Thai Police Suspect They Have Found Bodies Of 169 Missing Red-Shirts

[chooka]

Buried? In that case they would have to be Christians or Muslims.

Regardless of thier religious beliefs to simply just dump bodies into a mass grave is extreemly disturbing and totally against international standards. It has shown total disrepect for the deceased and thier families. It will probally be found that they were 169 illeagal immigrants who died from natural causes and without identification. (John Does) and the 169 missing redshirts will remain on the missing persons list. What I find unusual is why not a single one of the missing 169 redshirts has made contact with family. You would think that at least 1 (ONE) had been located.

Edited August 19, 2011 by chooka

[random]

Former deputy PM Suthep says 165 bodies in Rayong are unclaimed bodies transf. from Chumphon and not related to missing 51 red-shirts /TAN_Network

Oh well problem solved, the bastion of truth has spoken

[DP25]

597,500 bullets were taken out of army arsenals and 479,577 returned meaning 117,923 bullets were fired

Thats a summation from the unmentionable source in March of what was reported in parliament

Your assumption that 117,923 bullets were fired is incorrect. An unknown percentage could have been simply lost (it happens), stolen from dead and injured soldiers, or purloined by the troops for later sale. 5.56mm are also called .223 when used in civilian hunting rifles, an excellent round for mid-sized game (or men).

Given what happened during the conflict I wouldn't be surprised some disappeared. During the first clash in Ratdamnern, the one where the commander was assassinated by a sniper, the military was pushed back and they abandoned some of their vehicles. At other points soldiers were dragged from their vehicles and beaten. Reds at one point captured a huge stash of weapons which was displayed on tv, and they supposedly gave everything back, but who knows what else was taken. Soldiers themselves could have kept it or sold it. All throughout the conflict there were opportunities for weapons and ammo to disappear.

[OzMick]

597,500 bullets were taken out of army arsenals and 479,577 returned meaning 117,923 bullets were fired

Thats a summation from the unmentionable source in March of what was reported in parliament

Your assumption that 117,923 bullets were fired is incorrect. An unknown percentage could have been simply lost (it happens), stolen from dead and injured soldiers, or purloined by the troops for later sale. 5.56mm are also called .223 when used in civilian hunting rifles, an excellent round for mid-sized game (or men).

Thats not my assumption. It is what the officer reported in parliament. Im sure they wouldnt want MPs thinking say 50K just disappeared. By the way, it was a change from earlier statements that only rubber bullets and buckshot were used, whihc is why many people found the 100K number staggering. Also only 400 odd sniper bullets out of 3000 issued were returned

Many people may be staggered, but only because they have no experience of the statistics of combat. Hundreds of rounds fired per person hit is quite normal, and even higher figures expected for combat inexperienced and conscript troops. "Green" troops often have an overwhelming reluctance to actually shoot another person and will aim off - that is why they train with human silhouette targets, to try to overcome this. There is record from the American civil war of a charge into a point-blank fusillade, where not one person was hit - all the defenders had fired high.

Hard to believe? Try researching the number of bullets sent to VN, and compare that to the inflated kill claim. That will stagger you.

[whybother]

Does anyone have any links to reports of there being 169 missing red shirt protesters?

[chooka]

Former deputy PM Suthep says 165 bodies in Rayong are unclaimed bodies transf. from Chumphon and not related to missing 51 red-shirts /TAN_Network

Oh very clear now. Where did I put my COINCIDENCE stamp, dam_n I left it in Chiangmai.

[SICHONSTEVE]

Two men brought in 169 bodies ... and no one asked any questions?

I want to know why none of 169 families have bothered to ask questions about their missing relatives whereabouts for 1 year!!! In Argentina they held daily protest vigils in order to establish what had happened to "the disappeared". This doesn't sound right to me - if the whereabouts of say 2 or 3 missing people was unknown then MAYBE it wouldn't get reported in the news. But 169 all of a sudden, doesn't seem plausible to me!!!!

Another thing - why would ALL of the bodies suddenly materialise in 2 temples in Ranong!!!! It has been reported that 2 charity workers brought the bodies to the temples and the monks buried them without even the hint of a question as to why there was such a large number of deaths all of a sudden (no funeral rights were given I presume).

