Thaksin Announces House Dissolution, New Election

[opothai]

wow anon that is some claim

I cannot dispute that Mr Berlusconi is a bit of a shady guy but I see no evidence of Mr Blair being corrupt and definitely not Mr Kinnock and his wife/family.

The present UK goverment reeks of corruption & lies. Honours for money, goverment contracts to contributors to the Labour Party, Mandelson having to resign TWICE and still getting a job as European Commissioner, the suicide of Dr Kelly, the bogus '45 minutes' claim. I wouldn't trust any of them to clean my drains out.

Endure - I agree. I am no lover of this government and what you say stinks. We have never seen "cronyism" on this scale before but to compare it to "corruption" in the sense of doing it for personal gain on Blairs part to the things Thaksin has (allegedly) done is, in my opinion, like comparing chalk and cheese.

yep it does stink a bit

but it all seems to be true and nothing done if the average man did half of what these 'pillars of society' did,

prison it would be.

[penzman]

I am sick of the farangs whose hatred of Thaksin stems from nothing more than them having to pay a few more satang for their visas

Iam a Farang (correct name) and may I apologize for those Farangs that constantly take great delight in shooting their mouths off about somthing that they know diddly squat about.

Their verbosity outshines their viscosity,.

Fulungs do not have any right to comment about how Thailand runs it's affairs,we are guests in your country and should show respect, once again I apologize for those fulungs who know now better.

Breconman

On your knees, head bowed while typing this part?

[whitespider]

Lukamar

I fully accept your point there is far to much moaning from non-thais and little of it is healthy debate. I have often wondered why the persistant moaners stay here if they are that unhappy with it here.

[dr_Pat_Pong]

I am sick of the farangs whose hatred of Thaksin stems from nothing more than them having to pay a few more satang for their visas

You really haven't got a clue have you ?

[Krub]

Real democracy is surely the least bad political system but....

Democracy needs to be supported by the majority of the people.

The people have to be ready to fully participate in the democratic system.

This means much more than going to the ballot box once evry few years.

Democracy is not only about receiving freedom of justice, euqality, etc but also of responsibility to participate in the process (like paying decent amounts of tax)

I do not think Thailand is ready for real democracy and a strong leader is for the time being the best alternative in the meantime.

Taksin has given Thailand the stability it needs economically to slowly form a base for whatever system the Thais decide for themselves.

If Taksin is re-elected it will be mostly because it is easier to choose a strong leader who is keeping and increasing the confort of most of the Thais.

Strong leadership and strong government is not bad in itself (look at Singapore) and does not mean automatically corruption and personal gain.

Taksin, if re-elected, will continue to increase the well-being of most Thais and enable Thailand to live in peace.

Throwing real democracy at Thailand now and you would risk a lot of unrest and then we 'the farang guests' will have something to really complain about or even to run away from.

[benlee53]

A win again by fearless leader will literally crush his opponents. Smart move - no one can ever call the man stupid.

I agree with you 100%who is going to run against him .He was born at night but not last night he is one smart cookie

[dyertribe]

Don't get me wrong. This is my democratic opinion and nothing personel

And when might we have the pleasure to read your educated opinion?

Educated or not, every person has a right to an opinion. That opinion could be informed or emotional, but to the person who expresses it, it is still valid.

Lets be honest about why people vote for the person of their choice. ME ... I'm not going to vote for someone who is going to make my life harder or less pleasant, even if it does help everyone else who lives in my Soi. I'm going to vote to get the best deal for me.

And now - not responding to nasa, but a general observation about some other posts ... some people seem to have a little personal hate going in here (like for instance Breconman and his sparring partner Jaapfries). Guys, grow up - if you don't like someones post, go on to the next one. At least try to stay "On Topic".

That my lot ...

[Anon999]

wow anon that is some claim

I cannot dispute that Mr Berlusconi is a bit of a shady guy but I see no evidence of Mr Blair being corrupt and definitely not Mr Kinnock and his wife/family.

Sure, corruption goes on everywhere but to compare these people to the billions Mr Thaksin and his cronies are raping from their own countrymen is a bit much.

I am no fan of the people you have mentioned but the fact remains that if they DID things on Thaksins scale they would be in jail now for sure.

I also think you are missing the point about Marcos. He was evil and Thaksin is just a thief but they will both end up the same way - exciled but WITH their millions of dollars

Well as Blair lives on more freebies than I've ever heard of by an English PM, like holidays, flights and junkets, to which he returns the favour by awarding the 'suppliers' with places in the House of Lords or a Knighthood. Furthermore he provides jobs for cronies from his university days and people he shared accommodation with. His wife, a lawyer, used a known criminal to negotiate the purchase of property and uses her position to get on US TV chat shows and to give paid talks on the US circuit. Not to mention when asked by a fashion shop proprietor in OZ, while on a freebee visit, if she would like something, she helped herself to everything she fancied. Much to ths disgust of the owner.

