American Arrested On Child Sex Charges In Chiang Mai

[warfie]

Speaking as a father of three, if this guy is actually guilty, I would be at the head of the lynch mob.

(Notice that I didn't say anything about whether the court finds him guilty, but "if he is actually guilty").

Same goes for the mother, if that story is true... actually, she deserves even harsher treatment, if guilty.

But all we have to go on, so far, is: An internet forum posting on a media story about a police report of a ten year olds story...

Working backwards from the child, the story gets less credible with every step.

Children have been known to invent stories like this for all sorts of vengeful reasons, the local constabulary have a far from exemplary record, nor do the local media.

As man who has actually been in the position of believing his daughter had been "interfered with" (only one possible suspect, first reaction, tear off his balls and choke him to death with them).

After a doctors examination, proved there had been no "interference", I was glad that I had not had the opportunity to act on my first instinct (else I would probably still be doing time). I still feel guilty for believing that of my friend.

All I'm saying here is: "don't judge this guy, or the girls mother, until you have all the facts". Which we never will... so "Hang-em-high club", give it a rest.

Let justice be served, whether that be to exonerate this guy if he turns-out to be innocent, or to string him up by his balls and beat him to death if guilty.

[zigistar]

a true warning tale

2007 I was in CM at Kad suan keo big self service restaurant downstairs with my 4 Y O krung krung son ; left him at the table just the time to gather forks etc, with an eye behind my shoulder all the time ;( his mom had warned me ' CM , plenty of pedophiles around ' , I thought, I know Thailand , there aren't that many , just Thaï gossip ; It was my first time in LOS with my son ); then I asked for something like toothpick or whatever and I was directed just round a corner , with kid out of sight; I thought, I just walk and back, 30 seconds . Well in thirty seconds flat when I came back there was this 70 y o linguist of a farang trying to engage a conversation with my son , he saw me and asked " can he talk Thaï ?"

I was not polite in my reply and he moved back to his table with another weirdo.

I know I did a mistake by not watching him all the time . But think, 30 seconds and they crawl from under the rocks.

What makes you think the farang was in any way guilty? He committed the crime of talking to a child. Wow. Now you have labeled him a criminal pedophile. This Western frenzy that demonizes all men causes major problems. Innocent men are constantly being accused. A man can't exhibit any friendliness toward a child whatsoever these days. This sad state of affairs is completely unnatural.

It is not wrong in any way to interact with a child that is not yours.

This is not to say that pedophilia does not exist, nor that one should not be vigilant in caring for their children. But this instant rush to judgment is decidedly wrongheaded. Regarding the case of this thread I will not rush to judgment until the facts come out, if they ever do.

Exatly my opinion,what on earth did you make believe this man was up to sometyhing bad?You just accuse somebody just on the base of"daring to talk to a child" N.B in a crowded restaurant !!!I really advice you to look for help if this is your thinkingproces....Yes i do have children yes i am afaraid something like this could happen to them but before i chase people away from my children i will need to have a dam_n good reason and yours was a horrible reason.The reason that adults become scared to talk or play with children are because of reactions of people like you! Are you aware that some people do like to talk or play with children without any bad intention?Well at least i do but i will make sure its always in public as did your"offender".

[wolf5370]

Since we can't really comment on the charge then, who is the falang looking guy in the background with all the badges on his shirt?

My question as well... what do "volunteer wannabe cops" get out of helping the Tourist Police, and do they get a portion of the proceeds of the crimes committed by the Tourist Police, which would seem fair to me.

I'll not get into a discussion about what the "volunteer wannabe cops" get out of helping the Thai police (regular as well as tourist) as I think that anyone who has meet one of these, generally useless busy-bodies, already knows. But would like to comment why Thailand has/allows such a force. Having foreign volunteers in their police force is surely an admission of:

we don't know what we're doing because we're all so badly trained;

we can't speak the language

we're lazy and it's better to get someone else to do our work for us

or any combination of the above......If I was a Thai national I would be ashamed to think that my own police force was so inadequate that they have to have Foreign volunteers to get the job done...........is there any other country in the world that does this? I know of none.............

Wow what a bitter post - turn you down did they? Or did 'the busy bodies' catch you up to no good?

Having a volunteer foreign liaison (which is really what they are - they have no police powers they are escorted by police that do) makes sense in tourist areas. It makes tourists feel at ease when they can find someone to talk to in their own language and cultures and it eases the burden on the police to have to cross train learning every foreign tongue on the planet. Perhaps Santa was there to help inform the guy of his rights or to put across charges in a language that he understands - In a similar situation would you not also prefer to know where you stand, what you are charged with and what you are being asked to sign in a language you understand? I know I would - even if I can get by in Thai, its too important to leave to possible misunderstandings.

