Five Killed, 49 Injured When Bus Falls Into Ravine In Phitsanulok

[tom21]

i have traveled on the bus once, a year ago and you could smell the overheated brake pads. since then the only way i would go to chiang mai is via bangkok

[belg]

and we just had a story on TV here that people do not like to go to court as it takes so long to get their money after an accident

[Dap]

If someone started collecting statistics of accidents and deaths by bus company, people could start choosing the safest company to go with. Could even make the bus companies invest a bit in safety.

, people could start choosing the safest company to go with.

There ain't one.

Nakhonchai Air ? http://www.thaivisa.com/forum/topic/468030-nakhonchai-air-bus-types/#entry4426884 for example.

+1

[tom21]

If someone started collecting statistics of accidents and deaths by bus company, people could start choosing the safest company to go with. Could even make the bus companies invest a bit in safety.

, people could start choosing the safest company to go with.

There ain't one.

Nakhonchai Air ? http://www.thaivisa.com/forum/topic/468030-nakhonchai-air-bus-types/#entry4426884 for example.

+1

+2

[hullupullo]

I'm not familiar with Sombat Tours. Any more info or links on them?

http://www.sombattour.com/html/home.php

These 2 are good too

http://www.phetprasert.com/

http://www.iloveyellowbus.com/en/home.php

[belg]

we farang living here, have to report every 90 days, go begg each year for another extention

but cars, busses, trucks are never checked ever if they are road worthy or puffing out toxic fumes like those nice old 20 - 30 year or diesel trucks and busses which makes life and breathing very difficult

28.000 deaths per year, i tought any government would be concerned of losing so many of their country men

maybe here it is just a form of ... demographic controles ?

[CobraSnakeNecktie]

I take that bus once in a while. Last trip there was a truck with 3 trailers that flipped and blocked the mountain pass for 6 hours.

One <deleted> observation I have made is that few people wear the seat belts on these busses.

[T_Dog]

I rode on my last mini van yesterday from Ao Nong to Phuket and sent photos and a letter to the tourism authority. Others took video and hopefully are sending it in as well. The driver passed with oncoming traffic about a dozen times, either forcing the oncoming car onto the shoulder or swerving in at the last second. Everyone in the van was terrified and words to the driver had no effect. Crazy thing is that after all that passing, we stopped for a twenty minute rest break before renewing the death dance. A private taxi is twice as expensive, but you can tell the driver to slow down which might save your life. We were in the back of that mini van and if it had crashed, egressing would have been a sketchy affair.

Positive feedback for Nakonchai Air and Ligenite Tours however. Both of those lines seem to train drivers to be smooth and safe.

[eddie61]

we farang living here, have to report every 90 days, go begg each year for another extention

but cars, busses, trucks are never checked ever if they are road worthy or puffing out toxic fumes like those nice old 20 - 30 year or diesel trucks and busses which makes life and breathing very difficult

28.000 deaths per year, i tought any government would be concerned of losing so many of their country men

maybe here it is just a form of ... demographic controles ?

Mainly worthless peasants and farangs die in bus accidents.

Hardly worth getting worked up about it. Phu yai and their kids get driven around in german limos

[scotbeve]

If someone started collecting statistics of accidents and deaths by bus company, people could start choosing the safest company to go with. Could even make the bus companies invest a bit in safety.

A safe bus company is Nakornchai Air. They go the speed limit and the busses are in good shape.

[TallGuyJohninBKK]

I take that bus once in a while. Last trip there was a truck with 3 trailers that flipped and blocked the mountain pass for 6 hours.

One <deleted> observation I have made is that few people wear the seat belts on these busses.

NCA buses usually, if not always, have seatbelts.

Ever since repeatedly reading these kinds of OP reports of horrible crashes here on ThaiVisa, I now absolutely wear a seatbelt anytime I'm traveling and can.

Of course, the flip side to that is like what occurred recently with a van crash (I wanna say near Pattaya) where the van caught fire during the crash and most of the occupants were trapped and died inside. Horrible way to go.

But another fine advertisement for the tourism industry here.