Kinnock was a self serving member of the EU and has quietly arranged for his family to acquire jobs there too.

You could also add Mandleson to the list. Having had to resign twice in short order, (once for financial irregularities) from the cabinet, he gets rewarded with a nice cushy position as an EU Commissioner with all the excessive expenses that provides as it was even beyond Blair to promote him to the cabinet for a third time.

All of those things have been covered extensively by the British press but to no avail. They take the view that they'll do as they please.

Personally I would call that corrupt.

Being a very successful businessman will always provide the opportunity for criticsm. To get to that level requires some sharp practise and I'm sure you are aware of Bernie Ecclestone as a prime example. What makes you think that any astute businessman has all his assets in one place or one country? Marcos was not a businessman. I assume you meant "exciled but WITHOUT their millions of dollars"

That was my point about Marcos, he was evil not just a thief.

It's a nice idea to think that the top, corrupt, politicians would end up in goal for their actions. However, it rarely ever seems to happen, I wonder why?

Edited February 25, 2006 by Anon999

[bjsanook]

Taksin, if re-elected, will continue to increase the well-being of most Thais and enable Thailand to live in peace.

I'm not so sure people out in Isaan agree with that statement. At least the ones I know.

Maybe you mean the well being of well off Thai's.

BJ

[lukamar]

Lukamar

I have often wondered why the persistant moaners stay here if they are that unhappy with it here.

They may not have been happy at "home' either, possibly they have been looking for something in Thailand that has not come to fruition, maybe they blame others for the problems they themselves have created, perhaps once they sober up they realize that Thailand is more than Chiang and Bar-girls and then some people are not happy anywhere, and will find any excuse to whine, bitch and moan.

[tettyan]

One thing about the countryside vs. city vote, the lines aren't that clearly drawn. It's hardly elite against Thaksin and all the poor for him either.

Heng, I usually differ with you but I absolutely agree with you on this one. The so-called Bangkok-countryside divide is sort of an urban legend perpetuated by the Bangkok-dominated media. The whole issue is rather complex, but it's hard for city-dwellers to see through it since the media (which tends to look down upon rural people anyway) doesn't really make much of an effort to understand the political mood of the provinces. It's rather frustrating, but also one of the reasons why I visit this forum to seek information!

Well Blair is adept at enriching himself and so is his wife, publicly! Chirac is a criminal and you could hardly call the Italian PM squeeky clean. However, there is not much in the way of street protests against these people, despite all the press coverage they get as a result. The EU parliament is a 'gravy train' for corrupt politicians like Kinnock and his family who all seem to be involved, and unelected bureaucrats too.

So what's new in Thailand that's not happening in Europe, etc.?

It's a difference of degree. Of course, it doesn't excuse either, but let's face it, it matters.

Hitler killed 6 million Jews. The Japanese Imperial Army massacred 200,000 Chinese in Nanjing. Both acts were deplorable, but there is a difference.

Thaksin is bad, but as the Economist put it recently: Who is better? The other parties / politicians would all like to be Thaksin themselves, they are just as corrupt or even more, and on top of it many seem outright stupid, something that Thaksin definitely isn't.

That Thais will vote for him again has more to do with the complete lack of credible alternatives. I don't know Sondhi, I hope he wins a lot of votes with whatever party he runs with so the government doesn't own all the seats.

As far as I know, Sondhi is not a member of a political party, and is thus not eligible to run in this election (thank God). I think the Oxford-educated leader of the Democrats, Abhisit, is a credible alternative. He's been rather invisible lately, I think because he doesn't want to become too closely associated with the opposition out on the streets. Again, let me impress upon all of you the concept that there really are two oppositions - the parliamantary opposition and the mob - which have historically had an ambivalent and at times antagonistic relationship. Remember, it was Sondhi along with the NGO and trade union leaders who originally threw their lot with Thaksin in 2001 to oust the previous Democrat government.

[phuketrichard]

Do U all sleep under rocks? Thaksin won the rural vote.. why?? becaue he brought it.

He will will win it next time as well. Its not so much city folk vs country.. it any one with an brain vs the rest. The rural vote is dictated by the politicans and they get Favors and tell their people how to vote and they do. Its that simple

The whole Anti movement is based in Bangkok along with the south knowing who and what he is

He will win and the shit will continue

quote name='thaipro_pattaya' date='2006-02-24 19:10:37' post='656972']

Thaksin will be able to do much with a new mandate, it will silence his know nothing critics.

