I Need Urgent Advice

[YuryBalyasnikov]

I am sure Iguna ( the building company ) will not be happy if there is a large scale fraud going on there .I will email the Company myself to alert them of this discussion .

btw. I was in Iguana in December. In their office. I showed them all my bills, photos - they just dont care. They said me they r only builders and after condo is finished they dont have a part of managment....

[Thaifan2]

I am sure Iguna ( the building company ) will not be happy if there is a large scale fraud going on there .I will email the Company myself to alert them of this discussion .

btw. I was in Iguana in December. In their office. I showed them all my bills, photos - they just dont care. They said me they r only builders and after condo is finished they dont have a part of managment....

I have sent my email to Mr Haim ( Iguna top dog ) .They will not like the bad publicity ,as it could effect their next project Paradise Park ( next to Park Lane ) . :jap:

[YuryBalyasnikov]

I am sure Iguna ( the building company ) will not be happy if there is a large scale fraud going on there .I will email the Company myself to alert them of this discussion .

btw. I was in Iguana in December. In their office. I showed them all my bills, photos - they just dont care. They said me they r only builders and after condo is finished they dont have a part of managment....

I have sent my email to Mr Haim ( Iguna top dog ) .They will not like the bad publicity ,as it could effect their next project Paradise Park ( next to Park Lane ) . :jap:

Great!!! Please inform us here with his answer

[tropo]

math is not my strong suit but here ya go anyway

I have one 18,000 btu airconditioner

5.3 kwh

if it were old it probably would runfull during high heat and humidity especially since my place has old windows and no insulation above the ceiling.

5 kwh = 5 X 3.5 (govt rate) = 17.5 baht per hour the A/C is on

17.5 X 8 hours = 140 baht per day

140 baht X 30 days = 4,200 baht

4,200 baht per month for only one air conditioner at the government rate of 3.5 baht per kwh

the 5.3 kwh is from Daikens website and is also labeled to the unit.

FT50FVM / R50BV1

Cooling

5.30 kW, 18,090 Btu/h

is my math correct??

Just wondering for myself. May have to check my meter also.

I believe you are on the right track.

His first 4 bills were correct.

The last digit on the meter in NOT a fraction of a kilowatt hour, it is a full kilowatt hour. I'm surprised no one pulled him up on this. In fact his Jan - April bills were incorrect and he should have been charged 10 fold more.

1st bill: 320 kwH (September)

2nd bill: 414 kwH (October)

3rd bill: 484 kwH (November)

4th bill: 607 kwH (December)

5th bill: 42 kwH - should have been billed for 427 kwH (January)

6th bill: 72 kwH - should have been billed for 720 kwH (February)

7th bill: 60 kwH - should have been billed for 600 kwH (March)

8th bill: 91 kwH - should have been billed for 913 kwH (April)

9th bill: 1062 kwH (May) - They started reading the meter correctly again.

He should have been charged a total of 18,624 baht from Jan - April, but was only charged 1,855. He had a discount of 16,773 baht over these months.

These bills are consistent with running an inefficient air conditioner all night in a 2 bedroom apartment.

As Russians they probably run the air conditioner at a low setting.

For comparative purposes, I rent a 2 bedroom townhouse (billed directly by electric company and I can see my own meter). I use the air conditioner at night only on a setting of 27C. My daily electricity usage is between 15 and 20 kwH per day. That's between 450 and 600 kwH per month.

If I set my air conditioner much lower my electricity usage would be much higher and I'd be willing to bet that the Russian couple set theirs below 25C and probably at about 22C. Couple that with an inefficient unit in a badly sealed room with the compressor running most of the time and the OP's electricity usage above is not surprising at all.

(I had an inefficient unit in the last place I stayed and I had bills going over 700 KwH for the hot months)

Having had a discount of 16,773 baht for Jan - April I would suggest the OP keeps quiet about this before they discover the error. The discount will more than compensate for the inefficient air conditioning unit over the previous 9 months). The larger bills for April and May are consistent with the air con unit deteriorating and 2 hot months. For the next 3 months (which will be hot) I would suggest they buy a couple of fans and leave the air conditioning off at night.

