The Eternal Love Of The Chinese Cleaver.

[Hawkup2000]

Why do all Thais that I've seen cooking use a Chinese cleaver? I find it hard to believe that it's actually better than a standard 240 mm chefs knife since there are not that many technical techniques when it comes to make the usual Thai dishes. Yet, still most Thais hang on to their cleaver. Why?

[phaethon]

It's how they were taught by Mama and Mama knows BEST.

The chopping drives me nuts: If I get the urge for an afternoon nap you can bet your $%^&* someone nearby will start chopping. The concept of slicing is is completely alien to them. They'd chop soup if they could find a way to keep it on the board.

Could it be that this is the only outlet most Thais have for the violent frustration that 'face' prevents them from venting any other way?

[AyG]

A cleaver has a few advantages. It's heavier, so it's easier to cut through joints between bones, or even to cut through bones. It's better for scooping up chopped items. You can hold one in each hand and chop minced meat more easily.

[Thailaw]

There is a huge number of tasks in the kitchen (western or Thai) where a cleaver is by far the best instrument for the job. An experienced chef wouldn't be without one. It couldn't replace an 8 inch chef's knife, but few chefs/cooks would want to have only 1 knife in their kitchen (I have at least 25 high quality knives and 3 cleavers, but I use my 50 year old 10 inch Sabatier chef's knife 85% of the time). A competent surgeons would never walk into an operating room with only a scalpel. Even an inexperienced cook should know that, and value the use of a cleaver. And few Thai restaurants provide a knife as part of the table silverware, so preparing meat into a form that can be eaten without cutting at the table (as is the norm with Thai food) is, as noted above, much easier and faster with a clearver than a knife, even a heavy one. Most Asians understand this, but maybe some westerners are too closed to change (even where it is to their advantage) to understand the real value of a cleaver. Most Thai cooks have a cleaver and a large knife within reach and move between the two easily as the task requires. There's no chopping in McDonalds ("The chopping drives me nuts"), so you and your offensive attitude might prefer that to quality food prepared with a cleaver by an experienced and knowledgeable Thai cook.

[tutsiwarrior]

cleavers are cheap; a few baht compared to a couple thousand for a chef's knife and they are mostly made of carbon steel and take an edge a lot easier than stainless...

I woulda thought those would be the obvious advantages...

somebody mentioned the weight...one good whack takes down a whole head of garlic to make it easy to peel...nobody would abuse their fancy european chef's knife in that way...

bon apetit...

[tutsiwarrior]

a story, btw...

in Bolivia and in other rural places in latin america folks use chopping/slicing knives made from scrap metal...the blade has a shank that is attached to a roughly hewn piece of wood...viciously sharp and you got to watch out when in the kitchen but they sure do get the job done...

I watched one morning, dispassionately as our kitchen help, a voluptuous quechua indigenous girl named Romualda squatted in the dirt and slit the throats of a basket full of guinea pigs with one motion each for our lunch one day...she could've been slicing onions with more effort...

nice knife...

oh, and yeah...an associate once managed to take the discarded guinea pig hides and make a hat...sorta like Davy Crockett...nothing goes to waste in the rural andes...

Edited December 20, 2010 by tutsiwarrior

[sbk]

reminds me of a story a friend told me, he was at friend's restaurant and the cook was chop chop chopping away and the thai friend said, "that's the sound of a good wife." My friend answered, "no the sound of a good wife is the bang bang of the headboard against the wall." He said the cook blushed and the friend laughed.

[tutsiwarrior]

reminds me of a story a friend told me, he was at friend's restaurant and the cook was chop chop chopping away and the thai friend said, "that's the sound of a good wife." My friend answered, "no the sound of a good wife is the bang bang of the headboard against the wall." He said the cook blushed and the friend laughed.

a lascivious and lewd riposte to my wholesome tale of guinea pig slaughter in the central andes...?

no matter, I'm at home now and have been pursuing seduction devices regarding my mother-in-law: 'çome with me to vietnam and we shall swim naked together in the south china sea...'

unfortunately, I think that she's heard that one before...

[sbk]

reminds me of a story a friend told me, he was at friend's restaurant and the cook was chop chop chopping away and the thai friend said, "that's the sound of a good wife." My friend answered, "no the sound of a good wife is the bang bang of the headboard against the wall." He said the cook blushed and the friend laughed.

a lascivious and lewd riposte to my wholesome tale of guinea pig slaughter in the central andes...?

no matter, I'm at home now and have been pursuing seduction devices regarding my mother-in-law: 'çome with me to vietnam and we shall swim naked together in the south china sea...'

unfortunately, I think that she's heard that one before...

you love it tutsi!!!

