A Premeditated Plan To Burn Bangkok

[webfact]

OPINION

A premeditated plan to burn Bangkok

By Thanong Khanthong

The Nation

The torching of more than 30 buildings in Bangkok last Wednesday in the aftermath of the red-shirt rally was premeditated.

BANGKOK: -- The huge CentralWorld shopping complex was reduced to scorched rubble. Big C at Rajprasong was also badly damaged. The Centre One mall at the Victory Monument was burnt down along with the 300 shops inside, causing damage to the tune of Bt1 billion. The venerable Siam Theatre, which had stood for 44 years, was badly torched. The Maleenont Building on Rama IV, which houses Channel 3 TV station, was also damaged by fire, causing three days of blackout on that channel. The office building of the Metropolitan Electricity Authority was completely ruined by arsonists. About ten branches of Bangkok Bank around the city were smashed and set alight, and their ATMs outside were looted. Convenience stores were robbed. The violence also spread upcountry, where the red shirts came out to burn provincial halls.

Both Dr Panithan Watanayakorn and Colonel Sansern Kaewkamnerd have confirmed that the torching of central Bangkok, the provincial halls and other public and private buildings was part of a premeditated plot following the end of the red-shirt rally. The masterminds wanted to inflict maximum damage to the economy and the country as a whole.

From my understanding, CentralWorld was the biggest target for the reds, from the very beginning, if their rally failed. Burning down the giant mall would send a strong signal from the poor reds to the Bangkok elite. The owners and management of CentralWorld was aware of this possibility all along, of the building's vulnerability to arson attack. They tried to be friendly to the red protesters by allowing them to use the facilities, including toilets, in the basement of the building. After all, the reds were sleeping all around the "Ground Zero" of CentralWorld. The whole complex, along with nearby shopping malls, was closed down during the red rally from April 12 to May 19.

The reds used these buildings as if they owned them. They kept their arsenal of weapons and explosive stockpiles at CentralWorld, Big-C Rajprasong and in other buildings. Lumpini Park was where the reds' "Black Army" kept their weapons and explosives. Renegade officer Major General Khattiya Sawasdipol, who was killed by a sniper's bullet just days before the final crackdown, was responsible for defending the Sala Daeng barricades in the event of the military moving in. Khattiya said that if Sala Daeng were to fall, the Rajprasong rally site would be taken over.

Some time ago I overheard a red member saying: "We will never lose this battle. We have got strong backup. If the military moves in to hurt us, we will burn all the buildings. They will not dare lay a finger on us."

Going into the protest, the reds were almost certain that they would prevail. They thought that they would never have to use their weapons or explosives against the government's troops. By staging their rally at Rajprasong intersection, the reds were able to hold the entire country as their hostage. There were 2,000 to 4,000 reds, including women and children, at Rajprasong most of the time. This created a dilemma for Prime Minister Abhisit Vejjajiva. If he were to employ military force to remove the reds from Rajprasong, he would have to bear the consequences of the human casualties. The reds' armed faction would use heavy weapons to fend off any military attack, as well as kill their own supporters and burn the buildings in the area. The reds were assisted by snipers and black-clad extremists with military training. This "Black Army" would hit the security forces from behind the lines.

The reds would have put all the blame on Abhisit alone after the crackdown, especially if there had been a high number of casualties, particularly among the elderly, the women and the children. We would witness later on how the elderly, women and children feared for their lives when they were evacuated from the protest site to nearby Wat Pathumwararam, which is sandwiched between Siam Paragon and CentralWorld. Many did not know if they would be killed. They did not know what was happening around them. They cried as they walked out of the temple after the crackdown was completed with a minimum loss of life. It was like hel_l for them in the temple.

There is ample evidence, including video clips, to support the charges that the torching and destruction of Bangkok was premeditated. On January 27, Natthawut Saikua, a red leader, spoke to the red crowd at Khao Soi Dao, Chanthaburi. He said: "If they seize power, we'll start fires throughout the whole country. Burn them all, my fellow friends and brothers. I will assume the sole responsibility. If they want to find fault with someone, come and get me. If you seize power, just burn it."

On January 29, Arisman Pongruengrong, another hardcore red leader, told a red rally: "We'll have an appointment next time. If they are going to crack down on us, we don't need to prepare anything much. Just bring along your cups or bottles, which you can fill up with at least one litre of gasoline. If one million of us come to Bangkok, we'll have one million litres of gasoline. I can assure you that Bangkok will turn into a sea of fire."

CentralWorld was attacked and torched three times on May 19 after the red leaders caved in to the pressure of the military crackdown. About 200 reds were involved in these attacks. The first round of burning took place right after the red leaders announced an end to the two-month rally. The second attack happened at around five or six o'clock. The third occurred at around 9 o'clock.

