Thailand Theme Park Continues To Host Orangutan Kickboxing Matches

[jerrysteve]

Perhaps the Orangutans need some different competition...Members of Parliment would work well, some unarmed police would be great

competition too.

It would be great to see some members of Parliment and Policemen get the living poop kicked out of them by an Orangutan...

and of course the proprietors of the Amusement park too....now that would be super Amusing...I would defintely pay to see that.

Edited October 23, 2012 by jerrysteve

[MEL1]

Perhaps the Orangutans need some different competition...Members of Parliment would work well, some unarmed police would be great

competition too.

It would be great to see some members of Parliment and Policemen get the living poop kicked out of them by an Orangutan...

and of course the proprietors of the Amusement park too....now that would be super Amusing...I would defintely pay to see that.

Just pay to see Elton John on Dec 13th. There's the competition for the orangus. He'll be dressed in a twinkling bikini, underneath his twinkling jackets. Talking of jackets, he loves 2 potatoes with sausage in the middle.

Now, an orangutan on stage with Elton - now that would really appeal to the Thai mentality.... think about it. Bananas being sucked and eaten, live on stage to Candle in my wind? What more could a thicko ask for??

-mel.

[Pimay1]

Animals have no rights. Humans have rights. This is not to say that animals should be mistreated which they should not but they simply have no rights granted by any constitution of any country.

Edited October 23, 2012 by Pimay1

[sysardman]

It's good to see them coping with de-forestation and destruction of their habitats. At least they haven't sat monkeying around and they've sought gainful employment. Their acting abilities were incredible in the Plant of the Apes films and I think it's time we saw some animal Oscars - good on them I say

[osiboy]

Of course it will continue - Thailand is the hub of freak shows of all types isn't it?

unfortunatelly have to agree with you , having the new tourist markets of china and russsia won't help either , animal rights are the last thing on their minds,maybe they were expecting an orangutang bbq later,........ and as money is the first thing on thais minds im afraid it may well get worse . SAD.;

" PASS THE WHALE MEAT VLADAMIRE !!!

Edited October 23, 2012 by osiboy

[Puyai]

What about horse racing a multi-billion pound/dollar industry. Is this cruelty to animals?

Not saying I agree with orangutan boxing because I don't, but I got the feeling a lot of you that are jumping on the animal rights bandwagon would jump at the chance of a free ticket to the Grand National or the Kentucky Derby.

[omnilangur]

Humans really have done the job on orangutans - destroyed their habitat, hunted them to the brink of extinction, snatched infants for a lucrative market in cute primates and the ultimate indignity: for our amusement we dress them up as ourselves and train them to imitate our behaviour.

Its a depressing reflection on how humanity has no respect for the world and the other living things we share it with.

Orangutans are the distant ancestor of humans as well. These wild primates once roamed freely all over thailand thousands of years ago until they were slaughtered to death which is what is happening right now to wild gibbons and Langurs in Thailand!

[sysardman]

What about horse racing a multi-billion pound/dollar industry. Is this cruelty to animals?

Not saying I agree with orangutan boxing because I don't, but I got the feeling a lot of you that are jumping on the animal rights bandwagon would jump at the chance of a free ticket to the Grand National or the Kentucky Derby.

How dare you suggest that ThaiVisa members jump on bandwagons

PS you don't have a free ticket to Ascot by any chance

[Stevebkk01]

Not surprising at all this is happening in Thailand.

the average thai enjoys watching these kinds of sick shows. XXXXXXXX

Unlike the well educated and kind Americans that flock to SeaWorld and similar places to watch giant killer whales and dolphins that normally roam the wide open oceans of the world kept in tiny tanks and forced to perform stunts for the paying public. Or any of the other Zoo's around the western world where people go to look at majestic animals that normally live in the wide open spaces caged for their pleasure.

Of course only the stupid, uneducated Thais and Asians are cruel though aren't they Steve bkk01 ?

I did not say that. I would have reacted the same way in the US, Europe, Australia or Mozambique.