[tutsiwarrior]

reminds me of a story a friend told me, he was at friend's restaurant and the cook was chop chop chopping away and the thai friend said, "that's the sound of a good wife." My friend answered, "no the sound of a good wife is the bang bang of the headboard against the wall." He said the cook blushed and the friend laughed.

a lascivious and lewd riposte to my wholesome tale of guinea pig slaughter in the central andes...?

no matter, I'm at home now and have been pursuing seduction devices regarding my mother-in-law: 'çome with me to vietnam and we shall swim naked together in the south china sea...'

unfortunately, I think that she's heard that one before...

you love it tutsi!!!

one is not put on this earth to do anything less......and merry christmas to you,darlin'...

[dddave]

When making dishes with what westerners call ground beef or pork, most Thai cooks I've seen prefer to chop their own and the cleaver does that very well. My GF can reduce a piece of pork to finely chopped meat in minutes.

Pre-chopped meats are the quickest to spoil so there is a lot of sense to it.

[tutsiwarrior]

When making dishes with what westerners call ground beef or pork, most Thai cooks I've seen prefer to chop their own and the cleaver does that very well. My GF can reduce a piece of pork to finely chopped meat in minutes.

Pre-chopped meats are the quickest to spoil so there is a lot of sense to it.

if you have observed your GF using the cleaver to mince beef maybe you can describe her procedure...I've tried on a couple of occasions and the result was a mishmash but I had used a chefs knife instead, did she tenderize the beef first? Where I live now in rural VN the local market has some nice looking beef but no grinding facilities; haveta go to the nearest big town to the supermarket to get ground beef. It would be nice to know of a sure fire method to mince using a cleaver that didn't take 30mins per half kilo of meat...

in Thailand no one in my wife's family bother's with minced pork larb at home and it's just a treat that we get when we eat out...it would be a treat to know of an effective mincing technique using a cleaver...also an excuse to buy one as there is a splendid selection here where I live...

[tigerfish]

It's how they were taught by Mama and Mama knows BEST.

The chopping drives me nuts: If I get the urge for an afternoon nap you can bet your $%^&* someone nearby will start chopping. The concept of slicing is is completely alien to them. They'd chop soup if they could find a way to keep it on the board.

Could it be that this is the only outlet most Thais have for the violent frustration that 'face' prevents them from venting any other way?

another one is the pestle and mortar.

and as you said pheathon, you can bet your bottom dollar that at some point in the day when i am having a nap, be it 5 a.m. in the morning or midway through the afternoon the MIL will start thudding away on the bloody thing.

[dddave]

When making dishes with what westerners call ground beef or pork, most Thai cooks I've seen prefer to chop their own and the cleaver does that very well. My GF can reduce a piece of pork to finely chopped meat in minutes.

Pre-chopped meats are the quickest to spoil so there is a lot of sense to it.

if you have observed your GF using the cleaver to mince beef maybe you can describe her procedure...I've tried on a couple of occasions and the result was a mishmash but I had used a chefs knife instead, did she tenderize the beef first? Where I live now in rural VN the local market has some nice looking beef but no grinding facilities; haveta go to the nearest big town to the supermarket to get ground beef. It would be nice to know of a sure fire method to mince using a cleaver that didn't take 30mins per half kilo of meat...

in Thailand no one in my wife's family bother's with minced pork larb at home and it's just a treat that we get when we eat out...it would be a treat to know of an effective mincing technique using a cleaver...also an excuse to buy one as there is a splendid selection here where I live...

No special technique really; she puts the slab of meat on a heavy block of wood and starts hacking away in short, quick strokes. The weight of the cleaver seems to do most of the work. She frequently turns the meat so that she is chopping from a different direction, also turns the meat over once in a while. The whole process never seems to take more than a few minutes.

[Thailaw]

When making dishes with what westerners call ground beef or pork, most Thai cooks I've seen prefer to chop their own and the cleaver does that very well. My GF can reduce a piece of pork to finely chopped meat in minutes.

Pre-chopped meats are the quickest to spoil so there is a lot of sense to it.

if you have observed your GF using the cleaver to mince beef maybe you can describe her procedure...I've tried on a couple of occasions and the result was a mishmash but I had used a chefs knife instead, did she tenderize the beef first? Where I live now in rural VN the local market has some nice looking beef but no grinding facilities; haveta go to the nearest big town to the supermarket to get ground beef. It would be nice to know of a sure fire method to mince using a cleaver that didn't take 30mins per half kilo of meat...

in Thailand no one in my wife's family bother's with minced pork larb at home and it's just a treat that we get when we eat out...it would be a treat to know of an effective mincing technique using a cleaver...also an excuse to buy one as there is a splendid selection here where I live...

No special technique really; she puts the slab of meat on a heavy block of wood and starts hacking away in short, quick strokes. The weight of the cleaver seems to do most of the work. She frequently turns the meat so that she is chopping from a different direction, also turns the meat over once in a while. The whole process never seems to take more than a few minutes.

The meat should be sliced into about 1/4" pieces first using a sharp knife, and "repack" the pieces into the original form.. Then, turn the meat so that the slices are horizontal to chopping, and commence. When chopped well, turn the meat to chop it uniformly. The chopping time will be cut in half by cutting it first.