Thai Govt's Agricultural Price-Pledging Policy Has Failed

[Thai at Heart]

Thailand’s unmilled rice stocks jumped to a record high of 11.7 million tonnes, according to government and industry officials.

How many tonnes comes from neighboring countries?

I would dearly love to know how you go about warehousing 11mn tonnes of anything? Are the buildings visible from space?

[Skywalker69]

Thailand's unmilled rice stocks jumped to a record high of 11.7 million tonnes, according to government and industry officials.

How many tonnes comes from neighboring countries?

I would dearly love to know how you go about warehousing 11mn tonnes of anything? Are the buildings visible from space?

My God, you´r right the warehouses must be the size of the Pyramids in Egypt.

[waza]

The stunning successes of the Yingluck government just keep coming.

[Buchholz]

Informative article in the other paper this morning detailing how Thailand stands to lose tens of billions of baht as it sells off some of its over-stuffed warehouses of rice to India and China.

The sales will be at world prevailing prices which is far below what the government paid for it under the rice pledging scheme.

The Commerce Minister has said Thailand plans to sell 4-5 million tons of rice, up from the previously announced 3 million tons.

.

[Soupdragon]

Obviously no one will be held accountable for the 'errors of judgement' involved in thinking that Thailand could dictate the global market price of rice but just for giggles they should publish who actually ended up holding the cash,

[Ricardo]

Thailand's unmilled rice stocks jumped to a record high of 11.7 million tonnes, according to government and industry officials.

How many tonnes comes from neighboring countries?

I would dearly love to know how you go about warehousing 11mn tonnes of anything? Are the buildings visible from space?

One would hope that, when the auditors go in to check the quantity & quality of the 11.7 million tons, they don't discover that some of it has mysteriously vanished, as it did under TRT ? Perhaps DPM Super-Chalerm might be sent in to investigate/obfuscate ?

And wouldn't it be interesting to learn which foreign-governments are involved in these barter trade-deals, and exactly what Thailand is getting in-return, and what the cash-value at market-price of the exchanged-goods turns out to be ?

Not that anyone would suspect that there is a hidden-discount being given, of course not, the Thai government & civil-service is famed for its ability to make advantageous-deals of this type !

[SuneeTH]

The pot call the kettle black.

Mark govt also paid billion and billions of tax payer money to rice farmers. Please tell me what is so different?

Yingluck - Pay the farmers when they bring their physical rice in.

Mark - Pay the farmers when they claim they have sold the rice. No physical rice need to be shown.

Which method is more likely to be corruptible?

Edited August 11, 2012 by SuneeTH

[Buchholz]

Thailand's unmilled rice stocks jumped to a record high of 11.7 million tonnes, according to government and industry officials.

How many tonnes comes from neighboring countries?

I would dearly love to know how you go about warehousing 11mn tonnes of anything? Are the buildings visible from space?

One would hope that, when the auditors go in to check the quantity & quality of the 11.7 million tons, they don't discover that some of it has mysteriously vanished, as it did under TRT ? Perhaps DPM Super-Chalerm might be sent in to investigate/obfuscate ?

And wouldn't it be interesting to learn which foreign-governments are involved in these barter trade-deals, and exactly what Thailand is getting in-return, and what the cash-value at market-price of the exchanged-goods turns out to be ?

Not that anyone would suspect that there is a hidden-discount being given, of course not, the Thai government & civil-service is famed for its ability to make advantageous-deals of this type !

future news:

Rats Held Responsible For 6.3 Million Tons Of Warehoused Rice Gone Missing

.

[OzMick]

The pot call the kettle black.

Mark govt also paid billion and billions of tax payer money to rice farmers. Please tell me what is so different?

Yingluck - Pay the farmers when they bring their physical rice in.

Mark - Pay the farmers when they claim they have sold the rice. No physical rice need to be shown.

Which method is more likely to be corruptible?

As your summary of the 2 schemes is so far wrong it hardly requires dissecting, I will just point out that the Democrats scheme was paid directly to farmers. The former pledging scam saw 37% of disbursed money reach farmers, and it is suggested most of those were wealthy (Farmer's Assoc. figures).

[Hermeric]

Do you mean that only those who pay taxes should vote?

[Hermeric]

Do you mean that only those who pay taxes should vote?

[Thai at Heart]

Thailand's unmilled rice stocks jumped to a record high of 11.7 million tonnes, according to government and industry officials.