This is not about Thais specifically, but about people who patronize these shows. And in general, Thais do love these kind of shows.

Also I have been here long enough to have seen acts of cruelty against animals which go beyond what you usually see in the West.

And this is unacceptable here and anywhere.

Edited October 23, 2012 by Stevebkk01

[soi41]

Perhaps the Orangutans need some different competition...Members of Parliment would work well, some unarmed police would be great

competition too.

It would be great to see some members of Parliment and Policemen get the living poop kicked out of them by an Orangutan...

and of course the proprietors of the Amusement park too....now that would be super Amusing...I would defintely pay to see that.

Just pay to see Elton John on Dec 13th. There's the competition for the orangus. He'll be dressed in a twinkling bikini, underneath his twinkling jackets. Talking of jackets, he loves 2 potatoes with sausage in the middle.

Now, an orangutan on stage with Elton - now that would really appeal to the Thai mentality.... think about it. Bananas being sucked and eaten, live on stage to Candle in my wind? What more could a thicko ask for??

-mel.

Another very strong contender for: Most stupid post 2012 Award!

[mrbiggwigg]

I've been there and its all an act. There are far worse things going on in Thailand. What's worse, a primate dressed up, dancing for food, or a human dressed up dancing, and more, for money?

Edited October 23, 2012 by mrbiggwigg

[jackr]

Without the tourists' support, there wouldn't be this despicable spectacle.

This train of thought makes my skin crawl, putting the blame on the tourist... sort of like blaming men entirely for prostitution, or locking up the curb-crawler as opposed to ripping the tart off the street.

Anyway, it wouldn't surprise me to read one of these days: orangutan gets it on in Pattaya, moves upcountry and gets fleeced by female orangutan lookalike.

[IsaanUSA]

Scrolled down looking for Not The Nation. Hmmmm, I guess this is a real story?

I'm assuming the article writer never saw the show. It's just a show, for play, and there is no real fighting.

I didn't realize Orangutans are endangered, but some quick Googling shows their numbers are very small. Sad.

I had a great time at Safari World, although the shows were a bit odd for a zoological display.

[Geekfreaklover]

I guess as humans we feel pity for the animals that look most like us. Those animals with big eyes, like monkeys, seals, the cute animals.

We couldn't give a rat's ass about the insects, rodents, shellfish etc. We must come across animal cruelty everyday, in many ways, human cruelty too. but somehow a well fed ape dressed up and performing is much worse than the beggars we see in the streets in Bangkok. Human beggars crippled by gangs who take the money donated to them by deluded peole thinking that they are being rewarded with some BS karma.

I digress....

The thing with the organutans is that without zoos and without the tourist dollar there wouldn't be any left here at all in Asia. There are a few in the wild, in Indonessia I think, Borneo, but those are in reserves that are maintained by western dollars. Without conservation and zoos these animals would disappear from the radar. Maybe one of the kids that watches one of these 'shows' will remember the animals and try to something about conserving them when they grow older. Its a crap shot, its not ideal, but I can think of a lot worse things happening in the kingdom than this.

Edited October 23, 2012 by Geekfreaklover

[khaowong1]

Sad stuff. Shame on any tourists that pay to go and see such degrading spectacles as these.

Have you actually seen the show?

Dusit Zoo has Orangutan boxing & it's hilarious. It's a show, a joke. The Orangutans are not actually hitting each other, it's just a couple of them dressing in Muay Thai garb & doing a funny show. There's even a 'dolly bird' Orangutan coming on between rounds holding up the round card.

These Orangutans are NOT kicking and punching each other until there is a knockout. These are trained performing animals. Do you really think you could traing two powerful animals like this to REALLY punch each other without 'going ape' and REALLY getting into the sort of fight 2 adult apes would have.

The article is sensationalism. Of course, if you find trained Orangutans performing a scripted show, fair enough. But boxing? 2 chimps going at it until there is a knockout? It's total nonsense, not happening, sensationalist journalism at it's worst.

