Can We Learn From The Success Of Singapore?: Thai Editorial

[MaxLee]

look at education in thailand ,

Wrong, look at the greedy ministries organized crime mafias of Thailand that want to keep the curious people uneducated, and go so far in murdering smart people, or someone that knows too much...

Edited May 22, 2013 by MaxLee

[johnlandy]

Can We Learn From The Success Of Singapore?

No. Thailand isn't Singapore. Neither is it Switzerland, Nigeria or Germany. You have to work with what you have rather than what you wish for.

'vision and discipline' two attributes that Thailand will never have, particularly the latter...

What has the realm ever given the world? Germany Switzerland Nigeria, Well Germany has given 101 Nobel Laureates plus Hitler, Werner von Braun, and many other things, Switzerland 26 Nobel Laureates, some fine watch brands, along with a shonky banking system, Nigeria 'one' (Nobel) but let us not forget the 619, and Thailand, yes you got it, 'an obscure strain of rice',

Edited May 22, 2013 by johnlandy

[gemini81]

look at education in thailand ,

You mean like buying the exam answers outside the exam building at Ramkhampaeng just before the test? Then bragging you have a Master's? Haha. Long way to go.

[hellodolly]

Thailand and Singapore are at opposite ends of the global corruption table.

Singapore by necessity, has an overbearing albeit strong government. Thailand is run by proxy from Dubai because there is no real governance or political idealogy in LOS.

Singapore is open for business. Thailand is open for business if you invest millions of your dollars and put Thai army generals and their golf buddies on the company board.

Nothing ever changes in Thailand except the faces. And thats how we all like it here.

Actually Singapore is #5 least corrupt and Thailand is #88 out of a list of 176 countries. I would not call that opposite ends. Of course I did not get a Thai education I got mine in The States.

Yes I would definatly like to see new faces in Government. But gonna be a long time before that happens unless they change the law that protects Members of Parliament from being tried for their crimes.

[hellodolly]

Name some micro states that unsuccessful, pretty easy to manage something that small,

Non Partisan politics in Singapore? Get out of here, it's the PAP way or the Highway if you dare disagree, on the rare occasions a Singapore electorate has voted against the ruling party it has had many of the government services diminished.

It's the most successful benevolent hereditary dictatorship in the world. I can think of only Ghana as another fairly benevolent dictator ship during Rawlings many incarnations.

Do you have a clue how to discuss the topic which is Singapore being a leader on the world economic stage?

He's actually correct. Comparing Thailand to Singapore is like comparing an oil tanker to a jetski. Completely different. Singapore has a tiny urban population to govern and control and no land borders. A complete and utter lack of democracy has enabled a totalitarian regime to make Singapore an economic success..for the Singapore government but the cost of living for the majority of Singaporeans is extremely high. However in terms of social success Singapore is still where Thailand is in terms of rampant inequality and racism (although Singaporean tv shows and advertisments at least put a token dark skinned person in the mix). Exorbitant cost of living, high levels of control over the population, rampant immigration of foreigners which have kept wages stagnant for over a decade etc. Singapore looks good on paper and its easy for multinationals to be based there but your average Singaporean in among the most unhappy in Asia and the cost of living is spiralling. Not to mention the overcrowding as the population has swollen by 50% in the last 12 years. So it all depends on what you want to measure as success.

"The tiny city-state has outperformed its neighbours because it

has vision and discipline, precisely the things we lack in fractious,

divided Thailand

The answer is no and the reason is contained in the question.

[gamini]

Singapore is a police state. No freedom of speech. All media is controlled by the government. Immigrant workers are underpaid and do all the dirty work. The government is not corrupt financially but it is politically. You oppose them and they will destroy you. The Goverment has never had more than 60% of the population supporting it. Those who vote for the government only do because there is no credible opposition

Money is not everything. The quality of life in Thailand is much better than Singapore. Tiny government flats and shopping centers is just about all there is to look forward to. Singaporeans are arrogant and not nearly as friendly as Thais.

I left Singapore as soon as I had saved up enough money to retire in Thailand. I was CEO of a dozen companies and could have stayed there making nearly a million dollars a year. Its boring. So much so that in the end Lived in Malaysia and commuted to Singapore 5 gays week to work.

