U.s Visitor/business/marriage? Visa For Boyfriend Of Canadian

[jaiyen17]

Hello to everyone at Thaivisa.com. Let me first say your forum holds a wealth of information and has assured me that I may at last be able get some answers to the many visa and immigration questions my boyfriend and i will be faced with in our lifetimes. Let me start with some backround.

I am a canadian citizen living as a permanent resident in the U.S. I am eligible to apply for U.S citizenship although I've never felt inclined to want to do that. *until I met Pocky. Pocky is a thai national.

We met in 1999 in Bangkok. Wow! sounds like forever ago! When we first met I was naive enough to think he could just go to the airport and get on a plane with the same freedom those of us westerners enjoy. I was very wrong. I soon realized that even if we married, I being a canadian citizen was facing an almost impossible road of getting him to the states. I now have 17 round trip stamps in my passports between SF and BKK.

Five years ago I started selling thai handicrafts, clothing and textiles along side of another U.S clothing line I was representing. Two years ago I was able to quit my "real" job and open a store in Lake Tahoe selling my treasures from Thailand. Pocky buys and ships weekly to me from thailand and we have now started wholesaling to other U.S stores and shipping directly from Bangkok. We formed a Partnership in Thailand this year and have rented a house in Nonthaburi with an attached wherehouse space for the business. The house license/lease is in his name. His bank account, which is also used for the business right now usually fluctuates between 200,000 and 400,000 baht. He is paid a monthly salary of 17,000 baht by the business for his own spending and the business pays the rent on the house.\

So my questions are. What are our chances of getting a visitor visa to the U.S this next summer? Would we have any chance at a business visa? What happens if we get married, which we would like to do while my mom is visiting this winter. Would that make it more difficult to get a visitor visa, remember I'm canadian. ? If I apply for my american citizenship I would have it by next fall, then could we get a visitor visa more easily?

What I am confused about is it seems the U.S assumes everyone wants to live there. Even after Pocky and I are married we never want him to live in the U.S We would like to live in chang mai and I would return to the states in the summer and christmas time. Even after we are married can we just keep bringing him in on tourist visas for the rest of our lives?

I'm hoping we can prove to the embassey that both of our incomes depend on him returning to bangkok after two months or our business falls apart. We have 100's of shipping receipts in his name as well as proof of containers shipped, product catalogues, invoices, 1000's of emails.

It's just way beyond time for him to come and see my life in the states and the store that we have both worked so hard to create and for him to meet my dad. *my dad can't travel to thailand because of health reasons.

You can imagine my frustration after 6 years of this. I just have to say that this is definately not a free world and that love and relationships are difficult enough without adding the frustrations the visa laws create. We are not terrorists, just lovers who want to be together and get on with our life. I'm terrified to consider starting a family until I know we can be together and my clock is ticking.

Any help would be greatly appreciated!! I'll be traveling again to thailand Jan. 17th and need to start compiling paperwork if we're going to give the visitor visa a shot. I'm a little confused about what info of my own is worth bringing as I understand that Pock needs to stand up on his own at the embassey. It seems that my bank statements, business licences, shop leases, tax records etc. wont do much good. and is sponsorship even an option in the u.s it doesn't sound that way by reading the forums.

I hope one of you guys is a bit of a U.S expert! thanks in advance for you time.

[Carmine6]

I hope your frustration is due to the process and not a previously denied visa. My opinion below is only based on research and not any actual experience yet.

He has to qualify on his own for the visa, but it seems that your info is pretty integral to his story. Not necessarily your financial information, but if he says he wants to see the Grand Canyon and Disneyland, but they find out the real story, it could get messy. My (completely inexperienced) opinion is that you should build a strong case for his compelling economic ties to Thailand with all the bank statements, lease info, partnership docs, etc. and then have some info on visting you, his business partner and girlfriend. That way all the info will match the story and if they asked questions there won't be some surpise new info, it'd all build on the basic story.

