chanchao Posted November 22, 2005 Share Posted November 22, 2005 I think they don't have a clue. And the higher up you go in provincial or T.A.T. management, the less clues they have it seems. Lowly guesthouses and trek- or cooking class organizers seem to have a pretty good handle on what makes Western (or Japanese, etc) tourists excited. But higher up where millions/billions get spent on safari zoos and cable cars to Doi Suthep? I just read the response by the Night Zoo manager.. It was.. rather typical. You start wondering what the feller would need to do to lose his job: An excerpt: ---- Park director Plodprasop Suraswadi called an urgent press conference to say no restaurants will offer wild meats as earlier planned because it would confuse visitors and go against the park's theme of education and animal conservation. He was strongly criticised by the public last week after revealing his idea to offer exotic buffets consisting of zebra, crocodile, giraffe, dog and other exotic fare. "I have not lost face and don't feel embarrassed because I am doing what society wants,' Mr Plodprasop said." Mr Plodprasop hit back at international activists, urging them to look at the activities of their own people which were against conservation. He cited whale hunting and restaurants serving wild animal meats such as the Carnivore in Kenya. "Don't just target and criticise only Thailand,' he said." Mr Plodprasop also denied the exotic menu was part of a marketing campaign to promote the newly-opened park. However, he said, the debate over the last few days had raised the number of park visitors to about 4,000 per day, more than expected. ---- Strange, it didn't seem anyone was criticising Thailand, it seemed they were criticising an incompetent zoo director touting his shop around with an ill-conceived brain-fart.. Points awarded for being very Taksin-esque in his response though. By the way, I know some members live in that general area. 4000 visitors is something like 125 fully loaded VIP buses a day, or like 50 buses and a big stream of cars. Do you see all this traffic headed for the zoo daily? If not, could Mr. Plodprasob be less than truthful? Again, what colorful acts would he need to perform in his zoo to actually have a shot at losing his job? Getting back to tourism in general, it seems so much money is being spent without proper research. Sometimes less really is more when it comes to making actual, real, existing attractions of Chiang Mai more accessible to tourists. It does not require building a Disneyland. It does not require building a billion baht Night Zoo with imported African animals when Thailand has plenty of National Parks with actual wildlife of it's own. THATS what tourists come to see.. Tourists of most nations have excellent zoos at home! Sometimes I think Thailand doesn't need more TATs or other government projects, enterprises or organizations, it just needs one. It desperately needs an 'Authority for Not Messing Up Thailand.go.th. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
george Posted November 22, 2005 Share Posted November 22, 2005 However, he said, the debate over the last few days had raised the number of park visitors to about 4,000 per day, more than expected. Excellent marketing, Khun Chanchai! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
meadish_sweetball Posted November 22, 2005 Share Posted November 22, 2005 When it comes to Western tourists, and probably Japanese, you are right on the mark chanchao, and I think this area is exactly where Mr. Plodprasob does not even have the shadow of a clue. He would do well to hire a Western advisor in the future - if he wants Western tourists, that is... In the eyes of all Westerners I know, he lost face in a major and irreparable way. Even more so when he proved not to be man enough to admit his mistake. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
chanchao Posted November 22, 2005 Author Share Posted November 22, 2005 > He would do well to hire a Western advisor in the future - > if he wants Western tourists, that is... Well, having seen the pricing structure, I honestly don't think he does! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Plus Posted November 22, 2005 Share Posted November 22, 2005 They bet on Chinese tourists, don't they? Especially with exotic meats. I don't want to sound racist, but I expect Chinese to devour anything that moves, without any respect for nature, endangered species or whatever. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sierra01 Posted November 22, 2005 Share Posted November 22, 2005 I've only been to CM zoo once, back in April, I've never seen a more sorry lot of animals, even the Pandas looked pi$$ed off. That and the double pricing means I won't be going again. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ilyushin Posted November 22, 2005 Share Posted November 22, 2005 Answer: No they don't! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