[wolf5370]

Makes no odds guilty or innocent. Most so called "third countries" splash the dirt, (his picture, details, evidence & the like) on the front page BEFORE the trial or in many instances before the guy is charged. We are guests and it is their custom to print the details in advance. It is common to see "suspects" with heads bowed in front of the evidence, (drugs, guns, cash) etc. This guy may be innocent, i suspect differently however. Why would a 72 year old man want to be alone in an hotel room with a 10 year old girl? Perhaps he had some puppies he wanted to show her? Either way he should have played safe. Never put yourself in a position, if innocent, where others may think something is "going on". If he is innocent i pray to God he gets off. If he is guilty well so be it. Let the Thai's deal with it. As they say; "let the law take it's course". Nuff said.

The law in Britain is about to be changed, but currently the press have a field day publishing pictures of suspected rapists. Some obviously are innocent, but the dirt sticks. In one case recently the loacl paper in Swansea didn't have a photo so just looked up the suspect's name on facebook and used that picture on its front page. It turned out that they had the picture of the wrong guy. So a person that had nothing whatsover to do with the case has had his life turned into a nightmare, as people recognise him in the street and assume he is a convicted rapist.

To many people on this forum are too quick to accuse Thai people and Thai authorities of acting wrongly when the same goes on in their own countries,and often times much worse. If you don't like it here, just leave. Before you complain just take a look at your own countries first. Nowhere is perfect. Focus on the good things for a change, as these vastly outweight the bad things.

As someone else pointed out, how you get treat and the way you perceive things is down to your own attitude. Many on here have a really bad attitude problem, so I'm not inthe least surprised that they get treated badly and think the world has it in for them.

Erm we don't live in "our own countries" we live here - so it makes sense to "complain" about things here, no? Besides, how do you know we did not complain the same way in our own countries? Indeed, how do you know this is not our home country to begin with - plenty of Thai member here - where should they go then? Telling people to go home if they don't like it is an over used comment here - its is also a stupid one and if you take three minutes to think on it, you'll see (assuming an ounce of intelligence) why! I agree that "Many on here have a really bad attitude problem" [sic], but I guess you didn't factor yourself as being a member of that group, eh?

[wolf5370]

Sadly I have to admit that Canada also allows volunteer police to assist them. They are not allowed to carry firearms and play more of a security assist type of role. These people tend to be individuals that have been rejected by the force and/ or are trying to get more community based hours for their next application to the force.

There are Special Constables (volunteers) in the UK police,

but I doubt they are foreigners................

Actually they can - my Thai wife applied and got through to the selection centre in Kent (KCC). She didn't get in because she was "not aggressive enough" - she was asked if she would use her truncheon on a suspect ans she said if necessary, then asked if she would use it on a downed suspect, she said 'no'. The officer said that the suspect may still be armed or may get up and a strategic hit (to a leg I guess) might keep him subdued.

She had to pass a rudimentary English test - including watching a video and writing a report on what she saw (quite difficult for many non-native speakers) - some non-verbal reasoning tests and in interview. She had to have at least Indefinite Leave to Remain (she has British Citizenship so no problems here for her). On her caurse, she was the only female, but there were a couple of other foreigners on ILTR (Indian sub-continent).

[souvenirdeparis]

@zigistar & way toomuch coffee

""reactions of people like you""

had my kid not been here, my reaction would have been to kick him off , not a word spoken . In seven years with my son in lots of place this has been the only instance . He didn't like being 'interacted with' by this man at all ; weirdo was way too close when I arrived .

And good thing for him it was me the father who came, not the kid's mother on her own turf.

You two are downright self righteous botherers ; you weren' t there and don't know me ; I have only one child but have dealt with children aged from 10-11 for years ; I participated in a "green house " which is a Dolto-inspired place for interactions of kids with kids and occasionnaly parents with other kids .

Anyway there's the golden rule :

you-don't -talk- to - strangers.

strange you don't know that one being parents.

[way2muchcoffee]

@zigistar & way toomuch coffee

""reactions of people like you""

had my kid not been here, my reaction would have been to kick him off , not a word spoken . In seven years with my son in lots of place this has been the only instance . He didn't like being 'interacted with' by this man at all ; weirdo was way too close when I arrived .

And good thing for him it was me the father who came, not the kid's mother on her own turf.

You two are downright self righteous botherers ; you weren' t there and don't know me ; I have only one child but have dealt with children aged from 10-11 for years ; I participated in a "green house " which is a Dolto-inspired place for interactions of kids with kids and occasionnaly parents with other kids .