I know some folks will just say they're sightseeing and it'll work. But whenever I've heard stories like that they're usually in between University and work or University and grad school. Or they have a nice middle class job for a big corporation. In your boyfriend's case, where he's exporting to CA and he's flying into CA, it raises questions. And you want those questions to be answered by the application and docs.

I've never researched business visas, so hopefully that'd be a simpler application.

This is from a website is run by the US Dept of State which is a good read for general info:

http://www.unitedstatesvisas.gov/

"Applicants must demonstrate that they are properly classifiable as visitors under U.S. law by:

* Evidence which shows the purpose of the trip, intent to depart the United States, and arrangements made to cover the costs of the trip may be provided. It is impossible to specify the exact form the documentation should take since applicants' circumstances vary greatly.

* Those applicants who do not have sufficient funds to support themselves while in the U.S. must present convincing evidence that an interested person will provide support.

* Depending on individual circumstances, applicants may provide other documentation substantiating the trip's purpose and specifying the nature of binding obligations, such as family ties or employment, which would compel their return abroad."

It does seem like your boyfriend has a good case. Good luck.

[seanwg]

Hi,

I don't think its impossible. I'm in a similar situation.

I am Canadian working on a work permit in Bermuda, and have obtained US/Canadian visas for my Thai wife. She has been here much less than 6 years!

Couple of questions:

1) Do you travel to Canada often? How often to you see your father?

2) Are you married? Do you have a Thai Marriage cert?

I'll assume your married.

What I would do, is have your sig other apply for a Canadian Visitors visa. Then after apply for a US one.

This is the cool part - apparantly because of NAFTA your sig other will automatically be entitled to a USA visa.

Not exactly sure, but thats one possible way of attack.

Sean

[Carmine6]

...This is the cool part - apparantly because of NAFTA your sig other will automatically be entitled to a USA visa.

Not exactly sure, but thats one possible way of attack.

Sean

There's no way it'd be automatic. That'd be the loophole of the century.

I think wherever you heard this was talking about the provision of NAFTA that allows family members to join professionals working in the US. But it's a limited list of professions, and the Canadian citizen has to have entered with a visa under that provision. It also doesn't rely on the family member having gotten any Canadian visa either.

Here's more info:

http://travel.state.gov/visa/temp/types/types_1274.html#20

Sorry jaiyen17, your situation doesn't qualify for at least 4 reasons I can see there, and only 1, marriage could be changed easily. But I still think you've got a good case for the regular tourist visa.

[jaiyen17]

I hope your frustration is due to the process and not a previously denied visa. My opinion below is only based on research and not any actual experience yet.

He has to qualify on his own for the visa, but it seems that your info is pretty integral to his story. Not necessarily your financial information, but if he says he wants to see the Grand Canyon and Disneyland, but they find out the real story, it could get messy. My (completely inexperienced) opinion is that you should build a strong case for his compelling economic ties to Thailand with all the bank statements, lease info, partnership docs, etc. and then have some info on visting you, his business partner and girlfriend. That way all the info will match the story and if they asked questions there won't be some surpise new info, it'd all build on the basic story.

I know some folks will just say they're sightseeing and it'll work. But whenever I've heard stories like that they're usually in between University and work or University and grad school. Or they have a nice middle class job for a big corporation. In your boyfriend's case, where he's exporting to CA and he's flying into CA, it raises questions. And you want those questions to be answered by the application and docs.

I've never researched business visas, so hopefully that'd be a simpler application.

This is from a website is run by the US Dept of State which is a good read for general info:

http://www.unitedstatesvisas.gov/

"Applicants must demonstrate that they are properly classifiable as visitors under U.S. law by:

* Evidence which shows the purpose of the trip, intent to depart the United States, and arrangements made to cover the costs of the trip may be provided. It is impossible to specify the exact form the documentation should take since applicants' circumstances vary greatly.

* Those applicants who do not have sufficient funds to support themselves while in the U.S. must present convincing evidence that an interested person will provide support.