How many tonnes comes from neighboring countries?

I would dearly love to know how you go about warehousing 11mn tonnes of anything? Are the buildings visible from space?

One would hope that, when the auditors go in to check the quantity & quality of the 11.7 million tons, they don't discover that some of it has mysteriously vanished, as it did under TRT ? Perhaps DPM Super-Chalerm might be sent in to investigate/obfuscate ?

And wouldn't it be interesting to learn which foreign-governments are involved in these barter trade-deals, and exactly what Thailand is getting in-return, and what the cash-value at market-price of the exchanged-goods turns out to be ?

Not that anyone would suspect that there is a hidden-discount being given, of course not, the Thai government & civil-service is famed for its ability to make advantageous-deals of this type !

Well i worked in an export company that worked in 1000s of tonnes and we had about 15 rai under cover.

Millions of tonnes of storage is gargantuan.

[SuneeTH]

The pot call the kettle black.

Mark govt also paid billion and billions of tax payer money to rice farmers. Please tell me what is so different?

Yingluck - Pay the farmers when they bring their physical rice in.

Mark - Pay the farmers when they claim they have sold the rice. No physical rice need to be shown.

Which method is more likely to be corruptible?

As your summary of the 2 schemes is so far wrong it hardly requires dissecting, I will just point out that the Democrats scheme was paid directly to farmers. The former pledging scam saw 37% of disbursed money reach farmers, and it is suggested most of those were wealthy (Farmer's Assoc. figures).

You conveniently forgot to mention that only 21% of Mark's payment goes to the real Thai farmers, while 79% goes to imaginary people like: proxy, farangs, dead people, ghost, and even case of babies less than 6 months old found to be receiving the money.

[ratcatcher]

<snip>

future news:

Rats Held Responsible For 6.3 Million Tons Of Warehoused Rice Gone Missing

.

Oops, time to go to work.

I've heard of "fat cats", but now we may have "fat rats".

First place I'll look is in Parliament next week.

[Skywalker69]

Informative article in the other paper this morning detailing how Thailand stands to lose tens of billions of baht as it sells off some of its over-stuffed warehouses of rice to India and China.

The sales will be at world prevailing prices which is far below what the government paid for it under the rice pledging scheme.

The Commerce Minister has said Thailand plans to sell 4-5 million tons of rice, up from the previously announced 3 million tons.

.

Another great success for the PM and PTP leave Thai people to pay the bill.

[Soupdragon]

Informative article in the other paper this morning detailing how Thailand stands to lose tens of billions of baht as it sells off some of its over-stuffed warehouses of rice to India and China.

The sales will be at world prevailing prices which is far below what the government paid for it under the rice pledging scheme.

The Commerce Minister has said Thailand plans to sell 4-5 million tons of rice, up from the previously announced 3 million tons.

.

Another great success for the PM and PTP leave Thai people to pay the bill.

It could be judged a political success if the funds have been used to buy future support from influential people. Legality isn't a consideration obviously.

[Buchholz]

Informative article in the other paper this morning detailing how Thailand stands to lose tens of billions of baht as it sells off some of its over-stuffed warehouses of rice to India and China.

The sales will be at world prevailing prices which is far below what the government paid for it under the rice pledging scheme.

The Commerce Minister has said Thailand plans to sell 4-5 million tons of rice, up from the previously announced 3 million tons.

.

Another great success for the PM and PTP leave Thai people to pay the bill.

Anyone paying any Thai tax helps to pay the bill.

as for "tens of billions", we are beginning to see once again the level of incompetence/corruption that was previously described under Thaksin's regime as "unprecedented".

The level of money involved with the current administration is heading to surpass the unprecedented, if it hasn't already.

.

Edited August 11, 2012 by Buchholz

[Buchholz]

In reference to the OP:

No big deal as it's only 301.27 Billion Baht.

Now, they want even more...

Commerce Ministry to ask for another THB260 billion to finance crop pledging scheme

BANGKOK, 13 August 2012 (NNT) - The Ministry of Commerce will request the Cabinet to approve a budget of 260 billion baht for the agricultural products pledging scheme for the 2012-2013 crop year.

Commerce Minister Boonsong Teriyapirom said on Monday that the 260 billionbaht budget, to be proposed to the Cabinet, would be spent on the crop pledging program, which covers many types of crops, such as rice and cassava.

The minister confirmed the government did not have a liquidity problem and still had enough money to pay farmers participating in the program.