[tettyan]

Strong leadership and strong government is not bad in itself (look at Singapore) and does not mean automatically corruption and personal gain.

The "authoritarian transition" paridigm has been discredited time and again over the past four decades, yet many laymen persist in subscribing to this theory. Let's put it this way. How many Lee Kuan Yew's are in this world? One. How many dictators end up like Marcos or Mobutu? Countless.

There's no way you can compare Lee to Thaksin. Lee was quite serious about tackling corruption - he even had several of his own ministers prosecuted for it. How many of Thaksin's cronies have been sacked or charged for corruption? Zero. Does that mean NONE of them are corrupt? Even many Thaksin supporters concede that that is not the case.

Throwing real democracy at Thailand now and you would risk a lot of unrest and then we 'the farang guests' will have something to really complain about or even to run away from.

What a rather patronizing idea. The same line of logic was used to justify colonialism. Maybe the world should just revert back to that system, just for the sake of "stability".

Edited February 25, 2006 by tettyan

[lukamar]

The rural vote is dictated by the politicans and they get Favors and tell their people how to vote and they do. Its that simple

You have managed to describe the democratic voting process for every Democracy and Republic on earth. The governing politicians always offer perks to get reelected, the opposition always promises perks to get elected. Why should the system in Thailand work any differently than Canada, UK, USA, Russia, Germany and the list goes on. Sorry, but that's how Democracy really work.

[LaoPo]

The rural vote is dictated by the politicans and they get Favors and tell their people how to vote and they do. Its that simple

You have managed to describe the democratic voting process for every Democracy and Republic on earth. The governing politicians always offer perks to get reelected, the opposition always promises perks to get elected. Why should the system in Thailand work any differently than Canada, UK, USA, Russia, Germany and the list goes on. Sorry, but that's how Democracy really work.

Well said.

Politicians are ALL the same, all over the World, when they are trying to 'grab' the Power. Once they are IN Power they 'forgot' what they said and promised....

When there are new elections (and the 'old' guys have to step down) the 'new' guys are generous to the 'old' guys and reward them with good jobs elsewhere in the country untill the ball rolls again....and again...

Nothing new...as old as the World's history.

It's all about Power&(future)Money, nothing but Power&Money..or has someone here the idea that the most Powerful men in the World do it for their miserable salaries?

Men/Women like GW Bush, Putin, the Beijing Clan, Tony Blair, Chirac, Aroyo, Chavez, Berlusconi, Fidel Castro.....should I continue...oh I forgot, Mr TS

Power&Money

LaoPo

[Jai Dee]

THAKSIN TACKLES CRITICS

'Me or them'

PM dissolves House; sets snap poll for April 2 n Democracy leaders meet today to decide on theme for tomorrow's rally

Prime Minister Thaksin Shinawatra last night announced that he was "returning power to the people" by dissolving the House of Represen-tatives and calling a snap election for April 2.

"Now that political conflict has arisen, I would like to ask you to decide if you want to use the services of this government again. I will respect the decision of the public, not just one group of people," Thaksin said during a televised address lasting just over 10 minutes.

"Let me return the power to you so that the public will decide again. The next election will be extraordinary. I ask my fellow countrymen to turn out in force in making this important decision," said Thaksin.

He said he had dissolved the House because of "attempts to overthrow the government by people who stand to lose their benefits".

He also blamed "those who are unhappy with the government and various political groups".

"I can't stand it when mob rule tries to override the law," he said.

Thaksin said he had consulted with "people with good intentions towards the country" before coming up with the decision.

If political uncertainties were allowed to continue, he said, the country's economy would suffer.

The premier said the House dissolution was aimed at preventing a repeat of the violence that broke out in May 1992, the impact of which is still being redressed.

He was concerned another clash could break out at a public rally scheduled for tomorrow at Sanam Luang.

Before Thaksin's address, an announcer read out a statement by the Prime Minister's Office explaining the political situation that led to the decision.

The announcement came after mounting pressure on Thaksin to bring about political change.

Just a few weeks ago, Thaksin insisted he would stay his full four-year term.

He told his political opponents and critics to "wait until their next lives" for him to step down.

Thaksin broke the news of the House dissolution to reporters waiting at Thai Rak Thai Party headquarters.

He had had an audience with His Majesty the King at the Chitralada Palace at about 5pm.

"I have dissolved the House. There's no Cabinet reshuffle," he said.

The premier was heard humming a melody when he arrived at the party headquarters, shortly after 6pm.

He patted the shoulder of party deputy spokesman Pimuk Simaroj and said: "Let's do it over again; contest a new election."

Sources said Thaksin was also considering a Cabinet shake-up as an option to break the stand-off with his opponents.