* Depending on individual circumstances, applicants may provide other documentation substantiating the trip's purpose and specifying the nature of binding obligations, such as family ties or employment, which would compel their return abroad."

It does seem like your boyfriend has a good case. Good luck.

Hello Carmine 66

I'll check out that website, I havn't seen that one yet. Our government sites have been changing a lot with all the homeland security stuff! We will be very straight forward with our story, I live in Lake Tahoe and that's a major tourist destination in itself as well as great connections to San Francisco. and to finally meet my family who all lives in tahoe too. It's about time! after 6 years. We havn't wanted to try in the past because we knew we wouldn't get it. Pocky was working as an artist when I met him.

Thankyou for taking your time to answer me, I really appreciate it! I was beginning to wonder if anyone was out there to help.

Hi,

I don't think its impossible. I'm in a similar situation.

I am Canadian working on a work permit in Bermuda, and have obtained US/Canadian visas for my Thai wife. She has been here much less than 6 years!

Couple of questions:

1) Do you travel to Canada often? How often to you see your father?

2) Are you married? Do you have a Thai Marriage cert?

I'll assume your married.

What I would do, is have your sig other apply for a Canadian Visitors visa. Then after apply for a US one.

This is the cool part - apparantly because of NAFTA your sig other will automatically be entitled to a USA visa.

Not exactly sure, but thats one possible way of attack.

Sean

Hello Sean, Thanks for the interesting angle although Carmine seemed to think it wasn't much worth exploring & my situation probably really squashes the idea. I never travel to Canada. My mom and Dad live two streets away from me here in Lake Tahoe. (both still canadian) and my Aunt who lives in Vancouver (and owns real estate in Australia) stops in Bangkok to see me every year. Now if I can only get her to invest in Chiang Mai real estate with Pocky our Visa problems would be solved for sure. It all really just comes down to money. Thanks for your advice and let me know if you think of anything else. Good Luck in bermuda! Any surf there? I sure wish there were some waves in thaiand. (other than the one big one)

thanks again,

Christy

[seanwg]

Hello Sean, Thanks for the interesting angle although Carmine seemed to think it wasn't much worth exploring & my situation probably really squashes the idea. I never travel to Canada. My mom and Dad live two streets away from me here in Lake Tahoe. (both still canadian) and my Aunt who lives in Vancouver (and owns real estate in Australia) stops in Bangkok to see me every year. Now if I can only get her to invest in Chiang Mai real estate with Pocky our Visa problems would be solved for sure. It all really just comes down to money. Thanks for your advice and let me know if you think of anything else. Good Luck in bermuda! Any surf there? I sure wish there were some waves in thaiand. (other than the one big one)

thanks again,

Christy

Money as far as I know isn't the major factor. Its whether or not your sig other will return home after the completion of his trip.

Where else has your sig other worked? Does he have a university degree?

Do you pay any Canadian income taxes?

Despite everything you have, how big your business is, how much cash you have in your account the most important thing you have to prove is that your sig other will return.

Understanding more about your situation, if I were you I would get married.

You can kind of imagine what the questions during his interview are going to be like and can see why they would (if they did) deny a visa:

1) What do you do for work - I send products to an american girl I met X years ago. She sells them in lake tahoe.

2) Are you married to this american girl? No - Why? Explain Explain...

3) Where are this girls parents? In the usa. They live accross the street from her.

From everything I understand about US/Canadian immigration right there you would be denied. You've been together for X years, have not married and own a business together.

[seanwg]

There's no way it'd be automatic. That'd be the loophole of the century.

I think wherever you heard this was talking about the provision of NAFTA that allows family members to join professionals working in the US. But it's a limited list of professions, and the Canadian citizen has to have entered with a visa under that provision. It also doesn't rely on the family member having gotten any Canadian visa either.

This is from the horses mouth, from a canadian immigration inspector type person. I can't remember his exact title but he was pretty up there.

I have no idea where, but for sure there are some NAFTA laws/guidelines etc that allow this.

