webfact Posted December 6, 2011 Share Posted December 6, 2011 POLITICS Returning Thaksin's passport 'would be illegal' THE NATION The opposition Democrat Party said yesterday that Foreign Minister Surapong Towichukchaikul's efforts to help former prime minister Thaksin Shinawatra obtain a Thai passport violated the law. The government has no authority to return Thaksin's Thai passport to him as he is a fugitive from justice, said Democrat spokesman Chavanond Intarakomalyasut. The Democrats' revocation of Thaksin's passport was legitimate, but the Pheu Thai-led government's effort to return it to him was illegitimate, Chavanond said. Former foreign minister Kasit Piromya terminated Thaksin's passport in accordance with the ministry's regulations governing the issuance of passports, as the ex-premier had harmed the country, Chavanond said. Thaksin was involved in the protest against the previous government, the spokesman said, and had an arrest warrant against him. The Foreign Ministry cannot issue a passport to a person for whom such a warrant has been issued and who is on the run, said Chavanond, who formerly held the position of secretary to the foreign minister. Article 21 of the 2005 Foreign Ministry regulations clearly states that officials can reject a passport application from any fugitive from a criminal charge, he said. Many other articles of the regulation prohibit officials from issuing a passport to a person like Thaksin, he said. "Like many other fugitives from criminal charges, such as former Kamnan Somchai Kunplume and former minister Wattana Asavahame, Thaksin cannot hold a Thai passport," Chavanond said. "Should the minister ask Somchai and Wattana whether they held Thai passports while fleeing justice?" Surapong will be making a serious political mistake if he issues a passport to Thaksin, Chavanond said, adding that the Democrats would continue to seek Surapong's impeachment over the case, even if he were to lose his position. Surapong said last week that he wanted to return Thaksin's passport to him as a New Year's gift. -- The Nation 2011-12-07 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Buchholz Posted December 6, 2011 Share Posted December 6, 2011 Article 21 of the 2005 Foreign Ministry regulations clearly states that officials can reject a passport application from any fugitive from a criminal charge, he said. How very, very appropriate he's done in by a regulation from his own administration. . Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Soutpeel Posted December 7, 2011 Share Posted December 7, 2011 Article 21 of the 2005 Foreign Ministry regulations clearly states that officials can reject a passport application from any fugitive from a criminal charge, he said. How very, very appropriate he's done in by a regulation from his own administration. . Not really... if this is the exact wording, "can" is not mandatory, in other words officials reserve the right to reject an application, it doesnt say they have to Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
alstaxi Posted December 7, 2011 Share Posted December 7, 2011 Article 21 of the 2005 Foreign Ministry regulations clearly states that officials can reject a passport application from any fugitive from a criminal charge, he said. How very, very appropriate he's done in by a regulation from his own administration. . A shame that the scum will deny he applied for a passport, but very predictable, given all the drama surrounding him. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Buchholz Posted December 7, 2011 Share Posted December 7, 2011 Article 21 of the 2005 Foreign Ministry regulations clearly states that officials can reject a passport application from any fugitive from a criminal charge, he said. How very, very appropriate he's done in by a regulation from his own administration. Not really... if this is the exact wording, "can" is not mandatory, in other words officials reserve the right to reject an application, it doesnt say they have to True, he doesn't follow regulations he signed himself into effect that don't have any wiggle room, eg. returning Royal-awarded medals, so there's no reason to think he would comply with his own regulations that do. . Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SunDaRi Posted December 7, 2011 Share Posted December 7, 2011 I think the translated *can* is "jak" meaning *shall*, makes more sense.. no? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
virtualtraveller Posted December 7, 2011 Share Posted December 7, 2011 Funny how all these lawmakers have such a sketchy understanding or disagreement on the actual application of laws, bottom line is, if someone is running away from a jail sentence, why would you give them a passport. Interestingly too, this article mentioned three of the most high profile corruption case families in present day Thailand - the Shinawatras, the Kunplumes and the Asavahames and funny enough all three are currently in govt running our country (by proxy), all three leaders convicted and on the run. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
hearditallbefore Posted December 7, 2011 Share Posted December 7, 2011 Taking Taksin's passport was "Illegal" and he will eventually have it returned, just a matter of time, and life will go on. Go hide and watch. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Buchholz Posted December 7, 2011 Share Posted December 7, 2011 Taking Taksin's passport was "Illegal" That may be true, however, taking Thaksin's passport was not. . Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
whybother Posted December 7, 2011 Share Posted December 7, 2011 Taking Taksin's passport was "Illegal" and he will eventually have it returned, just a matter of time, and life will go on. Go hide and watch. There was nothing illegal about it. A government can cancel a passport. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
