Is It Legal?

[beano2274]

The OP is not shopping if he is getting paid for it, he is buying and selling goods, and exporting them. This is defined by the law as working, therefore his GF could shop him, however, it is mostly a ploy to get you to want her back and beg her to forgive you. Show her the door.

No i'm not selling them, that's the point.

You said you were getting money for them, so is that not buying and selling them, although not making a profit, you are buying them sending them out of the country then receiving money, this is exporting. So means you are working

[chrisinth]

The OP is not shopping if he is getting paid for it, he is buying and selling goods, and exporting them. This is defined by the law as working, therefore his GF could shop him, however, it is mostly a ploy to get you to want her back and beg her to forgive you. Show her the door.

Hear hear.

Change your address and phone number.

Grow your hair and a beard; if you already have, shave them off. Wear glasses and walk with a limp, change you aftershave.......

Run buddy run

[NewlyMintedThai]

there are so many people that buy stuff in thailand and take it to their home and sell it.

it's that way throughout the world.Maybe this might be a little extreme

The OP wanted to know if it was technically illegal or not.

Clearly it is.

[Beetlejuice]

The worst thing you could possibly do is to come on here posing such questions.

True to a point.

It all depends on what the OP wishes to hear and what sorts of answers he is expecting.

The solution is simple; before the crap hits the fan, is to cover himself and ensure that everything is above board, there is no time to waste.

If the OP believes he`s not contravening any laws, than he has nothing to concern himself with. If he has doubts than take advice to protect himself.

So as I said; what sorts of answers does he wish to hear?

[TAWP]

Going outside, gathering products, packing them, sending them out, getting money wired in.

Doing it repeatedly, organized, and the money is the money used for living on...

Yes, it is work.

[Geekfreaklover]

What is she going to do? I mean really do? Go to the department of labour and tell them everything? What will the department of labour do? Probably promise to do something and then have a chuckle about it when she leaves the building. Customs and excise? They are not interested in small operations such as this.

She has found a weak spot. She knows that you are nervous about your business and she plans to exploit that.

Move on. Break contact with her. Next.

[PoorSucker]

But is what i'm doing work though, buying stuff and sending it home, then surely

to send stuff home then.

Yes, it's unfair that you should pay customs.

.

Free trade..

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Free_trade

[Beetlejuice]

It appars the OP is running an illegal export business as a means of supporting himself in Thailand and without it would be unable to stay in the Kingdom.

Two reasons why the authorties clamp down hard on these crimes. First because it is cheating the Government out of revenue (tax evasion) and second, he`s a farang, ripe for extortion.

I always fail to understand why so many farangs staying in Thailand find it so difficult to keep within the laws? I would hate to live my life forever looking over my shoulder and fearing everybody.

[cardholder]

It appars the OP is running an illegal export business as a means of supporting himself in Thailand and without it would be unable to stay in the Kingdom.

Two reasons why the authorties clamp down hard on these crimes. First because it is cheating the Government out of revenue (tax evasion) and second, he`s a farang, ripe for extortion.

I always fail to understand why so many farangs staying in Thailand find it so difficult to keep within the laws? I would hate to live my life forever looking over my shoulder and fearing everybody.

Not quite sure how you come to the conclusion of tax evasion.

An individual is buying goods, at market prices, and shipping them to his home country. Any import duties (if any) are presumably being paid.

I do not see where the Thai Exchequer is being denied revenue. As a previous poster said it is no different, in effect, to traveling to Thailand buying goods and returning home with them. The OP is simply not returning home.

This is simply a question of whether the OP is acting in braech of the terms of his tourist visa. I believe that the answer is "yes" - literally he is. However, on a practical level I doubt that the GF (unless well connected with the BiB) could get a case to stick.

[attrayant]

Fight fire with fire. Tell her that you'll implicate her as your partner in crime. Bonus points if it's actually true. After all, this can't have been going on for years without her playing some kind of supporting role.

[toastie]

Nothing wrong with visiting the Kingdom, doing a bit of shopping and posting things abroad, particularly considering what airlines charge these days for extra freight.

What paper trail is there? Is your overseas friend paying by invoice or is it more informal? If invoice, that would put you squarely on the wrong side of the line.

If you wish to continue this trade, you could obtain a non-imm B visa, the one where you have to stamp in&out every 3mos, on the basis of being an agent for a foreign business. In that case no thai income tax, but it would be an offical taxable job in your home country. That visa exists for exactly this type of thing: the export sector is a very major part of the Thai economy.

To obtain said visa you will need backing documentation from your friend, and I believe that it must be applied for outside the country, best at the embassy where his company is incorporated. (ie, Vientiane ain't gonna cut it.) If you guys are not incorporated, you will need to do so in order to legitimise the business opportunity that you have discovered while ON HOLIDAY.

my 2 baht. cheers

Edited March 1, 2012 by toastie

[Dancealot]

The OP would be very naive if he wasn't thinking he was really up sh**t creek. And to make matters worse he posted this on a public site.

Delete facebook profile, delete thaivisa account. Setup another identity. But that's only your digital concern..

For the wife in worst case scenario you could be waited at the border for your next trip or at your exit...