I wouldn't exactly qualify this as a loophole - if your a canadian citizen, living outside canada, and you apply for a visa for your sig other to come to canada and get it, why on earth would the US deny it? Realistically if your a thai and get a canadian visa, and are determined to get to the US what would stop you from walking across the border. Yes canada/usa are completely different countries but they are linked in many ways.

Take the opposite situation - you apply for a US visa and are denied. What would your chances be with Canada?

Sean

[camster]

I'm a Canadian citizen with a Thai girlfriend, I was naive enough to think I could march into the Canadian embassy and get my girlfriend a visitors Visa to Canada......NOT! My second approach was to apply for a permanent resident visa for her. This took about 15 months and with landing fees, translations, couriers, and other miscellaneous cost me about 2,500 canadian (2,100)us. A very lengthy and at time frustrating process. But in the end we got her the Visa and now she is free to enter and exit Canada at her own free will. She can also work and conduct business in Canada as well as use our free health care system. The only stipulation is over the next 5 years she has to spend 2.5 in Canada non continuos. At the end of the 5 years if he has'nt spent the required time in Canada he would have to re apply.

You have to apply sponsor him and are responsible for him for I believe 3 years. This takes about 2 or 3 months to process and you should'nt have a problem being approved. You do not have to be married (I'm not) but merely have to be in Conjugal relationship for a minimum 1 year which you have been. Also with this visa your income nor your boyfriends are a factor but rather your and his ability to support yourselves. It's costly in money and time but once done is the best and easiset way to freely travel to Canada and Thailand. Of course you want him to enter the Us but I think you would have to get him entry into Canada first then I wouldnt think it would be a problem getting him a US visa of some sort. Just my thoughts.

Camster

[jaiyen17]

.NOT! My second approach was to apply for a permanent resident visa for her. This took about 15 months and with landing fees, translations, couriers, and other miscellaneous cost me about 2,500 canadian (2,100)us. A very lengthy and at time frustrating process. But in the end we got her the Visa and now she is free to enter and exit Canada at her own free will. She can also work and conduct business in Canada as well as use our free health care system.

Hello Camster,

A permanent resident visa for someone your not married to. Wow Canada sure is a lot liberal than the states! (I read they legalized group sex is clubs too)

Congrats on figuring the system out and getting that done! Sounds like it was a long road. On what grounds did they deny her visitor visa?

I don't think I'd have any luck with Canada as I don't have a house or business there, no canadian bank account and have never paid taxes there. I pay regular taxes in the U.S. Have bought and sold real estate and have a commericial lease on a store. I'm non-existent on the books for Canada except I was born there.

Thanks for you info. It was really interesting! I think I have to try the american embassey first. Do you think it would have been easier to get a visitor visa if you were married for canada? Why was the permanent resident card easier than a visitor visa? you would think it would be the opposite. My other problem is Pocky can't spend 2.5 years out of 5 in Canada. Our plan is to visit the states and canada only. We have a life and business to keep going iin thailand. We can't let our garden die

[Carmine6]

jaiyen17, luckily someone else mentioned the US Bangkok embassy website in another post.

http://bangkok.usembassy.gov/services/visa/

This document is "New" on the website and is pretty specific about what types of evidence would be helpful and also what forms to fill out.

http://bangkok.usembassy.gov/services/visa/NIVChecklist.pdf

[jaiyen17]

Hello Sean, Thanks for the interesting angle although Carmine seemed to think it wasn't much worth exploring & my situation probably really squashes the idea. I never travel to Canada. My mom and Dad live two streets away from me here in Lake Tahoe. (both still canadian) and my Aunt who lives in Vancouver (and owns real estate in Australia) stops in Bangkok to see me every year. Now if I can only get her to invest in Chiang Mai real estate with Pocky our Visa problems would be solved for sure. It all really just comes down to money. Thanks for your advice and let me know if you think of anything else. Good Luck in bermuda! Any surf there? I sure wish there were some waves in thaiand. (other than the one big one)

thanks again,

Christy

Money as far as I know isn't the major factor. Its whether or not your sig other will return home after the completion of his trip.