slapout Posted December 7, 2011 Share Posted December 7, 2011 When has legal/illegal ever had influence on the actions of this bunch of clowns and their advisers? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Soutpeel Posted December 7, 2011 Share Posted December 7, 2011 Taking Taksin's passport was "Illegal" and he will eventually have it returned, just a matter of time, and life will go on. Go hide and watch. There was nothing illegal about it. A government can cancel a passport. And conversely they can reinstate it as well, if there was nothing illegal in the previous goverment revoking it, there is nothing to stop the current goverment reinstating it.... give it to him back by all means, it still doesnt make the fugitive status and prison sentence go away... and obviously as a condition of getting his PP back, has to make full disclouse of how many different passports he actually has as well as giving up those citizenships Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
juleschiangrai Posted December 7, 2011 Share Posted December 7, 2011 (edited) Enough Already!!! Edited December 7, 2011 by juleschiangrai Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
whybother Posted December 7, 2011 Share Posted December 7, 2011 Taking Taksin's passport was "Illegal" and he will eventually have it returned, just a matter of time, and life will go on. Go hide and watch. There was nothing illegal about it. A government can cancel a passport. And conversely they can reinstate it as well, if there was nothing illegal in the previous goverment revoking it, there is nothing to stop the current goverment reinstating it.... give it to him back by all means, it still doesnt make the fugitive status and prison sentence go away... and obviously as a condition of getting his PP back, has to make full disclouse of how many different passports he actually has as well as giving up those citizenships Just because it was legal to revoke it does not automatically mean that it is legal to issue a new one. Other laws, as implied in the OP, may make issuing the passport to Thaksin illegal. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
makescents Posted December 7, 2011 Share Posted December 7, 2011 Why is this even a story? The dems clutching at straws trying to stop the inevitable. The country wants him back even if the rest of us don't. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
KKvampire Posted December 7, 2011 Share Posted December 7, 2011 (edited) The "country" wants him back? Well I guess you know the views of the"country" Edited December 7, 2011 by KKvampire Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
groovyc Posted December 7, 2011 Share Posted December 7, 2011 Taking Taksin's passport was "Illegal" and he will eventually have it returned, just a matter of time, and life will go on. Go hide and watch. There was nothing illegal about it. A government can cancel a passport. And conversely they can reinstate it as well, if there was nothing illegal in the previous goverment revoking it, there is nothing to stop the current goverment reinstating it.... give it to him back by all means, it still doesnt make the fugitive status and prison sentence go away... and obviously as a condition of getting his PP back, has to make full disclouse of how many different passports he actually has as well as giving up those citizenships Just because it was legal to revoke it does not automatically mean that it is legal to issue a new one. Other laws, as implied in the OP, may make issuing the passport to Thaksin illegal. Hahaha, classic bickering on TV by people who don't have a clue what they're talking about. at least some have the decency to admit that though. Keep up the entertainment. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
renaissanc Posted December 7, 2011 Share Posted December 7, 2011 Thaksin will get his passport back. The Democrats will impeach Surapong. The government will vote for Surapong and defeat the impeachment. Thaksin will win! Next: the Constitution will be changed. The Democrats will protest. The government will pass the changes. Thaksin will win and return! The Yellow Shirts will demonstrate every day and occupy a section of Bangkok in protest. The Red Shirts will oppose the demonstrators with violence and intimidation. Violence will escalate and escalate. Eventually, someone will have to give way as the capital city will become a kind of battle ground. Will Thaksin give way? ... No. Will the Yellows give way? ... No. ... Stalemate. What will happen then, is anyone's guess, but the country will be dragged down because Thaksin is home-sick and wants his money and power back. Hopefully, Thaksin will lose his snap election next year and return to Dubai for good, taking his cronies with him. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Soutpeel Posted December 7, 2011 Share Posted December 7, 2011 by people who don't have a clue what they're talking about. at least some have the decency to admit that though. Ok so please enlighten us then with your in depth knowlege of this subject then...... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
whybother Posted December 7, 2011 Share Posted December 7, 2011 Just because it was legal to revoke it does not automatically mean that it is legal to issue a new one. Other laws, as implied in the OP, may make issuing the passport to Thaksin illegal. Hahaha, classic bickering on TV by people who don't have a clue what they're talking about. at least some have the decency to admit that though. Keep up the entertainment. What did I say that was wrong? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
fvw53 Posted December 7, 2011 Share Posted December 7, 2011 Nalionality and passport are different issues. He did not loose his Thai nationality and therefore he should be always entitled to a Thai passport valid for 7 days and only valid to travel to Thailand so that he can defend himself in a Thai court. Of course some people may prefer that he cannot return and are for this reason opposed to issue him a passport. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