Anyway there's the golden rule :

you-don't -talk- to - strangers.

strange you don't know that one being parents.

You abandoned your child in a restaurant for an unknown duration, at least insofar as the restaurant patrons were concerned. Any observer might naturally be concerned for your child's welfare in such a situation. There are many other possibilities, but you seem to be blinded to them and instead prefer to label this guy as a weirdo implying he is a pedophile out to kidnap your child.

Edited June 20, 2010 by way2muchcoffee

[TAWP]

souvenirdeparis>> Your uncalled for outright hysteria is part of the problem.

[Slip]

Sorry- I've been out and forgot to refresh the page, I was responding to post #3 or something.

Edited June 20, 2010 by Slip

[wolf5370]

This is the sad truth in Thailand. Mom's (not all but many in the poorer areas) will allow there kids to be sexually molested by Farang with the plan of eventually getting dollars; or getting the Farang to marry their daughter in the hopes of getting both dollars and land from him.

I know of a 42 year old man living in Phetchabun who recently married a 14 year old girl. The police will do nothing unless and until the mother fails to get money and decides to retaliate against the Farang by pressing charges. Lucky for him he provided dollars.

For most of us, we would like to see both the Farang and the mother go to jail. The kids are the victims from every side of the issue. Neither the parents nor the police protect them from these despicable predators.

How does a (presumably) OLD, WHITE, man get a 10 year old Thai girl into a guesthouse alone? And not once, but multiple times? Isn't anyone at the front desk, or a cleaning person, or another guest, or anyone else at all around who asks what their deal is? I mean, everywhere I go people ask me where I'm from, where I'm going, how long I'm staying, if I'm married, anything and everything about my business.... So how does an old white man with a little Thai girl not set of any alarms?

And where were the child's parents/caretakers? Do they normally just not know where she is for substantial periods of time?

Really strange.

I mean, if the guy nabbed the girl on her way home from school once, then maybe it's a little more likely to have gone un-noticed. But this happened multiple times. You would think someone would notice.

With the consent $ of her mother.

poor kid.

Didn't Jerry Lee Lewis marry a 13 year old (his cousin no less) quite legally in the States back in the 50's?

[wolf5370]

Innocent until proven guilty in a court of law.

That unfortunately isn't true. Under Thai law, as I understand it, the persson arrested is a suspect helping the police with their enquiries and is deemed to be neither innocent or guilty. Also under this essentially Napoleonic legal code the arrest is not made until much further down the road than is the case in most Western countries. That is why the police usually have strong evidence upon arrest.

As for 'crazydrummerpauly's comments: unless it can be proved that the relationship does not involve money changing hands - and few courts will believe that in the case of a foreigner- then prostitution is assumed and then the legal age is 20, not 18. So your friends conviction, imprisonment and deportation were absolutely correct under Thai law.

The age of sexual consent here is 18, not 20. Anyone who is under 18 is regarded a child. The law about child abuse has a further limit at 13 when stipulating penalties.

Actually Tanaka its a lot more confused than that. Some legislation states the age of consent to be 15. Others say that it is child abuse if someone pays for sex AT A BROTHEL and the individual is under 18. Yet other legislation states that sexual intercourse with an under 20 year old required parental permission. Plenty of ways to be in the wrong - plenty of beautiful 20 somethings about, why risk it?

[souvenirdeparis]

@ waytoomuch and twap you stop harrassing me and if the story prevents you from having your nap, you can have a sleeping pill.

[way2muchcoffee]

@ waytoomuch and twap you stop harrassing me and if the story prevents you from having your nap, you can have a sleeping pill.

Do you honestly think you are being harassed? Really? I find that unfathomable. Please reread my posts and your responses.

Edited June 20, 2010 by way2muchcoffee

[cdnvic]

Stop the personal snipes at each other and get back to the subject please.

[dogleg]

Somebody, please tell me that neon sign in the news article isnt really allowed to exist!

:bah:

In Chang Mai or anywhere!

[cdnvic]

Inflammatory posts removed.

[powderpuff]

Don't know if it's been mentioned or not but IF this guy is found guilty he can get another 40 years in US federal pen because US pedo laws are global in scope. If he were to do time in a Thai prision & if he were released Federal agents would be there to escort him to a US Federal holding facility to await trial. Serious as a heart attack.

[TAWP]

@ waytoomuch and twap you stop harrassing me and if the story prevents you from having your nap, you can have a sleeping pill.

Uh, what?