[xen]

Just having driven back from Pattaya to Bangkok just a few hours ago , i find the larger buses are not the worry as much as the mini buses not only for their passengers but other road users. Tailgating at high speed, erractic lane changing without indication and judgement of safe passing distances make them an absolute horror to share the road with. The thing that concerns me is a lot of their driving behaviour is very indicative of yaa baa use and yaa baa's long term delusional invincibility of the self and when the yaa baa wears off no amount of red bull will keep the driver functioning as he was . I am not suggesting that all drivers are users but there does seem to indicative symptoms of high yaa baa use amonst drivers just from observation of how they drive. One wonders whether there is a link between the drivers and the yaa baa industry that the authorities are not game enough to intrude into.

Edited April 8, 2013 by xen

[Tomtomtom69]

Very sad, may the deceased victims RIP and the injured ones recover quickly...I passed through this exact same stretch of road yesterday coming over from Saiyabuli Laos, driving a Lao car. The road is a bit winding but nothing compared to the horrible roads in Laos. Somehow I have the feeling Thai drivers aren't good on mountainous roads...

[thairay]

so many RIP posts ...dont you know that buddah gives you another go around... ,so where is the worry? not so much RIP more "see you soon"

[Cnxforever]

a friend from Udon called me this morning about this accident. When he visited last year here in Chiang Mai he took the same company Chakrapong TV 3 news covered the accident this morning. This is not the first accident they had on this route.

Their buses are crap and the one my friend was on broke down in Lampang. He called me before midnight from Lampang telling me they where waiting for another bus from this company.

When the bus finally arrived 2 hours later it was almost full and he and several others where offered "standing room only" or more or less sit on the floor!!! Until Udon for the next 10 hours or so!

What a joke! This must be against any safety rules and regulations even in Thailand.

How do these people get a bus operating licence?

There is another company doing the same route which he took last time he visited Chiang Mai with double decker 24 seat VIP buses which looked really nice and he said he had a comfortable ride back to Udon.

Well after the accident today he is due to visit for Songran he opted to come to Chiang Mai by plane.

My heart goes out to the victims and their loved ones.

[marquis22]

Hmmm...geee and at 2:00am no less!

Wish I could say I am surprised......disgusted and saddened? Yes! But hardly surprised. I've been saying for years how damn dangerous these over night bus trips are. And here is another sad example where lives were lost because of simple incompetence & negligence I'm sure.

R.I.P. to those who lost their lives.

Yes, I think most of these crashes are caused by driver fatigue and falling asleep. Bus companies should be more aware of this problem and have in place the necessary instructions or warnings for their drivers to make sure they have adequate sleep. Do they know what a power-nap is?

[khaowong1]

Will this ever stop?

And please: spare me the "it happens everywhere"- bs!

In 40 years back home, I haven't read about as many fatal bus- accidents as I have here in the last 3 months.

It IS about how a country enforces laws, how it values education and safety etc.

RIP the victims

Back in the 50's and 60's in the US, you used to read about a lot of bus accidents.. I was even in a couple late at night-early morning. But they raised the laws on bus safety requirements and bus driver hours and virtually shut down those accidents in just about 7 or 8 years. Now you maybe hear about 2 or 3 a year. There seems to be no required laws at all here. Thai people tell me, if they too many requirements on bus equipment safety, and bus drivers, the bus prices would rise too high and no one could afford to ride the bus. Which brings it all back to what we are always taling about here.. Money. Lives are cheap.

[maidu]

Not to lessen the tragedy of the bus crash, but there is a modicum of good news: I took a r-t 'green bus' from C.Rai to C.Mai (3.2 hours each way). Ordinarily, there are movies or TV or sappy pop songs blaring for entire trips. On this recent trip however, there was only uninspired Chinese classical music at the beginning and ending 25 minutes of the trip. Other than that, no loud sounds, and no oppressive A.C. So, some improvements might be seeping in on the comfort-quotient of bus trips within Thailand.

[Asiantravel]

Hmmm...geee and at 2:00am no less!

Wish I could say I am surprised......disgusted and saddened? Yes! But hardly surprised. I've been saying for years how damn dangerous these over night bus trips are. And here is another sad example where lives were lost because of simple incompetence & negligence I'm sure.

