Detained Thai Red Shirts - Protesters, Terrorists, Citizens

[webfact]

Protester, Terrorist, Citizen

A recently completed Justice Ministry report submitted to the prime minister on the state of 175 red shirt protesters detained in 14 prisons nationwide due to their involvement in political unrest that took place between April and May of this year has yielded some unexpected conclusions. In the report, the ministry concedes that a number of those still imprisoned and awaiting trial have been charged excessively, that is they were slapped with harsh incriminations disporportionate to their actual actions. These individuals have remained in prison for close to half a year because their charges warrant bail payments far beyond their ability to pay.

The report continues that many of the over one hundred protesters have not, in their over five months of arrest, been able to consult with an attorney. Most of these lower level red shirt cases have had their trials scheduled for May of next year, meaning that authorities can legally keep them behind bars for up to eight more months. Making it to trial however doesn't mean the end of their stay in prison as they must remain detained for the duration of the deliberation.

The Justice Ministry, citing the best interests of “reconciliation”, has suggested the government seek ways to expedite the processing of these citizens. The ministry has stated that cases involving those not apprehended for serious crimes such as terrorism should be put on a fast-track. These individuals include those who left their residence after the curfew imposed during the time and those found to be participating in the anti-government movement, all of which have now spent the majority of this year locked up with others being held for assault and treason.

On the matter of bail, the Justice Ministry has recommended the Justice Fund be made accessible to those unable to shoulder the up to 800 thousand baht bond payment needed for their temporary release. Again, the ministry has commented that the administration's willingness to make the fund available would support its proclaimed aspiration for reconciliation.

The debate of terrorist or protester rages on as the Thai public looks back on the actions of the red shirts earlier this year, it has reached such a fever-pitch that the nation has all but forgotten what the member's of the group began as; citizens. The government was justified in taking the actions it'd taken when the red shirt movement spiraled out of hand, but over five months on and with the Kingdom's much needed reconciliation still so elusive, it may be time to let the overreactions of yesterday to subside and allow for a tomorrow of understanding to begin.

Khao Sod, November 02 2010

Translated and Rewritten by Itiporn Lakarnchua

Please note that the views expressed in our "Analysis" segment are translated from local newspaper articles and do not reflect the views of the Thai-ASEAN News Network.

-- Tan Network 2010-11-03

[Pi Sek]

I don't normally like these opinion pieces, but this is a good one.

[Buchholz]

These individuals have remained in prison for close to half a year because their charges warrant bail payments far beyond their ability to pay.

The report continues that many of the over one hundred protesters have not, in their over five months of arrest, been able to consult with an attorney.

This sounds like a continuation of the thread:

Many Thai Red Shirts Abandoned By Their Leaders

as the Red Shirt Leaders all have attorneys and have no difficulty whatsoever making bail at the first opportunity it is granted.

On the matter of bail, the Justice Ministry has recommended the Justice Fund be made accessible to those unable to shoulder the up to 800 thousand baht bond payment needed for their temporary release.

Rather than tap into the Justice Fund, how about if just a few of the millionaire Red Shirt Leaders chip in and pay their bail?

Edited November 3, 2010 by Buchholz

[whybother]

What is the point of using the Justice Fund for bail?

Bail is supposed to act as an incentive to turn up at the next court appearance. If they are using public money as bail, where is the incentive?

[hanuman1]

Rather than tap into the Justice Fund, how about if just a few of the millionaire Red Shirt Leaders chip in and pay their bail?

Oh, you'd love it if they did that. Cue another 10+ page anti-red obsessive feeding frenzy.

[Buchholz]

Rather than tap into the Justice Fund, how about if just a few of the millionaire Red Shirt Leaders chip in and pay their bail?

Oh, you'd love it if they did that. Cue another 10+ page anti-red obsessive feeding frenzy.

If they did, it would qualify for another 10+ page of pro-red lovers expounding on how just and moral the Red Leaders are.

[hanuman1]

Rather than tap into the Justice Fund, how about if just a few of the millionaire Red Shirt Leaders chip in and pay their bail?

Oh, you'd love it if they did that. Cue another 10+ page anti-red obsessive feeding frenzy.

If they did, it would qualify for another 10+ page of pro-red lovers expounding on how just and moral the Red Leaders are.

Oh no it wouldn't.....

[phiphidon]

These individuals have remained in prison for close to half a year because their charges warrant bail payments far beyond their ability to pay.

The report continues that many of the over one hundred protesters have not, in their over five months of arrest, been able to consult with an attorney.

This sounds like a continuation of the thread:

Many Thai Red Shirts Abandoned By Their Leaders

http://www.thaivisa....rights-activist

as the Red Shirt Leaders all have attorneys and have no difficulty whatsoever making bail at the first opportunity it is granted.

On the matter of bail, the Justice Ministry has recommended the Justice Fund be made accessible to those unable to shoulder the up to 800 thousand baht bond payment needed for their temporary release.

Rather than tap into the Justice Fund, how about if just a few of the millionaire Red Shirt Leaders chip in and pay their bail?