Thanks for the update. Probably no one will care but thanks anyway.

[fasteddie]

Humans really have done the job on orangutans - destroyed their habitat, hunted them to the brink of extinction, snatched infants for a lucrative market in cute primates and the ultimate indignity: for our amusement we dress them up as ourselves and train them to imitate our behaviour.

Its a depressing reflection on how humanity has no respect for the world and the other living things we share it with.

Speak for yourself!

He speaks for me also.

[fasteddie]

What about horse racing a multi-billion pound/dollar industry. Is this cruelty to animals?

Not saying I agree with orangutan boxing because I don't, but I got the feeling a lot of you that are jumping on the animal rights bandwagon would jump at the chance of a free ticket to the Grand National or the Kentucky Derby.

'' but I got the feeling a lot of you that are jumping on the animal rights bandwagon would jump at the chance of a free ticket to the Grand National or the Kentucky Derby''

Not me! wouldn't go there if you paid me, nearly as boring as golf.

[fasteddie]

I guess as humans we feel pity for the animals that look most like us. Those animals with big eyes, like monkeys, seals, the cute animals.

We couldn't give a rat's ass about the insects, rodents, shellfish etc. We must come across animal cruelty everyday, in many ways, human cruelty too. but somehow a well fed ape dressed up and performing is much worse than the beggars we see in the streets in Bangkok. Human beggars crippled by gangs who take the money donated to them by deluded peole thinking that they are being rewarded with some BS karma.

I digress....

The thing with the organutans is that without zoos and without the tourist dollar there wouldn't be any left here at all in Asia. There are a few in the wild, in Indonessia I think, Borneo, but those are in reserves that are maintained by western dollars. Without conservation and zoos these animals would disappear from the radar. Maybe one of the kids that watches one of these 'shows' will remember the animals and try to something about conserving them when they grow older. Its a crap shot, its not ideal, but I can think of a lot worse things happening in the kingdom than this.

''The thing with the organutans is that without zoos and without the tourist dollar there wouldn't be any left here at all in Asia. There are a few in the wild, in Indonessia I think, Borneo, but those are in reserves that are maintained by western dollars.''

Always nice to hear from an expert.

number Pongo abelii Sumatran orangutan Sumatra 6,667 Pongo pygmaeus Bornean orangutan Borneo P. p. morio Northeast Bornean orangutan Sabah 11,017 P. p. morio Northeast Bornean orangutan East Kalimantan 4,825 P. p. wurmbii Central Bornean orangutan Central Kalimantan >31,300 P. p. pygmaeus Northwest Bornean orangutan West Kalimantan and Sarawak 7,425

Edited October 23, 2012 by fasteddie

[Nisa]

I've seen the show. One of the best attractions in the park.

[pedro01]

Sad stuff. Shame on any tourists that pay to go and see such degrading spectacles as these.

These Orangutans are NOT kicking and punching each other until there is a knockout. These are trained performing animals.

How do you think they're trained? Scooby snacks maybe? Or maybe in some ways you'd rather not have to explain to your kids? Get a clue, dude.

I have a clue, thanks.

The article is incorrect. The Orangutans are not actually boxing by any stretch of the imagination. There are no knockouts. There are no kicks & punches. The whole thing is a parody of Muay Thai.

Now - I will repeat - I leave it to you all to pass judgement on a very tame show featuring trained animals. Some will hate it & some will love it.

What the article describes is not occuring. In fact, it is hilarious to think that people believe you can train 2 powerful animals to fight Muay Thai style. Perhaps others think they can be taught the Queensberry rules. You cannot train 2 large powerul animals to fight with kicks & punches. The reason is fairly simple, when one of the animals actually got hurt by the other, they would revert to more 'natural' means of defending themselves.

[Keesters]

I've been there and its all an act. There are far worse things going on in Thailand. What's worse, a primate dressed up, dancing for food, or a human dressed up dancing, and more, for money?

One chooses to do it, the other not.

[TongueThaied]

All of you who think that this is Cruel.... I guess You are all Vegetarian....