skylar Posted November 22, 2005 Share Posted November 22, 2005 He cited whale hunting and restaurants serving wild animal meats such as the Carnivore in Kenya. Um, Carnivore is a stand-alone restaurant and always has been. Not within a zoo or connected to a wildlife park! How can Old Ploddy possibly compare the two? It would be a bit macabre to view young lions and giraffes cavorting about only to be able to dine on them later... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
KhunMarco Posted November 22, 2005 Share Posted November 22, 2005 He cited whale hunting and restaurants serving wild animal meats such as the Carnivore in Kenya. Um, Carnivore is a stand-alone restaurant and always has been. Not within a zoo or connected to a wildlife park! How can Old Ploddy possibly compare the two? It would be a bit macabre to view young lions and giraffes cavorting about only to be able to dine on them later... <{POST_SNAPBACK}> next move is birdwatching sessions on Doi Inthanon in the morning and free hunting lessons in the afternoon Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gulliver_in_LOS Posted November 22, 2005 Share Posted November 22, 2005 I've only been to CM zoo once, back in April, I've never seen a more sorry lot of animals, even the Pandas looked pi$$ed off. That and the double pricing means I won't be going again. <{POST_SNAPBACK}> YES! WHY THE DOUBLE PRICING FOR FARANGS? Have never seen it anywhere in the world! G Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
johnnyk Posted November 22, 2005 Share Posted November 22, 2005 They bet on Chinese tourists, don't they? Especially with exotic meats. I don't want to sound racist, but I expect Chinese to devour anything that moves, without any respect for nature, endangered species or whatever. <{POST_SNAPBACK}> Endangered species= eat it now, it won't be here much longer! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
johnnyk Posted November 23, 2005 Share Posted November 23, 2005 I don't think they have too many clues either. They throw gobs of money at western marketing/ad agencies to sell Thailand abroad and leave it at that. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ThaiPauly Posted November 23, 2005 Share Posted November 23, 2005 I've only been to CM zoo once, back in April, I've never seen a more sorry lot of animals, even the Pandas looked pi$$ed off. That and the double pricing means I won't be going again. <{POST_SNAPBACK}> I have heard that if ou can prove you are a Chaingmai resident (i.e driving license) then you get charged the same rate as Thais! Or is this complete bullshit? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mobile69 Posted November 23, 2005 Share Posted November 23, 2005 4000 visitors is something like 125 fully loaded VIP buses a day, or like 50 buses and a big stream of cars. Do you see all this traffic headed for the zoo daily? <{POST_SNAPBACK}> And they'd all have to make a u-turn to cross the canal to get to the night safari - that's going to be interesting when they hit their proposed target number of visitors Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
meadish_sweetball Posted November 23, 2005 Share Posted November 23, 2005 If you have a work permit you can get in at the Thai price. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Johpa Posted November 23, 2005 Share Posted November 23, 2005 They bet on Chinese tourists, don't they? Especially with exotic meats. I don't want to sound racist, but I expect Chinese to devour anything that moves, without any respect for nature, endangered species or whatever. <{POST_SNAPBACK}> But of course the financial bet is on the regional tourist. The future of tourism in Thailand is based upon the growth of regional tourism, especially from China. They didn't build this "Safari" park for Farang tourists altough getting a few of them in the door never hurts. This entire investment is aimed at the burgeoning middle class of the PRC who just love this sort of entertainment. In the US these "Safari Parks" are never more than another roadside attraction at best. And not only are these parks geared for where the elite see the future tourist growth, but all these public health campaigns are geared towards the far more conservative East Asian tourist who are not comfortable seeing carousing white men with beer bottle in one hand and young Asian girl on the other hand in public. And as rare as I agree with the Thai elite, I think they are correct in where the growth for tourism lies for the country. If you cut down on the publilc drinking and carousing then you lose some Farangs tourists thereby keeping the price of sex down for the regional tourists Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ajarn Posted November 23, 2005 Share Posted November 23, 2005 If you have a work permit you can get in at the Thai price. <{POST_SNAPBACK}> Where did you read that? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sabaijai Posted November 23, 2005 Share Posted November 23, 2005 They bet on Chinese tourists, don't they? Especially with exotic meats. I don't want to sound racist, but I expect Chinese to devour anything that moves, without any respect for nature, endangered species or whatever. But of course the financial bet is on the regional tourist. The future of tourism in Thailand is based upon the growth of regional tourism, especially from China. They didn't build this "Safari" park for Farang tourists altough getting a few of them in the door never hurts. This entire investment is aimed at the burgeoning middle class of the PRC who just love this sort of entertainment. In the US these "Safari Parks" are never more than another roadside attraction at best. And not only are these parks geared for where the elite see the future tourist growth, but all these public health campaigns are geared towards the far more conservative East Asian tourist who are not comfortable seeing carousing white men with beer bottle in one hand and young Asian girl on the other hand in public. And as rare as I agree with the Thai elite, I think they are correct in where the growth for tourism lies for the country. If you cut down on the publilc drinking and carousing then you lose some Farangs tourists thereby keeping the price of sex down for the regional tourists That about sums it up. Well over half of tourist numbers to Thailand have always been Asian, who also tend to spend more while they're here than western visitors do. To answer Meadish's question, the Thai government does hire western consultants, quite a few. I've done some minor consulting with the ministry of tourism since it was first established, and with Government House when TRT first came to office six years ago. The current minister of tourism (a former ambassador to the US among other jobs) is an intelligent man, but he was given the job more or less as a pre-retirement bonus and has no previous experience in the tourism industry. All the other higher-ups I've met at the MOT are political appointees as well. The MOT's second-in-command, a former pop singer, recently told me that he thought that what Thailand most needed was an attraction like Angkor Wat. When I pointed out that NE Thailand already had 2000+ Angkor-period archaeological states, he pulled out a folder with mockup drawings for what he envisioned: an 80-story replica of the main prang/stupa at Wat Arun, to be built somewhere in the northeast. Then he pulled out a 2nd folder filled with plans and drawings for a linked series of marinas and megaresorts to line the coast all the way from Hua Hin to Chumphon. When he asked my opinion, I said that a lot of visitors come to Thailand to see beaches in a more natural state. He asked me who I was talking about, and I mentioned Europeans, Australians, Americans, etc. He interrupted and said that their most important markets in the present and future were Japan, Taiwan, Korea and China, so he didn't see the lack of natural coast as a problem. The lower-ranking MOT staff, on the other hand, are younger Thais who have a lot of decent ideas but have no voice in policy, as their job is to serve their elders. There are also others consulting at the MOT, including some relatively enlightened Thais from the private sector. We haven't given up, and the minister at least listens to us as if he is considering our concerns. Plenty of other people in Thailand and around the world are concerned about tourism trends and tourism policy in Thailand. Whether as NGOs or individuals, the best they can do is try to raise public awareness through protest, political canvassing, letter-writing, etc. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Loaded Posted November 23, 2005 Share Posted November 23, 2005 Last time I was at CM zoo there only seemed to be one-price-for-all. Don't know what the official policy about farangs paying the same as Thais nor does it seem the people at the gates who enforce the policy. A combination of speaking some Thai, a 5-year Thai driving licence and a work permit usually helps me get the same price. I've noticed that farang escorted by bargirl/hilltribe/Burmese girlfriends often get treated disrepectfully by the officials. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cmsally Posted November 23, 2005 Share Posted November 23, 2005 There's a lot that could be written on this one - but couldn't resist sharing this gem. Had some tourists ask me if I knew what the Mickey & Minnie mouse parade was for. Said I didn't know and thought to myself it was a bit odd. Suddenly realised these mice look very like 2 pandas. They had witnessed the "great panda wedding parade" and had thought it was a Disney parade. Quite frankly couldn't be bothered to explain something as stupid as a panda wedding, so told them they were probably opening a shopping mall. Panda weddings and disney parades are pretty much the same thing anyway; who came up with such a dumb idea anyway! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gulliver_in_LOS Posted November 23, 2005 Share Posted November 23, 2005 (edited) Last time I was at CM zoo there only seemed to be one-price-for-all. <{POST_SNAPBACK}> This is about the extra ticket you need to pay to view the pandas. Below is an excerpt from the Thai airways magazine -------------------------------------- Giant Panda Entrance Fee: Foreigner : Adult 100 Baht, Child 50 Baht Thai : Adult 50 Baht, Child 20 Baht ---------------------------------- In the English version of the official zoo's website only the designed price for foreigners is listed. G Edited November 23, 2005 by Gulliver_in_LOS Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ajarn Posted November 23, 2005 Share Posted November 23, 2005 Last time I was at CM zoo there only seemed to be one-price-for-all. <{POST_SNAPBACK}> This is about the extra ticket you need to pay to view the pandas. Below is an excerpt from the Thai airways magazine -------------------------------------- Giant Panda Entrance Fee: Foreigner : Adult 100 Baht, Child 50 Baht Thai : Adult 50 Baht, Child 20 Baht ---------------------------------- In the English version of the official zoo's website only the designed price for foreigners is listed. G <{POST_SNAPBACK}> The Zoo belongs to the government, right? It's not a private enterprise.... I think the price difference is fair, if based on residency, rather than nationality. Cheaper for the local 'tax-payers'. Foreign residents contribute their fair amount of taxes, too. I don't feel the same way about private companies, like the Croccodile Farm, who have price differences based on Nationality. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sierra01 Posted November 23, 2005 Share Posted November 23, 2005 I've noticed that farang escorted by bargirl/hilltribe/Burmese girlfriends often get treated disrepectfully by the officials. <{POST_SNAPBACK}> What does an off duty bar girl look like, does she look any different to any other Thai girl? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gulliver_in_LOS Posted November 23, 2005 Share Posted November 23, 2005 Last time I was at CM zoo there only seemed to be one-price-for-all. <{POST_SNAPBACK}> This is about the extra ticket you need to pay to view the pandas. Below is an excerpt from the Thai airways magazine -------------------------------------- Giant Panda Entrance Fee: Foreigner : Adult 100 Baht, Child 50 Baht Thai : Adult 50 Baht, Child 20 Baht ---------------------------------- In the English version of the official zoo's website only the designed price for foreigners is listed. G <{POST_SNAPBACK}> The Zoo belongs to the government, right? It's not a private enterprise.... I think the price difference is fair, if based on residency, rather than nationality. Cheaper for the local 'tax-payers'. Foreign residents contribute their fair amount of taxes, too. I don't feel the same way about private companies, like the Croccodile Farm, who have price differences based on Nationality. <{POST_SNAPBACK}> Dear Ajarn, I respect your opinion. However if this is the reason behind it, why is the entrance ticket to the zoo the same for everybody? Furthermore if we extrapolate your argument to all goverment owned companies, shouldn't we have different prices for locals and tourists for public transport, such as buses, subway, trains, etc? Does it make sense? I understand that some sections of society, such as children, students, senior citizens, have the right for a discounted price for some activities, but the standard price is always the same for everyone. JMHO. G Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gulliver_in_LOS Posted November 23, 2005 Share Posted November 23, 2005 (edited) I've noticed that farang escorted by bargirl/hilltribe/Burmese girlfriends often get treated disrepectfully by the officials. <{POST_SNAPBACK}> What does an off duty bar girl look like, does she look any different to any other Thai girl? <{POST_SNAPBACK}> I totally agree with sierra01. How do you know? I am waiting for your reply. If ourselves are judging other people by just their appearances, how can we complain about the Thais (not all of course) looking down at us? Do you like to be seen as a stupid "walking ATM" just because you are a farang? Or do you like to be treated with dignity as a human being? The same applies for any of the people you have mentioned. G Edited November 23, 2005 by Gulliver_in_LOS Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