In your eagerness to get some digs in about the Red Shirts, you forgot a fairly relevant part of the opinion piece;

" In the report, the ministry concedes that a number of those still imprisoned and awaiting trial have been charged excessively, that is they were slapped with harsh incriminations disporportionate to their actual actions".

[Buchholz]

These individuals have remained in prison for close to half a year because their charges warrant bail payments far beyond their ability to pay.

The report continues that many of the over one hundred protesters have not, in their over five months of arrest, been able to consult with an attorney.

This sounds like a continuation of the thread:

Many Thai Red Shirts Abandoned By Their Leaders

http://www.thaivisa....rights-activist

as the Red Shirt Leaders all have attorneys and have no difficulty whatsoever making bail at the first opportunity it is granted.

On the matter of bail, the Justice Ministry has recommended the Justice Fund be made accessible to those unable to shoulder the up to 800 thousand baht bond payment needed for their temporary release.

Rather than tap into the Justice Fund, how about if just a few of the millionaire Red Shirt Leaders chip in and pay their bail?

In your eagerness to get some digs in about the Red Shirts, you forgot a fairly relevant part of the opinion piece;

" In the report, the ministry concedes that a number of those still imprisoned and awaiting trial have been charged excessively, that is they were slapped with harsh incriminations disporportionate to their actual actions".

The digs are well earned.

In any situation where an article covers a multitude of aspects, posters will often clip the parts they have the most difficulty with. If I don't address a particular facet of an article, you might conclude that I don't disagree with it. The same as all other members do.

If every member addressed every issue in every news article, posts and threads would be a whole lot longer.

[Buchholz]

Rather than tap into the Justice Fund, how about if just a few of the millionaire Red Shirt Leaders chip in and pay their bail?

Oh, you'd love it if they did that. Cue another 10+ page anti-red obsessive feeding frenzy.

If they did, it would qualify for another 10+ page of pro-red lovers expounding on how just and moral the Red Leaders are.

Oh no it wouldn't.....

uhmmm... ok, if you say so. but I guess we'll never know if they would or not as the likelihood of the Red Leaders doing that would seem pretty slim.

[whybother]

Rather than tap into the Justice Fund, how about if just a few of the millionaire Red Shirt Leaders chip in and pay their bail?

Oh, you'd love it if they did that. Cue another 10+ page anti-red obsessive feeding frenzy.

Yes. Really a frenzy from the anti-red so far. 3 posts - 1 agreeing with the article, 1 suggesting the rich leaders pay for bail, and 1 questioning using public funds for (any) bail.

[Huey]

Everyone has a right to their opinion, however I, like so many other Bangkok residents who suffered through the red shirt terrorism, am of the opinion that red shirts belong in jail.

[craigt3365]

Rather than tap into the Justice Fund, how about if just a few of the millionaire Red Shirt Leaders chip in and pay their bail?

Oh, you'd love it if they did that. Cue another 10+ page anti-red obsessive feeding frenzy.

If they did, it would qualify for another 10+ page of pro-red lovers expounding on how just and moral the Red Leaders are.

Oh no it wouldn't.....

It would help for sure if the red leaders opened up their own pockets for these poor folk who are in jail for doing nothing more than attending a rally...egged on by the red leaders. IMHO, this is another reason people feel the reds are only out for Thaksin and to enrich themselves...not to help the poor. If they really wanted to help the poor, here is an excellent chance.

[rubl]

Rather than tap into the Justice Fund, how about if just a few of the millionaire Red Shirt Leaders chip in and pay their bail?

Oh, you'd love it if they did that. Cue another 10+ page anti-red obsessive feeding frenzy.

Yes. Really a frenzy from the anti-red so far. 3 posts - 1 agreeing with the article, 1 suggesting the rich leaders pay for bail, and 1 questioning using public funds for (any) bail.

As those UDD leaders are still incarcerated themselves it doesn't seem fair or proper to have them bail out other red-shirts. Maybe a better idea would be to have k. Jatuporn c.s. ask for donations (with proper receipts this time) to be able to afford lawyers and/or bail-out less fortunate red-shirts. At the same time some UDD lawyer may petition court to lower bail set to more reasonable amounts. Pointing to the MoJ report they may even try to get charges lessened and get people on a fast tract. Some red-shirts might even be eligible for immediate release.

Edited November 3, 2010 by rubl

[monkfish]

Did something get lost in translation?

They have been refused the right to an Attorney but have been offered bail?

[rubl]

Did something get lost in translation?

They have been refused the right to an Attorney but have been offered bail?

The report continues that many of the over one hundred protesters have not, in their over five months of arrest, been able to consult with an attorney.

No reason given in the OP.

[whybother]

Did something get lost in translation?

They have been refused the right to an Attorney but have been offered bail?

An earlier report indicated that some of them couldn't afford an attorney, not they have been refused the right to one.

[truethailand]

While we are on the theme of charges does the report say how many of the prisoners being held are to face terrorism charges. Just that the current government never uses that word in despatches anymore. Not to worry it served its purpose to orchestrate their vile propaganda against political opponents. Only I was thinking that the anti reds on here have stopped saying it so much, maybe they are just mouth pieces or farangs that believe everything that is told to them. Guilty partys on both sides but still no airport terrorists incarcerated. Sorry forgot they get made government ministers. Bring on the big bang, the sooner the better

[rixalex]

Oh, you'd love it if they did that. Cue another 10+ page anti-red obsessive feeding frenzy.