He also raised the matter when meeting with Privy Council president General Prem Tinsulanonda at the latter's house on Thursday, according to a source, who added that Prem recommended dissolving the House.

Rumours of an imminent House dissolution were prevalent earlier yesterday.

Thaksin fuelled rumours while presiding over a ceremony to mark the 90th anniversary of the Cooperative League of Thailand (CLT) in the morning.

"If you want to use me, please vote for me," he said to a cheering crowd of CLT members who convened a meeting to boost morale at Impact Arena Muang Thong Thani.

A Government House source said Thaksin decided to dissolve the House because he could not find a suitable candidate to replace him as prime minister.

Thaksin wanted a snap election to be held as soon as possible, preferably on April 2 or April 9, according to the source.

Earlier in the day, Election Commission (EC) member Prinya Nakchudtree said the agency would be able to make preparations in time for the general election to take place on April 2.

He said the EC would have to send lists of eligible voters to each household at least 20 days before election day but he was confident preparations could be made in time.

The EC yesterday announced that registration of candidates would be open from Wednesday until March 5.

Suriyasai Katasila, a coordinator of the People's Alliance for Democracy (PAD), said the group was unhappy with Thaksin's decision to dissolve the House and saw it as a selfish act.

He said the House dissolution would not solve the current problems but would allow Thaksin to seek a comeback and prolong his rule.

Suriyasai said that with the House being dissolved, tomorrow's rally would shift its theme from demanding the premier's resignation to urging people not to vote for the ruling party again.

PAD leaders will hold a meeting today to decide how to organise the demonstration at Sanam Luang, he said, adding that he believed it would not last longer than one day, as expected. The anti-Thaksin campaigners earlier vowed to "fight until we win".

Chamlong Srimuang, who has led his Dharma Army Foundation to join the anti-Thaksin campaign, yesterday said the premier should have resigned as it was him, not the House of Representatives, who was "the cause of all the problems".

"An election won't help ease social conflict. Thaksin and the Thai Rak Thai Party will be re-elected because their voter support is still strong," said Chamlong in a tired voice.

Source: The Nation - 25 Feb 2006

[Krub]

Taksin, if re-elected, will continue to increase the well-being of most Thais and enable Thailand to live in peace.

I'm not so sure people out in Isaan agree with that statement. At least the ones I know.

Maybe you mean the well being of well off Thai's.

BJ

I can only speak of experience and I think that the country people around my small village 25 km out of Uttaradti which is not really a Silicon Valley area are doing reasonnably better compared to the pre Taksin years.

Strong leadership and strong government is not bad in itself (look at Singapore) and does not mean automatically corruption and personal gain.

The "authoritarian transition" paridigm has been discredited time and again over the past four decades, yet many laymen persist in subscribing to this theory. Let's put it this way. How many Lee Kuan Yew's are in this world? One. How many dictators end up like Marcos or Mobutu? Countless.

There's no way you can compare Lee to Thaksin. Lee was quite serious about tackling corruption - he even had several of his own ministers prosecuted for it. How many of Thaksin's cronies have been sacked or charged for corruption? Zero. Does that mean NONE of them are corrupt? Even many Thaksin supporters concede that that is not the case.

Throwing real democracy at Thailand now and you would risk a lot of unrest and then we 'the farang guests' will have something to really complain about or even to run away from.

What a rather patronizing idea. The same line of logic was used to justify colonialism. Maybe the world should just revert back to that system, just for the sake of "stability".

Maybe we should try to impose our democracy and non-corrupt way of managing a country like 'we' try to do in Irak with the concequences we know.

I am not saying Taksin is a Lee but at least he created and kept stability together with pushing for economic succes for a big portion of Thais.

I do not believe Thailand os ready for outright democracy without a strong leader as it will be in high risk of unrest which will see misery and real hardship for all Thais and us 'guests'

I still think democracy is the way to go but too much right is often abused and turned into wrong also.

[Jai Dee]

People power remembered

The struggle for fuller democracy calls for patience and perseverance, as last night's House dissolution illustrates.

Twenty years ago today, more than 1 million Filipinos converged for the fourth day in a row on Edsa, a main thoroughfare in the metropolitan Manila area. They vociferously demonstrated against then-president Ferdinand Marcos, successfully toppling this corrupt dictator, restoring democracy and installing Corazon Aquino, the widow of slain senator Benigno Aquino Jr, as president of the republic. People Power, which has now come to refer to any populist uprising against a corrupt authoritarian regime, was born.

