Bringing 70K Usd In Cash To Buy Condo

[MattFS218]

Does anyone have any experience bringing 70k in cash to buy a condo. I know there are US treasury declarations. But I was wondering if anyone has been able to get the right certificates that indicate the money has been brought in from abroad from Super Rich or the Thai customs (where I assume it needs to be declared on arrival, since over $20k is being brought into Thailand).

Is this possible? It will save over $300 is wire transfer fees, but more importantly I won't be giving money to crooked Thai banks. Does anyone have any experience doing this?

[odedbkk]

Hi

Based on my personal experience .. It will not help.

After wiring the money form overseas, The bank issue another letter confirming that the source of the money is outside of Thailand.

If you carry cash and despoit it ,.. it is the same as using local money

By the way, you can use local money under some restictions (work permit , salary ,, ect)

If you buy condo that worth 70K , dont be cheap over 300$

Catched by the wrong officer at the customs can cost more

[beejoir]

Don't bother, wire it, I'm sure you can find a bank that'll charge you only $30 HSBC is good....

You'll have problems when you try to sell it with the paperwork else!

[Naam]

why do i have the strange feeling that "pennywise, pound foolish" applies?

[nong38]

Have you considered bringing a cheque with you, you will be charged a fee and it might take a month to clear but it would be a safer way than bringing cash and less expensive than wiring it maybe.

[chiang mai]

Far too many negative answers on this one, including:

1) US Customs might detect that you're carrying such a large amount of cash (assuming you're travelling from the US, but the same rules apply to many other countries also), will you have the right answers and the supporting documentation?

2) Thai Customs may appear inefficient but they have a job to do and they do it well, much of the time. So, same questions apply upon entry as upon exit, why do you have so much cash on your person and don't expect a to get it back quickly or easily, if at all, if you give the wrong answers. BTW, you will need to declare the funds upon arrival because it's over the limit for normal travel.

3) Do you suppose that SuperRich, a private money exchange company, will give you a currency exchange certificate confirming that your cash came from abroad, if you think that, think again because they will not!

Invest a few dollars and do it right, who knows, if you get your timing right you may even make a profit on the exchange rate.

[newbie001]

I have used Kasikorn and BKK bank and neither charged for overseas transfers. They also give a better exchange rate than a cash transaction. I actually have saved money on large wire transfers. The bank that you send from usually does the charging not the recieving bank. usually on 10K USD I pay about 50 dollars from the bank in the US.

Trust me, you don't want to carry 70K USD dollars. With all the security checks your money belt will be examined and will single you out for someone to rip you off. Not safe at all.

you will need to declare it here also.

cashier's checks are also ok, but as stated before you will need time for them to clear.

Traveler's cheques are also ok, but you will spend a lot of time filling out paper work for each one.

One time I exchanged about 10K USD in cash and the bank photo copied every single 100 dollar bill.

[BarnicaleBob]

Please, what ever you do, do not bring $70,000.00 in cash with you. There are just too many things that can go wrong, it is not worth the risk. Your money could end up being held by customs, a thief may see you show the money at customs and follow you to a place he feels safe in stabbing or shooting you for you cash. This is only some of the things that could go wrong, you also need to think about where you are boarding in America, after you get the cash from the bank you are subject to being robbed shot and killed at anytime with out notice. As you go through customs anyone around could see you with the money and do the same thing any Thai criminal would do to you. There are criminals that make a habit of watching airports for targets such as yourself. The risk is just too great to carry that much cash anywhere.

[dvdcm]

I don't recall the exact wording, but I seem to recall there's some sort of limitation on how much cash you can bring into Thailand without declaring it. Are you really ready to declare more than 2 million baht cash in USD on your person? I've seen people detained on the jetway in the States with far less. And if you're not ready to declare it on both ends, can you afford to lose it?

[rakman]

Please, what ever you do, do not bring $70,000.00 in cash with you. There are just too many things that can go wrong, it is not worth the risk. Your money could end up being held by customs, a thief may see you show the money at customs and follow you to a place he feels safe in stabbing or shooting you for you cash. This is only some of the things that could go wrong, you also need to think about where you are boarding in America, after you get the cash from the bank you are subject to being robbed shot and killed at anytime with out notice. As you go through customs anyone around could see you with the money and do the same thing any Thai criminal would do to you. There are criminals that make a habit of watching airports for targets such as yourself. The risk is just too great to carry that much cash anywhere.