meadish_sweetball Posted November 23, 2005 Share Posted November 23, 2005 If you have a work permit you can get in at the Thai price. Where did you read that? I didnt read it anywhere - but it's my personal experience from being able to get in at the Thai price with a work permit and speaking nearly accentless Thai, at a national park, at Dusit Zoo and at Dream World (an amusement park) in Bangkok. Maybe the combination of work permit and reasonable Thai is required though; I dont know how many bonus points I get for speaking Thai... In the case of the pandas, I paid the foreigner fee when I went, because I was not working in Thailand back then. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ajarn Posted November 23, 2005 Share Posted November 23, 2005 If you have a work permit you can get in at the Thai price. <{POST_SNAPBACK}> Where did you read that? <{POST_SNAPBACK}> I didnt read it anywhere - but it's my personal experience from being able to get in at the Thai price with a work permit and speaking nearly accentless Thai, at a national park, at Dusit Zoo and at Dream World (an amusement park) in Bangkok. Maybe the combination of work permit and reasonable Thai is required though; I dont know how many bonus points I get for speaking Thai... In the case of the pandas, I paid the foreigner fee when I went, because I was not working in Thailand back then. <{POST_SNAPBACK}> Okay, I thought your post related to the Night Safari, and that it was 'official'... I understand what your saying, though. I also get into National Parks for the Thai price, but the WP is only one way to show that you live here and pay taxes. Normally, simply showing my business card, or just speaking Thai, works for me. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ajarn Posted November 23, 2005 Share Posted November 23, 2005 Last time I was at CM zoo there only seemed to be one-price-for-all. <{POST_SNAPBACK}> This is about the extra ticket you need to pay to view the pandas. Below is an excerpt from the Thai airways magazine -------------------------------------- Giant Panda Entrance Fee: Foreigner : Adult 100 Baht, Child 50 Baht Thai : Adult 50 Baht, Child 20 Baht ---------------------------------- In the English version of the official zoo's website only the designed price for foreigners is listed. G <{POST_SNAPBACK}> The Zoo belongs to the government, right? It's not a private enterprise.... I think the price difference is fair, if based on residency, rather than nationality. Cheaper for the local 'tax-payers'. Foreign residents contribute their fair amount of taxes, too. I don't feel the same way about private companies, like the Croccodile Farm, who have price differences based on Nationality. <{POST_SNAPBACK}> Dear Ajarn, I respect your opinion. However if this is the reason behind it, why is the entrance ticket to the zoo the same for everybody? Furthermore if we extrapolate your argument to all goverment owned companies, shouldn't we have different prices for locals and tourists for public transport, such as buses, subway, trains, etc? Does it make sense? I understand that some sections of society, such as children, students, senior citizens, have the right for a discounted price for some activities, but the standard price is always the same for everyone. JMHO. G <{POST_SNAPBACK}> Where I come from, every government university has different pricing structures, based on residency. One price for in-State residents, one price for in-country residents, and one price (highest) for foreign students... I agree with you that it should be one price for eveyone, but I still can't call the current system unfair. But it would be unfair if they discriminated on the basis on nationality. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ChiangMaiThai Posted November 23, 2005 Share Posted November 23, 2005 By the way, I know some members live in that general area. 4000 visitors is something like 125 fully loaded VIP buses a day, or like 50 buses and a big stream of cars. Do you see all this traffic headed for the zoo daily? If not, could Mr. Plodprasob be less than truthful? Again, what colorful acts would he need to perform in his zoo to actually have a shot at losing his job? I live in the area and I haven't seen a single bus go in there, but it is a night safari and I'm not usually driving by at night. Still, I find 4000 people a day very hard to believe. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ChiangMaiThai Posted November 23, 2005 Share Posted November 23, 2005 I've noticed that farang escorted by bargirl/hilltribe/Burmese girlfriends often get treated disrepectfully by the officials. <{POST_SNAPBACK}> What does an off duty bar girl look like, does she look any different to any other Thai girl? <{POST_SNAPBACK}> I totally agree with sierra01. How do you know? I am waiting for your reply. If ourselves are judging other people by just their appearances, how can we complain about the Thais (not all of course) looking down at us? Do you like to be seen as a stupid "walking ATM" just because you are a farang? Or do you like to be treated with dignity as a human being? The same applies for any of the people you have mentioned. G <{POST_SNAPBACK}> I know that so many farangs like to come here and believe that their new girlfriend looks like all the locals, but sorry, that's often not the case. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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