[Markaew]

Don't know if it's been mentioned or not but IF this guy is found guilty he can get another 40 years in US federal pen because US pedo laws are global in scope. If he were to do time in a Thai prision & if he were released Federal agents would be there to escort him to a US Federal holding facility to await trial. Serious as a heart attack.

I doubt that would hold up in the US. The flimsy or no evidence that this country practices, which uses for purely extortion and payoffs, would never float in the US. As tough as the US is on the topic, they would still need solid evidence.

[brd]

How come Mothers are the ones whom dare to offer their so young daughters trading sex for benefits ? in Eastern Europe where even fathers are offering sons same same as shown on a CNN special report !

How any one, non Arab educated where in the culture ( same in India ) it is permitted to marry under age girls, can escape the punishment for abusing under age girls/boys not marrying one under age but succumbing even to the paying temptation apparently easily offered in some parts of the World ( not only in Chiang Mai ) available for those whom are sick to be interested with.

In Africa young teenagers bodies ( 10/12 years old ) are quickly firm females +18 y old looking but there it seems not as much as a problem would it be because of their colours or their different culture !

It is a pain to see regularly foreign especially culprits well placarded in the media and so many doing it for decades untouched...............in families !

American Arrested on Child Sex Charges in Thailand’s North

CHIANG MAI: -- Anti-Human Trafficking Division police have successfully arrested an American national accused of paedophilia on Wednesday. In addition, another transnational human trafficking agent has been apprehended whilst attempting to return to the Kingdom.

Thailand, the 17th of June 2010 [PDN]: An American man has been arrested in Thailand’s Northern Province of Chiang Mai on Wednesday. He was apprehended after reports surfaced that he had been engaging in sexual acts with a 10-year-old girl.

According to provincial tourist police, Mr. Wilbert Willis Holley [72] had been sexually interfering with a 10-year-old female school student at a guesthouse in the province of Chiang Mai.

Mr. Holley was arrested after investigators received a report from the alleged victim that she had been molested several times in a local guesthouse. At present the suspect has denied all charges being levelled against him whilst investigators continue to maintain that they have overwhelming evidence against him.

A search of Mr. Holley’s residence will be conducted later this week in an attempt to uncover further evidence of the suspect’s involvement in paedophilic acts.

Story continues: pattayadailynews.com

PATTAYA DAILY NEWS

-- 2010-06-18

[Tanaka]

Innocent until proven guilty in a court of law.

That unfortunately isn't true. Under Thai law, as I understand it, the persson arrested is a suspect helping the police with their enquiries and is deemed to be neither innocent or guilty. Also under this essentially Napoleonic legal code the arrest is not made until much further down the road than is the case in most Western countries. That is why the police usually have strong evidence upon arrest.

As for 'crazydrummerpauly's comments: unless it can be proved that the relationship does not involve money changing hands - and few courts will believe that in the case of a foreigner- then prostitution is assumed and then the legal age is 20, not 18. So your friends conviction, imprisonment and deportation were absolutely correct under Thai law.

The age of sexual consent here is 18, not 20. Anyone who is under 18 is regarded a child. The law about child abuse has a further limit at 13 when stipulating penalties.

Actually Tanaka its a lot more confused than that. Some legislation states the age of consent to be 15. Others say that it is child abuse if someone pays for sex AT A BROTHEL and the individual is under 18. Yet other legislation states that sexual intercourse with an under 20 year old required parental permission. Plenty of ways to be in the wrong - plenty of beautiful 20 somethings about, why risk it?

The Prostitution Prevention and Suppression Act and The Child Protection Act, B.E. 2546, Section 4 states: "Child" means a person below 18 years of age, but does not include those who have attained majority through marriage.

But Section 5 in Civil and Commercial Code states that if both parties are 17 years old they can be legally married. And a court may allow an earlier marriage on reasonable grounds. (whatever they may be)

I cannot find anywhere that age of consent should be 15. Please inform where your information comes from. And as said above, performing a sexual act, does nothave to be intercourse, with a person under the age of 18, is child abuse, be it in a brothel or elsewhere.

Also, I cannot find in the legislature where it says that you need parental permission to have sex with a person under the age of 20. Appreciate if you give your source of information.

Minimum age for ladies working in bars and gogos is 18. But you need to be 20 to order an alcoholic beverage there.

[djayz]

i think ,,,

if you are on the sex offenders registar in the u.k.

the chip on the new passports , would contain this information .

imo , child sex offenders , should not have a pssport .

if you are a regular male visitor to cambodia ,

this can brought to the attention of the child protection agency .