[RickBradford]

Successful countries tend to be those that are genuinely prepared to learn from others, and respect others in turn.

Singapore (despite the pertinent criticisms made above) is one of them, and so (albeit to a lesser extent) is Malaysia.

Throughout Vietnam's history, its people have been made aware of the power of new foreign ideas, and so the country is very open to them (although it usually tries to emulate them too quickly and falls on its ass through not having the expertise).

By contrast, Thailand's entrenched elites insist that everything must be done the 'Thai way', because to do anything else would be a betrayal of 'Thai-ness'. So the attitudes that allow Singapore to flourish -- transparency, accountability, a fair shake for foreigners, meaningful rule of law and attack on corruption, these 'Western' ideas, are rejected by the Thai authorities in favour of a mulish and arrogant xenophobia.

I like the Thai people, too, but they are being badly let down by the people who are supposed to be running the country, but whose mental development has stalled at a fairly primitive level.

I'm not surprised by the constant cock-ups and waste of public money in Thailand -- it's the rare successes that surprise me.

[winstonc]

if you keep the masses uneducated,youl keep control,even if it means stagnation ,,,,,,,once again IM ALRIGHT JACK,,,,,,,,

[Thai at Heart]

Successful countries tend to be those that are genuinely prepared to learn from others, and respect others in turn.

Singapore (despite the pertinent criticisms made above) is one of them, and so (albeit to a lesser extent) is Malaysia.

Throughout Vietnam's history, its people have been made aware of the power of new foreign ideas, and so the country is very open to them (although it usually tries to emulate them too quickly and falls on its ass through not having the expertise).

By contrast, Thailand's entrenched elites insist that everything must be done the 'Thai way', because to do anything else would be a betrayal of 'Thai-ness'. So the attitudes that allow Singapore to flourish -- transparency, accountability, a fair shake for foreigners, meaningful rule of law and attack on corruption, these 'Western' ideas, are rejected by the Thai authorities in favour of a mulish and arrogant xenophobia.

I like the Thai people, too, but they are being badly let down by the people who are supposed to be running the country, but whose mental development has stalled at a fairly primitive level.

I'm not surprised by the constant cock-ups and waste of public money in Thailand -- it's the rare successes that surprise me.

It very much comes down to the ability to self criticise and not take criticism as something negative but for what it is.

Take the UK, we have some great things in the country and others that are shocking. We endlessly compare our public services to those countries around us and see what can be done better or not.

To criticise things like that honestly, is actually to love ones country, but true criticism is apparently very difficult for Thais to stomach. Being self satisfied with being relatively better off than Laos or Cambodia isn't enough.

[MaxLee]

Successful countries tend to be those that are genuinely prepared to learn from others, and respect others in turn.

Singapore (despite the pertinent criticisms made above) is one of them, and so (albeit to a lesser extent) is Malaysia.

Throughout Vietnam's history, its people have been made aware of the power of new foreign ideas, and so the country is very open to them (although it usually tries to emulate them too quickly and falls on its ass through not having the expertise).

By contrast, Thailand's entrenched elites insist that everything must be done the 'Thai way', because to do anything else would be a betrayal of 'Thai-ness'. So the attitudes that allow Singapore to flourish -- transparency, accountability, a fair shake for foreigners, meaningful rule of law and attack on corruption, these 'Western' ideas, are rejected by the Thai authorities in favour of a mulish and arrogant xenophobia.

I like the Thai people, too, but they are being badly let down by the people who are supposed to be running the country, but whose mental development has stalled at a fairly primitive level.

I'm not surprised by the constant cock-ups and waste of public money in Thailand -- it's the rare successes that surprise me.

Well, I mean,... about that last part,... it's the Thai-Chinese ancestor mafia clan elite that made up that definition "THAINESS", and insolently referring it to all innocent Thais,... I would rather call it, "Thai-Chinese High-so-BACKSTABBING AND SURPRESSION" rather than THAINESS, because again,... I don't consider Thai people or kids as stupid. Nobody is really stupid by nature, they are misguided, brainwashed and terribly ripped off by the people in power who rule the country, along with the rich feudal clans who have connections to them....