Most likely you'll have your money confiscated by the DEA as a "drug dealer" at the airport, and you'll never get it back.

Save peace of mind, wire transfer the money to a decent bank.

But, if you want to save some $$, I'm going to bkk soon, I'd be happy to carry it over for you, just to be safe.. LOLOLOL

[rakman]

I have used Kasikorn and BKK bank and neither charged for overseas transfers. They also give a better exchange rate than a cash transaction. I actually have saved money on large wire transfers. The bank that you send from usually does the charging not the recieving bank. usually on 10K USD I pay about 50 dollars from the bank in the US.

Trust me, you don't want to carry 70K USD dollars. With all the security checks your money belt will be examined and will single you out for someone to rip you off. Not safe at all.

you will need to declare it here also.

cashier's checks are also ok, but as stated before you will need time for them to clear.

Traveler's cheques are also ok, but you will spend a lot of time filling out paper work for each one.

One time I exchanged about 10K USD in cash and the bank photo copied every single 100 dollar bill.

In bkk, USD $100 are usually exchanged with no problem. I was up in Ubon and had such a hassle at a decent Thai bank (forget the name) where they didn't have the correct "security bulletin" for the series of bills I had. Had to shuffle through to find the series numbers that matched, then after through examination of each bill in multiple places, they photocopied the exchanged bills and passport and had me sign each image.

So avoid pain in time and worries, wire the money.

[MattFS218]

I was not proposing to "sneak" or "launder" the money into Thailand. I was planning on making both the US and Thai declarations. US requires a declaration over 10k, and any Thai money exchanger who is legit is suppose to file one if changing over 20k.

My real question is can I get a Thor Tor 3 from either SuperRich or Thai Customs.

For those who do not understand, there's a significant difference in the exchange rate that the Banks giving you for exchanging money via a TT, and a cash rate for $100 USD bills. It amounts to about 0.5%, which when dealing with property can be significant, in addition to the wire fees changed by the sending and receiving bank.

SuperRich routinely changes this amount, and nobody is going to rob you in the Airplane. Just because you have to declare it doesn't mean it's illegal.

[chiang mai]

There's a third declaration and that's at Customs when you bring the money into the country.

A Thor Tor 3 can only be issued when it is known that money has been brought in from overseas, SuperRich wont be in a position to know that since you could easily has acquired the USD here in Thailand - it's BOT rules you need to satisfy in all of this, not SR.

[mitsubishi]

Some of you need to take a chill pill.

It's his money and if he's wanting to bypass the corporate banking then let him.

Also customs can only take your cash if the money is for criminal purposes.

So if, for example, your purpose is to buy a car, property, live off on a 1 year visa etc.

There's not much they can except delay your entry (which isn't the end of the world)

[chiang mai]

Some of you need to take a chill pill.

It's his money and if he's wanting to bypass the corporate banking then let him.

Also customs can only take your cash if the money is for criminal purposes.

So if, for example, your purpose is to buy a car, property, live off on a 1 year visa etc.

There's not much they can except delay your entry (which isn't the end of the world)

You missed the point, the OP is unlikely to achieve his objective if does as he stated.

[Daveroc]

When a Bank purchases cash it applies a Note buying rate. This would be the least attractive of the rates available. It is supposed to incorporate a facter that covers handling and supposedly the repatriation of the cash back to the country of origin. In reality it is likely sold to the next customer wanting that particularly currency. However banks do routinely repatriate cash when they acquire surplus.

Should you bring the funds in by Telegrahic Transfer the most attractive rate is applied. On todays rates if we use the USD70k you would get 2,095,100 baht if bought in by TT and 2,077,600 if by cash. A difference of 17,500 or roughly USD590. On this basis it is obviously more attractive by TT and does more than cover your Bank costs, which would appear high at the stated USD300. I would have thought a max. USD50-80. Then there is the comfort factor of not having to carry the cash.

And yes a Bank will iss the Exhange certificate if you bring in the funds in cash and show the Airport customs declaration.