Maybe the monks were told that there had been a local breakout of the bubonic plague!!! I can just visualise them bringing the bodies in through the streets on open topped waggons with the fog swirling around them at midnight!!!

The whole thing sounds like a hoax to me but I can't see how and why someone would pull such an elaborate hoax and for what purpose!!! Interesting to see how this progresses .

Erm, my children have gone missing during a protest, I fear they have been killed by the army, I know what I will do about this, i will hold a protest, oh no, wait, that would be foolish

I think you should grow up!!!

You shouldn't be trivialising on matters such as this!!!

[SICHONSTEVE]

The whole thing sounds like a hoax to me but I can't see how and why someone would pull such an elaborate hoax and for what purpose!!! Interesting to see how this progresses .

It's seems clear what some people would gain out of it. Any threat to Thaksin returning and getting his billions back has to be destroyed.

How would this help Thaksin????

[dindong]

The police knew it but only acted when the government changed.

Just another "cover up" to add to the growing list of the Dems collection of corruption. The country is well rid of them.

Exactly. The demos were corrupt, beyond imagination. They were there strictly to enforce the wishes of the military, who are corrupt, fat, lazy, greedy lying pigs, out to enrich themselves, gain more power, and deepen their already swollen pockets. Abhisit never made a decision without consulting a general or one of the military's proxies. Why do you suppose he got so little done? Why do you suppose he did so little for the "people"?

At least he wasn't corrupt like the other lot.

They may have given to the people but they took x100 for themselves.Just substitute any of their names to the above adjectives and you start to come close to the truth.

[bubba]

The whole thing sounds like a hoax to me but I can't see how and why someone would pull such an elaborate hoax and for what purpose!!! Interesting to see how this progresses .

It's seems clear what some people would gain out of it. Any threat to Thaksin returning and getting his billions back has to be destroyed.

How would this help Thaksin????

You mean how would implicating the past government to completely discredit them, indite them for crimes of humanity, cause the dissolution and banning of the Democrat party help Thaksin? Or just the part where it would give him a very satisfied sense of revenge?

I would guess that the fact that Thaksin's lawyer. Robert Amsterdam, broke this in his Facebook page yesterday speaks something regarding Thaksin's interest in this.

Edited August 19, 2011 by bubba

[random]

Two men brought in 169 bodies ... and no one asked any questions?

I want to know why none of 169 families have bothered to ask questions about their missing relatives whereabouts for 1 year!!! In Argentina they held daily protest vigils in order to establish what had happened to "the disappeared". This doesn't sound right to me - if the whereabouts of say 2 or 3 missing people was unknown then MAYBE it wouldn't get reported in the news. But 169 all of a sudden, doesn't seem plausible to me!!!!

Another thing - why would ALL of the bodies suddenly materialise in 2 temples in Ranong!!!! It has been reported that 2 charity workers brought the bodies to the temples and the monks buried them without even the hint of a question as to why there was such a large number of deaths all of a sudden (no funeral rights were given I presume).

Maybe the monks were told that there had been a local breakout of the bubonic plague!!! I can just visualise them bringing the bodies in through the streets on open topped waggons with the fog swirling around them at midnight!!!

The whole thing sounds like a hoax to me but I can't see how and why someone would pull such an elaborate hoax and for what purpose!!! Interesting to see how this progresses .

Erm, my children have gone missing during a protest, I fear they have been killed by the army, I know what I will do about this, i will hold a protest, oh no, wait, that would be foolish

I think you should grow up!!!

You shouldn't be trivialising on matters such as this!!!

trivializing???? me?

you make a comment that people should protest when their loved ones have disappeared during a protest, feared killed by the government/army, I simply point out the folly in your plan.

I got burned in a burning building, to demonstrate agaisnt fire safety I will go and stand in another burning building. Unbelievable.

people are scared to protest, or rather they were scared under the dems as they knew the consequences, now these people can demonstrate for justice as there is less chance of being killed by the army and buried in an unmarked grave.

Now back to the topic in hand, now treat it seriously please and think through your plans first.

[chooka]

The whole thing sounds like a hoax to me but I can't see how and why someone would pull such an elaborate hoax and for what purpose!!! Interesting to see how this progresses .

It's seems clear what some people would gain out of it. Any threat to Thaksin returning and getting his billions back has to be destroyed.

How would this help Thaksin????

