Bike Engine Rebuilt, Now Kick-Start Doesn't 'connect'

[ClareQuilty]

A couple of days ago I had a small bike's engine rebuilt, as well as a new 'clutch' installed. This is a Yamaha Fresh with the 'auto-clutch' or whatever you call it, the click through the gears style shifter like on a Wave. The whole job was done for about 2,000 baht, and the engine started and ran great. I drove it around about a day, but that night I stopped at a 7-11, when I came back out to re-start it five minutes later the kick start just spun free without connecting at all (in neutral of course). So, the bike can't be started (there is no electric start).

Very annoying - now I have to get it all the way across town, about 8 kilometers, to get the original shop to set their work right. Any idea what is wrong? Maybe they didn't install the clutch mechanism right?

[noob7]

Can't help you with the kick starter!

But you can start the bike! I hope, it usually starts right away.

Key 'ON", get it in the sec. gear, use the 'auto clutch', means push the shifter half way down, just before it shifts into 3.

Ask someone, to push you, Downhill you can do it alone.

Try first the 3. gear,. If not starting, use the 2.. should work.

Edited November 6, 2012 by noob7

[Turkleton]

I would not recommend to start the bike!

If there had been something fallen apart inside the engine, a starting/running engine could destroy the rest of it.

[VocalNeal]

Hope you are home now?

[Dutchbike]

As far as i can give a "diagnosis" by reading your post it could be 2 things, onë: something is not tightend inside the engine and came loose ( i assume the rebuild was apart from the clutch plates a new piston and rebore ??) go back to the shop. two: the kickstarter is just "slipping"over the kick axle shaft, caused by not tightening the kick starter nut well enough or a worn axle shaft.

I saw that problem more with older bikes and even a Thai style repairs: welding the kickstarter permanently on the axle shaft :-(

Good luck.

[noob7]

I would not recommend to start the bike!

If there had been something fallen apart inside the engine, a starting/running engine could destroy the rest of it.

So you think, it 'fall apart' during the 5 minutes parking, and not during the ride to the 7/11?

Interesting theory, methinks

[BirdsandBooze]

By what you say `spun free without connecting at all` it could well be that your kickstart pawl has broken. If it is that it is cheap and easy to fix, especially if you don`t trust it to a Thai `mechanic` but do it yourself.

[Turkleton]

So you think, it 'fall apart' during the 5 minutes parking, and not during the ride to the 7/11?

Interesting theory, methinks

Your interpretation, not my theory....

But, do you think, it is impossible, that something 'fall apart' when he tried to kickstart the bike, after his 7/11 shopping? .

two: the kickstarter is just "slipping"over the kick axle shaft, caused by not tightening the kick starter nut well enough or a worn axle shaft.

I saw that problem more with older bikes and even a Thai style repairs: welding the kickstarter permanently on the axle shaft :-(

yepp, thats possible.

[noob7]

I think, that

"the kick start just spun free without connecting at all (in neutral of course)"

gives space for "but in gear, it works".

Only the OP knows.

And in case "something 'fall apart' when he tried to kickstart the bike after his 7/11...", I would assume, he would have written about the "first it felt normal, than a strange sound, and it spun free.

But he mentioned, "when I came back out to re-start it five minutes later the kick start just spun free"

But again, only the OP knows.

[BSJ]

Unreal! You couldn't make this stuff up! What is involved in a 2000 baht engine rebuild? Strip the top end, lap the valves, hone the cylinder, drop in some new rings, silicone every mating surface 'n' bolt it back together. Or is that the 2500 baht rebuild?

PS: I forgot the new clutch.

Edited November 8, 2012 by BSJ

[ClareQuilty]

Unreal! You couldn't make this stuff up! What is involved in a 2000 baht engine rebuild? Strip the top end, lap the valves, hone the cylinder, drop in some new rings, silicone every mating surface 'n' bolt it back together. Or is that the 2500 baht rebuild?

PS: I forgot the new clutch.

Guy, its a ten year old Yamaha Fresh - a bike which was quite cheap new, and is now worth maybe 5-7k baht. It is only a 100 or 110 cc engine - what do you think it costs to rebuild this type of engine? It is always about 1,500-2,500 for a four-stroke, and about 1,000-1,500 for a two-stroke. I've had a few done, and mostly had great luck (admittedly better luck with two-stroke than four-strokes).