[MattFS218]

Daveroc,

Check super rich's rates at superrich1965.com for $100USD bills and compare it against the TT rates offered by all the major banks. TT is NOT the best rate in Thailand....

--matt

[chiang mai]

A quick spot check on USD/THB, 30.12 for notes at Super Rich, 30.08 via TT at Bank of Auyudya was the best available. Note: SR rate was 30.07 for fifties, 30.12 for 100's.

http://bankexchangerates.daytodaydata.net/default.aspx

Edited November 26, 2010 by chiang mai

[supaprik]

You are taking the "piss" right?

I shake my head

[chiang mai]

You are taking the "piss" right?

I shake my head

er, no!

[Naam]

Some of you need to take a chill pill.

It's his money and if he's wanting to bypass the corporate banking then let him.

Also customs can only take your cash if the money is for criminal purposes.

So if, for example, your purpose is to buy a car, property, live off on a 1 year visa etc.

There's not much they can except delay your entry (which isn't the end of the world)

You missed the point, the OP is unlikely to achieve his objective if does as he stated.

needs

[MattFS218]

The spread changes (bangkok bank has the rate at 30.03), but also do not forget the fact that on coming wire transfers, most Thai banks charge a minimum of 300thb just to receive it on top of the exchange rate spread, and any intermediary bank fees. Plus your own banks international wire fees.

The way I see it, $300-$400 in exchange rate spreads makes my next ticket back to the states half off, courtesy of Thai banks, as long as either customs or super rich can provide a tor tor 3 or equivalent for purchasing a condo.

If you haven't figured it out already, someone has to pay for all those fancy branches in those posh malls.

[MattFS218]

Besides changmai and mitsubishi most people here did not read or understand my post, instead (as usual) people chimed in on questions that I was not asking.

You with think such an advanced and senior member like Nam would go a little further than answering the question then giving the ever so helpful advice that I am being penny wise and pound foolish. Have you considered offering this advice on the many forums regarding the Pattaya Baht Bus double pricing scheme?

70k in 100 usd bills is not that much, in size it's the equivalent of 700,000 worth of, 1000thb notes, which every so often I see people walking into banks in thailand with.

I'll pay a real estate agent 5% commission to do some leg work, but paying a bank 0.5% for transferring numbers on a book (or I guess a computer no a-days) is near steeling--similar to the 150baht foreign transaction fee for atms.

At least at super rich, they actually have to pay staff to count and go through each note to make sure it's not fake--but they do this at a fair rate. So where's the Aeon of inbound TT wires?

[chiang mai]

Matt, I applaud your attempts to try and do things cost effectively, especially at the expense of the banks. But I do wonder if you've put a price on the risk involved in what you're contemplating because $70k is a lot of money to most people and to many Thai's it's an absolute fortune - so the biggest risk I see is that you become a target, is saving a couple hundred bucks really worth that?

This thread seems to have established that you could potentially save some money but that would require you to declare the funds at the point of entry and obtain a customs receipt, whether or not Super Rich would accept that remains unclear to me at least. I don't know about anyone else on this forum but I would no more declare $70k to Thai Customs or the Thai Police than I would voluntarily go and live in Ohio, personally I think it's a huge risk but each to their own and good luck with whatever you decide.

Sorry, an after thought: why not visit Bangkok Bank in the US and buy a cashiers cheque denominated in THB and carry that for deposit to a BB account in Thailand. I've done similar with GBP/THB in reverse and it was very cost effective because the ex rate used is the same as the TT rate - cost of the cheque in Thailand was Baht 300 and no charge to deposit.

Edited November 26, 2010 by chiang mai

[MattFS218]

A quick spot check on USD/THB, 30.12 for notes at Super Rich, 30.08 via TT at Bank of Auyudya was the best available. Note: SR rate was 30.07 for fifties, 30.12 for 100's.

http://bankexchangerates.daytodaydata.net/default.aspx

Nice www site find btw.

It's all about morals. If everyone willingly pays these fees to Thai banks they keep charging them. If enough people do the super rich method, maybe they will realize and lower their fees...but then again...maybe so will robbers

Either way, I wouldn't do it if I was taking a taxi around, or anything like this, but airport-to-airport-to super rich-to bangkok bank is a risk I'm willing to take. Thanks for the help.