Boonsong said the proceeds from the sales of the produce in the government warehouse would be paid back to the Bank for Agriculture and Agricultural Cooperatives, starting from August this year.

-- NNT 2012-08-13

[rubl]

The minister confirmed the government did not have a liquidity problem and still had enough money to pay farmers participating in the program.

Lucky Thai government. Still I wonder about taxpayers including myself

[Buchholz]

The minister confirmed the government did not have a liquidity problem and still had enough money to pay farmers participating in the program.

Lucky Thai government. Still I wonder about taxpayers including myself

It's only Half A Trillion Baht +.

That can't be much of an impact in a country where everyone is rich.

.

Edited August 13, 2012 by Buchholz

[ThaiOats]

The minister confirmed the government did not have a liquidity problem and still had enough money to pay farmers participating in the program.

Lucky Thai government. Still I wonder about taxpayers including myself

It's only Half A Trillion Baht +.

That can't be much of an impact in a country where everyone is rich.

.

Well, if the Thai people don't take any action, then they'll keep losing their hard earned money to the government (whichever government that may be). As of now, it seems only the opposition and the business sectors are the only ones complaining but the people themselves haven't done any. Pro-rice and pro-government won't have much to argue when the rice farmers and tax payers are the ones protesting. Until then, it can be only seen as propaganda to discredit the government.

Edited August 13, 2012 by ThaiOats

[DeepInTheForest]

Subsidising basic crops with inefficient and corrupt systems leads to literally millions of people working their butts off to remain in poverty, while the rest of the population pays higher prices for essentials.

Trapped in poverty, farmers can't afford NOT to vote for the party that offers the highest subsidies, and can't afford a decent education for their children. So the cycle continues.

Unless of course, they realise that the party that paid lower subsidies paid directly to the farmer, and who offered lower cost education instead of some gimmick toy, might actually be better for them. I live in hope.

Ag subsidies are a very fraught, complex topic. They are used extensively in the larger, industrialized countries. Twenty-two percent of farm income in OECD countries is now attributed to subsidies.

Two exceptions are Australia and New Zealand, whose subsidies are extraordinarily low.

New Zealand's experience with cutting subsidies is recounted here, a good read:

http://www.nytimes.com/2007/08/02/business/worldbusiness/02farm.html?pagewanted=all

Criticism of subsidies usually centers on who gets them (usually the larger, better-funded farmers), the types of food that are subsidized (in the US, the rising tide of obesity is sometimes blamed on heavy subsidies for corn, other grains, and sugar), and the fact that poorer countries cannot afford them, which leads to difficulties in their agricultural sectors. For an account of how Jamaica's agriculture was gutted, see the excellent documentary film "Life and Debt".

It is, however, easy to see a case for "good" subsidies. Or at least to see why they have a place in certain instances. Most countries do not want their food security to depend on the whims of the international market, which can be extremely volatile.

Perhaps the real problem is how to design more equitable and fair subsidies worldwide.

Incidentally, though Australia has low ag subsidies, water is another story-- water projects are heavily subsidized, which really is a subsidy for agriculture, upon examination.

http://www.theaustralian.com.au/news/opinion/water-plan-will-cost-a-tsunami/story-e6frg6zo-1225952287573

There is much to think about here...

[Skywalker69]

The minister confirmed the government did not have a liquidity problem and still had enough money to pay farmers participating in the program.

Lucky Thai government. Still I wonder about taxpayers including myself

It's only Half A Trillion Baht +.

That can't be much of an impact in a country where everyone is rich.

.

If the Government don´t stop this madness Thailand will soon be the "Greece" of Asia.

[Buchholz]

If the Government don´t stop this madness Thailand will soon be the "Greece" of Asia.

UTCC: Farmers in 100,000-baht debt on average

BANGKOK, 17 August 2012 (NNT) - A survey by the University of Thai Chamber of Commerce (UTCC) has indicated that Thai farmers on average are in 103,000 baht debt, the highest since it has conducted the survey.

http://thainews.prd.go.th/en/news.php?id=255508170007

[moe666]

I really feel for the farmers. It is tough work and not much income. The statement: " the government should support the development of farming, marketing and trading to allow the market mechanism to do its work." is spot on. The government should have looked into why Viet Nam can produce twice as much rice per rai and do the necessary research to pass on to the farmers to increase production. A lot of Universities here in the US do exactly that and it is one of the greatest reasons the US has such high food production.