I'm a proud member of PETA (People Eating Tasty Animals).

[BookMan]

Sad stuff. Shame on any tourists that pay to go and see such degrading spectacles as these.

Have you actually seen the show?

Dusit Zoo has Orangutan boxing & it's hilarious. It's a show, a joke. The Orangutans are not actually hitting each other, it's just a couple of them dressing in Muay Thai garb & doing a funny show. There's even a 'dolly bird' Orangutan coming on between rounds holding up the round card.

These Orangutans are NOT kicking and punching each other until there is a knockout. These are trained performing animals. Do you really think you could traing two powerful animals like this to REALLY punch each other without 'going ape' and REALLY getting into the sort of fight 2 adult apes would have.

The article is sensationalism. Of course, if you find trained Orangutans performing a scripted show, fair enough. But boxing? 2 chimps going at it until there is a knockout? It's total nonsense, not happening, sensationalist journalism at it's worst.

I would not pay to see a show like this, as it would support and encourage such spectacles. However, I have watched some youtube footage of the show itself.

The Orang-utans do not knock each other out, but rather perform a variety of rehearsed tricks.

The Orang-utans are caught from the would illegally and are then trained with cruel and harsh methods to perform some ridiculous tricks for us to watch.

I don't find these things funny to watch rather I find them sad when I think of what the animal has had to endure to learn its tricks and the life it has to lead.

[Nisa]

Sad stuff. Shame on any tourists that pay to go and see such degrading spectacles as these.

Have you actually seen the show?

Dusit Zoo has Orangutan boxing & it's hilarious. It's a show, a joke. The Orangutans are not actually hitting each other, it's just a couple of them dressing in Muay Thai garb & doing a funny show. There's even a 'dolly bird' Orangutan coming on between rounds holding up the round card.

These Orangutans are NOT kicking and punching each other until there is a knockout. These are trained performing animals. Do you really think you could traing two powerful animals like this to REALLY punch each other without 'going ape' and REALLY getting into the sort of fight 2 adult apes would have.

The article is sensationalism. Of course, if you find trained Orangutans performing a scripted show, fair enough. But boxing? 2 chimps going at it until there is a knockout? It's total nonsense, not happening, sensationalist journalism at it's worst.

I would not pay to see a show like this, as it would support and encourage such spectacles. However, I have watched some youtube footage of the show itself.

The Orang-utans do not knock each other out, but rather perform a variety of rehearsed tricks.

The Orang-utans are caught from the would illegally and are then trained with cruel and harsh methods to perform some ridiculous tricks for us to watch.

I don't find these things funny to watch rather I find them sad when I think of what the animal has had to endure to learn its tricks and the life it has to lead.

I think you will find they are trained by rewards and not by any cruel means. Not only does it work much much better and is easier but it is also easily witnessed during the show in terms of rewards. These guys are also much safer and live longer than those in the wild.

Although it really doesn't matter since there is no real fighting, you should know that the actual boxing aspect of the show is the shortest part of the show and almost the entire show is just gags taking place in and around a boxing ring.

Edited October 24, 2012 by Nisa

[Nisa]

[Payboy]

I strongly object to that headline referring to Thailand as a Theme Park.

Above post may contain matter offensive to some. Parental guidance is advised.

[BookMan]

Sad stuff. Shame on any tourists that pay to go and see such degrading spectacles as these.

Have you actually seen the show?

Dusit Zoo has Orangutan boxing & it's hilarious. It's a show, a joke. The Orangutans are not actually hitting each other, it's just a couple of them dressing in Muay Thai garb & doing a funny show. There's even a 'dolly bird' Orangutan coming on between rounds holding up the round card.

These Orangutans are NOT kicking and punching each other until there is a knockout. These are trained performing animals. Do you really think you could traing two powerful animals like this to REALLY punch each other without 'going ape' and REALLY getting into the sort of fight 2 adult apes would have.