... and again, I must justify, it's nothing against my own ancestries, I ONLY refer to the political and power-mafia elite among them, NOT TO all Thai-Chinese people. It's because a lot of the political ruling members ARE from Chinese ancestries, and they ARE as stubborn, and nasty, and back-stabbing-smiling in your face, and in the face of the International media...

[clockman]

look at education in thailand ,

Or lack of it!

[Thai at Heart]

Successful countries tend to be those that are genuinely prepared to learn from others, and respect others in turn.

Singapore (despite the pertinent criticisms made above) is one of them, and so (albeit to a lesser extent) is Malaysia.

Throughout Vietnam's history, its people have been made aware of the power of new foreign ideas, and so the country is very open to them (although it usually tries to emulate them too quickly and falls on its ass through not having the expertise).

By contrast, Thailand's entrenched elites insist that everything must be done the 'Thai way', because to do anything else would be a betrayal of 'Thai-ness'. So the attitudes that allow Singapore to flourish -- transparency, accountability, a fair shake for foreigners, meaningful rule of law and attack on corruption, these 'Western' ideas, are rejected by the Thai authorities in favour of a mulish and arrogant xenophobia.

I like the Thai people, too, but they are being badly let down by the people who are supposed to be running the country, but whose mental development has stalled at a fairly primitive level.

I'm not surprised by the constant cock-ups and waste of public money in Thailand -- it's the rare successes that surprise me.

Well, I mean,... about that last part,... it's the Thai-Chinese ancestor mafia clan elite that made up that definition "THAINESS", and insolently referring it to all innocent Thais,... I would rather call it, "Thai-Chinese High-so-BACKSTABBING AND SURPRESSION" rather than THAINESS, because again,... I don't consider Thai people or kids as stupid. Nobody is really stupid by nature, they are misguided, brainwashed and terribly ripped off by the people in power who rule the country, along with the rich feudal clans who have connections to them....

... and again, I must justify, it's nothing against my own ancestries, I ONLY refer to the political and power-mafia elite among them, NOT TO all Thai-Chinese people. It's because a lot of the political ruling members ARE from Chinese ancestries, and they ARE as stubborn, and nasty, and back-stabbing-smiling in your face, and in the face of the International media...

Thanks max. Very honestly put.

[clockman]

Maybe because it was colonised? and Thailand is so proud of not being colonised!

[bigbamboo]

Maybe because it was colonised? and Thailand is so proud of not being colonised!

That 'never being colonized' mantra is a two edged sword. Sure the Thais are proud of it but it's also like denying travel broadens the mind. Countries benefit from outside influences more than they suffer from them, wide exposure to the lingua franca that is English being one of them.

Singapore may be an island but Thailand is so much more insular. That is part of their problem and why comparing the two currently is pointless.

[wiki12]

EDITORIAL

Can we learn from the success of Singapore?

The Nation

The tiny city-state has outperformed its neighbours because it has vision and discipline, precisely the things we lack in fractious, divided Thailand

BANGKOK: -- Singapore is a city-state the size of Phuket. It has no natural resources, but since it gained independence from Malaysia in 1965, Singapore has become a leader on the global economic stage, thanks mainly to vision and adherence to policy. Singapore's development philosophy is manifested in three giant investment projects that have taken shape over the past five years.

.....

-- The Nation 2013-05-22

As long as Thailand stays colonized and hostage by the Thai-Chinese feudal family power elite and their mafias that terrorize the poor and clueless farang, then the answer is No.

A feudal nepotism culture that dumps down on independent thinking and is more concerned about saving face for their spoilt brats and stubborn ancestors, will bring the entire nation down and suck them ripp off dry...

The Chinese are controlling Singapore too, the Malays stock are considered 'inferior'.

Singapore is a benign dictatorship, if the government has a vision/policy 20 years down the line it will be completed as there is no rel change of leadership.

Criticism of the government results in loss of employment and hefty jail time and fines.

Government informers are everywhere.

Its illegal to be naked in your home.

Singporeans are obsessed with wealth/status.

Strikes are illegal.

It's a horrible plastic place in my opinion, bereft of a soul.

[CTO]

Name some micro states that unsuccessful, pretty easy to manage something that small,

Non Partisan politics in Singapore? Get out of here, it's the PAP way or the Highway if you dare disagree, on the rare occasions a Singapore electorate has voted against the ruling party it has had many of the government services diminished.