hammered Posted December 7, 2011 Share Posted December 7, 2011 Why is this even a story? The dems clutching at straws trying to stop the inevitable. The country wants him back even if the rest of us don't. There is absolutely no doubt the people of the country will take him back to end the intra-elite war and enable other changes vital for the long term stability relating to inequality to occur in a more balanced and less polticised manner. There is little doubt that his elite enemies and those currently in control of their managed party will do anything to prevent this. To do so they need to keep people scared of armageddon if Thaksin returns. However as that means they need to get more and more authoritarian to achieve this level of fear, it will create more and more tension with their own more liberal minded allies. Political reality. Right now excepting some of Tuls nutters it is easy to talk to ex-Pad supporters who are quit eopen to having Thaksin come back (under certain conditions) and that shows a fair deal of movement Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Skywalker69 Posted December 7, 2011 Share Posted December 7, 2011 A passport is a traveldocument. Thaksin don´t need a Thai passport as he has at least 3 passports from other countries so he is free to travel. He is even free to return to Thailand, maby he have to apply for a Thai visa, him beeing a Montenegrian. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Buchholz Posted December 7, 2011 Share Posted December 7, 2011 A passport is a traveldocument. Thaksin don´t need a Thai passport as he has at least 3 passports from other countries so he is free to travel. He is even free to return to Thailand, maby he have to apply for a Thai visa, him beeing a Montenegrian. Using his Ugandan diplomatic passport eliminates the need for a visa. . Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BigBikeBKK Posted December 7, 2011 Share Posted December 7, 2011 Thaksin will get his passport back. The Democrats will impeach Surapong. The government will vote for Surapong and defeat the impeachment. Thaksin will win! Next: the Constitution will be changed. The Democrats will protest. The government will pass the changes. Thaksin will win and return! The Yellow Shirts will demonstrate every day and occupy a section of Bangkok in protest. The Red Shirts will oppose the demonstrators with violence and intimidation. Violence will escalate and escalate. Eventually, someone will have to give way as the capital city will become a kind of battle ground. Will Thaksin give way? ... No. Will the Yellows give way? ... No. ... Stalemate. What will happen then, is anyone's guess, but the country will be dragged down because Thaksin is home-sick and wants his money and power back. Hopefully, Thaksin will lose his snap election next year and return to Dubai for good, taking his cronies with him. I expect that's pretty much how it will play out, with a coup at the end to break the stalemate, same as last time. Then we start all over again Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
biloutte Posted December 7, 2011 Share Posted December 7, 2011 it s totaly normal if he not get new passport he fugitif and many people forget that he brokke the law is totaly normal if he not get new one is not acceptable for other people now we have to think about people no have possibility to escape like him is not just he have money and power behind his sister and try again to escape his mistake if he staight and honest he have to back and go in jail like all others peoples we need to stop about red shirt yellow shirt or other the law is the law and if we work like that can be better for futur and stop to think how much you can get like money if he there the best it s think how we can do for win money everyday by ourself here many people lasy to work and ready to vote only with money look now what happen in this country they put people in trouble underwater for save industry many years before your King advice you about that but some people think they have better brain Now it s time to think about Thailand and PEOPLE Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tragickingdom Posted December 7, 2011 Share Posted December 7, 2011 Everything the democrats do and did is legitimate, even creating life firing zones in the middle of Bangkok. Everything people with different views do are illegitimate. Last time I checked it was that attitude that decimated the no so Democrat party in Thai elections. (Elections were by the way also considered illegitimate when the army raped democracy to the benefit of the DP). Don't be bother what the DP or the Nation say, they are preaching for their own community only. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sparebox2 Posted December 7, 2011 Share Posted December 7, 2011 Passport? What's the big fuss. Just a travel document, and nothing more. What's next? Not allow to have ID card for fugitives? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cloudhopper Posted December 7, 2011 Share Posted December 7, 2011 Using his Ugandan diplomatic passport eliminates the need for a visa.. A DP does not eliminate the need for a visa. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
hammered Posted December 7, 2011 Share Posted December 7, 2011 Everything the democrats do and did is legitimate, even creating life firing zones in the middle of Bangkok. Everything people with different views do are illegitimate. Last time I checked it was that attitude that decimated the no so Democrat party in Thai elections. (Elections were by the way also considered illegitimate when the army raped democracy to the benefit of the DP). Don't be bother what the DP or the Nation say, they are preaching for their own community only. Exactly and in the case of the Democrat party that is truly worrying as they are the main opposition party and should be a viable electoral alternative and to not even try to reach out to those who dont support them is a level of political idiocy that defies belief in a party that needs votes and lots more of them to bring it to power. Right now they seem more intent on buoying up the support of the more extreme among those who vote for them even at the cost of losing some peripheral votes who get bored with their constant confrontation and lauding it over everyone with their sense of entitlement and superiority complex Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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