You mean how would implicating the past government to completely discredit them, indite them for crimes of humanity, cause the dissolution and banning of the Democrat party help Thaksin? Or just the part where it would give him a very satisfied sense of revenge?

I would guess that the fact that Thaksin's lawyer. Robert Amsterdam, broke this in his Facebook page yesterday speaks something regarding Thaksin's interest in this.

Ah thaskin and his redshirts at it again. Satire right???

[Jawnie]

Er...uh, they just found them. Patience.

Shouldn't a discovery of bodies of this number (and this recent - allegedly) get the attention of international media? Where are they?

Instead all we've got is local articles with Thailand's finest already pointing fingers.

Another stink. Start getting your exit visas sorted out.

[sbk]

Former deputy PM Suthep says 165 bodies in Rayong are unclaimed bodies transf. from Chumphon and not related to missing 51 red-shirts /TAN_Network

Oh well problem solved, the bastion of truth has spoken

News reports also state there are not 169 missing.

http://www.nationmultimedia.com/home/2010/07/05/national/Sakhon-Nakhon-man-among-26-red-shirts-missing-or-h-30133017.html

So lets try to keep it factual, thanks

[jimbeam1]

It is far to early to comment or speculate.

BUT. If the bodies came from Chumphon, surely it would far better to ship them across the Gulf by boat?

jb1

[bubba]

Ah thaskin and his redshirts at it again. Satire right???

Not intended as satire. But why do you suppose Thaksin's lawyer would be so quick to post this news yesterday - the first post he has made since June? I would assume that he wants to publicize the story. Why?

Here is the link, which was emailed to me this morning before I even saw the TV story:

http://www.facebook.com/notes/robert-amsterdam/mass-grave-of-169-bodies-from-2010-discovered-in-thailand/236295033074348

[phiphidon]

Former deputy PM Suthep says 165 bodies in Rayong are unclaimed bodies transf. from Chumphon and not related to missing 51 red-shirts /TAN_Network

So there's only 51 missing red shirts? Where did the 169 (that conveniently matched the number of bodies) come from?

I don't know - where did you get the idea there were 169 missing red shirts from? And why is Suthep getting involved and why has he got a different number of bodies from everybody else?

[hammered]

Does anyone have any links to reports of there being 169 missing red shirt protesters?

The reds in general claim: 91 people killed and 2,000 people injured and many hundreds missing

I dunno the policy on links so wont post loads but simple google searches bring up reports of people disappearing after being arrested by the army after the May finale followed by disappearances around the country

I think the 169 link is just because that number matches the bodies found and is more likely bad wording or reporting or opportunistic claims. Reality is people did disappear and nobody will know how many. Are these some of them? In time hopefully we will find out. If a provable explanation of why thebodies are there isnt provided it is going to look very black and will likley become an explosive issue in the highly charged poltical atmosphere. I genuinely hope authorities can quickly provide the media with the paperwork to show they are indeed tsunami victims although I am not sure that will happen. If they cant then a truly independent investigation is needed. Mass graves are extremely serious issues and cant just be disappeared. This will also attract world attention as time moves on.

[hammered]

Former deputy PM Suthep says 165 bodies in Rayong are unclaimed bodies transf. from Chumphon and not related to missing 51 red-shirts /TAN_Network

So there's only 51 missing red shirts? Where did the 169 (that conveniently matched the number of bodies) come from?

I don't know - where did you get the idea there were 169 missing red shirts from? And why is Suthep getting involved and why has he got a different number of bodies from everybody else?

The leaked CRES report has Suthep as giving the live fire order

[random]

Former deputy PM Suthep says 165 bodies in Rayong are unclaimed bodies transf. from Chumphon and not related to missing 51 red-shirts /TAN_Network

Oh well problem solved, the bastion of truth has spoken

News reports also state there are not 169 missing.

http://www.nationmul...h-30133017.html

So lets try to keep it factual, thanks

There are so many distortions of truth in this thread yet you choose my post where I make no claim to figures etc

also the link you provide is a link provided by me on either page one or page two of this thread. the fact is that nobody knows how many people are missing, there are figures based on reported missing but nobody knows how accurate they are.

So sadly it is not possible to be factual, the report you quote is from last year, are you aware of any more people being reported missing, how many are being held without charge that families don't know about also, the figures will be cloudy to say the least.