The 7 baht per KwH just makes the problem seem a lot worse but this is common in rental apartments.

Edited May 22, 2011 by tropo

[tropo]

Having looked at your bills again ,yes they made a mistake or possibly scammed you .Your bill above should have been for 106 units ,making it B742 and not B7,000 +

Exactly.

Wrong! As per my post above, the 1062 kwH above is correct.

It is absolutely impossible to run an inefficient air conditioner every night in the hot season for only 106 kwH per month. That's absurd.

The OP's bill has gone up by about 150 kwH over the previous month, which is consistent with the weather getting hotter and an already malfunctioning air con unit deteriorating further.

The electric meters do not have decimal points. The last digit is a full kwH.

To anyone who has a meter - just go and look at it.

(To the OP: I'll bet you 10,000 baht on this)

Let's hope the OP comes to his senses before he makes a fool of himself and/or wastes money on lawyers.

Edited May 22, 2011 by tropo

[kdc1899]

Having looked at your bills again ,yes they made a mistake or possibly scammed you .Your bill above should have been for 106 units ,making it B742 and not B7,000 +

Exactly.

Wrong! As per my post above, the 1062 kwH above is correct.

It is absolutely impossible to run an inefficient air conditioner every night in the hot season for only 106 kwH per month.

It has gone up by about 150 kwH over the previous month, which is consistent with the weather getting hotter and possibly the air con unit deteriorating.

The electric meters do not have decimal points. The last digit is a full kwH.

To anyone who has a meter - just go and look at it.

Just looking at it from any angle I cant see how a monthly electric bill could be 742 baht. Only 371 baht at the government rate.

That's like 12 U.S. dollars for a monthly electric bill.

I didn't even need to do all my previous "assumptions" to know the OP is up to something here.

He needs to be careful with these public claims of fraud.

[tropo]

Just looking at it from any angle I cant see how a monthly electric bill could be 742 baht. Only 371 baht at the government rate.

That's like 12 U.S. dollars for a monthly electric bill.

I didn't even need to do all my previous "assumptions" to know the OP is up to something here.

He needs to be careful with these public claims of fraud.

The actual government rate is not a fixed rate. It's a sliding scale which goes up with usage.

My last 3 bills averaged 3.60, 3.66 and 3.85 baht per KwH (after the 7% tax).

[kdc1899]

Just looking at it from any angle I cant see how a monthly electric bill could be 742 baht. Only 371 baht at the government rate.

That's like 12 U.S. dollars for a monthly electric bill.

I didn't even need to do all my previous "assumptions" to know the OP is up to something here.

He needs to be careful with these public claims of fraud.

The actual government rate is not a fixed rate. It's a sliding scale which goes up with usage.

My last 3 bills averaged 3.60, 3.66 and 3.85 baht per KwH (after the 7% tax).

Thank God it's not a 14% tax.......

[endure]

If they missread his meter ,then they did so for both readings (start and finish ),so it works out a right reading in the end

No it doesn't. If his meter moves from 200.0KWH to 210.0KWH he's used 10KWH. If they ignore the decimal point (which appears to be what the problem is) they'll be charging him 2100-2000KWH which is 100KWH, 10 times the amount of electricity that he's actually used.

[tropo]

Here's a calculation which may shine some light on the OP's predicament.

I'm running a Mitsubishi Slim air conditioning unit with a capacity from 1.51 (min) - 6.93 kW (max)

Let's say, for example I'm running it at the lowest possible consumption level for 8 hours per night: 1.51 kW x 8 = 12.08 kWH per night = 362.4 kWH per month.

Let's say, for example, I'm running it at a higher level of about 4 kW for 8 hours per night assuming the compressor is running most of the time: 4 x 8 = 32 kWH per night = 960 kWH per month.