Where else has your sig other worked? Does he have a university degree?

Do you pay any Canadian income taxes?

Despite everything you have, how big your business is, how much cash you have in your account the most important thing you have to prove is that your sig other will return.

Understanding more about your situation, if I were you I would get married.

You can kind of imagine what the questions during his interview are going to be like and can see why they would (if they did) deny a visa:

1) What do you do for work - I send products to an american girl I met X years ago. She sells them in lake tahoe.

2) Are you married to this american girl? No - Why? Explain Explain...

3) Where are this girls parents? In the usa. They live accross the street from her.

From everything I understand about US/Canadian immigration right there you would be denied. You've been together for X years, have not married and own a business together.

I feel like I should start a new post, but I'll see if I get any answers adding to this one. My big question is Should Pocky and I get Married before I get my U.S citizenship? If we get married this winter and then apply for a visitor visa to the U.S with me still a canadian citizen w/ a green card in the u.s what will that do for us? Will us being married make his visitor visa application stronger?

Is there any truth to camsters post above that they will look down upon us if we are unmarried after 6 years? Any help would be great. I'm leaving to come back to thailand in 3 days!! Yeah! It's snowing here right now.

[Carmine6]

Hello Sean, Thanks for the interesting angle although Carmine seemed to think it wasn't much worth exploring & my situation probably really squashes the idea. I never travel to Canada. My mom and Dad live two streets away from me here in Lake Tahoe. (both still canadian) and my Aunt who lives in Vancouver (and owns real estate in Australia) stops in Bangkok to see me every year. Now if I can only get her to invest in Chiang Mai real estate with Pocky our Visa problems would be solved for sure. It all really just comes down to money. Thanks for your advice and let me know if you think of anything else. Good Luck in bermuda! Any surf there? I sure wish there were some waves in thaiand. (other than the one big one)

thanks again,

Christy

Money as far as I know isn't the major factor. Its whether or not your sig other will return home after the completion of his trip.

Where else has your sig other worked? Does he have a university degree?

Do you pay any Canadian income taxes?

Despite everything you have, how big your business is, how much cash you have in your account the most important thing you have to prove is that your sig other will return.

Understanding more about your situation, if I were you I would get married.

You can kind of imagine what the questions during his interview are going to be like and can see why they would (if they did) deny a visa:

1) What do you do for work - I send products to an american girl I met X years ago. She sells them in lake tahoe.

2) Are you married to this american girl? No - Why? Explain Explain...

3) Where are this girls parents? In the usa. They live accross the street from her.

From everything I understand about US/Canadian immigration right there you would be denied. You've been together for X years, have not married and own a business together.

I feel like I should start a new post, but I'll see if I get any answers adding to this one. My big question is Should Pocky and I get Married before I get my U.S citizenship? If we get married this winter and then apply for a visitor visa to the U.S with me still a canadian citizen w/ a green card in the u.s what will that do for us? Will us being married make his visitor visa application stronger?

Is there any truth to camsters post above that they will look down upon us if we are unmarried after 6 years? Any help would be great. I'm leaving to come back to thailand in 3 days!! Yeah! It's snowing here right now.

I think starting a new topic with something catchy like "Should we get married to help with tourist visa?" will get enough eyeballs that you'll get a more authoritative answer. There're actually more Brits and Australians on this board than Americans. So you'll have to dig the experienced US folks out of the woodwork.

Again, just my opinion, but it seems that the length of the relationship is more of an issue for a fiancee or marriage visa, not a tourist visa. The concern with a tourist visa is that they'll return to Thailand, while with a fiancee visa the concern is more the legitimacy of the relationship. Half kidding here, but is it surprising if a guy isn't married after 6 years? Now if you want to use this as an excuse to get married...

Have a great trip. That's a long trip out of Tahoe, but I guess living there makes up for it.

Edited January 14, 2006 by Carmine6