It's the most successful benevolent hereditary dictatorship in the world. I can think of only Ghana as another fairly benevolent dictator ship during Rawlings many incarnations.

Do you have a clue how to discuss the topic which is Singapore being a leader on the world economic stage?

Yes - which takes into account what are the various variables and differences in countries and why they can succeed. Note I am discussing the Nation article, which claims politics in Singapore is non Partisan which contributes to Singapore's success. This is clearly in correct to anyone familiar with Singapore's political situation.

[CTO]

<<If Thailand is ever to catch up with Singapore, a change in attitude is
essential. Thai politicians and citizens must come to terms with their
differences and set a course, as Singapore has done, based on a
non-partisan vision - entirely for the sake of the nation.>>

That's the problem, people keep forgetting there is no real opposition in Singapore, it's not non partisan, so the writer is completely out of touch with reality.

The writer wants Thailand to be a better place, is looking for a success story to emulate, but comes to the wrong conclusions as to why Singapore is successful and how Thailand must change.

That's rather chilling frankly.

[Thai at Heart]

Bothering to compare the micro of Singapore is pointless.

An understanding of the willingness to deal with western business on a reciprocal level would be more relevant.

Why does Thai industry continue to operate behind protectionism to the detriment of suppliers and consumers?

Edited May 22, 2013 by Thai at Heart

[dighambara]

No, Thailand can't.

1. Singapore is ranked as the fifth least corrupt country in the world. Link. People can do business there with some assurance.

2. Singapore lowers taxes and makes doing business there easy. Thailand makes it almost impossible with protectionist policies.

3. Singapore has the rule of law. You can count, within reason, on being treated fairly by the courts. This encourages investment.

4. Thailand wants all foreign investment to be for Thais, even requiring majority Thai ownership. Singapore gave land to The Sands Casino (of Las Vegas) to build a huge casino, employ people and pay reasonable taxes. BTW the owner of The Sands is one smart businessman - a self made billionaire. You don't see him trying to build in Thailand, even though he has casinos all over the world.

5. Singapore has low import duties, as a whole.

In short, Singapore gets it and Thailand doesn't. Thailand is a closed club for the few, and Singapore is open for business.

Thailand will still be 3rd world and going through messes 30 years from now, while watching other Western-like Asian countries excel.

In the beginning, the former Siamese Island of Koh Tumasek, followed a path conducive to foreign investment.

Meanwhile, the big boy on the block, Thailand, changed rules making it more difficult for foreigners, requiring over 50% of all businesses be Thai owned, and of course, the age old problem of corruption.

Thailand is in this mess because that is where all it's planning has placed it. To become a 2nd world party will require the extinction of all corruption - a fantastically impossible task, because custom, culture and laws strongly support corruption.

[Wombat6]

I forgot to mention the Singapore has no capital gains tax. This really encourages investment from within Singapore. Singapore also has a maximum income tax of 18% which encourages high earners to earn there and from there.

In Thailand capital gains are taxed at ordinary income tax rates, and the rates get high progressively for high earners. This discourages investment.

They also don't have rubbish lying around everywhere that attracts Rats, Flies and Mosquitos. Singaporeans have pride in their country, something which is lacking amongst Thais.

[CTO]

When I was a kid there in the early 70's the place was about as dirty if not more so than Bangkok today. The river, which is now a tourist area, was so rank you couldn't walk beside it, the smell was so bad. So Singapore went from a pretty stinky place to pretty amazing quite quickly. Thailand could do the same,

[NeverSure]

Name some micro states that unsuccessful, pretty easy to manage something that small,

Non Partisan politics in Singapore? Get out of here, it's the PAP way or the Highway if you dare disagree, on the rare occasions a Singapore electorate has voted against the ruling party it has had many of the government services diminished.

It's the most successful benevolent hereditary dictatorship in the world. I can think of only Ghana as another fairly benevolent dictator ship during Rawlings many incarnations.

Do you have a clue how to discuss the topic which is Singapore being a leader on the world economic stage?