My unit is quite large, but even assuming the OP's unit is smaller, if it is not running well and the compressor is overworking the OP's electricity usage is not surprising at all.

Edited May 22, 2011 by sbk

[gguy]

Sorry about your problems.

You must remember you are living in Thailand not FARANGLAND.

In Thailand, only Thais have rights.

In Thailand, the farang is only slightly above the local soi dog.

[YuryBalyasnikov]

tropo

Sorry, i was really thinkng few minutes how to explain u smth.

But,hey, ok last try

Look at this phote of the meter. Its another angle

There r 4 numbers in one box. They r KWatts. Its even written above. And there is a small number in another box. It is 1/10 kWt. On some meters its even marked red. To make it different.

And for all other ur calculations....Education is not ur power side.Keep living in MATRIX.

Edited May 23, 2011 by YuryBalyasnikov

[YuryBalyasnikov]

Most of the posts in this thread makes me scary. I can understand, that most of Thai people dont have enought money to pay for their education, but u....?

I couldnt imagine that some of u cant even read the meter right.

And the way u trying to prove me that 2+2=50, just because it was so for u for years - its just OMG.

I was living in Russia, USA, Italy, France. And everywhere in the world kWt=kWt

Yes, the price may differ. But not so much.

For example:

1. USA

http://www.eia.doe.g...table5_6_a.html

13 cents per Kwat avarage.

2. Russia

10 cents per kWt

And so on.

My avarage bill in USA for electricity was 50$. But i was living in 140 qms condo.

In russia i was paying ~100$ in 3 month.

If u paying thousands bath bills here - dont be mad on me. Go and check ur meter. Start asking questions. I dont really think that i am the only "lucker" here.

Edited May 23, 2011 by YuryBalyasnikov

[tropo]

tropo

Sorry, i was really thinkng few minutes how to explain u smth.

But,hey, ok last try

Look at this phote of the meter. Its another angle

There r 4 numbers in one box. They r KWatts. Its even written above. And there is a small number in another box. It is 1/10 kWt. On some meters its even marked red. To make it different.

And for all other ur calculations....Education is not ur power side.Keep living in MATRIX.

You're asking for advice, but instead you choose to insult people.

I think you are the uneducated person here. I already bet you 10,000 baht - how about taking me up on that if you're so certain. PM me on that - you could make some money)

Now here is an exercise to challenge you. If indeed that meter only has 4 whole digits, then it would turn the clock at 10,000 kwH.

If that was true, a typical user (such as my self) would turn the clock in just 20 months. That's absurd.

It's also absurd that you think your power usage is genuinely under 100 kWH per month when you claim to be using a inefficient air conditioning unit each and every night.

I can't wait to see the look on your face when you find out you need to pay an additional 16,000 baht for being undercharged from January to April along with fees to hire your lawyer.

[YuryBalyasnikov]

tropo

Sorry, i was really thinkng few minutes how to explain u smth.

But,hey, ok last try

Look at this phote of the meter. Its another angle

There r 4 numbers in one box. They r KWatts. Its even written above. And there is a small number in another box. It is 1/10 kWt. On some meters its even marked red. To make it different.

And for all other ur calculations....Education is not ur power side.Keep living in MATRIX.

You're asking for advice, but instead you choose to insult people.

I think you are the uneducated person here. I already bet you 10,000 baht - how about taking me up on that if you're so certain. PM me on that - you could make some money)

Now here is an exercise to challenge you. If indeed that meter only has 4 whole digits, then it would turn the clock at 10,000 kwH.

If that was true, a typical user (such as my self) would turn the clock in just 20 months. That's absurd.

It's also absurd that you think your power usage is genuinely under 100 kWH per month when you claim to be using a inefficient air conditioning unit each and every night.

I can't wait to see the look on your face when you find out you need to pay an additional 16,000 baht for being undercharged from January to April along with fees to hire your lawyer.