I understand what you're saying and why you're suggesting this but I have to disagree with you. I'm male and I've been to and passed through Cambodia a few times (and will do again in the future). Why should my name be brought to the attention of any protection agency just because I fit a "certain profile" (ie male visiting Cambodia)? No, sorry, I don't agree with you there. I have nothing to do with this scene and just because I'm male and caucasian doesn't make me any more suspect than a.... hmmmm, lets say female caucasian, or a male Asian, etc. That's the same as checking Arabs/Muslims more at airports than non-Arabs, non-Muslims JUST BECAUSE they're Arabs... totally wrong in my opinion.

I don't see why I should be treated differently just because some dirty filthy paedophiles can't keep their hands to themselves!

[travelingmike]

If the mother was bringing her daughter to the room, and the child was molested then both should be prosecuted. I dont know if anyone said it yet, but what if the mother was an angry girlfriend and no molesting occured, she was trying to extort money and he refused? A proper investigation would actually show if he has a history, a search of his computer, other vicims would come forward, etc.

[wolf5370]

The age of sexual consent here is 18, not 20. Anyone who is under 18 is regarded a child. The law about child abuse has a further limit at 13 when stipulating penalties.

Actually Tanaka its a lot more confused than that. Some legislation states the age of consent to be 15. Others say that it is child abuse if someone pays for sex AT A BROTHEL and the individual is under 18. Yet other legislation states that sexual intercourse with an under 20 year old required parental permission. Plenty of ways to be in the wrong - plenty of beautiful 20 somethings about, why risk it?

The Prostitution Prevention and Suppression Act and The Child Protection Act, B.E. 2546, Section 4 states: "Child" means a person below 18 years of age, but does not include those who have attained majority through marriage.

But Section 5 in Civil and Commercial Code states that if both parties are 17 years old they can be legally married. And a court may allow an earlier marriage on reasonable grounds. (whatever they may be)

I cannot find anywhere that age of consent should be 15. Please inform where your information comes from. And as said above, performing a sexual act, does nothave to be intercourse, with a person under the age of 18, is child abuse, be it in a brothel or elsewhere.

Also, I cannot find in the legislature where it says that you need parental permission to have sex with a person under the age of 20. Appreciate if you give your source of information.

Minimum age for ladies working in bars and gogos is 18. But you need to be 20 to order an alcoholic beverage there.

Just do a search here for at least a dozen threads quoting asll the contradicting laws and also the 'natural' law that the police often follow. From Ages of consent in Asia - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia ...

he age of consent in Thailand is 15 (with the below caveat) as specified by article 279 of the Thai Criminal Code. The current legislation applies to all regardless of gender and/or sexual orientation, although it is a common misconception that it applies only to women. However parts of the Prevention and Suppression of Prostitution Act which disallow any sexual contact with prostitutes under the age of 18, are widely interpreted by some local authorities to cover sexual acts classed as "obscenity for personal gratification". Also from the Penal Code Amendment Act of 1997 Section 283bis, having sex with a child under 18 is a compoundable offense even with the consent of that person. The parent or the child may file charges against the other side if he or she later regrets his or her own action. This ostensibly makes the Thai unfettered age of consent 18.

Like I said, why risk it., but hey, if you think your one law will trump all the others and really feel the need to walk on the wild side, go for it.

[cup-O-coffee]

OK I have read where there are rules to abide by if we answer to this subject in this forum so I will say it right now, with this _sshole I can not keep from slandering him or mocking his actions, without really getting pissed of that there are people like this in the world and they seem to congregate to Thailand for the easy pickings in kids. Also it seems to be all about money, the mother taking her little kid to his room, I'm sorry she is just as guilty as he is. I will not write anymore on this subject and these crees, if I do then the moderator will surly close me down, and ban me from this site for life.

I really have to get this off my chest because this topic apparently won't go away as long as the current culture of SEA exists and foreign, white males visit here. I have read every post here, including the poorly thought-out, inflammatory one above, and the general consensus regarding the ignorant, uneducated natives equates out to this:

They are corrupt in that they would do anything to get what they needed for the immediate moment, and without regard for any future consequences

They falsely stereotype foreigners as being wealthy

They look outside of their selves to solve the problems they create

They still live with superstitious beliefs that science has already de-mythed, yet they refuse to let it go.

They are like stubborn, stiff-necked 9 year olds; they either love you or hate you, and their love is based on "what's in it for me", and their hate based on "I am going to kill you", or, "I wish you were dead". They have no responsibility to themselves or anyone around them and they are never held accountable.