He's actually correct. Comparing Thailand to Singapore is like comparing an oil tanker to a jetski. Completely different. Singapore has a tiny urban population to govern and control and no land borders. A complete and utter lack of democracy has enabled a totalitarian regime to make Singapore an economic success..for the Singapore government but the cost of living for the majority of Singaporeans is extremely high. However in terms of social success Singapore is still where Thailand is in terms of rampant inequality and racism (although Singaporean tv shows and advertisments at least put a token dark skinned person in the mix). Exorbitant cost of living, high levels of control over the population, rampant immigration of foreigners which have kept wages stagnant for over a decade etc. Singapore looks good on paper and its easy for multinationals to be based there but your average Singaporean in among the most unhappy in Asia and the cost of living is spiralling. Not to mention the overcrowding as the population has swollen by 50% in the last 12 years. So it all depends on what you want to measure as success.

Can you stay on topic? This isn't about social ills. The article says "Singapore has become a leader on the global economic stage."

That's a fact. Singapore has, and it has done it with low income taxes, welcoming global business, low import taxes, not making it a private club for locals, lack of corruption in doing business, and other things.

The average per capita income in Singapore is ten times what it is in Thailand. It's more than it is in the USA. Link

If you want to start a thread about politics and conditions for the locals, that would be nice. I don't think the facts will totally back you up, but you are way off topic in any event. The question is "Can Thailand do what Singapore did economically" and the answer is no.

[masuk]

Bring PM Lee to LOS, introduce fines which are meaningful and cannot be skipped. This regulates traffic and most minor crimes.

Start teaching English at an early age.

Stop fining shops and others for using English on their signs. (must be smaller type if at all).

Promote English as the official 2nd language, and really TRY to have people use it.

Why do so few Thais not want to go outside Thailand? Are they afraid of the big bad world?

As the date for integration with ASEAN draws near, there's going to be a lot of frustrated potential business people from surrounding countries.

LOS either gets with it or loses it.

Get a half decent underground system in BKK, same as Singapore, instead of ambling along on an elevated slow train to a few inner city destinations. The Singapore train takes you to the Malaysian border!

[naboo]

Thailand is the greatest, they can learn from nobody as Thailand leads the world to all that is good.

As long as Thailand is nationalistic rather than patriotic, Thailand will never learn.

[Thai at Heart]

Nationalistic instead of patriotic.

Sums it up completely.

Edited May 22, 2013 by Thai at Heart

[livinthailandos]

Realistically no. Because thailand is primary unchanged in certain aspects for a long time.

Sent from my GT-I9300T using Thaivisa Connect Thailand mobile app

[hellodolly]

Name some micro states that unsuccessful, pretty easy to manage something that small,

Non Partisan politics in Singapore? Get out of here, it's the PAP way or the Highway if you dare disagree, on the rare occasions a Singapore electorate has voted against the ruling party it has had many of the government services diminished.

It's the most successful benevolent hereditary dictatorship in the world. I can think of only Ghana as another fairly benevolent dictator ship during Rawlings many incarnations.

Do you have a clue how to discuss the topic which is Singapore being a leader on the world economic stage?

He's actually correct. Comparing Thailand to Singapore is like comparing an oil tanker to a jetski. Completely different. Singapore has a tiny urban population to govern and control and no land borders. A complete and utter lack of democracy has enabled a totalitarian regime to make Singapore an economic success..for the Singapore government but the cost of living for the majority of Singaporeans is extremely high. However in terms of social success Singapore is still where Thailand is in terms of rampant inequality and racism (although Singaporean tv shows and advertisments at least put a token dark skinned person in the mix). Exorbitant cost of living, high levels of control over the population, rampant immigration of foreigners which have kept wages stagnant for over a decade etc. Singapore looks good on paper and its easy for multinationals to be based there but your average Singaporean in among the most unhappy in Asia and the cost of living is spiralling. Not to mention the overcrowding as the population has swollen by 50% in the last 12 years. So it all depends on what you want to measure as success.

Can you stay on topic? This isn't about social ills. The article says "Singapore has become a leader on the global economic stage."

That's a fact. Singapore has, and it has done it with low income taxes, welcoming global business, low import taxes, not making it a private club for locals, lack of corruption in doing business, and other things.