Yes, every 10 000 kWth, and what? In your world(where u using thousands kWth per month) its 100000 kWt. Whats ur point?

Sorry. Iam not a gambler. Cant teach u math and phisic too (

If u THINK u using hundreds(or even thousands) kWth per month - be my guest.

P.S. And it was u first to insult.

P.S.S. Energy is cheap. Thats why everyone using it. In Thailand its more expansive, but its still cheap. Dont try to sell me it for a gold price )

Edited May 23, 2011 by YuryBalyasnikov

[tropo]

Yes, every 10 000 kWth, and what? In your world(where u using thousands kWth per month) its 100000 kWt. Whats ur point?

Sorry. Iam not a gambler. Cant teach u math and phisic too (

If u THINK u using hundred(or even thousands) kWth per month - be my guest.

You don't gamble? If you were certain you were correct you wouldn't be gambling, would you?

They don't use 1/10 units on meters here:

Here's my meter:

Here's my most recent bill:

I'll guarantee you the last digit on this meter (your pic) is a whole kWH and not a fraction.

How about you give us the current reading for this meter which you said was installed in January so I can prove you wrong.

Do you seriously want us to believe that your entire electric bill from January to May is only 392.7 kWH and not 3927 kWH. 2749 baht for 5 months? You really are deluded.

Edited May 23, 2011 by tropo

[tropo]

P.S. And it was u first to insult.

How so? Is it considered an insult in Russia to point our a person's errors?

[vermut12]

Obviously this kind of scam has been going for quite a while. Here is a post with exactly the same issue from july last year.

And for those of you who cannot read the meter here is a good instruction If you are lazy to go and read I will quote it here: "Write down the five numbers shown from left to right, ignoring the last number(s) which may be in red".

Edited May 23, 2011 by vermut12

[tropo]

Most of the posts in this thread makes me scary. I can understand, that most of Thai people dont have enought money to pay for their education, but u....?

I couldnt imagine that some of u cant even read the meter right.

And the way u trying to prove me that 2+2=50, just because it was so for u for years - its just OMG.

I was living in Russia, USA, Italy, France. And everywhere in the world kWt=kWt

Yes, the price may differ. But not so much.

For example:

1. USA

http://www.eia.doe.g...table5_6_a.html

13 cents per Kwat avarage.

2. Russia

10 cents per kWt

And so on.

My avarage bill in USA for electricity was 50$. But i was living in 140 qms condo.

In russia i was paying ~100$ in 3 month.

If u paying thousands bath bills here - dont be mad on me. Go and check ur meter. Start asking questions. I dont really think that i am the only "lucker" here.

You're not making any sense at all.

No one is talking about thousands. In your case we are talking about one thousand, but mostly in the 400 - 1000 range. Your last bill is caused because you have a bad air-conditioning unit (your own admission) where the compressor is staying on all the time.

Don't make ridiculous exaggerations in an attempt to prove your wrong point. My meter is read by the electric company, so there's no error in interpretation, is there? They cannot read decimal points because there are none - how simple is that?

[YuryBalyasnikov]

Obviously this kind of scam has been going for quite a while. Here is a post with exactly the same issue not from july last year.

And for those of you who cannot read the meter here is a good instruction If you are lazy to go and read I am will quote it here: "Write down the five numbers shown from left to right, ignoring the last number(s) which may be in red".

Thank u for the links! Hope it will help someone.

[tropo]

Obviously this kind of scam has been going for quite a while. Here is a post with exactly the same issue not from july last year.

And for those of you who cannot read the meter here is a good instruction If you are lazy to go and read I am will quote it here: "Write down the five numbers shown from left to right, ignoring the last number(s) which may be in red".

Thank u for the links! Hope it will help someone.

It won't, because that meter is exactly the same as yours. It only shows whole units.

It's a 1998 version of mine.