The article is sensationalism. Of course, if you find trained Orangutans performing a scripted show, fair enough. But boxing? 2 chimps going at it until there is a knockout? It's total nonsense, not happening, sensationalist journalism at it's worst.

I would not pay to see a show like this, as it would support and encourage such spectacles. However, I have watched some youtube footage of the show itself.

The Orang-utans do not knock each other out, but rather perform a variety of rehearsed tricks.

The Orang-utans are caught from the would illegally and are then trained with cruel and harsh methods to perform some ridiculous tricks for us to watch.

I don't find these things funny to watch rather I find them sad when I think of what the animal has had to endure to learn its tricks and the life it has to lead.

I think you will find they are trained by rewards and not by any cruel means. Not only does it work much much better and is easier but it is also easily witnessed during the show in terms of rewards. These guys are also much safer and live longer than those in the wild.

Although it really doesn't matter since there is no real fighting, you should know that the actual boxing aspect of the show is the shortest part of the show and almost the entire show is just gags taking place in and around a boxing ring.

I don't have any evidence in this case that there is any cruelty in the way they train the orang-utans. I hope indeed that they do use reward methods.

I know the animals just have a playful slap around and some boxing style poses, with other orang-outangs coming and going in some vaudeville slapstick routine, which can easily be explained away as being innocent and harmless fun.

It is, however, common with performing animals to use a reward/punishment scheme to get quick results and maintain a performance level when when the animal doesn't want to perform. With most of these tourist parks sourcing their animals illegally you cannot expect the groups to be having high ethical standards to begin with.

The animals might be safer and live longer than in the wild but that doesn't mean they have a better quality of life. Gone is their freedom to roam. In the theme park they probably live in cramped conditions and are frustrated as hell.

[omnilangur]

The Tiger Temple in kanchanaburi, the crocodile farm show in Samut Prakarn and this Orangutang kickboxing should be shut down immediately. Thailand needs more NGO groups to protest and confront these evil people who torture animals. Real progress needs to be made immediately. Anyone want to start a group and do a protest?

[Globeman]

Actually, the elephants love it - you couldn't get them to do it otherwise. The polo guys (yes, they are mostly rich, and this seems to automatically brand them as a***holes) have tried to ensure it doesn't become a huge spectator sport - it is amazing how few people are in the stands when you consider how much money is raised.

By the way, the elephants are only on the pitch for less than ten minutes at a time, and after a chukka (period) they get hosed down and fed. It is a pretty different story from primate boxing. The elephants are also stuck with no way to make a living since the logging bans, and a long lifespan - and a reluctance to change mahouts. Beats begging in the street.

Meanwhile, book me for a slot on the Elephant Polo tour.

It's one thing to see locals and tourists laughing at ridiculous kickboxing urangutans - but nothing wrong racing on regal elephants with other rich bankers and the creme of Thai high-society.

[Nisa]

I don't have any evidence in this case that there is any cruelty in the way they train the orang-utans. I hope indeed that they do use reward methods.

I know the animals just have a playful slap around and some boxing style poses, with other orang-outangs coming and going in some vaudeville slapstick routine, which can easily be explained away as being innocent and harmless fun.

It is, however, common with performing animals to use a reward/punishment scheme to get quick results and maintain a performance level when when the animal doesn't want to perform. With most of these tourist parks sourcing their animals illegally you cannot expect the groups to be having high ethical standards to begin with.

The animals might be safer and live longer than in the wild but that doesn't mean they have a better quality of life. Gone is their freedom to roam. In the theme park they probably live in cramped conditions and are frustrated as hell.

Orangutans are very smart animals as well as very strong. The respond very well to treats and rewards and not punishment. But I agree, many animals (including humans) are taught through a reward/punishment system. Abuse is one thing but I have never heard of an instance of abuse at the Zoo regarding Orangutans and there was a huge investigation a few years ago (down to DNA testing) to determine how many were brought into the country illegally. I do believe people should obey the laws when it comes to removing animals from their natural habitat but when it comes to people doing this who give the animals a good and possibly better life, I have no problem turning a blind eye.