I'm a little tired of the taunting about the low-end. Surely it isn't news to anyone that we teachers must live on a low budget.

Anyway, on to the happy news - I had a tuk-tuk carry the bike the 8 kilometers back to the shop outside town (150 baht), where the guy replaced a kind of set of round parts, part metal, part plastic. I have no idea what they were (probably some parts of the clutch), but the total cost was an additional 380 baht, and now the bike works fine.

[VocalNeal]

Claire,

As usual all fixed. The only bug this time was the tuk-tuk ride.

It only took me two or three of your threads to realize where you are coming from with your bike purchases and small problems. Others on here tend to be either newer or slower on the take up.

Feel free to PM anytime to avoid all the price quips.

[cbuddha]

I'm a little tired of the taunting about the low-end. Surely it isn't news to anyone that we teachers must live on a low budget.

Haters gonna hate... They're just jealous they can't be in the Crappy 2T Club. I ride my 3,000 baht Tena with pride, and leave them all behind in a cloud of thick, white freedom.

LOL.

Seriously, though, you don't have to make excuses for having old/cheap/crappy bikes. Especially since you've bought about ten of them for less than the price of a new Fino.

[yankee99]

Unreal! You couldn't make this stuff up! What is involved in a 2000 baht engine rebuild? Strip the top end, lap the valves, hone the cylinder, drop in some new rings, silicone every mating surface 'n' bolt it back together. Or is that the 2500 baht rebuild?

PS: I forgot the new clutch.

Guy, its a ten year old Yamaha Fresh - a bike which was quite cheap new, and is now worth maybe 5-7k baht. It is only a 100 or 110 cc engine - what do you think it costs to rebuild this type of engine? It is always about 1,500-2,500 for a four-stroke, and about 1,000-1,500 for a two-stroke. I've had a few done, and mostly had great luck (admittedly better luck with two-stroke than four-strokes).

I'm a little tired of the taunting about the low-end. Surely it isn't news to anyone that we teachers must live on a low budget.

Anyway, on to the happy news - I had a tuk-tuk carry the bike the 8 kilometers back to the shop outside town (150 baht), where the guy replaced a kind of set of round parts, part metal, part plastic. I have no idea what they were (probably some parts of the clutch), but the total cost was an additional 380 baht, and now the bike works fine.

I mean you really should give BSJ some credit for his advice If you went for the 2380 rebuild instead of the 2000baht you would be ahead 150baht plus time and aggravation!

[ClareQuilty]

Seriously, though, you don't have to make excuses for having old/cheap/crappy bikes. Especially since you've bought about ten of them for less than the price of a new Fino.

Speaking of clouds of smoke for 3,000 baht - I got a Suzuki Akira six speed I want to show you... give a call.

I mean you really should give BSJ some credit for his advice If you went for the 2380 rebuild instead of the 2000baht you would be ahead 150baht plus time and aggravation!

Actually that's a good point, but its all up to the mechanic - I just hand it over to him and see what he comes up with. Sometimes when you rebuild one thing it does put a little stress on other things, and there's often a little 'sorting out' period with follow-up repairs.

[BSJ]

You coming from a different angle. Back home these days the mechanic would probably charge you 2000 baht to give you a quote! Then slug you 7000 baht to do the job.....but that's back home. It's unreal to me that any mechanic would do a rebuild for less than the cost of a good night out here in LOS.

Life is about choices. If teaching is your gig, that's your choice, but there are better paying jobs to be had if you want to make more money. Are you ready for the challenge?

[noob7]

You coming from a different angle. Back home these days the mechanic would probably charge you 2000 baht to give you a quote! Then slug you 7000 baht to do the job.....but that's back home. It's unreal to me that any mechanic would do a rebuild for less than the cost of a good night out here in LOS.

Life is about choices. If teaching is your gig, that's your choice, but there are better paying jobs to be had if you want to make more money. Are you ready for the challenge?

A good night, in LOS, for a Thai mechanic? A bottle Sang Som, some Coke, Some Soda water, plus 2-300 baht for a 'visit'.

So why do they charge 2000 Baht? Oh, 2 mechanics are on tour, plus the boss of the shop!

[ClareQuilty]

<p>

Life is about choices. If teaching is your gig, that's your choice, but there are better paying jobs to be had if you want to make more money. Are you ready for the challenge?

Heck yes, if you know of any better jobs I'd love to hear about them. So far I never met anybody but teachers and retired gentlemen here.