The behavior of youth - particularly the males (i.e. "the doted on and over-tolerated little princes") - are a clear statement of why the adults are so psychologically unfit to get along with the rest of the world

These so-called men, from the time they are children, are taught that it is acceptable and appropriate to do the following to the females around them: hit, beat, verbally and sexually abuse, cut in front of, violently take from, rape, stab, threaten, stalk, lie to, cheat on, have multiple women even when they are in a committed relationship. and so on. They do this because they get to.

These so-called women follow in the footsteps of this male behavior and dig out an existence that is bleak and lacking in any hope; climbing the ladder of survival based on the things that they have learned are the most important to that survival; money, food and safe shelter. It can be a recipe for quite a visceral behavioral mentality.

This sub-culture of poor, uneducated individuals creates a living that at best is animalistic in its behavioral approach to treatment of all human beings, and unbelievably their own offspring: survival and natural selection in its saddest state because it is intentional and premeditated and nothing is done to change this! It's 2010 folks and this is nothing new here. This article The Unsung Supporters Of Thailand's Street Children - Thailand Forum talks about child prostitution. Well it takes two, baby! I do not see any reference here to foreigners, so the 25,000 unchecked children are apparently surviving with men and women of some nationality and race; yet it certainly does not make a good news headline to get that one Thai man from the many and make an sensationalistic story about that, does it? Go figure!

Undeveloped country translates to undeveloped minds

When you have a law enforcement and legal system based upon the above, then change cannot be swift until the generations are purged out over time with enlightenment; but the problem here is you cannot get air out of a bottle unless you suck on it, or fill it with a more substantial substance to drive out the air. We live in the new millennium, and yet we are talking about a questionable women, who in all probability has a mentality that would fit right in with a culture from 2553 years ago. She is a mystery here, and her reaction to all of this is either too phony to be a real mother of an abused child, or she is the real McCoy and the consensus stated above truthfully describes her animalistic intentions towards her child.

This event first began to go wrong as soon as it reached the conscious level of the mother. She then transferred her thought processes to other Thais, and so on and so on; with the invariable Farang do-gooder being present to stir the pot and hype this up so they can get their money grants and supplement their NGO funding by stretching non-truths.

But the fact remains that any event in Thailand that reaches our conscious awareness, is probably already skewed, corrupted, twisted, convoluted and depicted for something that it emphatically is not; at least to you and I, the reader or listener. I believe that all of this crying and sobbing for the poor girl is only because there is "something in it for them" - their immediate, selfish, 9 year old needs - and not because they want to make life better for ALL 10 year old girls! Nobody ever asked this 10 year old girl if this is the life she wants to live; true, but contrary to the whiners who sob over the plight of these children, these kids version of normal is shocking, and there is nothing anyone can do to make that change unless the needs of the few become more important than the needs of the many. That is a sad truth from life. My mother used to always make me clean my plate by reminding me about the poor, starving kids in Africa.

It takes more faith to believe this man is guilty than it does to see that he is a victim of the above. Whether he is guilty or innocent, what makes this all ludicrous is the method and behavior of the people who claim to be the victim (the girl whose version of normal is to probably have unwilling sex with Thai men and even try to get fresh with a foreign man because her so-called mom threatens her to do it for a bit if extra cash for her vices), the victim's legal guardian (the so-called mother who needs a back-ground and DNA check to prove she is the mother and not just some pimping monster out for a quick baht). the people sworn to protect the so-called victims (the local country police who need to have a check on their record for working in league with the locals in order to extort vulnerable, old, foreign men), and the ones who should know better (foreign, volunteer do-gooders who claim to want to help, yet silently stand by and allow this to happen; and it is happening for those who just fell off the turnip truck). All these people, to begin with, are implicitly guilty suspect of being corrupt, because they associate themselves with this cultural belief system that sucks instead of replaces the foul air with a substantial substance. Who is doing an inside story on this; and who would be around long enough to be heard were it so? Maybe Al needs to do "An Inconvenient Truth, Part 2" to demonstrate more important matters in the world other than the demise of the beetle population in some tundra in Siberia, due to a half degree increase in temperature.

Why is it the Thai women let the Thai men get away with anything and everything? because they fear for their lives. Why is it that these men and women, in their unseemly relationships, suddenly band together like Samurai warriors when a vulnerable farang, or farang threat is percieved; and these Thais are ready to kill, maim, or pillage? Survival that equates out to money; pure and simple. Go to the consensus to see why. Attaching labels like "law", "law-enforcement", "justice" is a charade and a plagiarism of Western terminology used to make them feel like they are coming into their own in this world, when in reality they are one step away from living like they did a thousand years ago. Every country suffers from this, but here it seems to be a bit thick. I have seen with my own eyes a drunk, English punter get stomped to death for hitting a Thai man in the face; literally. Literally over 30 Thai men descending upon this man and murdering him. No action to intervene was taken.

