Silver In Thailand

[mccw]

Is there sales tax on silver bars in Thailand?

Where is the best / reputable place to buy it? Any where specifically in Bangkok or chiang mai easpecialy would be appreiciated!

What is the standard percentage purity?

And what is the stand mark up on the global spot price?

Thanks very much

(if I were to take some back to UK would I face any customs restrictions on personal or larger amounts?

Cheers

[mccw]

(if anyone of those helpful people from the thread about gold to silver and back again ad infinitum for increasing stack reads this- I'd just like to say thanks very much here as I may b blind but couldn't find that thread again; cheers)

[flying]

Hi mccw

Glad you liked that it was here...

Hope you can use that GSR swapping info to help yourself.

As for Silver in Thailand I am sorry I cannot be of assistance as I do all my silver swapping in the USA.

Hopefully someone will come along who works with Silver n Thailand.

I do believe I have read about VAT in Thailand on silver + it may be harder to move across borders

in quantities....Not that gold is easy

Good Luck to you.

Edited November 22, 2011 by flying

[shepsel]

Every item that has materials and labour added has VAT (Value Added Tax). In many countries that tax is built in to the price and is hidden in the price. Say for an example a manufacturer or workshop purchases 100 baht worth of silver to make a product in Thailand. The products real worth without the material is 93 baht, unless the place where it was purchased adds VAT onto the pice. The manufacturer then designs, casts, and finishes his product and then sells it to the distributor or wholesate for 300 baht for example. His price will either include the VAT of approximately 21 baht, or he will add 21 baht which is VAT to the 300 baht, thus charging 321 baht. The end user in most countries pays the tax without realizing it. If the goods are exported then the VAT is allowed as a refund when the merchandise is leaving the country. In North America sales taxes and the Goods and Services Taxes are added on to the sales ticket price therefore not representing the ticket price.

The only way of avoiding part of the VAT is purchasing items in an underground economy.

[eezergood]

Every item that has materials and labour added has VAT (Value Added Tax). In many countries that tax is built in to the price and is hidden in the price. Say for an example a manufacturer or workshop purchases 100 baht worth of silver to make a product in Thailand. The products real worth without the material is 93 baht, unless the place where it was purchased adds VAT onto the pice. The manufacturer then designs, casts, and finishes his product and then sells it to the distributor or wholesate for 300 baht for example. His price will either include the VAT of approximately 21 baht, or he will add 21 baht which is VAT to the 300 baht, thus charging 321 baht. The end user in most countries pays the tax without realizing it. If the goods are exported then the VAT is allowed as a refund when the merchandise is leaving the country. In North America sales taxes and the Goods and Services Taxes are added on to the sales ticket price therefore not representing the ticket price.

The only way of avoiding part of the VAT is purchasing items in an underground economy.

What like from the Wombles? they are all underground

[Shokdee]

I serendipitously bumped into a long-lost friend at a casino in Burma a while ago, he's a gem. Eventually the conversation got around to the financial crisis and his solution was stashing precious minerals. I mentioned I've been accumulating precious metals, buying gold since it hit 700, I told him I buy "chocolate bars" around Yaowarat. I convert any spare cash into gold but I try not to get caught up in daily price moves, I have placed my trust in cost averaging, I said smugly. Well don't place your trust in junk from Chinatown, even if it makes you feel real good, he laughed. Noticing my puzzled look, he said, follow me. He tipped his head, and we went up to his suite.

As I poured drinks he pulled out a small gold bar and a laptop-sized device. What's that, I asked. Ultrasonic, he replied, and placed the bar in the device. Look, he called out, pointing to the readings, it's not pure gold. What is it?, I asked. He turned to me, I'm not 100% certain. He proceeded to tell me one horror story after the other, until the blood drained from my face - maybe it was the drink. What should I do?, I asked him. Invest in silver, he replied, it has intrinsic value. We chatted til the wee hours, but he had an early flight, so I headed for the door.

I'm still fired up, I admitted after we traded goodbyes. Go play roulette downstairs, he advised, look which way the balls fall, the dealer at table 23 spins a good wheel, play these lucky numbers, and he wrote some number on a piece of paper. Do you know a dealer in Thailand where I can trade 99.99% pure silver? I asked him. Sure, he said, and he wrote that on the piece of paper too. Down on the floor, I hit a winning streak and my chips piled up. But when I cashed out at the counter, I suddenly realized that in the excitement I had lost track of the piece of paper with the lucky numbers on it. If only I could remember.