Personally i wouldn't have 1 night good sleep on my tourist visa if i was you.

[TAWP]

Not quite sure how you come to the conclusion of tax evasion.

An individual is buying goods, at market prices, and shipping them to his home country. Any import duties (if any) are presumably being paid.

I do not see where the Thai Exchequer is being denied revenue. As a previous poster said it is no different, in effect, to traveling to Thailand buying goods and returning home with them. The OP is simply not returning home.

This is simply a question of whether the OP is acting in braech of the terms of his tourist visa. I believe that the answer is "yes" - literally he is. However, on a practical level I doubt that the GF (unless well connected with the BiB) could get a case to stick.

Any incomes have to be taxed. He is avoiding taxes in one, possibly two, countries.

[notmyself]

Going outside, gathering products, packing them, sending them out, getting money wired in.

Doing it repeatedly, organized, and the money is the money used for living on...

Yes, it is work.

There is a grey area which is accepted by all countries including Thailand. In theory... If you buy anything in one country then end up selling it in another country it is in fact trade and thus work by the person doing it. Even within a single country you have the same grey are going on. If you buy a car for 5k and sell it for 7k then you should have to pay capital gains tax but all countries I can think of have a threshold for such person transactions. I think in the UK it is 9k per year for low cost items and high cost items have a limit on the number of transactions per year. The UK is pretty soft on high value transactions such as houses but they are tightening up. I understand New Zealand done this years ago regarding houses. If you buy and sell a house within a couple of years then you cannot do it again for 5 years or so. This all goes back to.....

Going outside, gathering products, packing them, sending them out, getting money wired in.

Doing it repeatedly, organized, and the money is the money used for living on...

Yes, it is work.

Being 'repeatedly, organized' would, without doubt, be considered as work rather than a windfall. OP should go ligit and become a businessman. Any questions of previous shipments should be put down as being samples sent for consideration of a future business venture.

[MAJIC]

The real "Acid Test" for the OP is:

"If you have doubts enough to ask advice on tv,do you think the Authorities will give the benefit of doubt to you"?

[easethesqueeze]

Fight fire with fire. Tell her that you'll implicate her as your partner in crime. Bonus points if it's actually true. After all, this can't have been going on for years without her playing some kind of supporting role.

Brilliant, this is champagne - i can use this for sure. This is why i posted on here. I've decided to visit some friends out of the country for a while and see how things pan out. She'll probably crawl back with her tail between her legs when the money dries up anyway.

As far as the internet is concerned i'm well proxied up on a public server with no personal details in any connected account, i wouldn't dream of joining a public forum using any real personal info that was ever traceable, that would be madness, obviously.

Edited March 1, 2012 by easethesqueeze

[cdnvic]

The worst thing you could possibly do is to come on here posing such questions.

Not really. Nobody knows who he is, and it's not like he's inquiring about something blatently illegal. He's just in a grey area and is trying to clear it up, so he asks for information and advice. That's what the forum is here for.

[theblether]

Clearly illegal.

So everyone who sends shi it back home is breaking the law

sort it out!

.

No, everyone who bases themselves in Thailand and makes a living runningan export operation is breaking the law.

Well if he is sending containers then I am wrong

But I think he is sending parcels

.

Your like a dog with a bone.

The main problem the OP is that his ex knows that he is doing the work for profit. Once the accusation is made then he has a problem.

It is clear that he cannot work in Thailand without a permit so........he is at the mercy of the individual who receives the complaint. Maybe they can be bothered, maybe they can't be bothered, or maybe his ex will just give up.

A lot of maybes there huh?

[craigt3365]

One post has been removed for inappropriate quotation of a member's previous post. Per forum rules:

In using Thai Visa I agree:

30) Do not modify someone else's post in your quoted reply, either with font or color changes, added emoticons, or altered wording.

[Mario2008]

It might be legal what the OP does if he has a non-B visa and only visits Thaland from time to time. In that case he is more a business traveler, buying and sending abroad. A mjor point of issue will be if he is working for the foreign company or he does business on his own with the Thai people and then sels with a profit to the foreign company.

I this case the OP appears to live in Thailand and not to be a visitor, doing business between a Thai and foreign company and then leaving. If he lives here, he should start an export business.

[Slaps]

Asking is it legal is the problem here, it brings out all the lawyer wannabes

Read this thread not one mention of a work permit

Many many do what you are doing in a small way and never have a problem

Get rid of your psycho girlfriend and carry on

it won't take you long to find another one, psycho girlfriend that is, ha ha

.

[Pseudolus]

I don't think it matters if you are being paid or not. Charity volunteers here need a work permit! So getting paid is irrelevant. Of all the threats a Thai lady can make, this is one of the easier ones to go through with in that it would only take a phone call for them to be on their way to you. They would not care if you were sending the odd thing back every now and then but it does rather sound like you are sending a shed load of gear back on a monthly basis. They would have to believe you are either the nicest guy in the world to your friends, or you are an agent working here.

Gut feeling is though that she threatened this, and has forgotten all about it as she finds her next knight in shining armour.