I was told by an intelligence source that the reds also had reason to burn down CentralWorld because they wanted to destroy the massive weapons stockpile kept inside the building. They wanted to get rid of the evidence. As the government troops were about to advance to Rajprasong, the reds were left with no time to move the weapons out. The military started the operation to flush out the reds at four o'clock in the morning. After some fierce fighting, the troops managed to take control of Lumpini Park, and then broke through the Sala Daeng barricades several hours later. There was fighting in Lumpini Park, but we don't know the number of casualties there.

It also appears that there were behind-the-scenes talks to avoid a full-scale civil war. Prime Minister Abhisit Vejjajiva, Korbsak Sabhavasu, the secretary to the PM, and Korn Chatikavanij, the finance minister, worked hardest to try to resolve the crisis situation. The military did not want to inflict heavy casualties on the reds. And the reds were well aware that they would be killed en masse if they were to fight back.

The reds must have known about the crackdown in advance. Was this a leak from the military watermelon again? I have heard that some police officers managed to sneak out red militants from Lumpini Park on the eve of the crackdown. But there would still be enough red fighters to fend off the crackdown for a while. In the end, the half-hearted remaining reds, using M-79s, sniper rifles and other weapons, could not hold out against the military's advance.

By 1:30pm, the red leaders at the Rajprasong rally site knew their fate. They had received the warning to disperse. Natthawut was the one who made the announcement that the reds would end the rally in the face of the military crackdown. The reds would surrender themselves at the nearby Office of the National Police.

Reactions were mixed. Many reds felt great relief that the rally had finally ended. Others were confused by the swift change in the tide. But many others were angry. They felt they had been betrayed by their leaders. A bomb suddenly exploded behind the rally site, causing the red leaders to move quickly away. Police officers came to the red leaders' rescue. They escorted them out of the rally site before the military could reach them. This helped avoid the humiliation of being nabbed by the Army, and so the red leaders walked proudly as heroes to surrender at the Office of the National Police.

Then, as we know, all hel_l broke loose. The torching of CentralWorld began in earnest. Later in the day, the other targetted buildings around the capital would suffer a similar fate. Arson and looting were rampant. The riots would spread upcountry.

As the red extremists burnt CentralWorld during three phases, to destroy their weapons and explosives kept inside, some of their number became trapped inside. In the aftermath, some ten reds were found dead in the basement of the huge complex near the weapons they were trying to get rid of.

The reds were ungrateful to the owners and management of CentralWorld, who had given them shelter and the use of facilities throughout their rally there.

In the end, the reds acted in a way that can be described as "kin bon ruen, khi rod bon lang kha". Eat in a host's home, then climb up on the roof to shit on it.

-- The Nation 2010-05-26

[newsfooter][/newsfooter]

[SomTumTiger]

Premeditated by who - my money is on Thaksin

[MCos]

Every word you say may be correct & the article has the ring of truth about and seems to fit the chain of events. However I'm afraid you are preaching either to the converted or the unconvertible as I would imagine subsequent comments will bear out. There seems to be very little middle ground on these forums - hopefully that's not representative of the whole of the community otherwise this crisis will drag on interminably.

[givenall]

Every word you say may be correct & the article has the ring of truth about and seems to fit the chain of events. However I'm afraid you are preaching either to the converted or the unconvertible as I would imagine subsequent comments will bear out. There seems to be very little middle ground on these forums - hopefully that's not representative of the whole of the community otherwise this crisis will drag on interminably.

Now what, too mch talk again. i want to see some arrests, and jail time for the guilty

[Portlandstone]

Goodness, now that the Reds are dispersed, the Bangkok gov't and it's many journalist supporters are really going on the information warpath.

How many times do we have to say it?  A few random Reds had possession of their own weapons, 99% did not.  If an outsider would read this article or the many like it flooding the 'news' these days for the first time they would think the Reds were essentially a heartless, callous military.

Why would I believe any opinion or assertion by "Dr." Panitan Wattanayagorn or Colonel Sansorn would say?  They are gov't right-hand-men with one-sided objectives.

[Ulysses G.]

Premeditated by who - my money is on Thaksin

Everything seems to suggest this.

[Samuian]

Premeditated by who - my money is on Thaksin

seconded, call him ..

..."The Coach"..

[whybother]

Every word you say may be correct & the article has the ring of truth about and seems to fit the chain of events. However I'm afraid you are preaching either to the converted or the unconvertible as I would imagine subsequent comments will bear out. There seems to be very little middle ground on these forums - hopefully that's not representative of the whole of the community otherwise this crisis will drag on interminably.

There is nothing to comment about in the middle ground is there? So 80-90% of people stay quiet, and it's only "the converted or the unconvertible" that will say anything.