Where in Thailand do you buy 99.99% pure silver?

[Shokdee]

Opps silly me, I don't have to remember a telephone number if I remember the place. My balls have dropped and I need to figure out my lucky numbers. Well, I'm all out of time, so have a Happy New Year, and for address of my silver dealer, PM Shokdee the Christmas Lottery winning numbers and I'll send it to you, for free.

Mrs. Shokdee: Sun's coming up, like a big bald head, poking up over the grocery store. It's Sharkey's day, it's Sharkey's day today. Sharkey wakes up and Sharkey says: There was this man ... and there was this thread ... and if only I could remember those posts ... I know they're trying to tell me ... something. Nobody knows him, nobody knows his name. Deep in the heart of darkest America, "home of the brave". Ha ha heehee. Listen to my heart beat. And the little girls sing: oooh eeee. Paging Mr. Shokdee. White courtesy telephone please.

[mccw]

Every item that has materials and labour added has VAT (Value Added Tax). In many countries that tax is built in to the price and is hidden in the price. Say for an example a manufacturer or workshop purchases 100 baht worth of silver to make a product in Thailand. The products real worth without the material is 93 baht, unless the place where it was purchased adds VAT onto the pice. The manufacturer then designs, casts, and finishes his product and then sells it to the distributor or wholesate for 300 baht for example. His price will either include the VAT of approximately 21 baht, or he will add 21 baht which is VAT to the 300 baht, thus charging 321 baht. The end user in most countries pays the tax without realizing it. If the goods are exported then the VAT is allowed as a refund when the merchandise is leaving the country. In North America sales taxes and the Goods and Services Taxes are added on to the sales ticket price therefore not representing the ticket price.

The only way of avoiding part of the VAT is purchasing items in an underground economy.

Thanks for taking your time to post; however already understood how VAT works. The reason I ask is that investment gold bullion in the UK is free from VAT and is only subject to the dealers mark up over the spot price. Where as silver bullion is not exempt.

I've never brought gold in Thailand but by the looks of the boards it's traded at just a hundred bht spread eitherway from the spot with no sales tax? I'm Asking if anyone experience to buy and sell silver and know if VAT is added at the point of purchase and if so at what rate?

Regards to the gambling man; I get your point; but personally I'd rather take considered risks and increase my wealth than leave money sat in a bank for them to gamble with while paying me a pittance.

[mccw]

Also I'd be prepared to wager that the big chain gold shops wouldn't stitch you up because loss of reputation would ruin their business. I'll propably inquire with them as a first point of call; but right now I'm in uk and was interested to see what information I might garner in the mean time.

Here is a link to a reputable uk dealer incase you are interested to see and notice the VAT situation I am talking about. Also note that 'Britania' gold coins are considered legal tender in the UK and are there for free from capital gains tax; where as gold bars are not!

[mccw]

www.goldline.co.uk

[mccw]

For the forums information Baird & co uk class Thai silver bullion as scrap (roughly £120 per kilo under spot) I expect it's the same for other dealers / smelters.

[fritter1970]

Both gold and silver bullion are tax exempt in Australia.

I suggest opening an account with the Perth Mint Depository Program (PMDP) if you are intending to purchase more than $50,000 USD worth of gold and silver.

Otherwise there is the Perth Mint Certificate Program (PMCP) where you purchase gold or silver bullion certificates through licensed dealers for, what I believe, are purchases of $5000 USD or more.

If in the future you wish to collect your bullion from the Perth Mint then you are able to take it out of the country with no penalty whatsoever.

[gregb]

There is no issue over whether silver bullion carries a VAT tax in Thailand. It does. Full stop.

The only thing anyone has ever had disagreements over on this forum is:

1) Does importing silver coins with a face value into Thailand carry VAT?

2) Are you allowed to import gold without a permit from the Ministry of Finance?

All the customs officials I've ever spoken with say that the form of silver is irrelevant. There is no country in the world that uses silver coins as a regular currency, there is no exchange booth that will accept coins for Baht in Thailand, and therefore silver is silver and everything is subject to VAT. Some say they think differently, but I can guarantee you that if a customs official says you must pay VAT, you must pay VAT. Trying to use the argument of "its a coin" will get you nowhere.