The money spent was a mistake. Put it into research and pass it on to the farmers at no cost.

The price of Thai Jasmine Rice has increased by 300% in some places here in the US. That really hurt our little restaurant. Now we have to charge for Thai Jasmine Rice.

CP Corporation has a program to train farmers in best methods.

[moe666]

Subsidising basic crops with inefficient and corrupt systems leads to literally millions of people working their butts off to remain in poverty, while the rest of the population pays higher prices for essentials.

Trapped in poverty, farmers can't afford NOT to vote for the party that offers the highest subsidies, and can't afford a decent education for their children. So the cycle continues.

Unless of course, they realise that the party that paid lower subsidies paid directly to the farmer, and who offered lower cost education instead of some gimmick toy, might actually be better for them. I live in hope.

Ag subsidies are a very fraught, complex topic. They are used extensively in the larger, industrialized countries. Twenty-two percent of farm income in OECD countries is now attributed to subsidies.

Two exceptions are Australia and New Zealand, whose subsidies are extraordinarily low.

New Zealand's experience with cutting subsidies is recounted here, a good read:

http://www.nytimes.c...?pagewanted=all

Criticism of subsidies usually centers on who gets them (usually the larger, better-funded farmers), the types of food that are subsidized (in the US, the rising tide of obesity is sometimes blamed on heavy subsidies for corn, other grains, and sugar), and the fact that poorer countries cannot afford them, which leads to difficulties in their agricultural sectors. For an account of how Jamaica's agriculture was gutted, see the excellent documentary film "Life and Debt".

It is, however, easy to see a case for "good" subsidies. Or at least to see why they have a place in certain instances. Most countries do not want their food security to depend on the whims of the international market, which can be extremely volatile.

Perhaps the real problem is how to design more equitable and fair subsidies worldwide.

Incidentally, though Australia has low ag subsidies, water is another story-- water projects are heavily subsidized, which really is a subsidy for agriculture, upon examination.

http://www.theaustra...o-1225952287573

There is much to think about here...

The major corn crop in the US is unediable as it is used for feed, alcohol, or sugar.

[moe666]

Informative article in the other paper this morning detailing how Thailand stands to lose tens of billions of baht as it sells off some of its over-stuffed warehouses of rice to India and China.

The sales will be at world prevailing prices which is far below what the government paid for it under the rice pledging scheme.

The Commerce Minister has said Thailand plans to sell 4-5 million tons of rice, up from the previously announced 3 million tons.

.

Another great success for the PM and PTP leave Thai people to pay the bill.

Anyone paying any Thai tax helps to pay the bill.

as for "tens of billions", we are beginning to see once again the level of incompetence/corruption that was previously described under Thaksin's regime as "unprecedented".

The level of money involved with the current administration is heading to surpass the unprecedented, if it hasn't already.

.

Come on now everyone did it before so it is alright, according to a few here

[ratcatcher]

<snip>

The major corn crop in the US is unediable as it is used for feed, alcohol, or sugar.

Are you saying "The major corn crop is inedible as it is used for feed"?

[Buchholz]

<snip>

The major corn crop in the US is unediable as it is used for feed, alcohol, or sugar.

Are you saying "The major corn crop is inedible as it is used for feed"?

Corn as far as the eye can see in Iowa.... and it's all to feed cattle.

[Buchholz]

Government's Agricultural Price-Pledging Policy Has Failed

in the government's eyes, however, it's...

Government declared success in rice-pledging scheme

BANGKOK, 18 August 2012 (NNT) – The government has declared its success in the rice-pledging program, which is said to have helped raise the standard of living for more than 2 million households.

Commerce Minister Boonsong Teriyapirom said on Friday that the government-initiated rice pledging scheme has been a success, as it has helped raise the standard of living of more than 2 million farmers’ families, out of some 3 million households registered with the Ministry.

He revealed that about 6.9 million tons of unhusked in-season rice were pledged with the government while approximately 10 million tons of the off-season rice produce were pledged with the government.

The Commerce Minister stated that the program has effectively raised local rice price to 11,000 baht per ton, while the average global rice price now stands at 678 US dollars per ton, which is already higher than last year’s price of 500 dollars a ton.

Boonsong is confident that if this trend continues, Thai farmers will be relieved from debt burden and have a better standard of living within 2-3 years.

He said that the government forecasts Thai rice exports at 8 million tons for 2012.

-- NNT 2012-08-18