Two things I don't understand: How did they attack the place at 9pm? I thought there was army there by then. Yes, there were still gun fights, but that doesn't give someone much of a chance to go in to light more fires. And how did they think fires would destroy a big stockpile of guns? Sure, any exposives would ... explode, but that would be a bit of a giveaway anyway. But it's not like the guns would melt, is it?

Edited May 26, 2010 by whybother

[whybother]

Goodness, now that the Reds are dispersed, the Bangkok gov't and it's many journalist supporters are really going on the information warpath.

How many times do we have to say it? A few random Reds had possession of their own weapons, 99% did not. If an outsider would read this article or the many like it flooding the 'news' these days for the first time they would think the Reds were essentially a heartless, callous military.

Why would I believe any opinion or assertion by "Dr." Panitan Wattanayagorn or Colonel Sansorn would say? They are gov't right-hand-men with one-sided objectives.

I wouldn't call them "random" reds. They were specially selected. Probably a few more than 1% too. They were in amongst another 5-20% armed with less lethal weapons. Then there were the people supporting them. Leaving a few brainwashed "human shields" in the centre with no idea what was going on elsewhere.

Ofcourse, the reds have had these weapons since day one. It's just that most international media failed to mention that.

[brahmburgers]

Mass prayer to mark Visakha Bucha Day

By The Nation

Buddhist monks from 83 countries will say a mass prayer to bless Thailand in a charity ceremony at the Visakha Bucha Day festival. They will also call for an end to political turmoil.

The monks will sign an accord to officially commemorate World Visakha Bucha Day, which also marks His Majesty the King's auspicious 84th birthday on December 5.

The mass prayer will be held at Buddha Monthol in Nakhon Pathom.

(cut for brevity)

-- The Nation 2010-05-26

[newsfooter][/newsfooter]

I've been a Buddhist (Mahayana/Tibet tradition) since I got out of high school in the US, 40 years ago. This talk of mass prayer doesn't do anyone any good. Ok, maybe the people praying feel warm and fuzzy inside, and they really think they're doing good on some levels. Hocus pocus.

If monks and nuns want to do some good in this world, they can go out and do tangible things, like counsel people in need (granted, they do some of that), and clean up streets and plant trees. Buddhism in Thailand has taken some hits lately. We see and hear Buddhist monks making lavish ceremonies to bless Thaksin and the Shinawatres (largely because the Shinawatres are mega rich. Would the monks be doing lavish ceremonies for a sidewalk seller of charcoal?).

Enough of the hocus pocus aspect of institutionalized Thai Buddhism, with its talismans, gold statues, belief in ghosts, metaphysical silliness, .....and more getting back to the essence of what Buddha taught.

Edited May 26, 2010 by brahmburgers

[Robby nz]

A lot of the article sounds reasonable BUT'

As the red extremists burnt CentralWorld during three phases, to destroy their weapons and explosives kept inside, some of their number became trapped inside. In the aftermath, some ten reds were found dead in the basement of the huge complex near the weapons they were trying to get rid of.

Has the above been confirmed? I thought they were still trying to put out the fire in the basement.

[Microwave]

This article is a statement of the obvious...

[brahmburgers]

- excerpt from OP -

As the red extremists burnt CentralWorld during three phases, to destroy their weapons and explosives kept inside, some of their number became trapped inside. In the aftermath, some ten reds were found dead in the basement of the huge complex near the weapons they were trying to get rid of.

Is there physical evidence of what's mentioned above?

[SomTumTiger]

Enough of the hocus pocus aspect of institutionalized Thai Buddhism, with its talismans, gold statues, belief in ghosts, metaphysical silliness, .....and more getting back to the essence of what Buddha taught.

You could insert any religion in that sentence, and be spot on. Religion is the selling of an invisible product.

[devaram]

I dont deny this could be true but unfortunately we never get to hear the reds point of view..so its always one sided information.

[Kvwielink]

There are a large number of assumptions in this article, which, although possible, are really not verifiable. The fact that central world was burnt down to "dispose" of a large stock of weapons for instance. Who is the "intelligence source" who provided this information to the writer of this article? Is there physical evidence to support this claim?

If I'm not wrong only 1 dead body was found in Central World as well, on a higher floor, not in the basement, probably trying to take something which was not his to begin with. There was mention of 10 bodies early on in the investigation, but this was later denied by all who were actually involved in the inspection of the building.

He has also "heard" that police smuggled militants out of Lumpini park the night before the crackdown. Again, I have not read or seen this in other media and, while perhaps true, it cannot be verified and is now only used as another statement to fuel the fire of hatred against the reds.