I'm still waiting for an up to date photo of your new meter that was installed in January, to see how many kWH it has clocked up. You've posted a lot of photos and scans, how about posting that one photo which will solve the case.

Edited May 23, 2011 by tropo

[YuryBalyasnikov]

Obviously this kind of scam has been going for quite a while. Here is a post with exactly the same issue not from july last year.

And for those of you who cannot read the meter here is a good instruction If you are lazy to go and read I am will quote it here: "Write down the five numbers shown from left to right, ignoring the last number(s) which may be in red".

Thank u for the links! Hope it will help someone.

It won't, because that meter is exactly the same as yours. It only shows whole units.

It's a 1998 version of mine.

I'm still waiting for an up to date photos of your new meter that was installed in January, to see how many kWH it has clocked up. You've posted a lot of photos and scans, how about posting that one photo which will solve the case.

Will add this photo today. After my meeting with the lawer. We will ask managment to open door for the meters.

But as i said before - there will be nearly 0400.0 kWth

[YuryBalyasnikov]

http://www.holleymeter.com/en/products_single.php?id=3

This is your meter model. Look and read carefully.

[tropo]

Fair enough. If it reads only just over 400 kWH you will have my sincerest apologies, but I put my money on over 4000 kWH.You'll then be forced to fork out an additonal 16,000 to cover the shortfall from Jan - April.

Edited May 23, 2011 by tropo

[tropo]

http://www.holleymet...single.php?id=3

This is your meter model. Look and read carefully.

Did you not look and read my meter carefully?

Here is it again:

There is a "1" clearly marked over the last digit indicating that these digits correspond to whole kilowatt hours.

The last digit on the meter in the pic you posted is clearly bright red.

You're really grasping at straws here.

Obviously a meter can be calibrated for individual needs and the Provincial Electricity Authority in Thailand doesn't read 10ths of kWh.

[YuryBalyasnikov]

http://www.holleymet...single.php?id=3

This is your meter model. Look and read carefully.

Did you not look and read my meter carefully?

Here is it again:

There is a "1" clearly marked over the last digit indicating that these digits correspond to whole kilowatt hours.

The last digit on the meter in the pic you posted is clearly bright red.

You're really grasping at straws here.

Obviously a meter can be calibrated for individual needs and the Provincial Electricity Authority in Thailand doesn't read 10ths of kWh.

Ur last number have small marks from the right. It meanы its not Integer. Its 1/10 of the number.Maybe its not red for u, but this is the very same model. And with very same meaning.

Edited May 23, 2011 by YuryBalyasnikov

[YuryBalyasnikov]

Obviously this kind of scam has been going for quite a while. Here is a post with exactly the same issue from july last year.

And for those of you who cannot read the meter here is a good instruction If you are lazy to go and read I will quote it here: "Write down the five numbers shown from left to right, ignoring the last number(s) WHICH MAY BE in red".

Once again:

Doesnt matter what meter u have - just follow instruction.

Edited May 23, 2011 by YuryBalyasnikov

[tropo]

Ur last number have small marks from the right. It meanы its not Integer. Its 1/10 of the number.Maybe its not red for u, but this is the very same model. And with very same meaning.

Each digit is clearly marked as such:

100000, 10000, 1000, 100, 10, 1

And you're still trying to say that the last digit is not "1" but "1/10"... because of little markings on the side?

Surely you can't be serious?

You're basically saying that my electric bills are overcharged by the electric company by a factor of 10? I should be paying around 200 baht per month, or around 2000 baht per year (some bills in the cooler season could be around 100)?

I now see only one problem. You have difficulty admitting you are wrong.

Please post the photo later, but I doubt you will as you are clearly wrong and you won't want to post evidence now that you've really stuck your foot in it.

Edited May 23, 2011 by tropo

[gmac]

Sent you a PM.

[YuryBalyasnikov]

http://www.alibaba.com/product-gs/424697357/DD28_electric_energy_meter.html

This is my new meter. Look at the picture.