R.I.P. to those who lost their lives.

Yes, I think most of these crashes are caused by driver fatigue and falling asleep. Bus companies should be more aware of this problem and have in place the necessary instructions or warnings for their drivers to make sure they have adequate sleep. Do they know what a power-nap is?

They have developed some great technology to combat this problem. It should be compulsory in all bus companies

http://www.optalert.com/the-products/alertness-monitoring.aspx

[animatic]

I've spent 18 hours or more on two busses this weekend.

One over night was just a miserable, no sleep, stress-fest,

The return today was much more relaxing, but still,

Even looking at the tires doesn't alleviate all worry.

RIP those lost and hope for a fast recovery for the injured

[mok199]

again we see this''i am a god'' bus driver attitude...these a holes need to go back to charm school and understand they ''drive a bus'',and usually poorly....also so many buses now,the maintaince lacks.....driver fatigue,driver incompatence,mechanical failure,poor maintance,the list is long...but we always seem to have enough money for stupid projects.thailanld has so much potential,is sad and upsetting to see it getting pissed away....so sad for the victims...

[rct99q]

Terrible tragedy which unfortunately will continue to happen until there is a proper enforcement of the existing laws. As well as dealing with the overall level of corruption which will take decades to eradicate (if ever).

During high season have at least 3 or 4 people travelling on this route every day. Had two people on this bus trip as well. Have not been in contact with them but am trying to find out if they are okay.

I have for years, when asked, provided my opinion on bus travel in Thailand and specifically this route Udon Thani - Chiang Mai and always recommend finding an alternate method of travel. I recommend the rail or flying but in nearly every case the answer is........it is cheap! From backpackers who travel on 100 baht a day (never understand these ones) to families to people who are well off but looking for that "grass roots" kind of travel.

I have been very fortunate as I have not had to answer an inquiring relative as to why their family member died. I have had to talk with quite a few family members to explain that their son/daughter, husband/wife etc were in hospital but alive and okay.

There is no quick fix. It will take a complete (and slow) over haul of the entire transportation system. It will happen....but it will take a long time. When talking with local Thai drivers (the good ones) and local expats involved in the tourism business the general consensus is 20-25 years. The biggest hurdle is the massive corruption involved at all levels.

But even after an incident like this I still had 3 people today who had no problems in taking the bus. It was cheaper than flying and quicker than the train. One lady said the odds of it happening again tonight were zero.....hope she was right.

[spidermike007]

Will this ever stop?

And please: spare me the "it happens everywhere"- bs!

In 40 years back home, I haven't read about as many fatal bus- accidents as I have here in the last 3 months.

It IS about how a country enforces laws, how it values education and safety etc.

RIP the victims

Well, there is little, to no enforcement. There is marginal education, due to a short sighted group of elite, who are terribly closed minded, and some of the least creative people in the world. They seem to think the only way to maintain and grow their fortunes, is to keep the Thai people stupid. Why else would they be fighting so hard to maintain such a poor educational system? And there is zero value put on safety. Three foreign pedestrians killed in Samui, in the past three weeks. What is being done, to stop the careless driving? Absolutely nothing.

[spidermike007]

Will this ever stop?

And please: spare me the "it happens everywhere"- bs!

In 40 years back home, I haven't read about as many fatal bus- accidents as I have here in the last 3 months.

It IS about how a country enforces laws, how it values education and safety etc.

RIP the victims

Back in the 50's and 60's in the US, you used to read about a lot of bus accidents.. I was even in a couple late at night-early morning. But they raised the laws on bus safety requirements and bus driver hours and virtually shut down those accidents in just about 7 or 8 years. Now you maybe hear about 2 or 3 a year. There seems to be no required laws at all here. Thai people tell me, if they too many requirements on bus equipment safety, and bus drivers, the bus prices would rise too high and no one could afford to ride the bus. Which brings it all back to what we are always taling about here.. Money. Lives are cheap.

