Recession ?

[pop3]

Lately I have been going to estate agents with my friend who is in the position of both selling a condo and looking for a house to buy. if we ask the agent about selling his condo we are told ... the market has taken a very big dive and the price of all property in Thailand is now very low, if we then say ... ok forget trying to sell my condo can you show me some of this very low priced property you have for sale he is unable to do so.

The property seems to be practically the same price as it ever was ? if the property market has crashed like they say it has we should be seeing property prices at much reduced prices like we are seeing in the USA but were not. why ?

[trogers]

Compare the holding cost of a vacated house/condo in the US and in Thailand.

When the agent says the market has taken a big dive, what was meant is that the gap between offer and accepted prices has widen, and thus no sales.

[sarahsbloke]

Thais won't sell at a loss.

They prefer to just leave the house to rot .........

So no cheap houses, but plenty of abandoned houses.

Same with the rental market

My landlady just informed us she is putting our rent up from 7,000bht a month to 8,000bht a month. So we move somewhere else and she has an empty house with no income and little hope of renting. She rents out 2 houses .... same for the other tenants, they are leaving too. The whole mooban is littered with abandoned houses, and houses for rent with no tenants. Thailand is a crazy place ... but sort of fun.

Edited November 6, 2010 by sarahsbloke

[zorro1]

thailand had no subprime exposure, they learn their lesson in the last bubble. You cant compare it to USA.

I bought another place 2 years ago off plan. They just put the price UP again for the 3rd time. Showed a friend who was interested but NO discount.

go figure..

[pop3]

Thais won't sell at a loss.

They prefer to just leave the house to rot .........

So no cheap houses, but plenty of abandoned houses.

Same with the rental market

My landlady just informed us she is putting our rent up from 7,000bht a month to 8,000bht a month. So we move somewhere else and she has an empty house with no income and little hope of renting. She rents out 2 houses .... same for the other tenants, they are leaving too. The whole mooban is littered with abandoned houses, and houses for rent with no tenants. Thailand is a crazy place ... but sort of fun.

.................................

Point taken sarahsbloke about Thais won't sell at a loss. but I would have thought in this present financial situation they would be FORCED to sell at a loss and are in no position to just sit and let the house or condo rot ?

[sarahsbloke]

.................................

Point taken sarahsbloke about Thais won't sell at a loss. but I would have thought in this present financial situation they would be FORCED to sell at a loss and are in no position to just sit and let the house or condo rot ?

Most Thais don't have the exposure to financial problems of the western world. No risk of homelessness, they just move back to the family farm. Food is cheap, and can be picked from the jungle for free.

Those that do.

They have a house repossessed, the bank then sits on the property ........ Thai banks don't sell at a loss either ...... they just leave the house to rot ..... the asset value to the bank remains.

Edited November 6, 2010 by sarahsbloke

[H2oDunc]

There are plenty of bargains to be had at the moment. Just look. I know of a 5 bedroom villa with 2 bed staff quarters place that was 50 million now 38 and with a twin engined speedboat and Fortuna car thrown in as well. The trouble is the agents don't want to sell you a cheap house but there are lots of owners who do.

Look in TV classified and other free to advertise places etc.

I think it was George Sorros who said " the time to buy is when people are scared and the time to be scared is when lots of people are buying " Or something along those lines.

Fill ya boots as they say back home

[trogers]

There are plenty of bargains to be had at the moment. Just look. I know of a 5 bedroom villa with 2 bed staff quarters place that was 50 million now 38 and with a twin engined speedboat and Fortuna car thrown in as well. The trouble is the agents don't want to sell you a cheap house but there are lots of owners who do.

Look in TV classified and other free to advertise places etc.

I think it was George Sorros who said " the time to buy is when people are scared and the time to be scared is when lots of people are buying " Or something along those lines.

Fill ya boots as they say back home

Yes, some farangs are being forced to sell at deep discounts - particularly villas and condo units in resort locations. If you are looking for distressed sales, try the auctions held by the Legal Execution Dept. But even the creditor banks (through their asset management companies) are there to bid for choice properties they had foreclosed and hold them instead of selling them too cheap.

[bangkokjohn]

In 5 years I've never seen a place in Thailand that you are not better off renting than buying and I've been looking.

Prices here are way too high because most Thai investors are not knowledgable about investment pricipals such as opportunity cost and depreciation.