It spread from the Philippines to leave a legacy of mostly peaceful political change in several countries around the world: in Poland, then in the former Czechoslovakia and in more recent times, through democratic revolutions in Georgia and Ukraine. The People Power movement was inspired in no small measure by the daring non-violent movement of Mahatma Gandhi that was responsible for purging India of British rule. And peaceful civil disobedience has since become an effective political tool of the oppressed with which to show their disapproval of dictatorial regimes everywhere.

Many studies have been written about the impact that People Power has had on democracy - or the lack thereof - in the Philippines. Manila's modern cityscape may have undergone tremendous changes over these past two decades, but the lives of most Filipinos remain mired in poverty. The economic situation there is simply deplorable. President Gloria Macapagal-Arroyo, a direct beneficiary of the Edsa protests, has completely failed the Filipino public. And now, even her democratic allies have turned against her and want to pressure her out of office, because of rampant corruption and gross inefficiency in her administration. But the biggest frustrations are those that are felt by the vast majority of citizens - the mass of poor living as squatters in Manila and upcountry. They expected democracy to improve their standard of living and bring about a brighter future. Luckily, the Filipinos' world-renowned resiliency has prevented even this worst of situations from dampening their spirits in any way, nor is the freedom they have enjoyed since the fall of Marcos viewed cynically.

Thailand has itself gone through its own versions of People Power in the past. In all three bloody uprisings that have occurred here since 1973, mostly peaceful demonstrators were subjected to the use of lethal force by government security forces. A high price was paid in the struggle for democracy in the form of lives lost.

Some Thai historians assert that Thailand's October 1973 uprising, which toppled the Thanom-Prapas military dictatorship, actually inspired the Filipinos to rise up against their own strongman, Marcos. State-sanctioned violence against unarmed protesters ultimately caused the collapse of the Thai regime, the brutal killings having deprived the leaders of all legitimacy to rule.

Now fast-forward to today. The anti-Thaksin movement has recently begun to gather momentum. Protesters will converge on Sanam Luang tomorrow in what is expected to be our largest expression yet of People Power. They will come together with the same objective in mind: delivering the same message to a beleaguered Thaksin Shinawatra that he no longer possesses the legitimacy or moral authority to rule.

Even though the House dissolution announced by Thaksin last night is a legitimate means of addressing the current political crisis, it should not be allowed to distract attention from the real issues of Thaksin's actions over the past five years and his lack of fitness to rule. Thailand's People Power movement must be prepared for a long, hard fight to drive home that message to the public at large, even if the Thai Rak Thai Party is returned to power with another House majority.

Anti-Thaksin activists say they will go ahead and stage Sunday's anti-Thaksin rally. They must see to it that their protest will be peaceful and not allow emotions to get the better of their good judgement. Government security forces must also exercise restraint in ensuring peace and order.

No one said the struggle for fuller democracy would be quick or easy.

Source: Editorial from The Nation - 25 Feb 2006

[gerryfarang]

I am sick of the farangs whose hatred of Thaksin stems from nothing more than them having to pay a few more satang for their visas

Thats a bit simple. I agree some farangs base there hatred of Mr. Thaksin because of raised visa fees or bar time closings. Many other farangs thou hate Mr. Thaksin for other reasons, civil rights, abuse of power, corruption, arrogance ETC.

It is much more than just a visa price thing for most farangs.

[Estrada]

SNAP ELECTION

Thaksin announces House dissolution

The prime minister then went to the Thai Rak Thai party head office and told reporters there that he had received a royal command to dissolve the House of Representatives.

He appeared relaxed and humming a song.

Was it Queen? WE ARE THE CHAMPIONS?

I’ve paid my dues -

Time after time -

I’ve done my sentence

But committed no crime -

And bad mistakes

I’ve made a few

I’ve had my share of sand kicked in my face -

But I’ve come through

We are the champions - my friends

And we’ll keep on fighting - till the end -

We are the champions -

We are the champions

No time for losers

’cause we are the champions - of the world -

I’ve taken my bows

And my curtain calls -

You brought me fame and fortuen and everything that goes with it -

I thank you all -

But it’s been no bed of roses

No pleasure cruise -

I consider it a challenge before the whole human race -

And I ain’t gonna lose -

We are the champions - my friends

And we’ll keep on fighting - till the end -

We are the champions -

We are the champions

No time for losers

’cause we are the champions - of the world -

[marshbags]

An interesting view taken from this mornings Nation.

JUST A THOUGHT

Strange politics for strange days

Whether or not something is "strange" depends largely on one's experience, because this is such a relative term.

To some, especially the powerful, many strange events have taken place in Thai politics over the past couple of months, including government MPs breaking ranks with the ruling party. The latest one has been the opposition seeking government-MP votes to launch a censure motion against the PM.