Edited November 26, 2010 by MattFS218

[taxout]

This thread indicates, as I believe is the case, that you're not going to get an exchange certificate from either Super Rich or a bank if you use US currency. You need to remit the funds from overseas.

http://www.thaivisa....-the-tor-tor-3/

Edited November 27, 2010 by taxout

[aurelius]

Besides changmai and mitsubishi most people here did not read or understand my post, instead (as usual) people chimed in on questions that I was not asking.

You with think such an advanced and senior member like Nam would go a little further than answering the question then giving the ever so helpful advice that I am being penny wise and pound foolish. Have you considered offering this advice on the many forums regarding the Pattaya Baht Bus double pricing scheme?

70k in 100 usd bills is not that much, in size it's the equivalent of 700,000 worth of, 1000thb notes, which every so often I see people walking into banks in thailand with.

I'll pay a real estate agent 5% commission to do some leg work, but paying a bank 0.5% for transferring numbers on a book (or I guess a computer no a-days) is near steeling--similar to the 150baht foreign transaction fee for atms.

At least at super rich, they actually have to pay staff to count and go through each note to make sure it's not fake--but they do this at a fair rate. So where's the Aeon of inbound TT wires?

Try Paypal or Western Union - - oops way more expensive, already the banks are starting to look like reasonable value.

You need to get some appreciation for value of risk reduction - settlement risk, personal security - some of it mentioned above. A TT may be physically a computer to computer transfer, but wait until something hits the fan and then you see the value of the integrity of the international settlement systems.

TT3 (or its equivalent these days) is only able to be issued by banks - it is a document governed by the policy of the Bank of Thailand. TT3 endorses the source of funds as originating from abroad - only banks have access to the financial transaction record which shows the source of funds.

While various posters had a wide range of comments, the allegation made in the OP remains open: "Is this possible? It will save over $300 is wire transfer fees, but more importantly I won't be giving money to crooked Thai banks. Does anyone have any experience doing this?"

Do you have any evidence that the banks are crooked - this is a serious claim - please provide facts - we would like to know more about this. Presumably you have something more than just your frustration with publicly announced fees and charges - which may be high, but are not crooked.

[zorro1]

You could have a heart attack. It happens! Who do you want to leave the money to? 70k is a fortune to most westerners let alone thais.

A very expensive car is 70k. we wouldn't dream of driving without insurance even though majority never have an accident. Think of it like that.

You got good advice here IMO. Just a question would you bring in 500k cash?

The point is yes you can do it but who would??

[MattFS218]

Well, if I have a heart attack and die, then the money is worthless to me because I am dead. But more than likely I'd travel with my trusted thai gf <g>. Yes, I'd bring over 500k in cash assuming super rich would change it--the more the better because it's economies of scale (only have to fill out treasury paper work once). I'm sure if I really cared I can find someone to insure the money from airport to airport to super rich for less than the Thai bank's are charging in currency spreads.

My statement about bank's being crooked is based on their fee structure relative to the costs involved with performing transactions. The examples I gave are foreign atm surcharges, up country transfer fees, TT foreign wire transfer fees, yearly debt card fees, etc, etc. Understand banks make far more money than fees by accumulating savings, and lending it out X fold at higher rates. I think something might have been missed in translation, as I wasn't accusing them of holding me up with a gun--rather they are a monopolistic mafia charging extravagant fees--in my book it cheating and steeling (ie being a crook).

[MattFS218]

Just to add, you may wonder why $100 USD bills get a higher premium than lower denominations. It's because in much of Asia and other places that have experienced high inflation in the past the $100 USD bills is a safe store of wealth. It's why the US currency is circulated so much outside of the US. As an added benefit I'm helping the US government get out of debt by borrowing interest free courtesy of rich people in Myanmar, Cambodia, Laos, and a lesser extent Thailand.

the reason is these bills are not recirculated back to the US. and thus there is no cost associated with the bill exchange which is why some people are falsely believing cash is a more expensive form of payment than electronic stuff.

Edited November 28, 2010 by MattFS218