[NewlyMintedThai]

Wonder if any of the things the OP is send are copy product. That could get him into a lot more trouble than the work permit issue.

[toastie]

Wonder if any of the things the OP is send are copy product. That could get him into a lot more trouble than the work permit issue.

A very valid point. All the paperwork in the world won't make that legal.

[personchester]

Clearly illegal.

Not illegal at all, the fact that he buys goods here and sends them to his home country is perfectly legal, the fact that he gets the money sent back (from selling the goods) is entirely a private matter, it is similar to a retired farang here who gets his monthly pension payment from his home country.

His activity is private matter and is not regarded as an official business enterprise, His GF will not succeed with her indented plan in order to kick him out.

Nevertheless, the OP should consult a Thai solicitor in order to get the matter outlined and sorted.

[NewlyMintedThai]

Clearly illegal.

Not illegal at all, the fact that he buys goods here and sends them to his home country is perfectly legal, the fact that he gets the money sent back (from selling the goods) is entirely a private matter, it is similar to a retired farang here who gets his monthly pension payment from his home country.

His activity is private matter and is not regarded as an official business enterprise, His GF will not succeed with her indented plan in order to kick him out.

Nevertheless, the OP should consult a Thai solicitor in order to get the matter outlined and sorted.

I'm sorry, but you're wrong. He is making a living by activities carried out in Thailand. That is nothing like receiving a pension.

I guarantee you 100% that the authorities would see it this way too, if called to their attention.

[cardholder]

Clearly illegal.

Not illegal at all, the fact that he buys goods here and sends them to his home country is perfectly legal, the fact that he gets the money sent back (from selling the goods) is entirely a private matter, it is similar to a retired farang here who gets his monthly pension payment from his home country.

His activity is private matter and is not regarded as an official business enterprise, His GF will not succeed with her indented plan in order to kick him out.

Nevertheless, the OP should consult a Thai solicitor in order to get the matter outlined and sorted.

I'm sorry, but you're wrong. He is making a living by activities carried out in Thailand. That is nothing like receiving a pension.

I guarantee you 100% that the authorities would see it this way too, if called to their attention.

I guarantee they won't.

Over to you...

[notmyself]

Clearly illegal.

Not illegal at all, the fact that he buys goods here and sends them to his home country is perfectly legal, the fact that he gets the money sent back (from selling the goods) is entirely a private matter, it is similar to a retired farang here who gets his monthly pension payment from his home country.

His activity is private matter and is not regarded as an official business enterprise, His GF will not succeed with her indented plan in order to kick him out.

Nevertheless, the OP should consult a Thai solicitor in order to get the matter outlined and sorted.

So if I was shipping out 2 40" containers of furniture every week it would be considered a private matter rather then a business enterprise?

Governments around the world don't care if someone is sending a few bits and bobs overseas mostly due to the cost of administering such a thing. If I sent a couple of t-shirts to the UK for a friend who didn't like them, sold them and sent me back the money I had paid then there is no issue. The cost of running such a scheme would far outway the return so it's allowed. All countries I know of have a value limit which if crossed may well raise eyebrows. If I returned to the UK then the limit was (and perhaps still is) £250. Anything above that I 'should' pay an import fee though if I buy a 400 quid laptop and take it back then it's not an issue. If I take back 300 t-shirts to the value of 400 quid then I would be very likely to be required to pay the import duty of 14% for textiles on the 150 quid extra. 14% could have changed as I have not been in the import export business for a number of years.

This actually wouldn't happen to me as I hold a UK and EU bonded goods licence so I don't have to pay any duty or tax until the product is sold. If the product is sold outside of the EU then I pay nothing. Both there licences cover T1 and T2 so I could sell to another bonded licence holder within the EU and they would need to pay the tariff if the product was sold within the EU.

Suffice to say that I have investigated the export side from Thailand and the money to be made is not enough for me to keep under the radar. I therefore remain retired.

[NewlyMintedThai]

Clearly illegal.

Not illegal at all, the fact that he buys goods here and sends them to his home country is perfectly legal, the fact that he gets the money sent back (from selling the goods) is entirely a private matter, it is similar to a retired farang here who gets his monthly pension payment from his home country.

His activity is private matter and is not regarded as an official business enterprise, His GF will not succeed with her indented plan in order to kick him out.

Nevertheless, the OP should consult a Thai solicitor in order to get the matter outlined and sorted.

I'm sorry, but you're wrong. He is making a living by activities carried out in Thailand. That is nothing like receiving a pension.

I guarantee you 100% that the authorities would see it this way too, if called to their attention.

I guarantee they won't.

Over to you...

I'd be happy to split the cost of a formal legal opinion with you. Labor law expert of your choice.

Over to you.

[cardholder]

I'm sorry, but you're wrong. He is making a living by activities carried out in Thailand. That is nothing like receiving a pension.

I guarantee you 100% that the authorities would see it this way too, if called to their attention.

I guarantee they won't.

Over to you...

I'd be happy to split the cost of a formal legal opinion with you. Labor law expert of your choice.

Over to you.

Save your money Minted - I have already been in touch with a lawyer.

However, I am sure that if you pay your lawyer enough you will get the answer you want to hear.