Edited August 19, 2011 by random

[Mosha]

How hard can it be? BIB apply usual level of investigative work when it's a farang. Mass suicide. Case closed back to the tea money collecting.

Edited August 19, 2011 by Mosha

[hardy1943]

The police knew it but only acted when the government changed.

Just another "cover up" to add to the growing list of the Dems collection of corruption. The country is well rid of them.

Clearly not much vision. Perhaps blinkered would be a better sign-in name?Abhisit is renowned as the most anti-corruption PM Thailand has seen for a long time.

This comment is typical of Thai Visa's 95% member attack anything anti their beloved Oxford boy or anything Yellow. Never give the other side a chance or the benefit of the doubt. This is a British Tabloid!

[Just1Voice]

Suthep - One of my favorite's, with quotes that truly define things.

"I don't respect foreigners" - his reply when asked about having international observers for the election.

"We didn't mean to kill anyone. They died when they ran into bullets". I just LOVE that one.

and now he's claiming the bodies found were transferred from Chumphon, and not related to the 51 (???) missing redshirts.

BTW - Chumphon to Rayong is 650km driving. Seems like a Very Long Way to send bodies to be buried. There weren't any temples closer along the coast??

[wlcart]

Amazing Thailand --- Forum.

I suggest people wait a bit until some accusations can become facts.

[webfact]

Army chief advises 'don't speculate' about 169 bodies buried in Rayong

BANGKOK, Aug 19 -- Army chief Gen Prayuth Chan-ocha on Friday urged the public to wait for the result of the investigation, and not to make any premature judgment regarding the 169 bodies found buried in the graveyards of three Buddhist temples in the eastern province of Rayong.

The army chief commented before accompanying Defence Minister Gen Yuthasak Sasiprapa to visit Si Sa Ket to inspect the situation at the Thai-Cambodian border line and gave moral support to the Thai troop stationed at border.

Gen Prayuth said he had learned about the issue from the media and found it 'interesting', but advised the public not to jump to conclusions regarding the origin of the remains.

"Nothing could yet be explained," he cautioned. "Please don't make any premature judgment but wait for the result of the investigation."

If no witnesses or evidence is found, forensic science could be used to identify the bodies and the causes of death.

Royal Thai Police Office of Legal Affairs Commissioner Pol Lt-Gen Santan Chayanon led a team of police to inspect the temples in the eastern province of Rayong after received complaint that there were mass graves at temples in Rayong that buried more than 100 people.

According to Red Shirt Rayong leader Rapin Pranonsatit, the bodies might be missing Red Shirt supporters killed during last year's United Front for Democracy Against Dictatorship (UDD) protest against the Democrat-led government of Abhisit Vejjajiva.

Gen Santan said the police had discovered mass graves at three Rayong temples -- 72 corpses at Wat Klong Ta Kwa, 32 at Wat Samor Prong and 31 at Wat Huai Yang.

According to the abbots of the temples, the bodies were taken to be buried at the graveyards in April 2010 but without documents identifying the cause of the death. A charity foundation from Chumphon had informed the temple of a plan for temporary burial and it was scheduled to retrieve the corpses next year for a mass cremation in order to clear the graveyards.

The abbots said the foundation told them that no relatives had claimed the bodies.

An abbot said he had never seen the condition of the bodies which reportedly were all men, but some witnesses said that they were bones wrapped in white cloth and put inside the coffins.

Gen Santan said the police had impounded all the remains and would examine them to determine if they might be "red-shirt protesters said to have gone missing" during last year's mass rally, which ended in clashes between the protesters and security forces on May 19. (MCOT online news)

-- TNA 2011-08-19

[backtonormal]

597,500 bullets were taken out of army arsenals and 479,577 returned meaning 117,923 bullets were fired

Thats a summation from the unmentionable source in March of what was reported in parliament

Your assumption that 117,923 bullets were fired is incorrect. An unknown percentage could have been simply lost (it happens), stolen from dead and injured soldiers, or purloined by the troops for later sale. 5.56mm are also called .223 when used in civilian hunting rifles, an excellent round for mid-sized game (or men).

