts probably have a lifespan of between 200 - 300k.

Another thing you should keep in the back of your mind is that for instance in California a Lexus like this could be purchased for as little as three thousand dollars. And a Mazda 3 will command considerably more.

Edited May 17, 2010 by losworld

[stingray]

No one can state a car is good for another 200k without seeing it and its service history. Has this car been using synthetic or regular oil (yes synthetic will last longer). How often was the oil changed? Was the radiator replaced (heavy strain on radiators in these hot climates), were transmission fluid replacements done every 100k at the very least? I'd be far more worried about the transmission than the engine as 200k on an original tranny is difficult in such a hot climate and a tranny could cost you as much or more than a motor.

I'd say these are the average life of various parts in this climate: engine if properly maintained should get 300k, transmission probably good for around 200k, radiator 200k. If these parts haven't been replace I think you can expect to do them fairly shortly. And don't forget alternator, fuel pump and other various parts probably have a lifespan of between 200 - 300k.

Another thing you should keep in the back of your mind is that for instance in California a Lexus like this could be purchased for as little as three thousand dollars. And a Mazda 3 will command considerably more.

That's what i mention in my former post. 3'k in US. But we aren't in US, that's the big difference. Straight swap? No way! There is no Mazda 2006 for 350'k ro 400 (what the lexus would be worth). The seller of the lexus should pay at least 100'k.

[stingray]

I'd have someone give it a once over and regarding actual mileage check for signs of wear in areas like brake pedal, door hinges, etc. to look for possible higher mileage than indicated. Personally I'd likely just hang onto the Mazda 3 as it should be better on mileage, easier to park, etc. The Lexus is really just a glorified Camry. Nice cars but not much in the handling or performance side. You know what you have in the Mazda 3 so why not just keep it?

Camry is a four banger in LOS. Lexus is a V6, there is much more power and smootness than in any Camry.

Toyotashop is not the right place to go. Had once a lexus ES 300, sold it to customer. After a while the air bag light show. Customer goes to Toyota Dealer in Pattaya (instead coming back to me). All what they done is, they blowed the air bags and said that they are not ok, becausae they are old. Customer got his Lexus back with 2 blowed air bags.

This is so far for Toyota Service.

Bangkok is maybe another option, but in a "Ban Nok" Village (outiside BKK) ther is no way to using Toyota Service. Or if so, make sure they have OBD 1 test scanner, before you let them touch this car.

[triffid]

I've ascertained that the lexus has a history of regular service - but by a toyota garage in Nan, who I'm told has the necessary contraptions to do the Lexus.

I will follow up on the specific points mentioned by losworld - and thanks for listing them. I suppose that if those things do need replacement at some point the cost will be substantial. More than 100k? And then presumably the car will be good for another 200,000 km?

The fact that the Mazda 3 is worth more, and likely to not give me a problem for a while, certainly gives me pause. It's being claimed that the Lexus is worth about 500k bht, or certainly not much less.

I'll be taking this slowly and not rush in.

Thanks again.

[MoonRiverOasis]

Here's a couple of links to explore re: market price for the ES300:

http://taladrod.com/w20/Search/TbRst3.aspx...ll+mk:31+md:141

http://one2car.com/search/search_result.as...1998&Type=1

Unfortunately not many Thai used car dealers list things like service history, mileage or condition, and there's only a very small sample available ATM, but stickers seem to range from 300L to 500K. If you'd like a more definitive valuation of both your current car and the Lexus, it may be worth considering a Redbook valuation for 100 Baht each:

https://www.redbookasiapacific.com/rbcert/i...ng=en&cc=th

[triffid]

It's that 3 litre V6 engine that tempts me - I've never owned a V6 car; that and the reputed quietness and luxury of a Lexus.

I was curious as to why the Mazda £ is better valued in the US. I can understand that being so in Thailand - Lexus being an import and the Mazda an Asean manufacture, also the greater economy being more valued here. But the US?

I wish there was an equivalent of the professional inspection and diagnosis available in Chaingmai - is there such a thing?

I have yet to do the red book valuation, but I will do it.

[stingray]

Here's a couple of links to explore re: market price for the ES300:

http://taladrod.com/w20/Search/TbRst3.aspx...ll+mk:31+md:141

http://one2car.com/search/search_result.as...1998&Type=1

Unfortunately not many Thai used car dealers list things like service history, mileage or condition, and there's only a very small sample available ATM, but stickers seem to range from 300L to 500K. If you'd like a more definitive valuation of both your current car and the Lexus, it may be worth considering a Redbook valuation for 100 Baht each:

https://www.redbookasiapacific.com/rbcert/i...ng=en&cc=th

Radiotor cost not over 10'k (new one) Thailand built. If you change put in a 3 core radiator

Alternator can buy second hand for 3'k (new one for 8'k, Nippon Denso 120 Amp) ( new Bosch 15'k) Denso is ok.

Drive shaft joints, left and right side maybe about 10'k max. (rebuilt ones)

You have to think allways another 50'k if you want to make the car good.

Parts are not expensive, but if you go Toyotashop, it will be expensive.

[katabeachbum]

hmm, 13 years old and 200k km is not newish nor reliable

what about 3,8 V6 at 255hp, 2004 car with less than 40k km at 590k baht? Chevy Lumina at Expatmotors.com

[WarpSpeed]

Ha! Just tried to search the link to expat motors and it says it's been suspended??

*edit* It comes up .co.th not .com

Edited May 18, 2010 by WarpSpeed

[katabeachbum]

Ha! Just tried to search the link to expat motors and it says it's been suspended??

*edit* It comes up .co.th not .com

sorry, sloppy, you r right, its supposed to be expatmotors.co.th, the dot.com is in Hong Kong