Safety standards. Imagine such a rarified, sophisticated, and elegant concept? Will they ever even consider them here? I have never seen any. Speedboat crashes, pedestrians getting mowed down by mini vans going double the speed limits, billionaire sons mowing down cops with their ferraris, trucks driving recklessly with impunity, and worse. The authorities simply do not seem to care. Is this a class thing? Is it ok for poor people to die?

[MarkCyr]

This is tragic news, indeed. But hardly surprising when you see who is behind the wheels of the buses, taxis and vans in the Kingdom. For taxis from Pattaya to the airport, I've had to stay awake and keep talking to the driver just to prevent him from driving off the road. In fact, I was woken up once in the wee hours as we were driving on the gravel curb veering off the road...and the driver was still out cold.

At 2am, I'd bet this is exactly what happened to that bus. Things need to change.

[gohmer]

The frequency of this type of accident is in direct correlation to the amount of (or lack of) money paid to victims. The victims settle for peanuts. If the tour companies were sued like in the States and/or their executives/owners held on criminal charges with severe sentences (that actually got fulfilled), that would be the near end of these accidents. The bad companies would be out of business, the good companies able to make better profits to pay higher wages to drivers and provide better training. Legislature without serious financial and personal consequences is worthless. Another option that would work even faster is if the victim's families take up arms and attack the bus companies hanging their owners. I vote for the latter - faster, more effective, and results in permanent change.

[PoodMaiDai]

Until life means something in Thailand, this will continue. Currently life doesn't mean much to anyone. 1000s more will die in the same tragic way. Mai pen rai. Thainess.

[HannahD]

Over the past 15 years there have been many, many bus accidents claiming many dozens of lives on this relatively short section of highway in Phitsanulok. Nearly all major bus accidents in Phitsanulok Province occur on the Nakhon Thai-Den Sai route and almost always are the Udon-Chiang Mai or Chiang Rai-Nakhon Phanom lines.

[Greer]

I hope this is NO 1th of April joke. But accidents have many causes here;

- bad drivers, no driving skills

- drunk or using other stuff

- animals

- bad roads

- weather

- wrong signs

- bad maintenance

- perhaps a wasp in the cabin, who knows

It seems to be impossible to fight this all. Be careful, that's what I think.

Perhaps but more logically this is so damned easy to fix.

1. Govern the motors, (electronically)

2. Introduce log books for drivers - 12 hours at the wheel maximum being 5 + 5 + 2 with half hour breaks in between and 12 hours out of the vehicle completely

3. Speed over distance (average speed) to see if the governing has been interfered with (use of tachographs is common in the west)

4. Passenger service vehicles should be road tested every 90 days and certified roadworthy

5. Maintenance logs mandatory by operators/owners, submitted with vehicle testing

6. Driver education

7. Driver selection based on experience, age and prior clean record

8. Driver medical assessment prior to contracted

9. Urine tests weekly (this one would be easy but a lot of protests to be sure)

You can blame the roads all you like - speed and driver inability mixed with mechanically faulty buses - a recipe for road carnage.

I just looked at your list and I believe you would find all these things are already being done by this company which is the only bus company I would ever go on in Thailand because when you have two drivers on board there is much less chance of an accident through driver fatigue.

http://www.nca.co.th/index.php

Yes Nakhon Chai Air is the only bus company that my wife would consider on the odd occasions that she uses a bus to visit Khon Kaen. Two drivers, and an isolated drivers compartment to minimise distractions. I am told that the First Class is excellent, like sitting in business class on an aircraft.

I honestly wish there were more companies that value the lives of their customers and crew like this, and do things properly.

I also see a lot of talk about it being too expensive to make the changes and enforce safety requirements for bus companies in the Kingdom - so how does NCA seem to be able to offer an excellent service and safe busses with two drivers?

If these guys can do it, then its damned well time the government forced the rest to fix their woeful safety records!

Edited April 9, 2013 by Greer

[yooper2001]

This will continue as long as thailand has no highway police that give a crap. The police are too worried as to where they will find a shade tree to be under to set up a helmet check

thailand needs real police that know the law and is willing to enforce them.

every day i see thai drivers go through red traffic lights and pass cars on the left side that is a left turn only lane

I have been to many countries and thailand by far has the worst drivers

Edited April 9, 2013 by metisdead
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