Also, there are very few good investment alternitives in Thailand and Thai tax structure contributes - received rent is taxed at 12%, empty property is not taxed.

The result is a lot of Thais with empty apartments hoping some fool will come along and bail them out. If not, they give it to the kids for them to live in or sell.

[trogers]

In 5 years I've never seen a place in Thailand that you are not better off renting than buying and I've been looking.

Prices here are way too high because most Thai investors are not knowledgable about investment pricipals such as opportunity cost and depreciation.

Also, there are very few good investment alternitives in Thailand and Thai tax structure contributes - received rent is taxed at 12%, empty property is not taxed.

The result is a lot of Thais with empty apartments hoping some fool will come along and bail them out. If not, they give it to the kids for them to live in or sell.

See those long queues outside goldsmiths in Chinatown? Quite a few did learn about leveraged investment and opportunity cost leading to the Tom Yum Kung crisis... and they held weekend markets at Soi Thonglor to sell off Rolexes, Benz and BMWs.

[craigt3365]

In 5 years I've never seen a place in Thailand that you are not better off renting than buying and I've been looking.

Prices here are way too high because most Thai investors are not knowledgable about investment pricipals such as opportunity cost and depreciation.

Also, there are very few good investment alternitives in Thailand and Thai tax structure contributes - received rent is taxed at 12%, empty property is not taxed.

The result is a lot of Thais with empty apartments hoping some fool will come along and bail them out. If not, they give it to the kids for them to live in or sell.

I would have to argue with that. Depends on your investment horizon and how much you paid for the property. People have made money recently in the housing market, and lots of new construction...but oriented towards Thais. I have a friend who is rehabing abandoned houses and reselling them to Thais. But for sure, if you buy now, unless you get a good deal, it will be years before you recoup your investment. Of course you will be living rent free in the mean time...and don't have to worry about a landlord...who may want to up prices on you just for the heck of it.

Back to the OP. Find out where you want to live. Visit a few places with an agent, then go back on your own and ask around. Many places are for sale and don't even have a sign out front...especially if they have been abandoned. The manager at the moo baan should know what is for sale and perhaps how to contact the owner. I know in our village, the ones for sale by the estate agents are 30% more than the ones for sale by owner. Deals are out there, you just need to do some research. Also, work with multiple agents. Many houses are only listed with one particular agent...

[SantiSuk]

So Thais are illogical are they because they see property as a lifetime and family investment and they don't borrow money to buy so they do not have to be forced sellers?

Come on guys - get real. Falangland is sinking into an <deleted> abyss because everyone thinks they can live now and pay later and flip in and out of stuff to make a profit. Personally I prefer Thai culture on this one.

PS - Thailand is not in recession (= two quarters of -ve GDP growth). Thai growth about 8% this year. That's agreed by the IMF before you get carried away with smart comments about government lies. [The Thai Tourist Authority is not part of an international financial community that holds countries to account so sure they can lie, but the same does not hold good for the Thai Ministry of Finance.

And another thing - isn't it a little naive to believe estate agents when they say that the selling market is difficult - they want to sell your place quickly and with the least fuss. Estate Agents are one area where falang culture is the same as Thai - untrustworthy.

Rant over.

[FarangBuddha]

Agree with those reporting there are plenty of deals to be had on the buying side of things. Prices in Pattaya are down 20-30% from 4 years ago at a minimum for resales (both houses and condos). Of course, if buying in most Western currencies, because of currency depreciation, the price will be the same or maybe even more.

Don't ever deal with estate agents (property-pimps), they bring nothing of value to a transaction. Most of the farang run agencies and their agents are uneducated college drop-outs who don't know anything about Thailand or the property market here. They just came here to chase girls or boys and need some way to fund their whoring and drinking so they flog condos and houses to their fellow clueless foreigners.

Just drive around an area you may want to live and look for sale signs or ask around. In condos, most lobbies have a board where units for sale are posted. You will find many nice places available and usually at much cheaper prices than through an agent.

[ProThaiExpat]

It is accurate to separate comments into two categories, Thai sellers and Farang Sellers. Thai sellers rarely lower their prices even for virtually abandoned houses in crap shape. Falang act like Westerners in most cases and realize that crap houses don't sell to anyone, so fix up and sell to falang or Thai, Thais don't fix up to sell in most cases.

The only houses in our moo ban that have sold in ten years have been Falang sellers who fixed up and then sold to Falang or Thais.