Even stranger is the fact that high-school students have formed an alliance and declared their stance on the current administration. Along with university students nationwide, youths have proven the doubtful wrong; they may be overly preoccupied with consumerism, but they do care about politics, particularly when the leader loses his legitimacy to rule.

So, what is not strange in Thai politics? Here's a list of what has evolved into "the usual":

1. The silent treatment for all questions. Despite repeated calls for clarification of numerous fishy deals and possible conflicts of interest, no clear answers were ever provided, and those involved were able to get away for so long because of clever spin tactics. Politicians have not needed to be accountable for their actions at all.

The question of morality has never been so high on Thailand's checklist as it is now. Five years ago, committing an "honest mistake" was excusable, but today nothing can justify it any more.

2. Silencing of the media. Libel and defamation suits are the best strategy for shutting up critics, not to mention frightening them. Fortunately, they have not worked. Supinya Klangnarong, secretary-general of the Campaign for Popular Democracy, is a walking testament to that, and she's not alone, having later been joined by media mogul Sondhi Limthongkul and his employees.

Silencing the media is a common path of dictators and others with much to hide. Even if the right to freedom of expression is not explicitly stated in the Constitution, any leader of a democratic country should know well that exchanging ideas is vital to ensuring growth.

3. Politicians not being answerable to their conscience. Instead of serving the public, various politicians today serve only their "master". They can no longer distinguish between personal and national interest. Enslaved by the Constitution, one might argue, but is that so? Everyone is entitled to stand up for what one thinks, and deciding to throw honour down the drain is a matter of choice.

Take the recent instance of allowing a United Arab Emirates company to take over management of six major US ports. Democrats and Republicans alike have voiced caution over the deal. Being a fellow Republican doesn't mean the person cannot criticise President George W Bush. Unfortunately, it is not that way in Thailand.

4. Independent organisations that are not independent. This is the most disappointing aspect of constitutional reform since 1997. Checks and balances have been destroyed, not because laws are not in place, but because there are those who interpret those laws in a certain manner. Again and again, guardians of the law have neglected their duty and betrayed the people's trust in them.

All of this may lead one to think it's time for some constitutional amendments, but do we really need that? Changing the law 10 or even a hundred times cannot solve any of the country's problems, so long as the authorities lack the spirit to work for the good of the country.

The government's invitation to university rectors to help brainstorm on amending the Constitution and its move to "consult" both houses reflect a sense of urgency to do something to quell people power, but these moves have come just a little too late.

Quite a coincidence that today marks the 20th anniversary of the People Power revolution in the Philippines, which toppled the authoritarian regime of President Ferdinand Marcos.

For Thailand, we have been embroiled in what has become "politics as usual" for so long that the line between what is strange and what is not has become totally blurred.

The good news is that the process of setting the standard right once again starts on a grand scale at Sanam Luang tomorrow!

Veenarat Laohapakakul

The Nation....................................................end of the article.

Some reasonable and very relative points as far as my take goes and not made by a farang.

The last elected TRT members must be feeling like true scapegoats for something that after all is down to the Kamoy in chief and his family.

Since when do 500 members of a political party, many of which are decent human beings, capable of running Thailand for Thai people without expecting personal gain from it all, have to be sacrificed

When they sought to form the party many of them did not become party members to further the

repeated mis use of power for the unethical choosen few, who are responsible for whatever has happened and what may now turn into a nasty situation.

They supposedly formed a party to achieve the opposite and stop all the wrong doings of years gone by not multiply them.

The genuine TRT members must be thinking of this on a constant basis but up until now have been made powerless, may they have the courage and find a way to overcome this for the sake of all fair minded Thai,s.

We have said it many times but again they all deserve better.

There can be a lot of positives achieved if they can get beyong the Kamoy and his band of Thieves.

marshbags

Edited February 25, 2006 by marshbags

[lukamar]

Many other farangs thou hate Mr. Thaksin for other reasons, civil rights, abuse of power, corruption, arrogance ETC.

Most of this is based on a western value system. You have to look at it through Thai eyes and from a Thai perspective, a majority of Thai think he's just fine and dandy. Thai's will vote and decide and we will just have to adjust to the outcome. No amount of complaining or arguing will swing one vote, Thai's will just agree with your point of view and then go off and vote the way they want, it's the Thai Way. No confrontation at any cost and we just have to get used to it.

[tettyan]

I can only speak of experience and I think that the country people around my small village 25 km out of Uttaradti which is not really a Silicon Valley area are doing reasonnably better compared to the pre Taksin years.

The relationship between political leadership and economic conditions is not so simple. Remember, Marcos was elected twice in landslides early on party because voters gave him credit for the economy, which was doing well then, but with little thanks to him. It took the people 20 years to realize the real damage he had done, but it was already too late to fix things then. I'm afraid that Thailand hasn't learnt the lessons of the Phillippines, it's a slippery slope, and Thailand is slowly slipping down.