So yes, all silver is taxed with VAT. Full stop. You might get lucky importing some kinds through the airport in some circumstances, but don't count on it.

As for importing gold, there is no problem importing a small amount of gold for your personal holdings via the airport. Importing a large amount of gold through a customs agency will likely be viewed as an attempt to distribute and require an import permit. That is about the only statement that seems to encompass the entire experience of the people on TV who have tried this.

As for purchasing silver, the only company that really tries to make a market for silver (i.e. will both sell it to you and buy it back from you) that I am aware of it Bangkok Assay. They typically sell silver shot in 1kg bags, but will melt it down into bars for you for a small fee. Silver is not a very fungible metal in Thailand, mostly due to the thinly traded market, the VAT which is lost on every purchase, and the large buy/sell spread.

It is much more useful as an investment in North America. Gold is the metal to own in Asia.

Edit:

Forgot to answer your other questions. VAT in Thailand is currently 7%. There is talk of raising it to 10%. It is added at the point of purchase.

I had a fire assay of the silver shot sold at Bangkok Assay done in the states. It came back as 99.82%. So slightly under the 99.9% they advertise. But given that they'll buy it back from you anyway, it is not a serious problem.

Edited November 22, 2011 by gregb

[mazd2]

There is no issue over whether silver bullion carries a VAT tax in Thailand. It does. Full stop.

The only thing anyone has ever had disagreements over on this forum is:

1) Does importing silver coins with a face value into Thailand carry VAT?

2) Are you allowed to import gold without a permit from the Ministry of Finance?

All the customs officials I've ever spoken with say that the form of silver is irrelevant. There is no country in the world that uses silver coins as a regular currency, there is no exchange booth that will accept coins for Baht in Thailand, and therefore silver is silver and everything is subject to VAT. Some say they think differently, but I can guarantee you that if a customs official says you must pay VAT, you must pay VAT. Trying to use the argument of "its a coin" will get you nowhere.

So yes, all silver is taxed with VAT. Full stop. You might get lucky importing some kinds through the airport in some circumstances, but don't count on it.

Greg i've read your post and it sounds like you know what you're talking about, but one thing I fail to understand is:

How can Austrian Silver Philharmonics and American Silver Eagles, which are both legal tender in these respective countries (and I think the austrian philharmonic is legal tender throughout the entire eurozone), be chargeable to VAT/Sales tax by the thai authorities?

[mccw]

Gregb - thank you for the very informative post.

[gregb]

There is no issue over whether silver bullion carries a VAT tax in Thailand. It does. Full stop.

The only thing anyone has ever had disagreements over on this forum is:

1) Does importing silver coins with a face value into Thailand carry VAT?

2) Are you allowed to import gold without a permit from the Ministry of Finance?

All the customs officials I've ever spoken with say that the form of silver is irrelevant. There is no country in the world that uses silver coins as a regular currency, there is no exchange booth that will accept coins for Baht in Thailand, and therefore silver is silver and everything is subject to VAT. Some say they think differently, but I can guarantee you that if a customs official says you must pay VAT, you must pay VAT. Trying to use the argument of "its a coin" will get you nowhere.

So yes, all silver is taxed with VAT. Full stop. You might get lucky importing some kinds through the airport in some circumstances, but don't count on it.

Greg i've read your post and it sounds like you know what you're talking about, but one thing I fail to understand is:

How can Austrian Silver Philharmonics and American Silver Eagles, which are both legal tender in these respective countries (and I think the austrian philharmonic is legal tender throughout the entire eurozone), be chargeable to VAT/Sales tax by the thai authorities?

Leave them in Austria or America and they won't be. Bring them into Thailand, and you have to follow the rules as Thailand sees them. And Thai customs agents don't believe in legal loopholes. Legal tender means something that can be used in day to day commerce. For foreign currency, this means something you could reasonably exchange for Baht in order to buy something.

A silver coin is not legal tender in that sense. Both customs agents I spoke with about this exact issue said this is not a valid argument because it is not a coin that is actually used to purchase goods at face value. It is traded at its silver value, and all silver transactions in Thailand incur VAT.

I am sure the customs agent would happily accept your argument if you sold him the coin at face value. If you aren't willing to do that, your argument is specious, and the Thai customs agents aren't stupid, even though they may be corrupt as hell.

[haveaniceday]

Does Gold in Thailand incur VAT ?