Regarding some of the off-hand comments about being humble in this country, I do love Thailand, the land. I do love the potential for cultural advancement, and I love the brief moments when a Thai demonstrates a flash of conscientiousness outside of their own self and towards another human. I am not talking about the skin deep acts of kindness, but the real deep and sincere acts that make your head turn and brings a breathe of fresh air into your life. I despise it when we foreigners are accused of not sitting quietly and keeping our mouths shut because "this is their country", yet they use every form of Western invented technology in order to further the cultural consensus in a way that makes me shudder. Thailand owes so much to the information and technology and resources they have gotten from the rest of the world. Perhaps it is time for a bit of acceptance that without these things, Thailand would be in a pretty fix and well below the ASEAN status of even the poorest country in this region.

So, in a roundabout way, this man is a victim because he is being accused in a cultural system where the law is plagiarized and used as a shield to conduct irresponsible business activity that is culturally acceptable and appropriate in the minds of our benefactors; but we are not allowed to go there. He is being accused by an individual who, to date, has not been scrutinized as to her involvement in this, and past attempts at luring victims in an effort to benefit her own selfish desires. Or perhaps she is a victim herself working in fear for her life to pay off some debt. Who knows? It is still more likely than what the OP alleges. He has been arrested by individuals who wear the clothes of authority, yet the question as to their intentions goes unanswered and unchecked.

The rest of the bunch, the foreign reporters and volunteers I hold in the lowest form of disgust for being in collusion with all of this and daring to justify it with mindless pap and jabberwocky. It is not a mere oversight that they fail to graciously come back in a future story and print front page articles to proclaim that past alleged "pedos" and "sexual 'interferers'" have been vindicated of all charges, and that they are indeed victims of this culture. No; they do not do that, and the answer supports my disgust for them. It seems that the farther along in time we go, the more disposable human beings become to each other; all in the interests of self gain.

[FlightRisk]

Thoughtful post cup-o-coffee. There are disturbing things about all of this, especially considering the continuing failure of Thailand to do anything sensible about the current lack-of-governmental mess it is in right now. I don't trust many of the NGO's that purport to be fighting this. In Asia, it's too easy for this to get twisted around, with the locals in collusion with the NGO's for profit and gain. A disturbing report on another blog that talks to this point: NGO Pedophilia controversy heats up in Cambodia

I'm also married to a Thai lady and we have a 12 y.o. son (by her Thai husband, whom she kicked out of the house years ago). We have a close relationship as a family and I don't want the kind of speculation and false accusations that the seemingly bottomless corruption in SE Asia is capable of generating for profit. It's why he's getting an overseas education, and will eventually be able to look back on his own culture with educated, independent eyes...

Edited June 22, 2010 by FlightRisk

[cup-O-coffee]

Thoughtful post cup-o-coffee. There are disturbing things about all of this, especially considering the continuing failure of Thailand to do anything sensible about the current lack-of-governmental mess it is in right now. I don't trust many of the NGO's that purport to be fighting this. In Asia, it's too easy for this to get twisted around, with the locals in collusion with the NGO's for profit and gain. A disturbing report on another blog that talks to this point: NGO Pedophilia controversy heats up in Cambodia

I'm also married to a Thai lady and we have a 12 y.o. son (by her Thai husband, whom she kicked out of the house years ago). We have a close relationship as a family and I don't want the kind of speculation and false accusations that the seemingly bottomless corruption in SE Asia is capable of generating for profit. It's why he's getting an overseas education, and will eventually be able to look back on his own culture with educated, independent eyes...

Thank you. You probably realize that the news used to be purely objective. It was designed to create a forum where people would come together and used the facts from the reported story and form their own conclusions. Now, it seems, the news not only reports events, but also weaves-in their personal opinions and bias so that the uneducated reader becomes emotionally charged if their thoughts are unchecked before reading. Anyone in the know realizes that most media informing agencies are now simply tools for a means to an end; no longer a resource for objective reporting that educates and allows the reader to form their own view. It's amazing that this is not an issue unto itself and something that is brought before the people; but then again, it must be a clear statement of the apathy this world is in the grips of. Information is food, but it is wise to be taught how to use a nutritious diet before going to the smorgasbord. I fear these current generations lack the ability to reason out information using logic, elementary deduction, and outside-the-box thinking. Taking things at face value just because it is all dressed up with sound-bytes and the reporter is wearing a suit seems to be good enough for today's youth and the embittered, hateful aged.