Maybe we should try to impose our democracy and non-corrupt way of managing a country like 'we' try to do in Irak with the concequences we know.

I am not saying Taksin is a Lee but at least he created and kept stability together with pushing for economic succes for a big portion of Thais.

I do not believe Thailand os ready for outright democracy without a strong leader as it will be in high risk of unrest which will see misery and real hardship for all Thais and us 'guests'

I still think democracy is the way to go but too much right is often abused and turned into wrong also.

Whose to judge who's "ready" for democracy and who is not? The British used the excuse that the Indians weren't "ready" for democracy in order to prolong their rule. Japan was a developing country in 1950, and it managed to develop itself pretty quickly, all under a democratic system.

Many Thaksin apologists emphasize "stability" and "strong leadership", so let me speak to these points. For one, the two factors are by no means correlated. Japanese politics, for instance have been very stable, even with (or because of?) the absence of strong leadership (PMs last less than 2 yrs on avg and the ruling party is highly factionalized). Check out my post in the "Beginning of the End?" thread (I repost it at the bottom for your convenience - apologies to those who have already seen it). In many ways, Thaksin's style of leadership is what is threatening to destabalize Thailand now. The protesters arn't the cause of the problems, they're the effect. If you're academically inclined, I suggest you check out the work of Yale political scientist Juan Linz, particularly his essay "The Perils of Presidentialism".

Let me just add another word about "stability." At this point, the source of Thailand's political instability is Thaksin himself. With his abrasive manner, authoritarian style, refusal to listen to critics and intimidation of the press, he has limited political space. These efforts to manage society and limit political space has caused tension in society to simmer to a boiling point. He yields a little only when he's really pushed into a corner - which only further encourages his detractors.

It all didn't have to turn out this way. If he had governed with a sublter style and delegated more authority, then maybe things would have been different. Thaksin's obsession with winning every battle (i.e. his control freakery) could end up causing him to lose the war. Check out this BKK Post op-ed, BTW, on some of the problems of Thaksin's politcal style: http://www.bangkokpost.com/News/24Feb2006_news23.php

Of course, it's too late for Thaksin to get a personality transplant now. Even if he did, he's already needlessly pissed too many people off, so it wouldn't help matters much. I think for him, the smartest course is to resign gracefully now, which would leave the door open to a comeback in the future (as scary as that may sound to me).

Edited February 25, 2006 by tettyan

[Cassandra]

Many other farangs thou hate Mr. Thaksin for other reasons, civil rights, abuse of power, corruption, arrogance ETC.

Most of this is based on a western value system. You have to look at it through Thai eyes and from a Thai perspective, a majority of Thai think he's just fine and dandy. Thai's will vote and decide and we will just have to adjust to the outcome. No amount of complaining or arguing will swing one vote, Thai's will just agree with your point of view and then go off and vote the way they want, it's the Thai Way. No confrontation at any cost and we just have to get used to it.

You're correct of course.Most of us -resident expatriates- have little natural sympathy for Thaksin whether we broadly come from the left or the right.Nevertheless it's fairly clear Thaksin will win the elections albeit with a reduced majority given his support in the countryside.But politics can be uncertain and it would take a brave man to attempt to predict the precise outcome.However returning to this forum surely even the most rabid anti-Thaksin expat must in a moment of clarity realise how irrelevant and useless are the rambling hyms of hate seen over the last few weeks.Expats opinions simply don't matter, and in any case this forum is probably more representative of the "floating" expat community than the more permanently established expats.

[bdenner]

Do U all sleep under rocks? Thaksin won the rural vote.. why?? becaue he brought it.

Yep! I notice the red and blue jackets handed out in this Amphur last election are fading, looking a bit tattered and ready for replacement. Looking forward to this years offering.

IMO The "Rural Poor" are looking at what is happening in the Bangkok and the South. The rising cost of energy is having it's effect, the teachers are not happy etc. etc. I think it's going to take more than a jacket this time to keep a lot of rural voters pointed in the same direction as the last election.

[john b good]

He will almost certainly win re-election although with a reduced majority.

He's called the elction because he knows he's in serious trouble and knows he will still win through the rural vote, even though they are voting whilst being misinformed, if they really knew the truth and got unbiased media reports it could be quite different.

The fact he is disolving the house shows he is in serious trouble, the campaigners should absolutley not accept this and carry on with the rally accepting nothing less that his total resignation and exit from politics. If they carry on with the protests it's more than likley they will get what they want.

There's no way a crook like this should be allowed to stand for re-election.