If they did, it would qualify for another 10+ page of pro-red lovers expounding on how just and moral the Red Leaders are.

Oh no it wouldn't.....

Has pantomime season started early this year?

[Pi Sek]

While we are on the theme of charges does the report say how many of the prisoners being held are to face terrorism charges. Just that the current government never uses that word in despatches anymore. Not to worry it served its purpose to orchestrate their vile propaganda against political opponents. Only I was thinking that the anti reds on here have stopped saying it so much, maybe they are just mouth pieces or farangs that believe everything that is told to them. Guilty partys on both sides but still no airport terrorists incarcerated. Sorry forgot they get made government ministers. Bring on the big bang, the sooner the better

I was going to reply to this but, as you have already had the facts shoved in your face and you still don't accept them, I don't think I'll bother. Sad, this is a victory for the red shirt propaganda machine.

[rixalex]

Guilty partys on both sides but still no airport terrorists incarcerated.

Which airport terrorists are they?

[hanuman1]

Oh, you'd love it if they did that. Cue another 10+ page anti-red obsessive feeding frenzy.

If they did, it would qualify for another 10+ page of pro-red lovers expounding on how just and moral the Red Leaders are.

Oh no it wouldn't.....

Has pantomime season started early this year?

At last someone gets the joke. Apologies to other nationals who may not be familiar with this traditional English exposition of a fruitless, and endless argument. For them, there are threads such as these.

Edited November 3, 2010 by hanuman1

[Buchholz]

Did something get lost in translation?

They have been refused the right to an Attorney but have been offered bail?

An earlier report indicated that some of them couldn't afford an attorney, not they have been refused the right to one.

Yes. The rich Red Shirt Leaders all have attorneys, but the Red Shirt minions don't.

The Red Shirt Bombers had an attorney provided by the Red Shirt Leaders (actually it was the same attorney they use), but the attorney was withdrawn from the cases when apparently the publicity of the association between the Red Shirt Bombers and the Red Shirt Leaders became too damning for the Leaders.

[rubl]

While we are on the theme of charges does the report say how many of the prisoners being held are to face terrorism charges. Just that the current government never uses that word in despatches anymore. Not to worry it served its purpose to orchestrate their vile propaganda against political opponents. Only I was thinking that the anti reds on here have stopped saying it so much, maybe they are just mouth pieces or farangs that believe everything that is told to them. Guilty partys on both sides but still no airport terrorists incarcerated. Sorry forgot they get made government ministers. Bring on the big bang, the sooner the better

I'm not aware of an 'airport' terrorist being made a government minister. Assuming you're talking about Thailand I won't ask you for a name as I do not want to put you at risk. Defamation laws in Thailand are draconic, even k. Thaksin wins them

As for the 'big bang' CERN has confirmed no risk of that

Edited November 3, 2010 by rubl

[geriatrickid]

These individuals have remained in prison for close to half a year because their charges warrant bail payments far beyond their ability to pay.

The report continues that many of the over one hundred protesters have not, in their over five months of arrest, been able to consult with an attorney.

This sounds like a continuation of the thread:

Many Thai Red Shirts Abandoned By Their Leaders

http://www.thaivisa....rights-activist

as the Red Shirt Leaders all have attorneys and have no difficulty whatsoever making bail at the first opportunity it is granted.

On the matter of bail, the Justice Ministry has recommended the Justice Fund be made accessible to those unable to shoulder the up to 800 thousand baht bond payment needed for their temporary release.

Rather than tap into the Justice Fund, how about if just a few of the millionaire Red Shirt Leaders chip in and pay their bail?

You missed the point.

In the report, the ministry concedes that a number of those still imprisoned and awaiting trial have been charged excessively, that is they were slapped with harsh incriminations disporportionate to their actual actions. These individuals have remained in prison for close to half a year because their charges warrant bail payments far beyond their ability to pay.

If the government has infringed civil livberties and acted inappropriately, then the government must take the remedial actions. Not other parties. It's called the fair administration of justice.

[geriatrickid]

At last someone gets the joke. Apologies to other nationals who may not be familiar with this traditional English exposition of a fruitless, and endless argument. For them, there are threads such as these.

Well said. It does however allow some to demonstrate their cut and paste abilities and of course to regurgitate the same lines that are used for every other thread.

[Buchholz]

At last someone gets the joke. Apologies to other nationals who may not be familiar with this traditional English exposition of a fruitless, and endless argument. For them, there are threads such as these.

Well said. It does however allow some to demonstrate their cut and paste abilities and of course to regurgitate the same lines that are used for every other thread.

Can you point out any, let alone "every other", thread that contains the comments that the quote was responding to?

No?, I didn't think so, but don't let that stop you from making your gross exaggerations.

[Gonsalviz]

In the end they will all get out on time served.

[SomTumTiger]

As long as they are not burning buildings down, I am happy.