How Safe Is Your Atm Card? Not Safe Enough

[maidu]

I have reason to believe the ATM machine (Bank of Ayudya) at Overbrook, at foot of stairs by old entrance is faulty. It is quite possible the machine is not secure. It has an antennae coming out of a separate box on its right side, and the back of the box has both doors ajar. It has wires jumbled in back, 2 of which aren't plugged in. On front, its business end is as loose as Cindy Creamcheese from High School. An antennae coming out of an ATM machine is for sending signals. A 2-bit thief can devise a way to intercept those signals and possibly fabricate fake ATM cards with pin-numbers.

Two weeks after using the Ayudya machine at Overbrook, I had several thieving withdrawals from my SCB account via KrungThai ATM machines. All were without my personal ATM card. I could go in to added detail, but I choose not to here. I've spoken with KrungThai and SCB about this ("oh so sorry, we have 100 ATM machines, so we don't know which ones."). And have filed police report (they're supposedly working on it). I haven't spoken yet with Ayudya bank. This post is a 'heads up' message for others - to possibly avoid getting their account drained.

It's odd. The Thai word 'Ayudya' comes from the Sanskrit word 'Ayodia' meaning: 'blissful abode of the Gods.' Perhaps becoming penniless is the way I get closer to the Gods.

Edited April 10, 2013 by maidu

[OneZero]

Thanks for the heads up.

[Dave8237]

Sorry to hear about your phantom/fraudulent withdrawals.

I am/was an ATM engineer in the UK until January, when I left the UK. As regards to this ATM, based on your description, the ATM's appear to be mainly Wincor machines in Thailand.

The main problem on fraudulent withdrawals are devices attached to the front of an ATM, false customer keypad, false front on ATM card reader slot, and miniature cameras attached to the ATM facia. I have seen a few over the years, and they are getting very sophisticated, and as you stated in your post the front of the ATM facia is loose, which points to this as a very good potential cause.

The bank regardless of which country can tell where the withdrawal has come from as all ATMs has its own ID, has too others wise, it's main bank would not know whom it was talking to, or how much cash was left inside the ATM. Also software downloads ect.

Good luck with getting your money back, don't let them palm you off, gather all your evidence, which you think is relevant, and keep on at them, every day if necessary, the big boys in the UK are the same they don't like admitting there a problem, it's bad for business, especially if its an internal problem!!!!!

I have edited this post as I went all technical, though I was training new engineers.........

Edited April 10, 2013 by Dave8237

[villagefarang]

Living your life under such a cloud of misfortune, I can’t help but wonder why you would use such a machine after your bat senses alerted you to the conspiratorial nature of its appearance?

[jambco984]

Living your life under such a cloud of misfortune, I can’t help but wonder why you would use such a machine after your bat senses alerted you to the conspiratorial nature of its appearance?

Totally agree. If you thought something was iffy and still proceeded to withdraw then for your sakes I hope it was just an off day and not a daily occurence

Sent from my GT-N7000B using Thaivisa Connect Thailand mobile app

[puck2]

@maidu

.... I've spoken with KrungThai and SCB about this ("oh so sorry, we have 100 ATM machines, so we don't know which ones."). And have filed police report (they're supposedly working on it). ...

Sorry to read about your loss.

One idea, I can exactly read on my Visa-Card-Account where I had drawn my money. So look into your online card-account.

And ... change the password imediately (online).

Edited April 10, 2013 by puck2

[maidu]

Yes, I changed password immediately. The way I found out about the thefts: I uncharacteristically went and got my saving account passbook updated - which is something I very rarely do. I didn't suspect anything was amiss until I looked at the recent record of withdrawals. Suggest to all reading this: do the same. Also, if there are suspicious withdrawals, you and only you are going to notice it. The bank isn't. Even when the bank is alerted to a problem, they're going to try to ignore it or hush it up. It's not in their interests to see a clouds of doubt welling up around their ability to secure other peoples' money.

As we heard last week: a group (Sri Lankans and others) were busted in Bkk - and found with dozens of fake ATM cards. The cops claim the thieves scored 10 million baht, though the cops also claim they only found Bt.18,000 on the thieves (go figure). I translated the article and printed it and showed it to the cops investigating my situation. Whether it makes an impression on them, I don't know.

[villagefarang]

It is much easier for me to check accounts online. All the information is there on a secure site. Taking your passbook in is pretty old school.

Edited April 10, 2013 by villagefarang

[onthedarkside]

After my Kasikorn card was skimmed and raided a couple of years ago I just gave my ATM card back. Since then I just call into the bank (plenty of branches at malls are open 7 days a week) show my passport and collect the cash. Sure it can be a bit less convenient BUT that's a lot better than than being defrauded.