He should be behind bars.

Correct ! Only a full resignation would satisfy me. The only sad thing is that the people who know the facts are in the minority and the masses (brain washed as they are) will almost certainly will almost certainly vote the ar%ehole back in.

[Estrada]

Copycat wrote:

Analysing mosts posts of our single-minded Thaksin fans here i see rather short outbursts with catastrophic syntax and spelling,

The ability to type on a keyboard and minimal intellectual capacity appearantly are completely different matters.

I am fed up with self righteous posters complaining about others spelling mistakes, and then go on to post a sequence of catastrophic syntax and spelling themselves:

Please note that APPEARANTLY is apparently spelt APPARENTLY.

But then again, as you stated "The ability to type on a keyboard and minimal intellectual capacity appearantly are completely different matters".

As for Single minded Thaksin fans. I met him first in 1997 when the Country was Bankrupted by the Opposition. He said he never wanted to be Prime Minister, but I persuaded him that he was the best man for the job being a Businessman. He went on to win the Election and paid off the IMF loan in record time. He has made Thailand strong again. Now there are many mega projects about to kick off, the opposition want to get rid of him, so that they can have their turn at the trough. The opposition do not have the good of the Country at heart, and only want to line their pockets.

I am actually close to the Democratic party and a former advisor to Sanan. I do not support TRT but Thaksin is the best man for Prime Minister.

[frodo]

I'm sure that everyone here realizes that in the end the decision rests on the voters here. Nobody disputes that at all. I have yet to see foreigners out in the streets protesting with their picket signs. I heven't seen foreigners placing signs on windows, poles, or store fronts demanding the resignation of the PM. All I have seen is people expressing their views on a weboard in cyberspace. It won't make a difference one way or another.

Though I respect other peoples point of views, I don't agree with what many people are writing. The talk about how we shouldn't be able to express dissatisfaction, should not be able to openly have a viewpoint since "we are only guests here," or that Thai people will judge all foreigners for even mentioning politics since it is nothing but western idealism is rubbish.

I work with many Thai people (female and male) and on occasion we, meaning my foreign co-workers and myself, are asked about our opinions about the government. It is something we never bring up first, however, if asked, then it's okay. Likewise, we may ask their feelings about the current situation in Iraq, about GWB, etc. Nobodys judging anybody, the conversations are excellent, and all of us learn from each other. The only people who have ever mentioned western ideals, being ethnocentric, or anything remotely close to this are the foreigners themselves.

Reading some of the posts here, I have to ask myself, "How long have you lived here and do you openly talk with the locals or are the interactions on a very superficial basis only?" Granted, I've been living here for 7-years and have walked by places such as Patpong and Nana maybe four times (never visited these places), therefore, I don't have an inkling to what is discussed in pubs or bars. Maybe I have missed something by not visiting these places or places like them. From my own experience, I've yet to meet a foreigner anywhere here that will suddenly strike up a conversation and start talking about how bad the government is. Amongst friends in the privacy of our homes, we can and do talk about different governments. So what? Certainly, our opinions are not taken to the streets.

Maybe some of you are having different experiences. As of today, no Thai person that I personally know has ever once accused any foreigner of what some of you are describing.

[Noel]

SNAP ELECTION

Thaksin announces House dissolution

BANGKOK: -- Prime Minister Thaksin Shinawatra announced a House dissolution Friday evening after he was granted an audience with His Majesty the King.

Anek Laothamthap, a former leader of Mahachon Party, denounced Thaksin for dissolving the House without informing other parties first as he had promised in the past.

Anek said Thaksin used to say he would inform MPs and other parties at least 90 days before a House dissolution so that MPs could switch party.

--The Nation 2006-02-24

Well as Thaksin is against 90 Day Reporting, he can't be all bad...

[lukamar]

Expats opinions simply don't matter, and in any case this forum is probably more representative of the "floating" expiate community than the more permanently established expats.

The thing is that the foreign community can have a voice and a say in the way things are done and the decisions that are made regarding foreigners by the government. We have jointly a lot of pull and a lot of capital to use as leverage; but things have to be done slowly by lobbing the Thai Government and it's Ministries to bring the concerns of the foreign community to their attention, in a peaceful and non-confrontational manner. Will things change, of course they will, but it's slow and every time some foreigner gets arrested for some crime like pedophilia or forged passports the foreign cause is setback once again. You have to remember that we ARE the visible minority and our actions are noticed by the Thai population.

There is a Thai proverb

งามแต่รูปจูบไม่หอม

Ngam tae rup, jub mai horm - Great look but bad breath.

Those who have good appearance, but do not behave well.

The foreign community should act so the Thai population does not think we all have bad breath.