The average per capita income in Singapore is ten times what it is in Thailand. It's more than it is in the USA. Link

If you want to start a thread about politics and conditions for the locals, that would be nice. I don't think the facts will totally back you up, but you are way off topic in any event. The question is "Can Thailand do what Singapore did economically" and the answer is no.

You are partially right. The artical talks about economic things.

But the title says

"Can we learn from the success of Singapore?"

Success has a price If we ignore that.

The answer would be no. Because all we are looking at are the asses we also need to see the down side to formulate the whole picture and make a decision is that what we want.

When you talk about economy what does Singapore know about agriculture. That is a huge part of are economy, Does Singapore produce enough food to feed themselves.

The truth is we are talking apples to oranges here.

[Thai at Heart]

Name some micro states that unsuccessful, pretty easy to manage something that small,

Non Partisan politics in Singapore? Get out of here, it's the PAP way or the Highway if you dare disagree, on the rare occasions a Singapore electorate has voted against the ruling party it has had many of the government services diminished.

It's the most successful benevolent hereditary dictatorship in the world. I can think of only Ghana as another fairly benevolent dictator ship during Rawlings many incarnations.

Do you have a clue how to discuss the topic which is Singapore being a leader on the world economic stage?

He's actually correct. Comparing Thailand to Singapore is like comparing an oil tanker to a jetski. Completely different. Singapore has a tiny urban population to govern and control and no land borders. A complete and utter lack of democracy has enabled a totalitarian regime to make Singapore an economic success..for the Singapore government but the cost of living for the majority of Singaporeans is extremely high. However in terms of social success Singapore is still where Thailand is in terms of rampant inequality and racism (although Singaporean tv shows and advertisments at least put a token dark skinned person in the mix). Exorbitant cost of living, high levels of control over the population, rampant immigration of foreigners which have kept wages stagnant for over a decade etc. Singapore looks good on paper and its easy for multinationals to be based there but your average Singaporean in among the most unhappy in Asia and the cost of living is spiralling. Not to mention the overcrowding as the population has swollen by 50% in the last 12 years. So it all depends on what you want to measure as success.

Can you stay on topic? This isn't about social ills. The article says "Singapore has become a leader on the global economic stage."

That's a fact. Singapore has, and it has done it with low income taxes, welcoming global business, low import taxes, not making it a private club for locals, lack of corruption in doing business, and other things.

The average per capita income in Singapore is ten times what it is in Thailand. It's more than it is in the USA. Link

If you want to start a thread about politics and conditions for the locals, that would be nice. I don't think the facts will totally back you up, but you are way off topic in any event. The question is "Can Thailand do what Singapore did economically" and the answer is no.

You are partially right. The artical talks about economic things.

But the title says

"Can we learn from the success of Singapore?"

Success has a price If we ignore that.

The answer would be no. Because all we are looking at are the asses we also need to see the down side to formulate the whole picture and make a decision is that what we want.

When you talk about economy what does Singapore know about agriculture. That is a huge part of are economy, Does Singapore produce enough food to feed themselves.

The truth is we are talking apples to oranges here.

True, but there are many ways to skin an apple or peel an orange in economics. Success and progress are the ultimate measure.

Edited May 22, 2013 by Thai at Heart

[CTO]

Neversure, once more and I'll type slowly,

The article suggests in it's conclusion, that economic growth will come if Thailand follows Singapores non partisan political structure.

<<If Thailand is ever to catch up with Singapore, a change in attitude is
essential. Thai politicians and citizens must come to terms with their
differences and set a course, as Singapore has done, based on a
non-partisan vision - entirely for the sake of the nation.>>

The problem is, there is severe partisan politics, just that if you disagree, you won't get anything from the government,

So the writer is clearly wrong,

I also believe Thailand can't emulate Singapore, because it's a city state, that always a huge number of socio-economic structures to be put in place simply and easily, it far harder to give equality of services in a large country like Thailand/Australia/Malaysia etc, than it is in a city state, city states by the very nature of the geographical structure, are far easier to manage, and control.

To ignore these points is to accept a joke of an article.

[CTO]

For the record, Singapore has a pretty vibrant underground culture and is far from boring, I look forward to living there again one day. It's expensive, but if you eat as the locals do, it's not so bad, it's not perfect, neither is Thailand, and I am happy to have lived in both for many years.