While I realize that this is an opinion piece, nobody benefits from wild claims like this. As pointed out earlier, those who already believe this to be true will only be further strengthened in their opinions, whereas supporters of the reds will as usual deny all these claims. The majority who is in the middle will probably read this for what it is, an opinion with little evidence to prove the points being made. Yet it's those minorities that do not need to be convinced any further, that pose the biggest threat to the stability of Thailand right now. Extreme opinions can easily lead to extreme behavior as we have seen during the last few months in Thailand, and in the rest of the world throughout the years. If we would be willing to look at the facts only, and to not try to portray our anger-fueled opinions as facts, Thailand would be able to recover, and indeed, improve the plight of its people, ALL the people, much faster.

[Insight]

I dont deny this could be true but unfortunately we never get to hear the reds point of view..so its always one sided information.

We've suffered the reds POV for the past two months. Next time they should strip out all the BS and get it done with in a day.

[Grower]

Well, that moron Savage and an Aussie have been arrested and are now in jail. Made my day.

[MikeyIdea]

I work at Off at Central World and my IT guys have been allowed in again now. They talked to the guards who were working there throughout the whole occupation. The guards said that the "peaceful demonstrators" put gas tanks out ***Long Before*** the soldiers moved in (cooking gas tanks).

When time came, they smashed the windows, opened the valves on the gas tanks and threw them in, and spiced it all with Molotov cocktails (M-150 bottles and other bottles of different sizes, filled with petrol), then threw in grenades to light it all up

So much for peaceful demonstrators... – No, I don’t accept when anyone say that they were innocent, they are all guilty, not only of being either slow or stupid but also as accomplices. Everybody around Ratchaprasong had heard for weeks that the plan was to burn down Bangkok; the loudspeakers were so loud that you’d have to be death to miss it; in fact, some of them had heard it at red rallies for months.

So much for peaceful demonstrators...

[angiud]

From the article:

There was fighting in Lumpini Park, but we don't know the number of casualties there.

In the aftermath, some ten reds were found dead in the basement of the huge complex near the weapons they were trying to get rid of.

Just wondering if these, once unconfirmed news, are facts or just rumours.

[mazeltov]

Some of the readers are maybe interested to compare this opinion piece with a previous entry at Thanong's blog from Friday , May 21.

http://blog.nationmultimedia.com/thanong/2010/05/21/entry-1

Basically the same, just a few changes and rewording, but still interesting.

[hammered]

I would say a mix of premeditated and spontaneous. Certainly the damage caused to a building such as Central World could not have been caused without extensive preparation and planning even if sprinklers were not functional. That damage required temperatures that would have required a lot of accelerant. Certain of the other burnings around Kling Toei looked very spontaneous and damage levels wouldnt have needed any preparation.

That the leaders had for several months been talking of burning implies soem plan vague or otherwise was in place although likely only in a relative small number of buidings inside the perimeter was extensive preparation actually done.

[chantorn]

Premeditated by Thaksin and Thaksin alone.

[ThienTu]

Well, that moron Savage and an Aussie have been arrested and are now in jail. Made my day.

Any word on the 2 Dutch protesters that were arrested in Chiang Mai.

[MCos]

Now what, too mch talk again. i want to see some arrests, and jail time for the guilty

"I want! I want! I want!" That attitude should solve the problems real quick . . .

[wasabi]

Well, that moron Savage and an Aussie have been arrested and are now in jail. Made my day.

Som nam nah!

[chantorn]

Well, that moron Savage and an Aussie have been arrested and are now in jail. Made my day.

Som nam nah!

Not just a crazy guy. The Australian guy is a trained cold blooded killer / sniper. Said the Thai government.

http://thainews.prd.go.th/en/news.php?id=255305250040

[mazeltov]

The reds were assisted by snipers and black-clad extremists with military training. This "Black Army" would hit the security forces from behind the lines.

Was the video clip below already discussed at the board? Sorry if yes, but was an explanation/ conclusion found what happen there?

Between 0:11 - 0:19 you can see a person in civilian clothes, a white shirt and shorts, armed with a rifle and probably also shooting. Similar to the clips with a sighting of one of the 'terrorists'. But the problem here is that he is together with regular army troops, soldiers in combat gear, Abhisits security forces.

[Grower]

Not just a crazy guy. The Australian guy is a trained cold blooded killer / sniper. Said the Thai government.

http://thainews.prd.go.th/en/news.php?id=255305250040

Not according to the Australian Embassy; they said he tends toward gross exaggeration.

[Methuselah]

Although the article only mentions the role of the BIB on a couple of occasions,it would appear to anyone unaware of the situation in Thailand,that the BIB were actively assisting the red shirts.This surely must be a major embarrassment to the Thai government,who will face a very difficult task in implementing law and order in the future.

Without the support of the military,one fears what would have been the outcome of the protests.

Most governments would introduce a full scale enquiry into the lack of implementation of the law by those entrusted with this power.I wonder if it will happen.