In the mean time, the culprits get away with murder and robbery, and the media covers their six by veiling the truth and distracting with mindless entertainment, and the governments form laws of censure to protect the plunderers, and the readers pop more pharmaceuticals and alcohol from all the stress from too much "fear-mongering" about stupid reporting on things that will affect us in a 1000 years. LOL.

Incidentally, in the spirit of the OP and my initial response, our next door neighbor, a Thai woman, just kicked her Thai husband out of the house. They had just had a baby together. They have been married for 7 years. He is seeing another Thai woman at his work place, in a sexual affair. The mother's family supports the husband's extra-marital affair. The mother is made out to be the bad person. She finally gave in to pressure and took him and the baby to the woman's house, and said, "Here, if you think you can take better care of my husband and my baby than I can, then take them. And do not let him come back to me." She then left the three of them there and went home. So how do you rate that, culturally? The poor misunderstood Thai man gets to be a gigolo (because he can) and gets off the hook with the support of his family, instead of working out things with his wife and the mother of his child. Regarding the OP, this is a clear demonstration of what any Farang could not do, and the results would make the morning headlines in some trumped of story. No comment needed because I wish to respect the OP.

[newtronbom]

Since we can't really comment on the charge then, who is the falang looking guy in the background with all the badges on his shirt?

I go along with you on that. I see so many of these falang police types and do wonder just who the heck they are and just who nominated them to play god over here........and this innocent until proven guilty 72 year old US citizen, was taking a big chance on have any sort of intercourse - verbal or otherwise - in associating with a 10 year old girl or any young child these days, without also having some other people around him, to keep things kosher. Very dangerous these days to have anything to do with kids, sorry to say, unless it's in the right circumstances. I mean you can't even smack a kid for putting his finger in a power socket to stop it getting electrocuted, without going up on an assault/abuse charge now days, it has got so ridiculous. I take 3 young kids to school and back every day, and I pity the teachers and feel sorry for the kids, who just run wild, knowing that the worst will be a tongue lashing, which most take no notice of anyway. Still. He(this old guy) should have thought of that(maybe has people to vouch for him) which is my hope is the case. Shudder to think of the alternative if he was on his own with her. We will have to wait for more facts, I guess. Just seems to be a very high insidence of pedophilia up that way in the north though, for some reason. Any one who abuses kids, deserves the worst in my opinion. To ruin a young life for ever, is worse than murder in many ways I think. Big shortage of facts here though. If he is innocent, which I hope is the case, I feel very sorry for him, as an accusation like this, is almost impossible to shake off. People will always think the worst. Very sadd situation, however it turns out. I must say that many men have needlessly suffered for the rest of their lives, from false accusations. My step father was such a case. Anyone who knew him, or was close to him, never believed that he had done anything wrong. His ex wife, just made it up to screw the guy, having lost out on a claim to his large savings acct in a failed legal action. The bitch really ruined his name and to this day, many people still think he molested his young daughter, despite a full police investigation and a denial from the daughter several years later, admitting that her mother had told her what to say. Pitiful on both them, as the daughter was 11 at the time, so quite capable in my opinion, of not going along with her mother. Neither of them were prosecuted or even censured, for ruining my step-dads life. He was and is still, a really good man. I just hope that this case is not like that for the sake of this old guy, if he is innocent. Either way now, he is "tarred with the brush" whatever happens. I detest waste of life, whether it be a child, or an adult. Having said all that, I still think the punishment for this type of crime, is far too light. I can not print here, the punishment that I would give a pedophile- and unlike today's punishment, if they had done to them, what I would like to do, there would not be any chance at all, at all of re offending. Some kids do get over it I am told, but most of them are permanently scarred for life. It's hard enough for a kid to get ahead in life and be successful these days anyway, with peer pressure and all the various temptations, without that sort of weight on their back too. This is a world wide sickness, that occurs in every country unfortunately.

[BadMonkey]

Firstly it's always the "Pattaya Daily News" raking in the garbage, they are THE De facto standard gutter press of Thailand, problem is they usually spice up reports with made up falsities and biased comments so its always hard to understand whats really happening with cases like this.

Secondly why don't we hear about all the Thai Pedos ... Oh wait a minute the pages would be over flowing if that were to happen.

[BadMonkey]

Firstly it's always the "Pattaya Daily News" raking in the garbage, they are THE De facto standard gutter press of Thailand, problem is they usually spice up reports with made up falsities and biased comments so its always hard to understand whats really happening with cases like this.

Secondly why don't we hear about all the Thai Pedos ... Oh wait a minute the pages would be over flowing if that were to happen.