[Big Gary]

A good friend of mine had his English Bank Card scammed and used here but he got all his money back as he had insurance and could prove he was nowhere near the ATM that the scam was done on. Luckily he was in Surabin Hospital for tests at the time his card was used on Koh Samui.

[maidu]

Lots of rip offs out there. For all such scammers, whether using ATM's or internet, if they're caught and convicted, should get 4 years first offense, and 15 years 2nd offense.

[ripstanley]

I pay 10 baht a month to have SCB SMS me when any action happens on my account. When using ATM I cover the pad with my other hand while I input my pin.

[maidu]

Covering the key pad with your other hand may not be enough. The Nation newspaper has had a couple articles lately showing how atm breaches are becoming commonplace in Thailand. Even the banks are waking up, and realizing they may have to compensate clients who have been ripped off. http://www.nationmultimedia.com/2009/03/11/national/national_30097607.php

it's a glimmer of hope for me. Even so, the only chance (slight as it is) that I'll get compensation, is if I take a dynamic action and run around town informing bank personnel and cops of what's going on. Left to their own devices, the banks and cops would rather just sit on their hands and watch Tele-Tubbies on TV. Indeed, years ago, I went to speak with a police captain in his office (another topic) and he was distracted by watching Tele-Tubby program on the large TV which was suspended 3 feet above his desk. I jest not.

Even while filing a police report on this ATM problem recently, every cop I spoke with was distracted - often. On average, every 8 seconds, someone or something would take his concentration away. You would think in a Buddhist society (people are supposed to be able to meditate, aren't they?) that folks would be able to concentrate better than a goldfish.

[patriot 9]

A good friend of mine had his English Bank Card scammed and used here but he got all his money back as he had insurance and could prove he was nowhere near the ATM that the scam was done on. Luckily he was in Surabin Hospital for tests at the time his card was used on Koh Samui.

way back in 2008, i got a bill on my uk card acc, according to the letter i had spent 3500 pounds in drinking dens in china. ????? never been told them check passport etc and other stuff, The only place i transfer money via my uk card is Tesco lotus phuket it gets swiped and my passport also copied, i never use it as a visa card. i use my bkb card for current use. Once i have my monthly money requirement,I just walk to the BKB bank in tesco lotus and deposit , and of course check

IMM visa account, as well as current .Any way it was proved that the card was copied and info checked via the line to Uk verifying I have money,when it was swiped, now im going to shout WHEN YOUR DOCUMENTS ARE PHOTO COPIED AND GIVEN TO YOU TO SIGN ENSURE YOU SIGN DEEPLY OVER THE CARD DETAILS MAKING IT HARD TO COPY. the Brit bank checked and accepted, i had never been to china or my card , and cancelled the debt also thanked me for the heads up re the exchange booth ,I have to say though, i hate going to ATMS here i check and double check the area and ATM .tried to do a transfer from uk to Thailand in central once and they insisted i gave them the pin number for the card , good by i said patriot 9

[maidu]

Update on my situation: Nearly nothing to report. Not surprising, when you figure a Thai official is supposedly on the case. He took off a week for Songkran. Last I heard, several days ago, was that all the ATM data including video goes down to (surprise) .....Bangkok. When the data will get transferred back to the provinces, no one knows. Sometimes I wonder if Chiang Rai authorities can clip their nails without getting prior authorization from Bkk.

And if authorities do find culprits, you can bet that, in spite of official claims of tens of millions of baht being stolen via ATM swindles, the cops will claim to only find a few thousand baht at the crime scene or on the culprits when they're apprehended. Hmmm, sounds a bit fishy, but par for the course.

Will any Thai banks assist their customers who have been ripped off? I'll let you answer that. Hint: the banks don't even inform or contact customers re; odd activity within accounts. Banks want all this pesky ATM stuff to blow over, so they can continue unhindered with the business of doling out customers' money to their bosom buddies under the guise of 'loans.'

I know one Thai fellow, whose brother happens to be an ex-governor. This guy gets a plot of land, then gets an artist to paint a lovely picture of a deluxe house. Then the guy takes the painting to the bank and get a bazillion baht loan to build. He builds a little house, and then takes a long vacation. Does he ever get pressured to pay back those loans? Did I mention he's the brother of a former governor? That should answer any such questions about loan responsibilities.

Edited April 24, 2013 by maidu

[maidu]

I'm looking to contact either....

>>> anyone who has been ripped off by ATM scam, and is contemplating or has instigated a lawsuit (against the banks, or....) in that regard

OR

>>> An attorney working in Thailand, who is not afraid to take offending banks to task. In other words; Banks are in the biz of securing depositors' money. If they don't do that, they're not doing their jobs well enough.

personal or blog responses are appreciated, thanks in advance.

[maidu]

I tried contacting a law firm listed in T.Visa classifieds for C.Rai and C.Mai. their tel# was wrong and no responses from 2 other ways. Suggest a lawyer? thanks