[noob7]

<p>

Life is about choices. If teaching is your gig, that's your choice, but there are better paying jobs to be had if you want to make more money. Are you ready for the challenge?

Heck yes, if you know of any better jobs I'd love to hear about them. So far I never met anybody but teachers and retired gentlemen here.

What is that saying to us? Looks like, some people avoiding, to meet you?

Ever thought about this?

"Birds of a feather flock together."

Edited November 30, 2012 by noob7

[BSJ]

My eldest daughter is a teacher, my sister-in-law is a teacher, my cousin Barry is a teacher. Their 3 people I don't ask "And hows work going"!

[TommoPhysicist]

<p>

Life is about choices. If teaching is your gig, that's your choice, but there are better paying jobs to be had if you want to make more money. Are you ready for the challenge?

Heck yes, if you know of any better jobs I'd love to hear about them. So far I never met anybody but teachers and retired gentlemen here.

I have met quite a few drug dealers and drug smugglers (does that help?).

[ClareQuilty]

<p>...if you know of any better jobs I'd love to hear about them. So far I never met anybody but teachers and retired gentlemen here.

What is that saying to us? Looks like, some people avoiding, to meet you?

Ever thought about this?

"Birds of a feather flock together."

Dude, what kind of farangs do you think live in Isaan? Astronauts? Ferrari salesmen? Its all teachers or 'farang geh' - old retired guys - up here.

By the way, about the bike in the original post -

It is now running ok, never leaves one stranded, however once it gets good and hot after 30-45 minutes of use, it can be a little balky. As in, it kind of jerks, like a bit of a miss, and feels like it might stall out, but doesn't. It keeps going, its just a bit nervous making. I noticed another rebuilt bike of mine - a two stroke Tena, also acted like this a bit. What could cause this kind of thing?

Edited November 30, 2012 by ClareQuilty

[Lickey]

Sounds like a mini-heat seize, like a tight piston/rings, try putting a dessert tablespoon of 2t oil in the tank, prefably with about 3 ltrs of petrol inside, if this helps, gradually decrease the dose till the engine beds in and try it without,

[Turkleton]

What could cause this kind of thing?

As nobody knows, what Somchai REALLY did with your engine, everything could be possible...

But here a few ideas, you can start with.

Wrong/cheap aftermarket piston/rings, cylinder-bore damaged or too big or oval/tapered (from honing),

broken or old gaskets/seals, wrong timings/ignition timing, leaky valves, wrong valve clearance...?

[ClareQuilty]

I honestly don't think its so likely that the guy seriously messed up the job.. its not that difficult. Basically I had the same guess as Lickey:

Sounds like a mini-heat seize, like a tight piston/rings,

I feels just like that - like the engine is 'too tight' or the compression is too high.. like its having difficulty firing off.

try putting a dessert tablespoon of 2t oil in the tank, prefably with about 3 ltrs of petrol inside, if this helps, gradually decrease the dose till the engine beds in and try it without,

Interesting idea, I'll try it. I was also wondering if this is the kind of problem which might get better with time even if you do nothing - like just needing a 'breaking in' period.

[robsamui]

<p>

Life is about choices. If teaching is your gig, that's your choice, but there are better paying jobs to be had if you want to make more money. Are you ready for the challenge?

Heck yes, if you know of any better jobs I'd love to hear about them. So far I never met anybody but teachers and retired gentlemen here.

Well, you just missed a 40K a month job as a general features writer (WP included) on Samui . . . :-(

R

[Neilly]

I feels just like that - like the engine is 'too tight' or the compression is too high.. like its having difficulty firing off.

Don't know this engine, but could the timing be out?

[ClareQuilty]

Well, you just missed a 40K a month job as a general features writer (WP included) on Samui .

Well jeez that's really not any better than teaching. I thought when people mentioned 'better jobs' they meant like 80-120k/month. Teaching already pays 30-45.

I feels just like that - like the engine is 'too tight' or the compression is too high.. like its having difficulty firing off.

Don't know this engine, but could the timing be out?

I thought of that too, but I'm not aware if these type of engines, being only one cyclinder, actually have 'timing'.

[BSJ]

All simple 2 strokes have a set of breaker points or a CDI system. It should fire at idle 0 to 5 degrees before TDC and at full revs (9000???) 10 to 14 degrees before TDC.

[roban]

deleted

Edited December 3, 2012 by roban