Given what happened during the conflict I wouldn't be surprised some disappeared. During the first clash in Ratdamnern, the one where the commander was assassinated by a sniper, the military was pushed back and they abandoned some of their vehicles. At other points soldiers were dragged from their vehicles and beaten. Reds at one point captured a huge stash of weapons which was displayed on tv, and they supposedly gave everything back, but who knows what else was taken. Soldiers themselves could have kept it or sold it. All throughout the conflict there were opportunities for weapons and ammo to disappear.

Ok if your weak excuses for ammo maybe missing. Lets say its 50,000 rounds gone missing. It leaves a lot of bullets to shoot at your own people

[hammered]

"Without documents"

This needs a very open investigation

[ginjag]

LOOK AT THE THREAD HEADLINE.

Now look at the comment of the police--------see the difference ?????????????????/

Gen Santan said the police had impounded all the remains and would examine them to determine if they........... might ,,,,,,,,,,,,,,be "red-shirt protesters said to have gone missing"

In any case why would they mention it, if they had any brains they would say nothing at all--LIKE no comment until any evidence is found to WHO they are, and how they died.

[jimbeam1]

Army chief advises 'don't speculate' about 169 bodies buried in Rayong

BANGKOK, Aug 19 -- Army chief Gen Prayuth Chan-ocha on Friday urged the public to wait for the result of the investigation, and not to make any premature judgment regarding the 169 bodies found buried in the graveyards of three Buddhist temples in the eastern province of Rayong.

The army chief commented before accompanying Defence Minister Gen Yuthasak Sasiprapa to visit Si Sa Ket to inspect the situation at the Thai-Cambodian border line and gave moral support to the Thai troop stationed at border.

Gen Prayuth said he had learned about the issue from the media and found it 'interesting', but advised the public not to jump to conclusions regarding the origin of the remains.

"Nothing could yet be explained," he cautioned. "Please don't make any premature judgment but wait for the result of the investigation."

If no witnesses or evidence is found, forensic science could be used to identify the bodies and the causes of death.

Royal Thai Police Office of Legal Affairs Commissioner Pol Lt-Gen Santan Chayanon led a team of police to inspect the temples in the eastern province of Rayong after received complaint that there were mass graves at temples in Rayong that buried more than 100 people.

According to Red Shirt Rayong leader Rapin Pranonsatit, the bodies might be missing Red Shirt supporters killed during last year's United Front for Democracy Against Dictatorship (UDD) protest against the Democrat-led government of Abhisit Vejjajiva.

Gen Santan said the police had discovered mass graves at three Rayong temples -- 72 corpses at Wat Klong Ta Kwa, 32 at Wat Samor Prong and 31 at Wat Huai Yang.

According to the abbots of the temples, the bodies were taken to be buried at the graveyards in April 2010 but without documents identifying the cause of the death. A charity foundation from Chumphon had informed the temple of a plan for temporary burial and it was scheduled to retrieve the corpses next year for a mass cremation in order to clear the graveyards.

The abbots said the foundation told them that no relatives had claimed the bodies.

An abbot said he had never seen the condition of the bodies which reportedly were all men, but some witnesses said that they were bones wrapped in white cloth and put inside the coffins.

Gen Santan said the police had impounded all the remains and would examine them to determine if they might be "red-shirt protesters said to have gone missing" during last year's mass rally, which ended in clashes between the protesters and security forces on May 19. (MCOT online news)

-- TNA 2011-08-19

Just love the Photo. One looking worried, one very sly, the other tut, tut, this is so tedious, I have so many more important issues to attend?

jb1

[Junglejumbo]

Totally ridiculous chain of events. So can we all turn up at temples with 97 dead buddies and no questions asked?

I have to say that I always suspected that a lot more than 92 people died, which included all the deaths from April 10th until the end of May 2010.

I say this because I was staying next to the Marriott Service Apartment on Sathorn Road (corner of Suan Plu), and the maids came up in the early morning talking about all the dead bodies and commotion in the car park of that service apartment next door. I went down with my friend and counted twenty four bodies that were obvious however we suspected several more under a huge army canvess adjacent to the ones in the open. The army would not permit us to walk in any further.

If my memory serves correct this was on the first night of the violence in May. By 8.30 am when I went down to talk with the manager out of shock and some concerns of hygiene and the smell, all the dead had already been cleared. What made me very suspicious is that I think they only announced 19 dead that night.....which included from everywhere such as Aree, Ratchaprasong, Rama 1 etc. and these dead it seemed had been brought to several hospitals.